'Brutal Battle' Expected as Regulators Close in on Apple Around the World

[bookofxero]

There have been competitors - including Microsoft and Palm, amongst others. They could not effectively compete despite their best attempts. There are Linux distros that are trying to break into the mobile market which, while seemingly interesting, are not quite ready for prime time. There comes a point where it feels like they are not promoting competition so much as punishing success and trying to get as much money out of Apple and Google as possible.
If Microsoft, with all their resources, could not effectively compete, what do they expect just about any other company to be able to do? And I disagree that the App Store should be treated differently than any big box membership club (eg, Sam's, Costco, BJ's, etc) that - gasp! - makes a profit from what they allow to be sold in their stores.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Guess you missed the key part about limited government (not no government). And it was working just fine for the US as a constitutionally limited republic.

Perhaps. Except each state is controlled by a government also. So it’s just moved the onus, it’s really just an illusion for regular people.

 

[dk001]

It's nearly guaranteed that many apps would immediately pull out of the App Store and go direct to consumer, and do who knows what else to their apps in the process. Which ones remain to be seen.

According to what?
If that was true we would have seen the same at least in part in Android. We haven't. Those few that tried went back.

There is nothing at this time to support your statement in any fashion.
As far as I know.

 

[izzy0242mr]

Ecosia!!!!
Been using this since six month. I’m happy

How does it compare to Google? Never heard of it but I'm glad there are other options you like!

 

[siddavis]

Perhaps. Except each state is controlled by a government also. So it’s just moved the onus, it’s really just an illusion for regular people.

Yes, federalism. It limits (supposed to anyway) the federal government to only those powers enumerated in the constitution. The rest fall to the states. More localized control means your voice is more powerful. But people just keep pushing for their nanny to take care of everything for them!

 

[Nuno Lopes]

This is a great way to put it even though I do not agree that regulators should meddle here.

I might respect an opposite POV of mine. What I do not respect is a POV that resorts to gaslighting, case is case use Privacy as the core reason why iOS policies are what they are ... when it is not, instead of focusing the argumentation on the merits of the actual reasons. I might disagree with them or not ... but it does weakens the potential merits of the actual reasons ... rising even more suspicions over the act than clarify it.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Yes, federalism. It limits (supposed to anyway) the federal government to only those powers enumerated in the constitution. The rest fall to the states. More localized control means your voice is more powerful. But people just keep pushing for their nanny to take care of everything for them!

Well I’m from a different part of the world, so I can’t really comment. But government is government. It benefits the local government that they aren’t controlled by the main gov, but you yourself likely gain little from this. You’re still governed, after all.

 

[ian87w]

Where were these regulators when Windows Phone and WebOS were around? The "duopoly" was actually the end result of market competition.

Take your electricity company. Can you elect to get electricity from dozens of company? No, only one. The same with your ISP. Do you have a choice of dozens? No, just a handful. The same with wireless carriers, as in the end, there will be consolidations as the market simply doesn't have room for unlimited competitors.

The regulators cannot claim lack of competition when what we have is actually the result of competition.

 

[vipergts2207]

Where were these regulators when Windows Phone and WebOS were around? The "duopoly" was actually the end result of market competition.

Take your electricity company. Can you elect to get electricity from dozens of company? No, only one. The same with your ISP. Do you have a choice of dozens? No, just a handful. The same with wireless carriers, as in the end, there will be consolidations as the market simply doesn't have room for unlimited competitors.

Interesting, you seem to be unaware that because the lack of competition with utilities they are usually regulated through a state's public utilities commission. Is that what you're advocating be done with Apple and Google then?

The regulators cannot claim lack of competition when what we have is actually the result of competition.

They can actually. In such an instance we can say that there used to be competition, but now there no longer is.

 

[I7guy]

Using Google doesn't sacrifice any privacy versus other options like DuckDuckGo? You sure about that?

You were the one that brought up Siri.

If you use Siri to perform a search by voice rather than by typing in Safari, it uses Google who is known to lack the privacy offered by other search providers, rather than using the provider you've selected in your settings for Safari. Is that precise enough for you?

Can you tell us what information Siri exchanges with google? Do you want Siri to give sub-par search results by using Yahoo? You may want to get subpar results, I don't. So I'm totally fine if Siri uses google I use google by typing in google.com. And this sub-conversation is a smoke screen anyway. None of the this changes the fact that Apple claims they protect your PII.

 

[I7guy]

The sooner you learn that, the better off you'll be.

It's irrelevant. You can trust apple or not or trust google or not. For me it doesn't change anything.

 

[I7guy]

Well, I took that statement as Apple being the champion of privacy while western regulators are not.

Yet Apple was quick to release users data ... abandon privacy .... to a government and invest in such a market to maintain the App Store modus operandi ... which actually the topic being regulated.

As much as Apple would like this topic to be about Privacy actually is not. In that respect it lost all credibility already if not for the uninformed.

What? I'm not sure if we are being gaslighted or not. It seems to some Apples' definition of privacy is a rolling definition.

 

[I7guy]

According to what?
If that was true we would have seen the same at least in part in Android. We haven't. Those few that tried went back.

There is nothing at this time to support your statement in any fashion.
As far as I know.

Maybe the scale of the economics are different from android than ios for the respective app stores.

 

[Stromos]

Where were these regulators when Windows Phone and WebOS were around? The "duopoly" was actually the end result of market competition.

Take your electricity company. Can you elect to get electricity from dozens of company? No, only one. The same with your ISP. Do you have a choice of dozens? No, just a handful. The same with wireless carriers, as in the end, there will be consolidations as the market simply doesn't have room for unlimited competitors.

The regulators cannot claim lack of competition when what we have is actually the result of competition.

Funny I can choose between about 10 trash vendors and about 8 Natural Gas companies.

 

[vipergts2207]

You were the one that brought up Siri.


Can you tell us what information Siri exchanges with google? Do you want Siri to give sub-par search results by using Yahoo? You may want to get subpar results, I don't. So I'm totally fine if Siri uses google I use google by typing in google.com. And this sub-conversation is a smoke screen anyway. None of the this changes the fact that Apple claims they protect your PII.

Siri may not exchange anything directly with Google, but what does Google do once you start clicking around on their website that Siri directed you to?

 

[cupcakes2000]

Siri may not exchange anything directly with Google, but what does Google do once you start clicking around on their website that Siri directed you to?

Not much if you have private relay on. Automatic for anyone that pays the minimum for more storage. Even less if you’re the sort of person that cares about such things and so realises. Aside that, you probably use Google anyway, so it’s irrelevant.

 

[SDJim]

They're just going to make Apple adopt Google's crap model and then we will have no choice! STOP! MILLIONS OF US WANT EXACTLY WHAT APPLE IS OFFERING!

 

[I7guy]

Siri may not exchange anything directly with Google, but what does Google do once you start clicking around on their website that Siri directed you to?

That’s the point…the $$$ do not change anything. Google is the defacto search engine and returns the best results. Want to hide your tracks use DDG? Want to use Siri, go right ahead. Apple is ahead of the curve in protecting your PII as best as can be given the mechanics of the internet. This is not all or nothing.

 

[skottichan]

Rock on, when they're done, they need to move to do away with gaming walled gardens, I want to play Fire Emblem on my PS5.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Rock on, when they're done, they need to move to do away with gaming walled gardens, I want to play Fire Emblem on my PS5.

I don’t know what that means. But I assume you will need the dev to create the game for the system? Do you need the gov to demand that devs make everything for all systems even if they would rather not?

 

[Abazigal]

And to think there are actually people here calling for Apple to get ahead of regulators by cutting a deal with them. To buy some “goodwill”, so to speak.

We are talking about jeopardising the overall user experience of the Apple ecosystem.

I will say the right thing to do is for Apple to continue to fight their legal battles based on their respective App Store merits and see where things fall.

Continue to fight, and continue to win, Apple. I expect nothing less.

 

[sideshowuniqueuser]

Of course this is what Apple is going to do. It's not that the claims that all their lock-in have no merit, it's that they are highly exaggerated. That's always been the issue. The world gets along just fine on MacOS, but all of a sudden it's an issue on the phone (where coincidentally they just so happen to have billions of dollars on the line from their lock on the garden doors).

Yep, the existence of macOS is the hilarious thorn in the side of Apple's bulldust. Ironically, macOS was born when Apple had to fight for existence against MS's evil lock-in FUD rhetoric, and now iOS/iPadOS has become the evil lock-in FUD rhetoric.

 

[vipergts2207]

Not much if you have private relay on. Automatic for anyone that pays the minimum for more storage. Even less if you’re the sort of person that cares about such things and so realises. Aside that, you probably use Google anyway, so it’s irrelevant.

Ah, so it's more of fine print/asterisk kind of thing. Apple protects customer privacy.*

*for a fee

As of 2018 Apple had 850 million iCloud users worldwide with only 170 million, or 20%, paying. This tells me that a substantial number of Apple's customers cannot take advantage of private relay to get around Apple selling them out to Google.

That’s the point…the $$$ do not change anything. Google is the defacto search engine and returns the best results. Want to hide your tracks use DDG? Want to use Siri, go right ahead. Apple is ahead of the curve in protecting your PII as best as can be given the mechanics of the internet. This is not all or nothing.

The argument isn't about whether or not Google returns the best search results. It's about whether or not Apple places user privacy over profits. Actions speak louder than words and those actions say no.

 

[skottichan]

I don’t know what that means. But I assume you will need the dev to create the game for the system? Do you need the gov to demand that devs make everything for all systems even if they would rather not?

Sorry, forgot sarcasm doesn't portray well in text. Basically, I'm just in the camp that's baffled as to why Apple is the big target, when other industries, especially video games, have walled garden systems as well.

Also, the bigger baffle, Apple's not even the market leader, so how are they a monopoly? They're no more a monopoly when it comes to their App Stores than Sony is of their Playstation Store.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Ah, so it's more of fine print/asterisk kind of thing. Apple protects customer privacy.*

*for a fee

As of 2018 Apple had 850 million iCloud users worldwide with only 170 million, or 20%, paying. This tells me that a substantial number of Apple's customers cannot take advantage of private relay to get around Apple selling them out to Google.

Once again, as there is a choice to choose your search options, then there is nothing forced here. No selling out. Simply hyperbole.