Basic Driving Lessons 101: Which do you do?

Misskitty

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 18, 2010
447
2
The other day I had to drive my dad to get the car (worst thing ever, next time he can take a taxi). Everyone doesnt want him in their car for this very reason - he thinks hes perfect and this Mr. know it all perfectionist driver. Just in general, hes always right, hes never wrong and its only others who are wrong. Just cause you've been driving for over 70 years doesnt mean anything. Hes always been like this even when he was in his 40s. He will always try to correct you and pinpoints the stupidest flaws, flaws that arent even valid. Anyway, I wasnt looking forward to it at all.

We got in, I backed out of the driveway and right away hes on my case (in this cranky voice) "Youre not suppose to back out like that blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Me: "uhh ok, really....everyone does it. Thats why you look both ways first"
Him: "It doesnt matter, this is how people get into accidents"
Me: shaking my head, rolling my eyes
Him: "You want to do it the wrong way, then fine, dont come to me when someone hits you."
Me: Im just sitting there "omg" "ive been doing this since i started driving 17 years ago....looks like I just got lucky all this time eh considering no one has hit me"
Him: "It doesnt matter, thats not how you back out"
Him: "I learned this from a friend over 60 years ago, i think i know what im talking about." blah blah blah blah blah
Me: Turns up music to ignore him and drown out his voice. Honestly I have no tolerance for garbage like this and especially when ive been driving for 17 years. You want to criticize over nothing then go find some 16 yr old kid who is just learning to drive.

Now this is taking it that you back out, with the intention of heading to the right, so the lane youre getting into is opposite side of the street from your house.

This is how I back out and everyone I know (black line). The green line is how he backs out every single time he pulls out of the house (good mother of god). I dont know a single person who backs out like he does but considering hes perfect and knows it all and is never wrong in life....that means every single one of you, and everyone you know in your life are backing out of your driveways wrong! Completely wrong! All of you! *sigh*

 
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mobilehaathi

macrumors G3
Aug 19, 2008
9,347
6,217
The Anthropocene
You seem to air a lot of your grievances here...


How I would back out depends strongly on the street I'm backing out into. Whether it is a small low traffic side street versus a broad high traffic thoroughfare clearly makes a difference.
 
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Misskitty

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 18, 2010
447
2
You seem to air a lot of your grievances here...


How I would back out depends strongly on the street I'm backing out into. Whether it is a small low traffic side street versus a broad high traffic thoroughfare clearly makes a difference.
Yes of course, but here its strictly residental and not the interstate freeway.;)

obviously if it was a much more congested main road, you would be a moron for backing out into the lane across from you. I've seen some of the stupidest driving habits ever in my life and ive never ever seen anyone do this before on a busy road.
 

Scepticalscribe

macrumors Sandy Bridge
Jul 29, 2008
45,518
30,748
The Far Horizon
You seem to air a lot of your grievances here...


How I would back out depends strongly on the street I'm backing out into. Whether it is a small low traffic side street versus a broad high traffic thoroughfare clearly makes a difference.
Um, yes. Actually, to a large extent, I am in agreement with you on both points.

Re the street, yes, it depends on the street, volume of traffic and so on. Regarding elderly parental passengers, the day will come (and it does) when - surprisingly quickly - you become their taxi service. And then another day will come when you will be glad to remember a correcting voice, because advancing age and increasing neediness will obviate any need for any meaningful conversation.
 

DeltaMac

macrumors G3
Jul 30, 2003
9,535
2,303
Delaware
I should point out that I have a big pet peeve about aggressive driving.
I guess I drive like your dad (and I probably share his point of view about defensive driving - it's also how I was taught in driver's ed. I detest (and will avoid at all costs) backing out across a traffic lane to go the "wrong" direction.
And, there's the alternate (which is how I would do that) - park in your driveway nose out - so you don't have to put yourself at risk by backing out into traffic.
But, if the street is low traffic (side street, dead end, etc) then you should do what you feel comfortable with. Try not to let your attitude affect your relationship with your father. It's not your fault, you know...
 

carjakester

macrumors 68020
Oct 21, 2013
2,226
55
Midwest
around here everyone backs out to whichever direction you are going. as long as you don't block traffic i don't see whats wrong with it. No point in doing all that extra driving when you can just turn the other way to begin with. That reminds me of how UPS/Fedex drivers try to make their routes with 3 rights instead of a left turn to save time/gas.
 

Misskitty

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 18, 2010
447
2
I should point out that I have a big pet peeve about aggressive driving.
I guess I drive like your dad (and I probably share his point of view about defensive driving - it's also how I was taught in driver's ed. I detest (and will avoid at all costs) backing out across a traffic lane to go the "wrong" direction.
And, there's the alternate (which is how I would do that) - park in your driveway nose out - so you don't have to put yourself at risk by backing out into traffic.
But, if the street is low traffic (side street, dead end, etc) then you should do what you feel comfortable with. Try not to let your attitude affect your relationship with your father. It's not your fault, you know...
Oh you dont know how my dad drives. NO ONE and I mean not a single person on this planet drives like him.

He drives only residental streets and through the city core where stop and go traffic is at its worst and theres stop signs/red lights within metres of one another. He never takes the high or freeways.

In fact he doesnt even drive, he just taps the gas periodically. His old car (has new one now and thats where i was taking him in my O.P), has been driven like a shopping cart in an empty parking lot. More cars pass him on a daily basis than tourists passing through the red light district in Ampsterdam, dead serious.

I remember one time like 6 or 7 years ago, I was in his car and we were just on a normal flat road (60-70kmh speed limit) and my dad wasnt even hitting the gas. He just let the foot off the gas and let it roll until it got too slow and had cars behind honking, then he would tap the gas again for one second and let go. This is just how he drives. And the reason why no one but my mom rides with him ever. Tap the gas for one sec, immediately let go, few secs later when the speed drops, hit the gas again for one second.

And this explains why hundreds of cars pass him no matter where he is haha. I know theres a few reasons why he will never take a free or highway and quite frankly theyre all a bunch of bologne. My dad never takes any highway or even freeway that has no lights within a 3km distance. All stop and go, light to light, stop sign to stop sign.

He even takes ridiculously long detours and drives through downtown during rush hour with all the traffic just to avoid the freeway, even if there was a freeway that took him to where he had to go in 1/3 the time. Absolutely bizzarre indeed and thats why I say no one drives like him and no one wants to drive with him. You drive with him and you might as well ride a tricycle.

Those 5km trips are 10km in his car.
Those 20 min trips are 45-60mins in his car.

Poor car. Poor gas milage. Poor wallet. But he doesnt get it.
 

smithrh

macrumors 68020
Feb 28, 2009
2,463
833
This is interesting - I've known a few people that also avoid expressways/major highways. Either they just won't use them, or they'll jump at any reason at all to get off and use side streets.

I wonder why this is, do they somehow think there's less risk on the side streets?
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Nehalem
Feb 21, 2012
32,801
22,653
Behind the Lens, UK
The other day I had to drive my dad to get the car (worst thing ever, next time he can take a taxi). Everyone doesnt want him in their car for this very reason - he thinks hes perfect and this Mr. know it all perfectionist driver. Just in general, hes always right, hes never wrong and its only others who are wrong. Just cause you've been driving for over 70 years doesnt mean anything. Hes always been like this even when he was in his 40s. He will always try to correct you and pinpoints the stupidest flaws, flaws that arent even valid. Anyway, I wasnt looking forward to it at all.

We got in, I backed out of the driveway and right away hes on my case (in this cranky voice) "Youre not suppose to back out like that blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Me: "uhh ok, really....everyone does it. Thats why you look both ways first"
Him: "It doesnt matter, this is how people get into accidents"
Me: shaking my head, rolling my eyes
Him: "You want to do it the wrong way, then fine, dont come to me when someone hits you."
Me: Im just sitting there "omg" "ive been doing this since i started driving 17 years ago....looks like I just got lucky all this time eh considering no one has hit me"
Him: "It doesnt matter, thats not how you back out"
Him: "I learned this from a friend over 60 years ago, i think i know what im talking about." blah blah blah blah blah
Me: Turns up music to ignore him and drown out his voice. Honestly I have no tolerance for garbage like this and especially when ive been driving for 17 years. You want to criticize over nothing then go find some 16 yr old kid who is just learning to drive.

Now this is taking it that you back out, with the intention of heading to the right, so the lane youre getting into is opposite side of the street from your house.

This is how I back out and everyone I know (black line). The green line is how he backs out every single time he pulls out of the house (good mother of god). I dont know a single person who backs out like he does but considering hes perfect and knows it all and is never wrong in life....that means every single one of you, and everyone you know in your life are backing out of your driveways wrong! Completely wrong! All of you! *sigh*

Image
Well your both wrong. Your not supposed to back out of your drive at all. Your supposed to back into your drive so you can drive out.
 
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Roller

macrumors 68030
Jun 25, 2003
2,527
964
@Misskitty:

As long as you have situational awareness, it doesn't matter if you're backing onto a relatively quiet street. From the diagram, it looks like your dad drives onto the connecting street and pulls a U-turn around a median with some trees, which I would argue is less safe than your method.

However, I would give the guy a break. It's hard to drop old habits, and as Scepticalscribe pointed out, the time will come when your dad won't be able to provide any advice. I'd give anything to spend an hour with my dad, who passed away when I was a kid, even if only to hear him give me bad advice (which he never did).
 

Misskitty

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jun 18, 2010
447
2
This is interesting - I've known a few people that also avoid expressways/major highways. Either they just won't use them, or they'll jump at any reason at all to get off and use side streets.

I wonder why this is, do they somehow think there's less risk on the side streets?
He claims: (Again hes perfect and Mr. know it all, so these all must be facts). :rolleyes:

1) Driving a car gentler is better for the car and will make it last longer. Says merging onto high speed roads overworks the car. LOL. Wrong. Its much easier on any car long term when highway driven. Ive always tried to tell him that stop and go traffic is much worse on any car. Your wear and tear will be much higher, your engine wont last as long, your milage will suck and as a result more money out of your pocket. But he doesnt care.

Im the complete opposite (but Im smart), where I avoid stop and go traffic whenever I can and 80-90% of my driving is on freeways or highways. He thinks im dumb lol. Ok.

2) Highways and freeways are too dangerous. Sure they are, but not much more than driving downtown during rush hour with 1500 pedestrians around you. The truth is, he feels safe off fast speed roads and plus he doesnt have the attention span to handle highway driving. He would get killed or get someone else killed just trying to merge (thats the honest truth), since he never throttles his car. Feathering your gas in 1 second taps every 3-4 seconds is gonna put you at more of a risk more than anything and this is for all roads. It is quite painful watching him drive. Like just give er geez, cars are machines meant to be pushed.

It would actually be worse for the car engine by giving it one sec taps every 3-4 seconds than just keeping your foot on the gas. Itll save your foot and ankle too since its not going back and fourth 5084 times on a 5km trip. Good riddance.

3) About 10 years ago, he hit a pedestrian crossing the street. Hes very fortunate that he didnt get charged. My mom was in the car as well and was very upset and my dad was shaken up. This was 10 years ago. His attention span and concentration on the roads is noticably worse today than it was before. I keep telling him, why drive so much? Cut back on it and rest up in your free time. But nooo, he'd rather just drive for 8 hours a day, everyday of the week, everyday of the year for nothing. Most of the time he just drives for the sake of driving, with no destination to go. I understand its nice to just get out and drive and not particularly have a place to go to but who does it for 50+ hours a week? Not only are you putting on unneeded milage on the car but wasting gas and money.

Well your both wrong. Your not supposed to back out of your drive at all. Your supposed to back into your drive so you can drive out.
True and i usually do back in (even in reg parking lots etc), but in winters I park straight in on my driveway simply cause I plug in my car on the severe cold days.

@Misskitty:

As long as you have situational awareness, it doesn't matter if you're backing onto a relatively quiet street. From the diagram, it looks like your dad drives onto the connecting street and pulls a U-turn around a median with some trees, which I would argue is less safe than your method.

However, I would give the guy a break. It's hard to drop old habits, and as Scepticalscribe pointed out, the time will come when your dad won't be able to provide any advice. I'd give anything to spend an hour with my dad, who passed away when I was a kid, even if only to hear him give me bad advice (which he never did).
True. My dad and I used to be really close but over the past 10 years I notice we grew apart and dont get along like we once did. Hes crankier, its much more stressful communicating with him and more stubborn than ever (and he was incredibly stubborn even in his 40s).

Its just that over the years Ive tried helping him on certain things and give him advice but he just isnt willing to listen and neglects it cause he wants to do it his way (even though its the wrong way and will lead to a much worse outcome). But like my mother says, hes incredibly stubborn and can be a total hyprocrite at many times. No matter how hard someone tries to teach him or help him on something, he doesnt listen, not even open to hearing what the other person has to say. So mom says just let him do it how he wants and let him learn the hard way.
 
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Huntn

macrumors demi-god
May 5, 2008
17,060
16,569
The Misty Mountains
The other day I had to drive my dad to get the car (worst thing ever, next time he can take a taxi). Everyone doesnt want him in their car for this very reason - he thinks hes perfect and this Mr. know it all perfectionist driver. Just in general, hes always right, hes never wrong and its only others who are wrong. Just cause you've been driving for over 70 years doesnt mean anything. Hes always been like this even when he was in his 40s. He will always try to correct you and pinpoints the stupidest flaws, flaws that arent even valid. Anyway, I wasnt looking forward to it at all.

We got in, I backed out of the driveway and right away hes on my case (in this cranky voice) "Youre not suppose to back out like that blah blah blah blah blah blah"

Me: "uhh ok, really....everyone does it. Thats why you look both ways first"
Him: "It doesnt matter, this is how people get into accidents"
Me: shaking my head, rolling my eyes
Him: "You want to do it the wrong way, then fine, dont come to me when someone hits you."
Me: Im just sitting there "omg" "ive been doing this since i started driving 17 years ago....looks like I just got lucky all this time eh considering no one has hit me"
Him: "It doesnt matter, thats not how you back out"
Him: "I learned this from a friend over 60 years ago, i think i know what im talking about." blah blah blah blah blah
Me: Turns up music to ignore him and drown out his voice. Honestly I have no tolerance for garbage like this and especially when ive been driving for 17 years. You want to criticize over nothing then go find some 16 yr old kid who is just learning to drive.

Now this is taking it that you back out, with the intention of heading to the right, so the lane youre getting into is opposite side of the street from your house.

This is how I back out and everyone I know (black line). The green line is how he backs out every single time he pulls out of the house (good mother of god). I dont know a single person who backs out like he does but considering hes perfect and knows it all and is never wrong in life....that means every single one of you, and everyone you know in your life are backing out of your driveways wrong! Completely wrong! All of you! *sigh*

Image
If you back out represented by the black line, why did you label it "the wrong way" or is this how your Dad describes it?

Based on your drawing, I say it depends. If you want to go to the right, and there is no traffic, the black line works. If traffic is heavy and you'd have to negotiate 2 lines of traffic, heading in opposite directions, then use the green line, when the close lane traffic allows. The key is flexibility. :)
 

snberk103

macrumors 603
Oct 22, 2007
5,484
87
An Island in the Salish Sea
The other day I had to drive my dad to get the car ...
Just remember - one day you will be as old as your dad. And things you are learning now will be as obsolete as the attitudes you are complaining about in your dad. And ... you will be missing your dad.

I am not nearly as old as your father - and some of things I learned in Driver's Ed are now considered wrong. It wasn't wrong then... but cars have changed since then. I actually have a vague memory of being taught to do what your dad does to get out of a driveway.... But conditions have changed and when you get older it is sometimes difficult to be as flexible as you once were.

Here's an interesting thought exercise. Consider the technologies that didn't exist when your dad was young, and that he is now having to deal with them. Now consider that when you are his age you will be facing even bigger changes in how things work. And your child will be complaining about how 'backwards' you are. So instead of ranting and raving about how he does things... identify one priority area and see if you can bring him around. Not with a debate or an argument or logic... just gently and with compassion and encouragement. It will be good for both you and your dad, I suspect.

Good Luck
 
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Renzatic

Suspended
Green line is correct, likely the black line is illegal. If it was a small empty residential road, I'd probably do the black line though.
Yup. Backing out across a lane of traffic is only illegal (or at least enforced) on wide, busy roads where people tend to drive at higher speeds or merge in and out quite a bit.

If you back out like that on a highway or on a street downtown, you'll get your ass busted. And if you cause an accident, it's automatically your fault. But on a little road in the middle of a subdivision, no one will care one way or another.
 

turtle777

macrumors 6502a
Apr 30, 2004
678
15
How about backing into the driveway when you arrive ?

That way, you can legally take the black route because you merely make a left turn out of the driveway ?

-t
 
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maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
63,851
30,368
Boston
Here's my $.02
Back into the driveway when you arrive to the house, as its much easier to do this and then you can safely pull out.

Short of doing that, I see no major difference between the two as you'll want to make sure the traffic is clear when backing out. If I were doing it, I'd use the black lines.
 

ucfgrad93

macrumors P6
Aug 17, 2007
17,539
8,163
Colorado
For those of you saying to back into the driveway, what about when they approach the house and have to back up from the other side of the road? They are crossing another lane of traffic just like the black line is doing.
 

Apple fanboy

macrumors Nehalem
Feb 21, 2012
32,801
22,653
Behind the Lens, UK
For those of you saying to back into the driveway, what about when they approach the house and have to back up from the other side of the road? They are crossing another lane of traffic just like the black line is doing.
If you are on the other side of the road you stop, cross the road and park (as if leaving your car out the front of the house. Then when it is clear, reverse onto the drive. This is the legal way to do it.
 

jamesmccoy

macrumors newbie
Jun 7, 2018
6
0
Monahans, Texas
Hi there,

My daughter is only 14 and she wants me to teach her driving. I've been searching for the basics and schemes for her, but I'm not sure if that's the correct method. She can't understand anything from the scheme. I found this one (posted by the OP) and some theory on teen driving essentials.
Do you think I should take her to any off-road driving pace for training? Perhaps I should also look for professional driving instructor's page or something?
Thanks,
James