AT&T Gives Up on T-Mobile Acquisition

[CDCC]

Too big to fail

T-Mobile merged with Orange in the UK and that reduced competition and they made their stores much nicer. Why was everyone in the USA against this?

Where have you been the last five years?

"Too big to fail" mean anything to you?

 

[JoeiiApple]

AT&T Is Always the Bad Guy, Huh?

iDon't know why AT&T is the subject of hate. No one is perfect, no phone is perfect, no COMPANY is perfect. In any case, you have to look at it from 2 sides. AT&T's and ours, the consumer's. From AT&T's standpoint, they were looking to: buy spectrum, build out 4G (rapidly), Increase customer base, become the leading provider, PROVIDE BETTER COVERAGE, increase jobs, make money (<=== We'll get to that in a second) and provide a better customer experience, overall.

Now from the AT&T (hater) consumer/non-consumer's standpoint, they were looking for: higher prices, less innovation, less competition, a possible monopoly/duopoly, higher prices, worse service, higher prices, higher prices, higher prices, yatta, yatta, yatta...

Why is AT&T wrong for trying to buy a dying company.? Clearly, it was a smart move. Over 90% of the MacRumor community who posted on this thread have a passionate dislike/hate for AT&T as a whole. So if we left it up to you (haters) to choose what should happen to AT&T, you'd probably say "Kill 'em! Stop the company's service, at once! Why? Because it 'SUCKS'! Their coverage is trash, their 2G, 3G, 3G+(HSPA+), and 4G (LTE) speeds are garbage, they drop over 99.8% of their phone calls, and who cares about simultaneous voice & data? Their coverage is non-existent in the US, and they have the worst plans! Every time we look at our AT&T signal bars, we see either one bar, 'Searching...' or 'No Service'. AT&T, as a whole, just SUCKS!!" Yeah, that's what you all think, but for me and the other couple hundred thousand people who actually enjoy our service, would have liked to see this deal go through. Now that we've established what the AT&T haters want of the AT&T company, shut the ufck up.! Damn. Stop crying all the damn time.! SHEESH.!

 

[ART5000]

T-Mobile merged with Orange in the UK and that reduced competition and they made their stores much nicer. Why was everyone in the USA against this?

read what you just said. "reduced competition!"

 

[Akack]

Now Apple and T Mobile agree to bring the iPhone to T Mobile.

 

[RalfTheDog]

Now Apple and T Mobile agree to bring the iPhone to T Mobile.

Not going to happen. T-Mobile will be gone before they could ship.

 

[eye]

I wish death upon AT&T. They hate their customers and would not produce on single job if allowed to acquire t mobile. They'd cut jobs. No need for redundant positions. If you can't figure that out, you're a sucker. I don't hate them because they are any worse then the others, I hate them because they blatantly lied about what the acquisition would do. They lie about just about everything.

 

[Grimsrud]

Now Apple and T Mobile agree to bring the iPhone to T Mobile.

That sure would be great. T-Mobile and MVNOs on its network like Simple Mobile would explode with their $40 unlimited talk/text/data 3G plans if there was an iPhone that supported AWS 3G.

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Not going to happen. T-Mobile will be gone before they could ship.

Who knows. There are many reports from users of unlocked iPhone 4S's that T-Mobile is "refarming" its 1900 MHz 2G PCS spectrum into HSPA+ in some small pockets of the western US right now. If something big happens with that, T-Mobile just may live to fight another day.

 

[pkoury]

Personally, I think this deal wouldn't have been as bad as everyone tries to make it sound.

Everyone has the major concern that AT&T and Verizon would raise prices. If that were to happen (and it was that big of deal) there would be a mass exodus to Sprint. The markets would ultimately decide the winners / losers - not the government in this case.

I could be wrong, but I really don't see how.

 

[donnaw]

Personally, I think this deal wouldn't have been as bad as everyone tries to make it sound.

Everyone has the major concern that AT&T and Verizon would raise prices. If that were to happen (and it was that big of deal) there would be a mass exodus to Sprint. The markets would ultimately decide the winners / losers - not the government in this case.

I could be wrong, but I really don't see how.

The "market" can't decide if there is no competition. This merger would have left the US with one GSM carrier. Of course you know GSM is what most of the world uses.

I don't know what will happen to T-Mobile. One thing I'm sure of. They won't simply pack up shop and depart. They have too much infrastructure and assets. My guess is that they will break up into several smaller companies and AT&T will purchase the areas they most want or one of the cable companies will purchase it. Whether that's a good thing or not is up for debate. But spectrum is valuable and all wireless companies want/need more.

I know it seems weird to some folks but my guess is that most of you are too young to remember what a real monopoly is like. I'm not and although it sounds like a good thing at first it is never a good thing in the long run.

 

[Stridder44]

I wonder how much further along AT&T would be in their LTE rollout if they just took the $39 billion and invested it in wireless infrastructure versus trying to buy T-Mobile.

What the hell is wrong with you people. Doing that would improve their network by a noticeable margin, leading to happier customers, and overall a better experience with at&t, which in turn would give them a better reputation and more faithful customers. That's a terrible idea.


Yes, sarcasm.

 

[KPOM]

I can relate to what you're saying. I'm thrilled that AT&T didn't just become AT&TT-Mobile, but the reality is that DT has essentially tipped its hand that it wants out of the US market. So as a T-Mobile customer, it feels like the writing is on the wall anyhow. And I *love* T-Mobile: great customer service (actually, almost cult-ish at times), decent reception in the places I work and travel, and great pricing. With my Nexus One, I can also tether directly on to 3G without any additional cost and I've got their version of unlimited data (slows down after crossing 2GB or so).

But I'm keeping an eye on Sprint, both because of its pending WiMax to LTE conversion and the types of phones becoming available for it (Android and the iPhone). And also because it seems like I'll need to be leaving T-Mobile anyway within the next 2 years by hook or crook.

Yes, I also have a Nexus One that I use for tethering. Ironically, when I'm in weak AT&T zones (like my office), I turn on my Nexus One's Wi-Fi hotspot at my office so that my iPhone can still fetch my e-mail.

I've thought about Sprint, too, since they still offer unlimited data (though not for 4G, so expect a change when the iPhone 5 comes out). However, in the interim, while DT figures out what to do with T-Mobile, hopefully they take that $4 billion cash and commit to a big order of iPhone 5s in 2012 so that Apple puts in a pentaband HSPA+ chipset. T-Mobile needs the iPhone, if only to stem the loss of postpaid subscribers.

 

[pkoury]

The "market" can't decide if there is no competition. This merger would have left the US with one GSM carrier. Of course you know GSM is what most of the world uses.

I don't know what will happen to T-Mobile. One thing I'm sure of. They won't simply pack up shop and depart. They have too much infrastructure and assets. My guess is that they will break up into several smaller companies and AT&T will purchase the areas they most want or one of the cable companies will purchase it. Whether that's a good thing or not is up for debate. But spectrum is valuable and all wireless companies want/need more.

I know it seems weird to some folks but my guess is that most of you are too young to remember what a real monopoly is like. I'm not and although it sounds like a good thing at first it is never a good thing in the long run.

Yes but you still have 2 other mobile providers. I see your point with the GSM network but does that make it impossible for someone to enter the market? I don't know enough about how the airwaves work to be certain if it's possible.

My thought would be that as long as AT&T does not prevent competition this purchase would have made a minimal impact.

 

[KPOM]

Actually, in the U.S., we have rules that you cannot buy your way into a Monopoly, which is what would happen if AT&T were allowed to by T-Mobile. ... AT&T and T-mobile merging would have eliminated it and ultimately caused Sprint to go out of business, leaving AT&T and Verizon and who knows how long Verizon would have lasted/

Two companies does not make a monopoly. Verizon would have been just fine as the #2, just as AT&T will likely survive as the #2 now.

Now, Apple could buy T-Mobile without much of a headache, as it would still leave competition in the wireless market place.

I doubt Apple would do that. Why would Verizon, Sprint, C-Spire or anyone else keep the iPhone if Apple bought T-Mobile?

Honestly, this would have been bad for everyone. As for if T-Mobile were to go bankrupt, I would imagine that the courts would step in and figure something out to where AT&T doesn't get anything, for the same reasons as above.

Actually, AT&T would be the only logical buyer for T-Mobile's towers, since they are the only major wireless company that could actually use them. Verizon and Sprint (or US Cellular, C-Spire, MetroPCS, etc.) could buy T-Mobile's spectrum.

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What the hell is wrong with you people. Doing that would improve their network by a noticeable margin, leading to happier customers, and overall a better experience with at&t, which in turn would give them a better reputation and more faithful customers. That's a terrible idea.


Yes, sarcasm.

Unfortunately, it isn't that simple, since there isn't enough available spectrum. That was T-Mobile's most valuable asset. AT&T's biggest problem is that it doesn't have enough spectrum to build a reliable network.

 

[Kar98]

From AT&T's standpoint, they were looking to: buy spectrum, build out 4G (rapidly), Increase customer base, become the leading provider, PROVIDE BETTER COVERAGE, increase jobs, make money ...

Eliminate competition, foremost. And the "create jobs" claim is laughable. As is the one about providing better coverage.

 

[JoeiiApple]

Eliminate competition, foremost. And the "create jobs" claim is laughable. As is the one about providing better coverage.

--

Really.? How.?

 

[donnaw]

Yes but you still have 2 other mobile providers. I see your point with the GSM network but does that make it impossible for someone to enter the market? I don't know enough about how the airwaves work to be certain if it's possible.

My thought would be that as long as AT&T does not prevent competition this purchase would have made a minimal impact.

The only way a company can enter the market is to own spectrum. That's it. Spectrum is a finite commodity. You just can't conjoined up more. T-mo owns quite a lot along with their infrastructure. Allowing AT&T to acquire T-mo in its entirety would in essence give AT&T a monopoly on the GSM spectrum in the US. You might be surprised to find out that for many people a CDMA phone is not an option. We travel out of the country a lot and if we go with Verzion or Sprint we either have to buy another phone or get a loaner.

I totally see why cutting our providers down to only 3 with just one who owns an entire GSM spectrum is not a good thing. As I said, some other company will step up, most probably one of the wireless companies. Or T-mo may just find a big investor (again probably a big wireless company) and keep the company.

Don't know for sure how this will play out but in the long run I firmly believe its a good thing it won't go through as originally designed.

 

[Terrin]

So the back out money from AT&T should keep T-Mobile out of bankruptcy for what... another year, two tops?

AT&T will get the parts they actually wanted in the bankruptcy sale and probably save a few billion in the process.

I love all this uninformed T-Mobile is in trouble hogwash. It made billions in profit last year. Further, last quarter profits increased, and it added 126, 000 new subscribers all while this whole not knowing if T-Mobile would exist in the future was going on. It is true T-Mobile needs to acquire spectrum to keep its 4G momentum going, but 1) it will acquire some of the spectrum from AT&T, and 2) it has some unneeded towers it can sell. Moreover, if Apple brings the iPhone to T-Mobile, T-Mobile's unlimited plans are 1) significantly faster than Sprint's, and 2) they are cheaper.

 

[CorporateFelon]

To all those who are saying that TMobile is doomed to fail, can you point out why that is?

While these quarterly financial reports are alittle greek to me, it seems as if TMobile is profitable and making money. http://www.t-mobile.com/company/InvestorRelations.aspx?tp=Abt_Tab_InvestorRelations&ViewArchive=Yes


Unless I am reading them wrong, can some one point out where they are actually losing money?

 

[Terrin]

T-Mobile is going under. They're bleeding customers in droves.
Their exit from the U.S. market is only prolonged a little longer with the AT&T back-out money.

Get your facts straight. It increased both profit and subscriber growth last quarter all while this sale stuff was going on. With the sale off the table, T-Mobile will grow even stronger as it will get even more competitive.

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I wonder how much further along AT&T would be in their LTE rollout if they just took the $39 billion and invested it in wireless infrastructure versus trying to buy T-Mobile.

AT&T wasn't giving 39 billion to DT. It was paying for it 1) by being able to fleece T-Mobile customers by raising their prices while getting rid of T-Mobile's overhead (e.g. retail stores and employees), and 2) paying DT in AT&T stock.

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Did anyone even read the technical parts of deal or did they just see the bold title and go "oh hell no". this merger would have done a huge benefit to end users and it would not have driven prices up. instead of 1 giant that overshadows AT&T, sprint, and tmobile, it would have been 2 giants overshadowing just sprint. Sprint would have gotten it stuck in the butt. But who cares, sprint has been aweful for years. But by no means would there have been a monopoly. as long as there are 2 or more companies making a product, they can't jack up prices.

Had they merged they intended to bring more 4g to AT&T, as well as far more coverage. and tmobile customers who were absorbed would have gotten a lot more coverage as well as a lot more options (like an official iphone for example). Merging two network technologies together would have been able to create a better network technology using the best from both.

So i don't know why everyone is hating so hard on the deal. I think it's a real shame it failed.

Imagine if the DoJ denied apple aquiring next, or anything of the other companies that made them what they are today. Instead of great products apple would have died and we'd have crap. But i guess people are more paranoid these days. If a company liked apple tried to buy a competing OS concept today they'd be denied because it discourages competition. As if. Only if EVERY competeitor was gone would it matter.

As a T-Mobile who fled AT&T, I would have got crap if the sale went through. T-Mobile today offers more plan variety than AT&T and it does it cheaper. For instance, I have an iPhone without a data plan. AT&T wouldn't let me do that even with an unlocked iPhone. Further, the only reason there is no T-Mobile iPhone is because Apple isn't stupid enough to sink tons of money into a Carrier that was going to be gobbled up by AT&T. Now that this deal is off the table, we will see Apple come around. It might take until the next upgrade, but it will happen.

As far as Next goes, the problem with your reasoning is NeXt didn't license government (e.g. the public) owned spectrum that was non transferable, and NeXt was nowhere near being a monopoly. It didn't compete with Apple at all. The government also didn't help create NeXt by for many years giving it an exclusive telephone monopoly.

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I don't think you know what the word "monopoly" means.

The sale would have created a monopoly on the GSM network. As a T-Mobile customer with an unlocked paid in full iPhone, where would I take my phone if I didn't want to do business with AT&T? The answer is nowhere, as the phone only works on T-Mobile and AT&T's network.

 

[vitzr]

I don't think you know what the word "monopoly" means.

Theoretically the US government does, yet it still can't get things right.

Anyone who is interested, could do the research & learn what happened the last time the government broke up "The Ma Bell - AT&T Monopoly".

Bottom line? We've come full circle all for nothing. When it comes to business Washington D.C. is completely out of touch.

It's as simple as that.

 

[Terrin]

If I understand this bit, since it is tax deductible, guess who picks up part of the tab for this little debacle.

Don't I love paying for corporate *****k-ups.

AT&T doesn't pay taxes. It pays lobbyists.

 

[vitzr]

I wish death upon AT&T. They hate their customers and would not produce on single job if allowed to acquire t mobile. They'd cut jobs. No need for redundant positions. If you can't figure that out, you're a sucker. I don't hate them because they are any worse then the others, I hate them because they blatantly lied about what the acquisition would do. They lie about just about everything.

Please post a link to a credible source that will verify your accusations.

 

[i-John]

How is reducing competition a good thing? You'd be ok with paying more just to have nicer stores?

How is the presence of t-mobile keeping down prices? There are less options elsewhere in the world, and their prices haven't changed a whole lot. Customer demand is what drives prices, not the number of companies.

Verizon and AT&T cut their unlimited plans, t-mobile and Sprint kept cheaper unlimited plans, yet Verizon and AT&T continue to get more customers and less churn than their cheaper 'competition'.

The old mantra of more companies make for cheaper prices is outdated and no longer relevant. Customer demand for products drive companies, and we don't need four of them. Three is a good number, Verizon and AT&T as the big leaders, with Sprint being in the middle between them and the cheap local carriers.

t-mobile WANT out of the US market. It just hasn't worked out for them. I'd bet if it was Sprint, no one would say a word against it.

Me, I want better service. If the likes of AT&T have to spend more to get that for me, who pays for that?

 

[Plutonius]

When this whole thing started a long time ago... people were saying "T-Mobile USA is profitable so why would Deutsche Telekom want to get rid of it?"

That's why I was confused.

Since T-Mobile USA is failing... they needed this merger/acquisition. But the US Government prevented that.

So now what? T-Mobile USA is still in trouble.

The US can bail out another company .

 

[i-John]

Theoretically the US government does, yet it still can't get things right.

They had a monopoly with the Post Office for years and couldn't make it even break even