AT&T to Face Net Neutrality Complaint Regarding FaceTime Over Cellular Limitation

st1y said:
I'm not backing AT&T up or anything... they're the only service provider that catches at my house...

It works both ways... trying imagine what our data speeds would be like if they did allow facetime over cellular? talk about bogging down the network it be pointless to facetime being all choppy and lagging...

be happy AT&T didn't do what verzion is doing... NO UNLIMITED plans with iPhone 5...

and on the plus at least we can talk and browse...

it's not much, but it is something...
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Get your facts right: there is unlimited, but you have to buy iphone 5 as retail price.
 
urbanslaughter said:
But of course, you realize that's the entire foundation of our legal contract system? If people were able to get out of contracts because they wanted out, then we would no longer have reliable contracts. As someone else pointed out, my circumstances have changed during the years I've had this contract with them. AT&T certainly wouldn't let me change the rules, nor should we let them.
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AT&T has never allowed Facetime on their networks. You don't have a contract with AT&T that allows you to use Facetime on their networks. Their new contracts do allow it however, but only on their new plans.

You do realize that the entire foundation of our legal contract system is very tightly bound to what is actually in the contract don't you?
 
i guess the biggest problem in the US is that u don't really have those cheap "supermarket" providers that sell sim cards like bread anywhere unlike here in Europe and plans for 9€ which the "big coops" have to try to compete with

AT&T has it pretty easy, they can basically do whatever they want because there arent really any discounter sims to compete with as far as i know

if there arent any options that its nothin u can rly do about it and AT&T knows that
 
tacobandit said:
I understand the outrage, I really do. I think the philosophy and goals behind net neutrality are good. But what you guys fail to realize is that AT&T is not being malicious here, and you should probably be more understanding to their predicament:

These grandfathered unlimited plans are based on a business model that far predates the technology packed into an iphone now. The plan was primarily geared towards calling with data as an afterthought. So what happens when you can painlessly make pure data calls from any iphone to any iphone (without first conspiring to have a common app like skype and signing up and adding friends etc) basically what you get is the potential for all hell to break loose. Now, somebody who was paying a lot more for their minutes no longer has to because those minutes are now measured on their data plan, which is unsustainably cheap. So what do you suggest AT&T do? If you were on their board, and a large shareholder, what would be your great plan to remedy this impedance mismatch between technology and business model? The "oh well block FaceTime unless they're on a modern plan" idea seems great on the surface to AT&T: you can maintain your old business model for those that don't want to move and love their unlimited data... People are free to choose: classic cell plan or new cell plan (unlike Verizon which has stopped offering old plans to new customers)

What else can AT&T do? Would you prefer it if they were more forceful about moving you to a modern plan? Just canceling the grandfathered unlimited data plans outright? I suspect they thought that would be an even larger PR disaster. Verizon probably has FAR FAR FAR fewer iPhone users on their grandfathered unlimited plan than does AT&T so the loss is more easily swallowed for them.

I mean, AT&T is not malicious, they're not trying to force you into paying them more for stuff you don't need.. They're trying to reconcile the new technology with an old business plan, and there is no easy solution that will make everybody happy.
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I think you are mistaken about AT&T not being malicious. Search the internet for De La Vega quotes and you'll see the CEO has nothing but the utmost repugnance for his customers and considers us peasants (an almost 1-1 analogy from one of his more famous quotes).
 
SandboxGeneral said:
Many people do. I use it on occasion, and would use it more often if I could while on cellular.

However, it's more of a principle thing for me and probably most of us who complain about this issue. It's completely wrong that AT&T is trying to do this, and it's almost unethical. Data usage is data usage - the company shouldn't regulate how we use our data. If we want to use it all up on FaceTime, that's our choice to make, not theirs.
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well huge companies like att will lose business :cool:.
 
samson533 said:
You whiners need to get over it. AT&T is a business and therefore it makes business decisions. When AT&T offered unlimited data, devices simply didn't use that much, they were slow, apps were slow, steaming movies and videos through cellular technology wasn't quite here yet, etc.

Now data consumption has gone through the roof and AT&T has to manage their costs. You are bunch of entitled babies that expect businesses to operate at a loss to give you the service you think you deserve. You are lucky they didn't strip away your unlimited data already. Businesses are NOT in business for the good of humanity. They are here to make a profit. They make a profit by providing goods or services at a price where we can FREELY choose to trade our hard earned dollars for that service. If you don't like the service they provide, STOP freely CHOOSING to trade your dollars for their service. It's as simple as that.
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You have absolutely zero proof that they'd be operating at a loss without these new data plans. The iPhone as a product brings in a ton of revenue for AT&T, revenue that they never had before, and who's to say the problem doesn't exist because AT&T failed to build proper infrastructure to support the iPhone.

Let me know when you have access to AT&T's financial statements, until then feel free to stop spewing nonsense, and trying to use conjecture as evidence.
 
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It's my data plan AT&T let me use it as I damn well please. What do you care if its watching my TV via Slingbox or FaceTime chatting with someone.

I hope they get crushed.
 
DJsteveSD said:
I'm single and have a wifi only ipad, switching to a "shared" plan would increase my monthly bill about $20 before taxes. Like I told the AT&T rep, how does that make sense? He agreed.
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I agree that it would not make sense for everyone. But I suspect that it is still a more valuable option since I am going to assume you haven't factored in the unlimited calling, unlimited text message, and now your mobile hotspot is included and not an additional charge which you could use to provide cell data to your iPad. But if you are trying to reduce your overall cost, then paying more doesn't make sense in your situation.

Again, AT&T should not have forced people to the mobile shared data plan for Facetime since I suspect that for many people the mobile shared plan would be an economic choice anyway.
 
samson533 said:
AT&T has never allowed Facetime on their networks. You don't have a contract with AT&T that allows you to use Facetime on their networks. Their new contracts do allow it however, but only on their new plans.

You do realize that the entire foundation of our legal contract system is very tightly bound to what is actually in the contract don't you?
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So unlimited data doesn't cover the thousands of other apps that have come out since I signed my contract? It doesn't cover 3G voice or LTE? It doesn't cover songs that have been written in the time since I signed my contract? Now you're just being obtuse. Contracts regularly include items that are not explicitly included, but are, however, implied. I wouldn't feel the need to call you out if you didn't act as though you knew what you were talking about.
 
samson533 said:
You whiners need to get over it. AT&T is a business and therefore it makes business decisions. When AT&T offered unlimited data, devices simply didn't use that much, they were slow, apps were slow, steaming movies and videos through cellular technology wasn't quite here yet, etc.

Now data consumption has gone through the roof and AT&T has to manage their costs. You are bunch of entitled babies that expect businesses to operate at a loss to give you the service you think you deserve. You are lucky they didn't strip away your unlimited data already. Businesses are NOT in business for the good of humanity. They are here to make a profit. They make a profit by providing goods or services at a price where we can FREELY choose to trade our hard earned dollars for that service. If you don't like the service they provide, STOP freely CHOOSING to trade your dollars for their service. It's as simple as that.
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Awesome, so now we have communists posting on Macrumors.
 
I felt this way about text messaging from Day 1. AT&T charging customers extra to text, which takes a tiny fraction of bandwidth as opposed to a phone call?
 
newagemac said:
Because when unlimited data was originally offered, you didn't have as much capability to suck down data and clog up the network as you do now with HSPA+, LTE, and native video calling over retina screens and HD cameras. You can't realistically expect for the carriers to be able to handle unlimited data (at your original price) no matter how much technology improves and data consumption increases. What was realistically possible with unlimited data then is different now. And not taking that into account is pie in the sky thinking.

However, there is no excuse for limiting a feature on data plans that are metered. The carrier isn't on the hook for anything because you already purchased a set amount of data at an agreed upon price and even pay more for overages. Their excuse on "unlimited" plans at least make logical sense and its reasonable. The excuse on plans that are limited make no sense at all.
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Considering they post record earnings every quarter, your argument holds no water for unlimited plans. They wanted more customers, they offered unlimited data, they didn't make contract end dates for that unlimited data program. They screwed themselves and are now trying to get out of it by screwing their customers who in good faith left their other carriers for this new agreement. They have to make amends to those customers. Cut them off and offer them something else and reimburse them or offer them something for their mistake with an option to leave with no ETF. The fact is they don't want to lose those customers because they know they are bleeding them dry with the some of the highest phone plans in the industry by CHARGING A PREMIUM TO USE A SPECIFIC PHONE. They did this to themselves and are hurting their customers as a result.
 
ULFoaf said:
I felt this way about text messaging from Day 1. AT&T charging customers extra to text, which takes a tiny fraction of bandwidth as opposed to a phone call?
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And thankfully, Apple did come to our rescue with message. I'm not sure how they'll get around AT&T on this one.
 
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Mundty said:
You have absolutely zero proof that they'd be operating at a loss without these new data plans. The iPhone as product brings in a ton of revenue for AT&T, revenue that they never had before, and who's to say the problem doesn't exist because they failed to build proper infrastructure to support the iPhone.

Let me know when you have access to AT&T's financial statements, until then you can kindly shut the $&%* up, and stop trying to use conjecture as evidence.
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I didn't say that AT&T it operating at a loss. I just said people wouldn't care if they did as long as they got the service they felt entitled to. AT&T is a public company and you can get access to their financial statements any time you want.

I'm sorry you got so worked up over all this you had to use your symbols *&#$&%*#. I didn't intent to use conjecture. I've just simply said that AT&T is free choose to offer whatever plans and services they want. If they are going to start offering Facetime (A NEW SERVICE THEY HAVEN'T PREVIOUSLY SUPPORTED), then it can be on their terms.
 
"AT&T's actions are incredibly harmful to all of its customers, including the deaf, immigrant families and others with relatives overseas, who depend on mobile video apps to communicate with friends and family."

Yeah because anyone in their right mind makes international video calls over a cellular connection...
 
urbanslaughter said:
So unlimited data doesn't cover the thousands of other apps that have come out since I signed my contract? It doesn't cover 3G voice or LTE? It doesn't cover songs that have been written in the time since I signed my contract? Now you're just being obtuse. Contracts regularly include items that are not explicitly included, but are, however, implied. I wouldn't feel the need to call you out if you didn't act as though you knew what you were talking about.
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AT&T has always been explicit ever since Facetime was first released that it wasn't going to be supported.
 
I remember when you had to pay by the minute with Internet access in the 1990s. The faster your modem, the more you pay.

Hopefully Facetime will be allowed without any addition fees after all is said and done.
 
thuchu1 said:
I'm not on an unlimited plan so it doesn't really affect me. It is, however, very evident that AT&T is trying about everything they can to force people off plans that they sold to them. If someone is on a grandfathered unlimited plan, it means that they have been with you for a while. You would think a company would want to reward loyal customers, not punish them...
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That would be the case for any other industry, but they realize that they're the only game in town besides Verizon for most Americans. In many cases, they are even the only option. The fact that there is no real competition between telecoms in the US means they can just shaft their users whenever they want knowing that the majority of them will just deal with it as they have no other choice. If there was the choice of provider that exists anywhere else in the world (like east Asia or Europe for example), these kinds of corporate decisions would never fly.
 
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