Besides ivy bridge, is anything else changing with the iMacs?

[Hellhammer]

The roadmaps are basically public knowledge. You can see what they're developing several years out on their own website. Apple does need chips for fine tuning. They probably receive pre production chips for testing. You have to allow a little wiggle room on these things. Bugs pop up. Specs can be a little off, and production can take time to ramp up.

There were already several Ivy Bridge based laptops at CES. Big OEMs like Apple work very closely with Intel and definitely get their hands on engineering samples.

I'll do some research now and post my predictions soon, as people seemed to like them last year

 

[thekev]

iMacs use the same mobile GPUs as the current Macbook Pros, less than an inch thick. Also, check out the new OLEDs that were shown at CES 2012 last week:

Image

Before the white iMac G5 was shown, no one could have imagined a computer could fit in such a thin chassis design. Technology shrinks dramatically over time and this is most definitely not the end of the line. iMacs will get even smaller. It's a constant.



Silence is golden, agreed, and these Macs are already available if you configure it with an SSD. The chin has been shrinking since the G5 iMac was released. In fact, it has shrunk twice since then. Why doubt that it will get even smaller? Again, technology shrinks over time. I won't be surprised if the chin gets cut in half next redesign.

It might get a little smaller. I'm saying that the smaller you make it, the more weight you have to put into the base relative to what it balances without running into other weird design constraints. It has to balance either by weight or leveraging surface area and center of gravity. In any event, it's expensive so you want it to be fully stable. I imagine the chin alone consumes more design hours than people might realize.

The 6970M is the gpu that I had in mind. I should have been specific. That one runs damn hot. It's quite a big leap from the other even if the name sounds similar. The overall tdp there is quite high.

Also thanks for the OLED link. It's pretty cool, but somehow I'm not expecting to see it in a computer display just yet. Televisions generally come out with this stuff earlier. A computer monitor can have a pretty tight pixel density. Again I don't think the imac is Apple's top focus right now, and if they were going to change the display technology, I would hope they would consider the expected display life before it looks ugly relative to what is used currently. Apple has cut a lot of corners on the imacs before. You can call it a beautiful display when you purchase it. Many of them look like garbage after a year.

Given that it is a desktop, it would be nice to see it run a little cooler so that turbo boost could be enabled over a long period of time, but this comes down to design choices. Apple tends to prioritize aesthetics. A user accessible hard drive is one thing that would be extremely nice with these. Hard drives are not reliable, and having

 

[Hellhammer]

$1199 iMac

21.5" 1920x1080 screen
i5-3330S (4/4; 2.7GHz/3.2GHz)
AMD 7750M (512MB GDDR5, 768, ~600MHz)
4GB RAM
500GB HD

$1499 iMac

21.5" 1920x1080 screen
i5-3550S (4/4; 3.0GHz/3.7GHz) - BTO option for i7-3770S (4/8; 3.1GHz/3.9GHz)
AMD 7770M (512MB GDDR5, 768, ~675MHz)
4GB RAM
1TB HD

$1699 iMac

27" 2560x1440 screen
i5-3550S (4/4; 3.0GHz/3.7GHz)
AMD 7770M (512MB GDDR5, 768, ~675MHz)
4GB RAM
1TB HD

$1999 iMac

27" 2560x1440 screen
i5-3470 (4/4; 3.2GHz/3.6GHz) - BTO option for i7-3770 (4/8; 3.5GHz/3.9GHz)
AMD 7970M (1GB GDDR5, 1536, ~700MHz)
4GB RAM
1TB HD

Those are pretty much the straight successors of the components used in current iMac.

Some words on the GPUs though. The number in the middle (768 or 1536) represents the amount of cores. GCN architecture has 16 ALUs per SIMD and 4 SIMDs per CU. 7970 consists of 32 CUs, i.e. 2048 cores. My guess is that 77xxM lineup will consist of 12 CUs, i.e. 768 cores. 79xxM should have double the cores, i.e. 1536. This is also what rumors suggest.

 

[theSeb]

There were already several Ivy Bridge based laptops at CES. Big OEMs like Apple work very closely with Intel and definitely get their hands on engineering samples.

I'll do some research now and post my predictions soon, as people seemed to like them last year

Any info that you have would be very welcome.

On the CES thing, does the hardware really have ivy bridge or are they just demo models specifying what will be inside? I assume the press is not allowed to actually fondle these if they indeed have ivy bridge hardware?

Edit: what are your thought on bto 27" CPUs?

 

[jeremyshaw]

Any info that you have would be very welcome.

On the CES thing, does the hardware really have ivy bridge or are they just demo models specifying what will be inside? I assume the press is not allowed to actually fondle these if they indeed have ivy bridge hardware?

Edit: what are your thought on bto 27" CPUs?

Ivy Bridge was initially supposed to launch in Dec2011 (at least the desktop HW), however, OEM/ODM pressure pushed it back to Mar/April timeframe (primarily due to Sandy Bridge chipset recall taking 3 months or so to resolve).

 

[MacOG728893]

Everything I want is all just wishful thinking for now. Anything Apple chooses to surprise me with be the icing on the cake.

I was going to sell my 1st Gen 27 i5 for the latest 27 i7, but I needed a MacBook for school so a good chunk of my money went to that.

That has been almost a year, I'm just stoked that I'll be getting some minor improvements of SB with benefits of running cooler and more efficient.

 

[Icaras]

Those are pretty much the straight successors of the components used in current iMac.

Some words on the GPUs though. The number in the middle (768 or 1536) represents the amount of cores. GCN architecture has 16 ALUs per SIMD and 4 SIMDs per CU. 7970 consists of 32 CUs, i.e. 2048 cores. My guess is that 77xxM lineup will consist of 12 CUs, i.e. 768 cores. 79xxM should have double the cores, i.e. 1536. This is also what rumors suggest.

It's been a while since I've read your predictions. Surely this must mean iMacs are close

I know hard drive manufacturing is in bit of a pickle right now in Thailand, but what kind of SSD configurations do you think we might we see?

I'm hoping Apple gives us the option for dual SSD drives like the current Mac Mini.

 

[Hellhammer]

Any info that you have would be very welcome.

On the CES thing, does the hardware really have ivy bridge or are they just demo models specifying what will be inside? I assume the press is not allowed to actually fondle these if they indeed have ivy bridge hardware?

There were laptops running Ivy Bridge, not just stickers saying what will be inside. Obviously, the OEMs weren't allowed to share any details of Ivy Bridge and I think press had limited access to those machines (can't install CPU-Z and so on).

Edit: what are your thought on bto 27" CPUs?

Oh, forgot that. Quite obvious that we will see i7-3770.

Ivy Bridge was initially supposed to launch in Dec2011 (at least the desktop HW), however, OEM/ODM pressure pushed it back to Mar/April timeframe (primarily due to Sandy Bridge chipset recall taking 3 months or so to resolve).

I don't think we know the real reason behind this. Intel is moving to tri-gate transistors with IVB and some reports have claimed poor IVB yields, which would explain the delay. On the other hand, the 6-series chipset fiasco is logical explanation as well.

It's been a while since I've read your predictions. Surely this must mean iMacs are close

I know hard drive manufacturing is in bit of a pickle right now in Thailand, but what kind of SSD configurations do you think we might we see?

I'm hoping Apple gives us the option for dual SSD drives like the current Mac Mini.

I don't think we will see a big overhaul here. Most likely just a bit cheaper SSD and possibly 512GB option as well.

 

[MacOG728893]

I don't think we will see a big overhaul here. Most likely just a bit cheaper SSD and possibly 512GB option as well.

If we were to see the current 256GB SSD price be the new 512GB price, I think I would just order that BTO rather than me and my friend (owns an Apple/Windows certified repair shop) trying to install it our selves.

That might be asking for too much, but we'll see!

 

[theSeb]

There were laptops running Ivy Bridge, not just stickers saying what will be inside. Obviously, the OEMs weren't allowed to share any details of Ivy Bridge and I think press had limited access to those machines (can't install CPU-Z and so on).



Oh, forgot that. Quite obvious that we will see i7-3770.

I see. Makes sense, I suppose. Based on your experience, and who you write for, do you think there is any reason for Apple to not include USB 3.0 from a technical perspective?

 

[jeremyshaw]

I see. Makes sense, I suppose. Based on your experience, and who you write for, do you think there is any reason for Apple to not include USB 3.0 from a technical perspective?

Not directed towards me, but still gonna take a shot.

There is no technical reason for not having USB3 if it is indeed part of Ivy Bridge chipset.

Potential reason for not having it is to promote ThunderBolt better. Another reason for not promoting it is because no iPod, iPhone, or iPad currently uses USB3.

 

[theSeb]

Potential reason for not having it is to promote ThunderBolt better.

That doesn't make any sense. Apple will not benefit financially directly from promoting Thunderbolt.

Another reason for not promoting it is because no iPod, iPhone, or iPad currently uses USB3.

A USB 3 port will work with USB 2 devices since it is backwards compatible so connecting those devices won't be an issue.

I am more curious about the technical perspective since USB 3 will be supported by the chipset. I assume this means that USB 2 is still supported natively by the chipset.

 

[Hellhammer]

If we were to see the current 256GB SSD price be the new 512GB price, I think I would just order that BTO rather than me and my friend (owns an Apple/Windows certified repair shop) trying to install it our selves.

That might be asking for too much, but we'll see!

512GB SSDs are still around $700 so I doubt we will see one as the replacement of 256GB. Apple currently charges $600 for the 256GB SSD (or $500 if you don't want the HD). I can see the prices being cut by $100, i.e. $400 if you don't want the HD and $500 with the 1TB HD. Then possibly an option for 512GB for $900/$1000. I would love to see an option for 128GB SSD, though.

I see. Makes sense, I suppose. Based on your experience, and who you write for, do you think there is any reason for Apple to not include USB 3.0 from a technical perspective?

Well, it would save Apple the work of writing drivers for USB 3.0. Then again, they need to write drivers for the 7-series chipsets anyway so I don't think that makes much sense.

Potential reason for not having it is to promote ThunderBolt better. Another reason for not promoting it is because no iPod, iPhone, or iPad currently uses USB3.

We will see SoCs with USB 3.0 support this year, for example TI OMAP 5.

That doesn't make any sense. Apple will not benefit financially directly from promoting Thunderbolt.

I think Apple doesn't always think about the financials. Especially during the era of Steve, if he had decided something, it was also going to happen. If Apple sees Thunderbolt as the best port, then it's possible that they won't add USB 3.0. Personally I doubt this though, as Intel doesn't really palce TB against USB 3.0 - they are coexisting.

I am more curious about the technical perspective since USB 3 will be supported by the chipset. I assume this means that USB 2 is still supported natively by the chipset.

You are only getting a maximum of four USB 3.0 ports from the chipset. The rest are USB 2.0 anyway, plus USB 3.0 is backwards compatible too.

 

[jeremyshaw]

[...]



We will see SoCs with USB 3.0 support this year, for example TI OMAP 5.


[...]

Those are way later in this year

 

[Hellhammer]

Those are way later in this year

They are, but iMacs or other Macs won't be updated again in H2'12 just so they get USB 3.0. Of course, we don't know if Apple will use USB 3.0 in their SoCs but I don't think that matters when discussing USB 3.0 in Macs.

 

[beosound3200]

probably a typo but...

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Ivy-Br...later-this-month-claims-Best-Buy.68812.0.html

 

[MacOG728893]

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512GB SSDs are still around $700 so I doubt we will see one as the replacement of 256GB. Apple currently charges $600 for the 256GB SSD (or $500 if you don't want the HD). I can see the prices being cut by $100, i.e. $400 if you don't want the HD and $500 with the 1TB HD. Then possibly an option for 512GB for $900/$1000. I would love to see an option for 128GB SSD, though.

You're probably right, but I would rather live in a world where my wishful thinking is what actually happens lol.

Let me ask you. Is it still better to buy your own SSD and install it or just have Apple do it for you?

I've heard that they specially fit the SSD for the iMac when you choose a BTO.

 

[Hellhammer]

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You're probably right, but I would rather live in a world where my wishful thinking is what actually happens lol.

Let me ask you. Is it still better to buy your own SSD and install it or just have Apple do it for you?

I've heard that they specially fit the SSD for the iMac when you choose a BTO.

Buying your own is definitely cheaper but installing it can be difficult if you're not good with your hands, although there are great guides. Also, buying from Apple gets you the full warranty so there is no need to take the machine apart if the SSD fails.

 

[Icaras]

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You're probably right, but I would rather live in a world where my wishful thinking is what actually happens lol.

Let me ask you. Is it still better to buy your own SSD and install it or just have Apple do it for you?

I've heard that they specially fit the SSD for the iMac when you choose a BTO.

Yea, I just paid to get the BTO SSD with my 2011 iMac. Forget opening up my iMac, voiding warranties, and dealing with installation on a not-so-user-friendly serviceable design. Personally, I just don't feel comfortable doing that.

But many people do, so you just have to weigh in the pros and cons of it for yourself. If you are willing to spend the extra money, then I think the added security, peace of mind, not to mention convenience of ready out of the box, are well worth it in my opinion.

 

[MacOG728893]

Buying your own is definitely cheaper but installing it can be difficult if you're not good with your hands, although there are great guides. Also, buying from Apple gets you the full warranty so there is no need to take the machine apart if the SSD fails.

Yea, I just paid to get the BTO SSD with my 2011 iMac. Forget opening up my iMac, voiding warranties, and dealing with installation on a not-so-user-friendly serviceable design. Personally, I just don't feel comfortable doing that.

But many people do, so you just have to weigh in the pros and cons of it for yourself. If you are willing to spend the extra money, then I think the added security, peace of mind, not to mention convenience of ready out of the box, are well worth it in my opinion.

Both excellent points! Now to my next question..

Even if prices do not change much, do you think we'll see some better performing SSD's?

That might just make it worth it for me.

 

[Icaras]

Both excellent points! Now to my next question..

Even if prices do not change much, do you think we'll see some better performing SSD's?

That might just make it worth it for me.

I'm pretty sure they could. Check out the recent article about doubled performances on new SSDs (for use in Macbook Airs) from CES 2012 just last week:

http://9to5mac.com/2012/01/11/the-macbook-air-samsung-ssd-is-about-to-get-twice-as-fast/

 

[CrAkD]

anyone think we will see a 6 core imac anytime soon?

 

[MacOG728893]

I'm pretty sure they could. Check out the recent article about doubled performances on new SSDs (for use in Macbook Airs) from CES 2012 just last week:

http://9to5mac.com/2012/01/11/the-macbook-air-samsung-ssd-is-about-to-get-twice-as-fast/

You know most people are saying you won't notice the speed difference and for the average use that's true. But doing any heavy video editing one probably could see the difference. Either way faster helps future proof the purchase anyways.

anyone think we will see a 6 core imac anytime soon?

I kind of asked the same question, check this out..

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1307065/

 

[srxtr]

2012 iMac is gonna be super duper. Let's just leave it at that.

 

[Hellhammer]

Both excellent points! Now to my next question..

Even if prices do not change much, do you think we'll see some better performing SSD's?

That might just make it worth it for me.

I'm pretty sure they could. Check out the recent article about doubled performances on new SSDs (for use in Macbook Airs) from CES 2012 just last week:

http://9to5mac.com/2012/01/11/the-macbook-air-samsung-ssd-is-about-to-get-twice-as-fast/

It's hard to say. Currently, Apple is using Toshiba SSDs in all Macs except MBA (it uses both, Toshiba and Samsung). Toshiba doesn't have a SATA 6Gb/s controller, although it is possible that Apple would be the first to gain access to it. If Apple sticks with Toshiba, then we might see another round of SATA 3Gb/s SSDs. Note that Mac Pro is still SATA 3Gb/s, so it's logical that Apple hasn't switched to SATA 6Gb/s SSDs yet. When/if Mac Pro gets updated, it will also get SATA 6Gb/s.

Samsung has a SATA 6Gb/s SSD (830 Series) so that's definitely an option for Apple if Toshiba is out of the game.

anyone think we will see a 6 core imac anytime soon?

Most likely not until Broadwell, 2014. Ivy Bridge is quad core so it's doubtful that Haswell would bring hex-core to mainstream market as it will be 22nm as well. I wrote a long piece on this awhile back.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/5174/why-ivy-bridge-is-still-quad-core