Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
It doesn't cost squat to sit around and think of using your fingers to "rotate" an image on a screen.

It doesn't cost squat (at least initially) for a company like Samsung to simply copy the work of other people. Which is what they (unquestionably) did. Whether that copying rose to the level of infringement is something the courts are working out.

But who are YOU to decide what is, or isn't, "valuable"?

I recall recently being somewhat surprised to learn that the father of (current GOP Presidential hopeful) Jon Huntsman had made a multi-billion dollar fortune largely on his (patented) invention of the "clamshell" container that holds McDonalds hamburgers. It struck me as somewhat ironic that (Mr Huntsman Sr's undisputed business acumen notwithstanding) that a great family fortune could be build around something that was essentially designed to end up as garbage.

The thing is, it isn't up to me. Its up to the market. And in a world where several billion people eat a hamburger each month, anything - no matter how seemingly insignificant or obvious - that makes it even the slightest bit more efficient, is going to be worth a tremendous amount of money. Mr Huntsman Sr's patent on hamburger boxes and egg cartons ultimately a) improved the world and b) made him a very wealthy man.

Apple works in this world. It works in a world where even the slightest improvement in the way a device handles data, or responds to a user's touch or gesture, can make - or break - a device.

Thing is: They are willing to pay for the ideas that make those devices work the way they do. They hire great artists and software engineers. And - yes - they buy the IP of company's like Fingerworks. And yes, they will take legal action to defend the IP that they own.

If you don't like the current legal system regarding Patents - fine. I don't like it either. But lets not pretend that there are a whole lot of easy answers.

And lets not kid ourselves that Apple is the bad guy here. They aren't.
 
If I understand the ruling correctly (I am Dutch, but not a lawyer) it is highly specific indeed.

Apparently, the tab allows one to use a (powerful) single gesture (a swipe) to immediately scroll to the next image, even when one has zoomed in at the current one. It appears that an essential part of the patent involves a _mandatory_ bounce when swiping on zoomed images that are not already aligned to the boundary that the swipe is moving away from; i.e. a second swipe is then needed to scroll to the next image. According to Apple this second swipe avoids desorientation for the user. And as this is basically the main problem that the patent attempts to avoid, and the tab does not _always_ (!) force this second swipe, the judge rules that the tab does not infringe.

Note that the fact that it is _possible_ to have a "bounce back" when the swipe is not powerful enough is not sufficient to infringe on the patent...

This also explains why swiping in general is no problem. The patent specifically deals with the situation of swiping over a "zoomed area" while also having to deal with using the same gesture to get to the next item.

Well, this is really peanuts if you ask me, and I imagine that Samsung is having a party right now.

Yeah, if youre reading is correct they should be popping some dom atm.

Apple is kut! Hoe gaat het met jou?

(dutch pro!)
 
Yeah, if youre reading is correct they should be popping some dom atm.

Apple is kut! Hoe gaat het met jou?

(dutch pro!)

Prima, dank je wel maar ik ga nu wel naar bed! (I am fine, thanks but I am going to sleep now!).

Have to do some windows development tomorrow...
 
Prima, dank je wel maar ik ga nu wel naar bed! (I am fine, thanks but I am going to sleep now!).

Have to do some windows development tomorrow...

Goedenacht. And, so you (and others) know, Jobs just stepped down as CEO. :eek:
 
It doesn't cost squat (at least initially) for a company like Samsung to simply copy the work of other people.

I don't know if I would use the phrase "simply copy", because it's not even close to being an exact reproduction like some chinese clones.

It's a lot harder and more expensive to create the illusion of being similar without resorting to actual copying. Samsung's designers came up with similar but non-infringing icons, similar but non-infringing shape cues.

Ironically, Samsung took the rougher road while other manufacturers took the easy path of avoiding too much similarity. Obviously Samsung thought this would pay off in sales, but it certainly wasn't easy or cheap to do.

Which is what they (unquestionably) did.

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means - princessbride :)

A judge with the power to withhold a product from all of the EU does not agree.
 
Last edited:
Here's a question:

Was Samsung financially impacted by this suit against the Tab?

Does EU law say that the loser must pay for all damages?
According to the verdict, each party has to pay their own expenses in this case. In case Samsung continues to sell the S, SII and Ace after 7 weeks plus a day, the need to pay EUR 100,000 per day or EUR 10,000 per item.

The true answer to your question is unknown; this whole circus costs a lot of money but it is a big advertisement as well. Yesterday (24th) I saw large ads for the 10.1 tab on a station here in NL. They are certainly supported by the exposure received due to this lawsuit.
 
Seems like Samsung keeps coming out on the losing end of these lawsuits and injunctions. Scary thing is, there's lots more coming for them.
 
Agreed

Should we be concerned by this guy's photo library? If I'm not mistaken, we have a photo of two people strapped to the ground in the first photo, and an oncoming train in the second.

Well, creepy patent pics aside, I have to say this is getting pretty silly. How different is swiping left and right to scrolling up and down? Enough to award a patent and ban the sale of phones? Seriously??

This is getting ridiculous. Can't we all just get along?
 
After some L1 level of Korean language training (read as Chrome language translator), I got the following from Samsung blog...
 

Attachments

  • issue_Dutch-Court.jpg
    issue_Dutch-Court.jpg
    141.4 KB · Views: 131
I wonder what will happen when Apple uses the Samsung control button shape and larger screen?

I would like to see voice commands or control buttons for this function. My screen gets way too dirty using my fingers.:D
 
Totally agree with whoever said, "I like apple products, but hate the company". I specifically bought a Galaxy S... because I got fed up having to Jailbreak Iphones and Ipod touches to make them work properly. Apple got successful by innovation, Microsoft got successful by stifling competition, and look where that's getting them these days. People like innovation but hate being told what they can use their device for or who they can buy from. Take note Steve - YOU ARE LOSING CUSTOMERS WITH THIS CRAP!

:rolleyes:

It's Microsoft own OS and they can do whatever they want. If they want to throw in a free Internet explorer, Netscape shouldn't be crying. If Microsoft wants to add a free mp3 player, Winapp shouldn't be crying. In Linux Distro and Mac OS X there is also free software bundled but I hear nobody crying about this?

If it wasn't for Microsoft, all of you would be paying for free programs like a Internet Browser, MP3 & Movie player and so on.

Anyway, what Apple is doing is far worse than what Microsoft is doing. Microsoft only made software free with it's OS to gain market share for Internet Explorer and Windows Media Player ( Microsoft is banned from shipping Internet Explorer without offering Firefox and Chrome as alternative ). This is a win for the customer because software has become free. Apple is denying every product in order to gain a monopoly.
 
Yeah, it's pretty pathetic that they're doing this. This is not good at all for the consumers - I actually wanted to buy a Galaxy S2.

This is totally anti-competitive behavior. I love your products Apple, but I'm really starting to hate you as a company.

Yeah... We should encourage more copying and stealing so stuff will be cheaper...

Or wait nobody will create anything then...

Support the people that invent and reinvent product categories, not those who come in later and just copy them and try to profit off their hardwork and investment.
 
Yeah... We should encourage more copying and stealing so stuff will be cheaper...

Or wait nobody will create anything then...

Support the people that invent and reinvent product categories, not those who come in later and just copy them and try to profit off their hardwork and investment.

What company are you talking about?
 
Just in: Samsung is prohibited for selling Galaxy Tab's in Germany

DÜSSELDORF - The South Korean technology group Samsung, the new Galaxy Tab tablets are not sold in Germany because they are too much like the Apple iPad.
Source: NU.nl

That what the court decided in Düsseldorf Thursday.
 
Just in: Samsung is prohibited for selling Galaxy Tab's in Germany

Details are weak :

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/25/us-samsung-court-idUSTRE77O0OU20110825

(Reuters) - A German court upheld an injunction on Thursday sought by Apple banning the sale of Samsung's new Galaxy Tab tablet computers in Germany because they were too similar to Apple's iPad.

The Duesseldorf court had previously imposed an injunction covering the whole of the European Union but later limited it to Germany, saying it was not clear that its jurisdiction extended to the whole bloc in this case.

That question was still being decided by the court on Thursday. Apple and Samsung were also due to make their cases.

Did the hearing even take place ? It's close to 13:30 in Germany now.
 
Just in: Samsung is prohibited for selling Galaxy Tab's in Germany

Will be interesting to read the verdict since the dutch judge pretty much threw it all out. Will also be interesting to see what this really means, given the free-trade nature of the EU. If its just sammy that is blocked, im sure that others (like Mediamarkt) will import the devices on their own. Heck, i can see the ad-campaigns already: BUY THE PAD APPLE BANNED! ONLY AT MEDIAMARKT.

----------

Details are weak :

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/25/us-samsung-court-idUSTRE77O0OU20110825



Did the hearing even take place ? It's close to 13:30 in Germany now.

Apple Inc. (AAPL)’s ban on sales of some of Samsung Electronics Co.’s Galaxy tablet computers is likely to be limited to Germany, a Dusseldorf judge said.

Samsung can overturn the temporary ban if it can show that Apple knew as early as June that the Korean company would start imports into the country, Presiding Judge Johanna Brueckner- Hofmann said. The court’s assessment is preliminary, she said.

“There are a lot of alternative ways to design a tablet device, as the market amply shows,” said Brueckner-Hofmann. “We think Apple EU design rights grant a medium range of protection, if not a broad one.”

The legal battle between Apple and rival smartphone makers is intensifying as an increasing number of consumers use smartphones and handsets to surf the Web, play games and download music and videos. Apple, the world’s top smartphone seller, has filed patent cases against handset makers using Google Inc.’s Android operating system, including Samsung, Motorola Mobility Holdings Inc. and HTC Corp.

The German case is: LG Dusseldorf, 14c O 194/11.

To contact the reporter on this story: Karin Matussek in Dusseldorf at kmatussek@bloomberg.net

To contact the editor responsible for this story: Anthony Aarons at aaarons@Bloomberg.net.​
 
.

Samsung can overturn the temporary ban if it can show that Apple knew as early as June that the Korean company would start imports into the country, Presiding Judge Johanna Brueckner- Hofmann said. The court’s assessment is preliminary, she said.

I think Amazon.de had pre order Tabs way back in June
 
After some L1 level of Korean language training (read as Chrome language translator), I got the following from Samsung blog...

Thanks for that!

A lot of the Dutch court findings echo opinions that have been posted in these forums. For instance, the comments on Apple's slide-to-unlock patent:

The only difference (between the Neonode and the iPhone) is the use of an unlock image.

The judge finds that the application of such an unlock image is obvious. (...)

It would be trivial to work out the application of such a graphic element (feedback / interaction) from long-known virtual on / off slider buttons (on previous touch UIs).
- Dutch court

Compare that to my own comments here, back in 2010:

As I've pointed out before, the Neonode N1 was using a horizontal swipe to unlock back in 2002.

The Apple patent is about moving a (optionally I think) visible object completely down a visible path in order to unlock.

(Which I personally consider obvious because if a boss came to a programmer and said "let's do an unlock swipe like the Neonode, but I want it incredibly obvious for the user to know what to do", then any programmer would've come up with the visible objects.)
- kdarling
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.