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Audio Decoding KILLS MacPro (2009) green factor

nanofrog said:
I'm glad this is finally getting some traction. :)

I still think the real issue lies in the ICH10R drivers though, as that's where the USB, FW, and PWM controller are physically connected. Power Management is a side-ways approach (CPU), but it's better than nothing at all at this point. ;)
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I thought someone proved it was the CPU power management kext several pages back (providing a hacked kext that disabled CPU power management that cleared up the problem but introduced others)? :confused:
 
Hi All


First, thanks to Cindori, sure keeps things cooler :)

Secondly, how many here are using this patch ?
 
VirtualRain said:
I thought someone proved it was the CPU power management kext several pages back (providing a hacked kext that disabled CPU power management that cleared up the problem but introduced others)? :confused:
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cl-user said:
Power Management and Turbo-Mode info

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/nehalem-microarchitecture_9.html
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It's the PWM Controller that has my attention. It's a separate chip that attaches to the ICH10 family, and it's governed by firmware (SMC), not the PCU's functions in the CPU. Even the CPU's connection to the system firmware is through the ICH.
 
Well, my post with a link to the Ars Technica article was banned (big surprise) from Apples discussion boards:

"Apple removed your post on Apple Discussions, titled "Nehalem & Logic owners: you must read this!" because it contained the following: Speculation or Rumors, Discussion of Apple Policies, Procedures or Decisions."

At least we now know that someone from Apple has read the article!!:)
 
Cynicalone said:
Hopefully Apple will have to listen now.

I'm still surprised this didn't make the front page of MacRumors.
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It is on the front page of MacRumors now.

Thanks to everyone who keeps pushing this issue. I would like to purchase a MacPro for a DAW but need a resolution on this issue before I commit to anything.
 
so far its on the following sites:

http://gizmodo.com/5463326/nehalem-mac-pros-have-serious-problems-with-audio-processing

http://www.macnn.com/articles/10/02/03/spikes.in.power.heat/

http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2...ake-20-performance-hit-when-playing-audio.ars

http://9to5mac.com/mac-pro-audio-issues-nehalem-3245934

https://www.macrumors.com/2010/02/0...-and-performance-issues-for-nehalem-mac-pros/

http://www.betalogue.com/2010/01/11/audio-heat/

http://tweetmeme.com/story/523700911/nehalem-mac-pros-take-20-performance-hit-when-playing-audio

http://gadgetblips.dailyradar.com/story/nehalem-mac-pros-have-serious-problems-with-audio/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_Pro#External_links - have links to the news report there

http://i.tuaw.com/2010/02/03/mac-pro-users-reporting-performance-hit-linked-to-audio-use/

Wired - Twittered my Link to Ars
 
don't make any freekin sense, they work in MSN & textmate soon as i enter them in a forum no they dont work :/

fixed now i copied them from a previous post weird....


on a good note i found out my mate has some contacts, in the BBC that decide which news reports get aired & looked into (one of the main TV news here in the UK) he's contacting him & he hopefully if will contact me with more questions.
 
Is this happening in both 32 and 64 bit kernel modes under SL? I have an APC that shows my wattage load at around 325 and doesnt change at all when i try some of the steps here to reproduce it. I'm running SL in 32 kernal bit mode at the moment. 2009 Quad 2.66, 8GB, GTX 285.
 
eyeruh said:
Yes, it affects the early '09 models. I've sent an email to Chris asking him to correct that detail in his article.

If your MOTU interface is firewire or usb, then you most likely are *always* suffering from this bug. If you try benchmarking with the MOTU disconnected, you'll probably see that your machine is faster than you thought it was.


EDIT: Someone else already let Chris know--he's working on fixing it. :)
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I play all of my Mac Pro audio through a MOTU PCI-424 card and MOTU 1224- so this is why I had never seen or heard of the problem until just now? When i switch over to internal audio the CPU wattage immediately increases. Switch back to the 424 and it's back to "normal".
 
Apple's point of view

How about a thought experiment - take Apple's point of view.

They are no fools and must have got the message back last summer when we started to send detailed reports about this bug. It would seem to make no sense not to fix it. But what if it is just not fixable.

So they'd sold many 09MPs and users were largely oblivious of the problem. What could they do? Fess up and offer compensation, or take back the machines and give a refund! And in so doing ruin the current Mac Pro offering. The cost in cash and kudos would have been huge.

Could it be that they decided at the highest level just to play dead, hope they could get away with it. So issued an edict to all staff to play zombie with customer reports (under the usual Apple threat of dire consequences for snitches).

That might account for (a) the uniform stonewalling by Apple staff at every level, (b) their overall stoical silence, (c) their threatening to withdraw AppleCare from customers who speak to the media about it, (d) their veto of references to the ars technica article on their discussion lists (e) the worldwide bewilderment of customers at Apple's conduct in all this - so at odds with the company image.

But now the cat's been levered out of the bag, what can they do. Confess? Then do what. If they can't fix it, what next. Offer a compensation payment to all customers? Somehow I can't see Apple doing that.

If any of this is on target, there'll be midnight oil burning at Apple HQ right now.
 
VirtualRain said:
I refuse to believe this can't be fixed in software or firmware.
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Same here.

It's a software flaw that's the culprit, as it's not occuring when running Windows on the same machine. That's FIXABLE. They just need to stop stone-walling, and get it done. If they're short of staff, hire. They can certainly afford it according to financial data available, and the damage to thier reputation could be far more expensive than a small number of warm (and hopefully highly talented) bodies to dedicate to the MP and Xserve market. :rolleyes:

Users would have more respect if they publicly admitted there's an issue, and they're working on the issue. It could go a long way to alleviate the frustration current users are having, and attract those that are sitting out on the side-lines to go ahead and purchase the systems they need. Just much better method of handling customer/public relations IMO.
 
nanofrog said:
Same here.

It's a software flaw that's the culprit, as it's not occuring when running Windows on the same machine. That's FIXABLE. They just need to stop stone-walling, and get it done. If they're short of staff, hire. They can certainly afford it according to financial data available, and the damage to thier reputation could be far more expensive than a small number of warm (and hopefully highly talented) bodies to dedicate to the MP and Xserve market. :rolleyes:

Users would have more respect if they publicly admitted there's an issue, and they're working on the issue. It could go a long way to alleviate the frustration current users are having, and attract those that are sitting out on the side-lines to go ahead and purchase the systems they need. Just much better method of handling customer/public relations IMO.
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Lets be realistic here, you are asking what is quite probably the most stubborn company in the US to admit not only to an issue in their top of the line computer, a possible flaw in the OS, but also that they have done nothing to help the users thus far. It's like asking water not to be wet.

The only way a specialized team would get assigned to the MP/Xserve department is if Apple had a sudden interest in extorting pros even more than they are now. I don't know about anyone else, but to me this makes the future seem quite bleak.
 
Techhie said:
Lets be realistic here, you are asking what is quite probably the most stubborn company in the US to admit not only to an issue in their top of the line computer, a possible flaw in the OS, but also that they have done nothing to help the users thus far. It's like asking water not to be wet.

The only way a specialized team would get assigned to the MP/Xserve department is if Apple had a sudden interest in extorting pros even more than they are now. I don't know about anyone else, but to me this makes the future seem quite bleak.
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I didn't say I expected that to happen, given their response/stance to date. :D :p
 
It's interesting to read how people will run an application without a clear understanding of what it does.
If you decompile the AppleScript application contained in the ABF installer made by Cindori, you will see that it moves AppleIntelCPUPowerManagement.kext to AppleIntelCPUPowerManagement.old, and then to enable sleep which has now been broken, it installs the SleepEnabler.kext made by pista7.
Besides breaking the power management design, this will cause a kernel panic at boot after an update from 10.6.0-1 to 10.6.2, or from 10.6.2 to 10.6.3, because of incompatibilities between SleepEnabler and kernel versions.
The developer's site for SleepEnabler is at http://code.google.com/p/xnu-sleep-enabler/.
Better to wait for Apple to release a fix, and if you're concerned with component life, use a Fan Control application until then.
 
It seems to me that there are two related problems regarding heat

1. The increased power draw, increased core temperatures, and decreased performance when running audio & video apps; and

2. The seemingly defective fan control.

Has ANYONE heard/seen their fan speeds increase on a 2009 MacPro as they increase processor load? No matter what I'm doing, I NEVER find my MacPro ramping up fan speed. This suggests to me defective fan control software. (I've had to use SMCFanControl to speed up my fans.)

So there may be two defective kexts, one for power control, one for fan control.
 
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