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All these unfounded accusations from people who are reading other peoples accusations about the i7 MacBooks.:confused:

My 17" i7 amazes me how cool and quiet it is! :)
The case feels cold to the touch doing the usual stuff, while the back gets slightly warmer in the middle if I make it work a little harder.

Sure If I really push it hard it will get hot, but don't all computers. I can toast marshmallows next to the rear fan of my MacPro while its working under heavy loads.

My only other experience of Apple notebooks was an early Core Duo white MacBook that was impossible to use on you lap for mare than 30 mins and you could almost fry an egg on it got so hot. My new i7 is so far from that and these previous gen MacBook Pro people should stop spreading these stories around.
 
While the analysis you provide gives some good logic for not getting the i7, Anandtech's benchmarks show this thing consistently outperforming the i5 version by a hefty margin! I will DEFINITELY be getting the i7 version!!
 
This benchmark shows the core i7 vs the core i5 really well and the reviewer thinks the core i7 is worth the price difference.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3659/apples-15inch-core-i5-macbook-pro-the-one-to-get/3


I wish i could find a benchmark tests between the 15" core i7 with 512 VRAM and the 17" core i5 with 512 VRAM.

If those two came out close I have it as 2134 for the 15" and 2144 for the 17" in the education store pricing. both have the 500gb 5400 because I plan on switching out hdd for a ssd. the 15" with the hi res anti glare and the 17" with the anti glare as well.

any opinions on which one i should go for? i will be using the laptop hopefully for photoshop cs5 and possibly gaming.
 
I wish i could find a benchmark tests between the 15" core i7 with 512 VRAM and the 17" core i5 with 512 VRAM.

If those two came out close I have it as 2134 for the 15" and 2144 for the 17" in the education store pricing. both have the 500gb 5400 because I plan on switching out hdd for a ssd. the 15" with the hi res anti glare and the 17" with the anti glare as well.

any opinions on which one i should go for? i will be using the laptop hopefully for photoshop cs5 and possibly gaming.

I'm debating the same thing; think I'm going for the 17" though because of the higher resolution and the express card slot, which is much more valuable than a processor bump for me.
 
PROs and CONs

It's being said that the PRO of the i7 (performance) is 'small or insignificant' but you can turn that around and say the CONs (heat emitted and battery life) are also 'small and insignificant', which I bet they are.

In real life usage, you are not going to notice literally degrees of difference in temperature on your lap (like "ooh that computer is so much colder than mine"), or an hour's extra battery life or something. Both the PROs and the CONs will be small, really.

So, just get the best you can afford because the higher grade chip you get, the more longevity you are getting for your machine, hence I'm getting the i7.
 
My 17" i7 amazes me how cool and quiet it is! :)
The case feels cold to the touch doing the usual stuff, while the back gets slightly warmer in the middle if I make it work a little harder.

Could you please let us know the configuration of your 17" i7?
 
You are still buying almost the same machine. The i7 monicker is there for marketing purposes, they want you to buy the most expensive one because it is the one that distinguises from the others. i7 sounds big.

The reality is that inside of the little CPU chip, you have exactly the same processor (besides the 1MB cache). Or do you think that the make different processors? i5-540M and i7-620M are either two overclocked versions of i5-520M or the i5-520M and the i5-540 are two underclocked versions of i7-620M. It has always been this way.
 
This benchmark shows the core i7 vs the core i5 really well and the reviewer thinks the core i7 is worth the price difference.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3659/apples-15inch-core-i5-macbook-pro-the-one-to-get/3

Thank you for posting that -- I've been waiting for a good Photoshop benchmark.

Not that it matters since there is no i5 with 512MB VRAM, but I wonder how much of a role the graphics chip played in that....

I wish i could find a benchmark tests between the 15" core i7 with 512 VRAM and the 17" core i5 with 512 VRAM.

If those two came out close I have it as 2134 for the 15" and 2144 for the 17" in the education store pricing. both have the 500gb 5400 because I plan on switching out hdd for a ssd. the 15" with the hi res anti glare and the 17" with the anti glare as well.

any opinions on which one i should go for? i will be using the laptop hopefully for photoshop cs5 and possibly gaming.

I've been considering the same choice for the same reason (although I don't game). Leaning towards the 15 because although 1900x1200 would be sweet, I've worked on 1680x1050 and while I like having more space (I have dual 1680x1050 monitors at the moment) it's sufficient for everything I do except Flash.

The express card slot is really the only major difference between the two other than the resolution. I'm just not convinced that it's enough to make up for the loss in portability and laptop comfort (I'm a small person).
 
Geekbench scores are starting to pour in for the new models. When looking at Geekbench scores, you have to be sure you are comparing 32-bit mode tests to other 32-bit mode tests and 64-bit tests to other 64-bit tests.

I took the first ten 32-bit Geekbench scores for each model and averaged them. Looking strictly at 32-bit scores, here are the results:

2.40GHz Core i5: 4753
2.53GHz Core i5: 4964
2.66GHz Core i7: 5429

So, looking strictly at CPU and memory performance (what Geekbench measures)....

The 2.53GHz Core i5 has a 5.2% faster clock speed than the 2.40GHz Core i5 but in Geekbench testing the 2.53GHz Core i5 is only 4.3% faster than the 2.40GHz Core i5. If you equip the 2.40GHz Core i5 with a 500GB 5400rpm drive, the price difference is only $100. That 5.1% price difference buys you 4.3% better performance and no difference in video memory.

The 2.66GHz Core i7 has a 9.8% faster clock speed than the 2.40GHz Core i5 and in Geekbench testing the 2.66GHz Core i7 is 12.5% faster than the 2.40GHz Core i5. If you equip the 2.40GHz Core i5 with a 500GB 5400rpm drive, the price difference is $300. That 13.7% price difference buys you 12.5% better performance AND double the video memory.

The 2.66GHz Core i7 has a 4.9% faster clock speed than the 2.53GHz Core i5 and in Geekbench testing the 2.66GHz Core i7 is 8.6% faster than the 2.53GHz Core i5. The price difference between those two is $200. That 9.1% price difference buys you 8.6% better performance AND double the video memory.

As you can see, the Core i7 is definitely faster. And not just because it has a faster clock speed.

The (so far) "missing link" is how much of a difference the Core i7 model's additional graphics memory will make for applications that take advantage of it. Me, I use Aperture 3 heavily, along with some Photoshop. Both of those apps love extra video RAM (and are CPU intensive anyway) so I have ordered the Core i7. My current MacBook Pro (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo) is 3 years old. If I keep the Core i7 just as long, the $200-$300 price difference amortized over 36 months works out to $5-$8 per month. Chump change considering the additional speed. And, in 3 years, the Core i7 will net a higher resale value too.

Each person has to decide which model makes sense for them. But I think the 12.5% performance difference between the top of the line Core i7 and the bottom of the line Core i5 is significant enough to justify the money. Particularly given the upside potential for OpenCL and graphics due to double the video memory.

Lastly, to help put these figures in perspective, here are the Geekbench scores from two of my current Macs:

MacBook Pro 2.2HGz Core 2 Duo: 3110
Mac Pro 2 x 2.66GHz Xeon (four cores): 5628

That's a Mac Pro 1,1 model. A large, heavy, power hungry chunk of aluminum. Granted, it's also about 3 years old but look at that score and compare it to the new 2.66 Core i7. My new MacBook Pro is almost as fast as my Mac Pro! Freaking awesome!

EDIT: BTW, I ordered through my employer's employee purchase plan site. The discount on the more expensive models is slightly better. So my actual cost difference between the 2.40GHz Core i5 (with 500GB 5400rpm drive) and the 2.66GHz Core i7 is 11.8%. 11.8% more expensive to get 12.5% better performance. A no brainer for me. :)

Mark

Want to thank you for this post, it helped make my mind up as to what to purchase and took the plunge for an i7 :D

Loving it so far, generally cooler than my previous late 2008 2.4GHz model. Just tried running Crysis, left the resolution at the default 1024x768 and hit the optimal settings button. The game then selected high settings so gave it a go and ran smoothly. Also didn't notice it get any hotter than how my previous MBP did under full load, very impressed.
 
Want to thank you for this post, it helped make my mind up as to what to purchase and took the plunge for an i7 :D

Loving it so far, generally cooler than my previous late 2008 2.4GHz model. Just tried running Crysis, left the resolution at the default 1024x768 and hit the optimal settings button. The game then selected high settings so gave it a go and ran smoothly. Also didn't notice it get any hotter than how my previous MBP did under full load, very impressed.

Glad I could help! I'm loving my new Core i7!

Mark
 
I'm thinking of picking up the 17" but I can't decide between the i5 and the i7. I'm waiting for more real world posts on operating temperatures.

If 1920x1200 is the native resolution on the 17", how will 1680 by 1050 look? Will it be pixellated? I don't know if my eyes will be able to cope with 1920x1200. I originally thouht about getting the hi-res 15" but I figured 1680 on that would be too small for me. I don't have good eyes and they get tired easily so I'm opting for anti-glare.
 
I'm thinking of picking up the 17" but I can't decide between the i5 and the i7. I'm waiting for more real world posts on operating temperatures.

If 1920x1200 is the native resolution on the 17", how will 1680 by 1050 look? Will it be pixellated? I don't know if my eyes will be able to cope with 1920x1200. I originally thouht about getting the hi-res 15" but I figured 1680 on that would be too small for me. I don't have good eyes and they get tired easily so I'm opting for anti-glare.

I bought the 17" i5 the other day and I'm having buyers remorse. I really want the 17" i7. What's going to happen if I take it back to an apple store and try to exchange it for the i7? What about if I call apple and do it thru the mail. Will I have to pay a restock fee to upgrade to the i7?
 
I bought the 17" i5 the other day and I'm having buyers remorse. I really want the 17" i7. What's going to happen if I take it back to an apple store and try to exchange it for the i7? What about if I call apple and do it thru the mail. Will I have to pay a restock fee to upgrade to the i7?

10% restock
 
I'm thinking of picking up the 17" but I can't decide between the i5 and the i7. I'm waiting for more real world posts on operating temperatures.

If 1920x1200 is the native resolution on the 17", how will 1680 by 1050 look? Will it be pixellated? I don't know if my eyes will be able to cope with 1920x1200. I originally thouht about getting the hi-res 15" but I figured 1680 on that would be too small for me. I don't have good eyes and they get tired easily so I'm opting for anti-glare.

Non-native resolutions typically look pretty icky. You could get away with 960x600, but I don't know why you'd want to.

If you don't want the high resolution, why are you going for the 17"?
 
I don't know if my eyes will be able to cope with 1920x1200. I originally thouht about getting the hi-res 15" but I figured 1680 on that would be too small for me.

The 17" at 1920x1200 has more pixels per inch than the 15" at 1680x1050 so if you think the hi-res 15" will have text/images too small then the 17" at 1920x1200 will be even smaller. And yes, splitpea is right, non-native resolutions do look much fuzzier than native resolutions so if you drop the 17" to 1680x1050 the lack of sharpness could cause you eye strain.
 
Damn review.. now I'm in doubt again :mad: :p

Have you done the math on the % increase?

General OS
i7 38 3.95%
i5 39.5

Adobe Photo shop
i7 31 12.26%
i5 34.8


Apeture 2 Raw Import
i7 2.37 11.79%
i5 2.12


3d Rendering 2 Raw Import
i7 3925 14.73%
i5 3421


3d Rendering 2 Raw Import
i7 8530 14.24%
i5 7467


Video Encoding
i7 100.4 15.14%
i5 87.2

Average
12.02%



Price
i7 2199 22.23%
i5 1799
 
The reality is that inside of the little CPU chip, you have exactly the same processor (besides the 1MB cache). Or do you think that the make different processors?

I do, and I have very good reason to think that, in general, they make many different processors. It's not uncommon to have significant non-obvious differences. Often, they don't show up obviously in the basic specs, but once you look closer, you can see a lot of differences.

It's like with GPUs; some of the difference might be clock speed, but there's also the number of shaders, and the efficiency of shaders. You can have two chips with the same number of shaders, same clock speed, and same memory interface, and one can be 20% faster than the other.

So unless you've got concrete evidence that i7 are actually identical hardware, rather than hardware from the same model family, my default assumption is going to be that they are in fact different, just as there's been differences between lots of other Intel CPU lines in the past.
 
Wow, many thanks for your clear grade.

Is there any defect (grade)?
kinda how is i7 hotter (number)? less battery life time between i7/i5?
it definitely some trade off......I'm so desired to know these too......

Is anyone having?

thanks again

Have you done the math on the % increase?

General OS
i7 38 3.95%
i5 39.5

Adobe Photo shop
i7 31 12.26%
i5 34.8


Apeture 2 Raw Import
i7 2.37 11.79%
i5 2.12


3d Rendering 2 Raw Import
i7 3925 14.73%
i5 3421


3d Rendering 2 Raw Import
i7 8530 14.24%
i5 7467


Video Encoding
i7 100.4 15.14%
i5 87.2

Average
12.02%



Price
i7 2199 22.23%
i5 1799
 
I do, and I have very good reason to think that, in general, they make many different processors. It's not uncommon to have significant non-obvious differences. Often, they don't show up obviously in the basic specs, but once you look closer, you can see a lot of differences.

It's like with GPUs; some of the difference might be clock speed, but there's also the number of shaders, and the efficiency of shaders. You can have two chips with the same number of shaders, same clock speed, and same memory interface, and one can be 20% faster than the other.

So unless you've got concrete evidence that i7 are actually identical hardware, rather than hardware from the same model family, my default assumption is going to be that they are in fact different, just as there's been differences between lots of other Intel CPU lines in the past.

Pretty Close...

http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=47341

http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=43560

i7 (i7-620M) i5 (i5-520M)
# Cores 2 2
# Threads 4 4
Clock Speed 2.66 2.4
Max Turbo 3.333 2.933
Smart Cache 4 3
Bus/Core Ratio 20 18
DMI 2.5 2.5
Lithography 32 32
Max Mem 8 8
Type DDR3 DDR3
Mem Chan 2 2
Bandwidth 17.1 17.1
Address 36 36
ECC No No


Apple is doing what Intel expects (Charge more for the i7). The i7 is better, but I don't think it is much better in the CURRENT mobile form. Right now the best deal in my openion is the $1799 Macbook. I do think that if you really want to spend the money buy the i7, but don't expect that you will get the performance gain you would have gotten on previous computers.

I think Intel could have done better...

That's my .02 ...

Look here and you will see that the i5 is a super deal compared to the previous version of the Mac Book. If you add some disk performance, maybe a 7200 RPM Drive you can beat the previous versions where this one is weak..

http://www.macworld.com/article/147273/2010/04/benchmarks_corei5mbp_15in240ghz.html
 
Forget which website, but read some i7 utilize triple-channel memory, while all i5s access dual-channel memory. What does our i7 use, triple or dual channel?
 
I'm thinking of picking up the 17" but I can't decide between the i5 and the i7. I'm waiting for more real world posts on operating temperatures.

If 1920x1200 is the native resolution on the 17", how will 1680 by 1050 look? Will it be pixellated? I don't know if my eyes will be able to cope with 1920x1200. I originally thouht about getting the hi-res 15" but I figured 1680 on that would be too small for me. I don't have good eyes and they get tired easily so I'm opting for anti-glare.

You could always go to the Apple store and look for yourself. I've been there a few times now and find the 17" looks fine, even though my eyes are getting worse and worse.

You don't have to change the screen resolution. In most programs you can up the font size (as in Safari) or zoom the window as in Keynote, Pages, InDesign, etc. to make the characters larger. This still gives you finer rendering of the images and larger fonts when you need them.
 
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