Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Audio Decoding KILLS MacPro (2009) green factor
- Thread starter handheldgames
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
That appears to be the case, given the information available/uncovered by MR members' testing and posting results.
That appears to be the case, given the information available/uncovered by MR members' testing and posting results.
lol nicely worded so you're safe no matter what the final result
I wondered if someone would catch that.lol nicely worded so you're safe no matter what the final result
Seriously, Core Audio is the suspect. But I worded it in a manner that allows for the discovery of new information. Remember, initially Quicktime X was considered the culprit. New information surfaced, and narrowed it to Core Audio. So it's at least possible it could change.
Again.
im on the ball (for once)I wondered if someone would catch that.
Seriously, Core Audio is the suspect. But I worded it in a manner that allows for the discovery of new information. Remember, initially Quicktime X was considered the culprit. New information surfaced, and narrowed it to Core Audio. So it's at least possible it could change.
it does sound very suspicious. so this means that both QT7 + QTx use the Core Audio.. hmph
It makes perfect sense in my way of thinking, as it reduced the development time and effort required. Systems.... build on something that already exists rather than start from scratch. It's easier and cheaper, which corporate accountants (and up the food chain) really take notice of.
It makes perfect sense in my way of thinking, as it reduced the development time and effort required. Systems.... build on something that already exists rather than start from scratch. It's easier and cheaper, which corporate accountants (and up the food chain) really take notice of.
thats true. so they sort of lied when they said completely re-written - i guess they just meant QTx
Yep. I'm certain they view QT X as separate code, even though QT X relies on Core Audio to function.thats true. so they sort of lied when they said completely re-written - i guess they just meant QTx
Yep. I'm certain they view QT X as separate code, even though QT X relies on Core Audio to function.
Seeing as VNC, Mplayer, iTunes, system sounds all depend on core audio kinda separates QT from the system as a whole
is Core Audio the actual piece of software used to output the sound? or are there other built in alternatives that software may use?
Yep.Seeing as VNC, Mplayer, iTunes, system sounds all depend on core audio kinda separates QT from the system as a whole
It's easier to keep that portion split for 3rd party applications to utilize it, and potentially consume less memory space. Less clock cycles would be nice too, but that's not the case here, or this thread wouldn't even exist.
Yep. It's apparently the portion that handles the hardware - software interactions (physical layer access). So if an application wants access to the audio chip, USB or FW audio device, this is engaged.
so, ANY program that produces audio is likely to suffer from this? i thought FW sound devices didnt give the increase in heat?
It would seem that way. Seisend's FW interface and my USB interface cause the temps to increase just by plugging in the device.
Yah. What is weird about his issue, is unlike the Mac Pro issue which this thread details, his Macbook Pro is not affected unless he connects an external sound device. It could be a core audio bug as well, but I still think it is an entirely different process causing that behavior on his Macbook Pro. I am having trouble linking it to what we are seeing on our 09 machines.
RME has a few PCIe cards that work in Macs, but they're nowhere near "cheap". Unfortunately, the least expensive devices I've noticed are either USB or FW interfaced units.
Ouch! Anyone know of a more economical way to facilitate my optimum hacking mode (play Back whilst designing/writing code) ... ie. more economical PCIe sound cards?
It's pathetic on Apple's part that we are in this predicament. After spending $$$$$ on top Apple hardware, we need to seek out a third party solution just to playback music while working.
USB and FW are the more economical solutions for MP's. RME is the only company I'm aware of that makes a PCIe device that works in a MP.
I wish there was better news in this regard, but unfortunately, that's not the case ATM.
It's wait for Apple to solve the issue, or on the slim chance a competitor will release an inexpensive PCIe model that works in a MP.USB and FW are the more economical solutions for MP's. RME is the only company I'm aware of that makes a PCIe device that works in a MP.
I wish there was better news in this regard, but unfortunately, that's not the case ATM.
There is Apogee Symphony PCIe card. But after all, it's a top end solution and expensive. You can't expect quality from an inexpensive PCIe audio card / interface. So therefore , it's a no go for musicians because external devices are a better solution in the same price range.
I was oblivious to this problem, I just happened to see the article on macnn.com. I have a 2.66 Quad, which is used almost exclusively for audio work. I use an M-Audio USB interface.
I'd never looked at my idle temps without the interface on, in fact probably never even booted the machine without the audio interface on until today, therefore had never seen idle CPU temps of 23C.
Just having the interface on but otherwise idle didn't seem to make much difference, 1 or 2C increase in CPU temp after 10 minutes, but I've been listening to music with itunes for about 26 minutes as of now, and the CPU temp is up to 43C, so definately not normal I guess, but nowhere near as bad as some of you guys seem to have been getting.
I was none the wiser and just assumed that CPU temps in the 40s were normal for idle or nearly idle situations, since everything I do involves audio and I'm always using itunes if I'm not making my own music, and my audio interface is always on.
I don't think I've ever really checked the temps after a long session with Logic studio, so next time I'm doing a long session, I'll keep an eye on it.
I do feel pretty hacked off now, though. After spending a significant amount of money on a premium product, I expect any problems to be acknowledged and sorted out. I'd be understanding if Apple said "OK, we know there's a problem, we're checking it out but it might take a while".
I'll definitely submit a bug report, but collecting precise data etc. isn't really my forte, so I hope that if I just draw their attention to the big difference in CPU temps when using/not using itunes, then I will have done my bit.
I know that Apple are a big, rich and arrogant company, but you'd have thought they might be a bit more interested in an issue which could mean more problems/early machine failures down the line, especially after the G5 liquid cooling fiasco, and other such problems I've heard about.
Thanks to all who have been trying to raise the profile of this issue. It is obviously working, as I wouldn't have discovered this for myself.
I'd never looked at my idle temps without the interface on, in fact probably never even booted the machine without the audio interface on until today, therefore had never seen idle CPU temps of 23C.
Just having the interface on but otherwise idle didn't seem to make much difference, 1 or 2C increase in CPU temp after 10 minutes, but I've been listening to music with itunes for about 26 minutes as of now, and the CPU temp is up to 43C, so definately not normal I guess, but nowhere near as bad as some of you guys seem to have been getting.
I was none the wiser and just assumed that CPU temps in the 40s were normal for idle or nearly idle situations, since everything I do involves audio and I'm always using itunes if I'm not making my own music, and my audio interface is always on.
I don't think I've ever really checked the temps after a long session with Logic studio, so next time I'm doing a long session, I'll keep an eye on it.
I do feel pretty hacked off now, though. After spending a significant amount of money on a premium product, I expect any problems to be acknowledged and sorted out. I'd be understanding if Apple said "OK, we know there's a problem, we're checking it out but it might take a while".
I'll definitely submit a bug report, but collecting precise data etc. isn't really my forte, so I hope that if I just draw their attention to the big difference in CPU temps when using/not using itunes, then I will have done my bit.
I know that Apple are a big, rich and arrogant company, but you'd have thought they might be a bit more interested in an issue which could mean more problems/early machine failures down the line, especially after the G5 liquid cooling fiasco, and other such problems I've heard about.
Thanks to all who have been trying to raise the profile of this issue. It is obviously working, as I wouldn't have discovered this for myself.
I should have added that those CPU temps I quoted are from istat pro. Having installed and run Temperature Monitor, I am alarmed to see CPU core 1 at 65C. I understand that this may not be an accurate temperature, but I can clearly see that there is something very wrong here.
Good to know RME isn't the only company out there with PCIe gear that will work. It's just that RME is all that I was aware of.
I do recall a long unfulfilled promise by Creative (makers of SoundBlaster products) to produce a Mac compliant product though. It's just remained vaporware, and I've no expectations it will ever surface.
Here's a strange one! I have two external Firewire 800 Hard Drives. Copying files from one external drive to the other, causes the same behavior. Temp jumps up to 60C+ and power consumption goes through the roof. CPU Usage stays below 5% the whole time and it all normalizes when I stop copying files across...
OK, I also did some tests now. I wasn't patient enogh to do it for an extended period of time, but long enough to be able to confirm the theorie you developed during the course of this thread.
In idle state with my USB audio interface unplugged my temps were at 31°/27° C for CPU 1/2, ambient at 22°. Power was at -0,75W/-0,5W (?).
I played music in iTunes until the temperatures stopped rising, which took about 10 minutes (I can also confirm that even the blip sound when pressing the volume keys causes the temperatures to rise). They rose to 52°/42° at 21,88W/22,88W. As soon as I stopped playback the Power values fell slightly below zero again. Ambient temperatures rose to 25°, which is probably due to bad heat dissipation caused by my Mac Pro standing pretty close to a wall corner.
I let it cool down to about 30° again and then plugged in my USB interface (Tascam US-122), which made the Power values immediately jump to 22W/25,88W and the temperatures start to rise.
So, I can confirm the problem with audio interfaces, and I also feel sad now
In idle state with my USB audio interface unplugged my temps were at 31°/27° C for CPU 1/2, ambient at 22°. Power was at -0,75W/-0,5W (?).
I played music in iTunes until the temperatures stopped rising, which took about 10 minutes (I can also confirm that even the blip sound when pressing the volume keys causes the temperatures to rise). They rose to 52°/42° at 21,88W/22,88W. As soon as I stopped playback the Power values fell slightly below zero again. Ambient temperatures rose to 25°, which is probably due to bad heat dissipation caused by my Mac Pro standing pretty close to a wall corner.
I let it cool down to about 30° again and then plugged in my USB interface (Tascam US-122), which made the Power values immediately jump to 22W/25,88W and the temperatures start to rise.
So, I can confirm the problem with audio interfaces, and I also feel sad now
This also explains why a USB webcam w/o audio has the same effect.