Buying a new car.

[Lord Blackadder]

Range Rovers aren't known to be just "problematic" they are known for catastrophic failures.

The diesels are the more reliable versions, but we don't get them in the US. I know an old foreign auto mechanic who used to work at a Land Rover dealership, and he told all sorts of tales of Land Rovers corroding quickly and suffering major component failures.

I'd still buy a Range Rover if I was rolling in money and could afford it (and if I wanted an SUV). The Escalade is incredibly vulgar and not at all special mechanically, the Cayenne is an offense to the eyes and to the Porsche name, the Audi and BMW SUVs are too dainty and designed for the road regardless of what is claimed, and all of the large Japanese SUVs are ugly. The Land Crusier is very capable but to close in cost to the Range Rover.

This issue was in a ~10 page spread in Car and Driver. They got a whole bunch of industry experts together to try and determine a real SUV, and they came up with the following: a SUV isn't a real SUV unless it has 4WD, a lo-range gearbox, is body on frame with it's construction and can tow at least 7000lbs. Obviously not conclusive, but I agree

What you're describing there is simply any 4WD truck...at any rate Car and Driver are industry cheerleaders, they never criticize anything. As for the body-on-frame argument, I disagree. Unibody is always superior in terms of chassis stiffness, handling and safety, and the Range Rover is a unibody vehicle (as is the new Explorer).

The people who say an SUV should be body-on-frame are the same people who think Mustangs should always have a solid rear axle. Th reason the auto industry does it is simply cost - any truck becomes an SUV with a little bodywork, whereas a unibody SUV must be engineered from scratch (or, in the case of many crossovers, from a car platform).

 

[h1r0ll3r]

some small 4' high woman down the road is driving her kids to school with a Escalade
here in the UK those are solely used for the school run , drug dealers here in the UK want to keep a low profile on the road and drive impreza's or evo's

Exact opposite here in the Washington, DC area. Mommies drive their kids to school in Prius' and VW's while the drug dealers roll around in jacked up Escalades with 24" chrome rims all while blaring hip hop on their ghetto rigged sound systems.

 

[leomac08]

X5M nuff said

BMW performance is what we are talking about

But at like 10-15MPG...

I hope it's a car your going to use for local business, go to work come back, pick up kids, and not "hey let's go to Vegas for the weekend"

 

[Lord Blackadder]

X5M nuff said

M5 Touring > X5M.

 

[greygray]

I just watched this and my jaws dropped. Seriously? An Escalade against a GTR?

 

[n8236]

It sounds like you have no interest in Japanese cars...in any case, out of the ones you listed, I'd go Audi and BMW.

 

[RaceTripper]

X5M nuff said

X5M and X6M are the most dumbass and meaningless cars BMW has ever done. A total waste of the BMW brand and does nothing but dilute the ///M brand. What a joke (and I am normally a huge BMW fan).

As long as BMW does stupid crap like the X M cars they have lost their way and deserve to lose ground to anyone else.

 

[Sankersizzle]

What you're describing there is simply any 4WD truck...at any rate Car and Driver are industry cheerleaders, they never criticize anything. As for the body-on-frame argument, I disagree. Unibody is always superior in terms of chassis stiffness, handling and safety, and the Range Rover is a unibody vehicle (as is the new Explorer).

The people who say an SUV should be body-on-frame are the same people who think Mustangs should always have a solid rear axle. Th reason the auto industry does it is simply cost - any truck becomes an SUV with a little bodywork, whereas a unibody SUV must be engineered from scratch (or, in the case of many crossovers, from a car platform).

I hate the people who jive in with the solid rear axle crowd (and people who like Mustangs in general ), but I agree with the body on frame assumption. It's the same reason police cars are body on frame, you can batter things with them, and then hoist them up and fix all the damage must easier than a unibody. It really lends to the "utility' stamp in SUV. Not to mention body on frame vehicles can tow substantially more.

Also consider that since rust is a much more critical issue on unibody vehicles, as the whole body is integral to the structure of the car. Then combine that with the dreaded "your Range Rover's door has rusted away, sir" and you have a pretty serious issue.

----------

X5M and X6M are the most dumbass and meaningless cars BMW has ever done. A total waste of the BMW brand and does nothing but dilute the ///M brand. What a joke (and I am normally a huge BMW fan).

As long as BMW does stupid crap like the X M cars they have lost their way and deserve to lose ground to anyone else.

I love M cars more than any other type of vehicle, but I don't think the X5M and X6M are that bad. I think they fulfill the sleeper role most M's slip into. If you ask me, the current bloated M3 is more of an affront to the M label than the X5M. With the exception of the 1M (which I think is more of a true successor to the E46 M3) I think all the current M cars are a bit sacrilegious to the heritage. When they put power folding/heated mirrors on an M car, THAT'S when they lost their way.

 

[RaceTripper]

I love M cars more than any other type of vehicle, but I don't think the X5M and X6M are that bad. I think they fulfill the sleeper role most M's slip into. If you ask me, the current bloated M3 is more of an affront to the M label than the X5M. With the exception of the 1M (which I think is more of a true successor to the E46 M3) I think all the current M cars are a bit sacrilegious to the heritage. When they put power folding/heated mirrors on an M car, THAT'S when they lost their way.

I disagree. Calling an SUV -- any SUV -- is the most complete affront to the ///M brand. The E92 M3 is kicking ass all over the GT2 field in ALMS. That's what the ///M brand is.

 

[Sankersizzle]

I disagree. Calling an SUV -- any SUV -- is the most complete affront to the ///M brand. The E92 M3 is kicking ass all over the GT2 field in ALMS. That's what the ///M brand is.

I know the E92 M3 is a great car (I have one ), and I know the E30 M3 got it's start as a homologation special, but I remember the announcement note of the road car. The guy said he wanted something that would "surprise" other motorists with it's speed. In that definition I think the MSUV's success is definitely warranted. They've taken a massive vehicle and made it handle in a way that people literally can not believe. That's a large part of the ///M Spirt -that's why the E60 and E39 cars were so great. They were massive and they handled like nothing else. They were surprising -and it's literally impossible to argue that either the E60 or E39 weren't true M cars.

 

[RaceTripper]

I know the E92 M3 is a great car (I have one ), and I know the E30 M3 got it's start as a homologation special, but I remember the announcement note of the road car. The guy said he wanted something that would "surprise" other motorists with it's speed. In that definition I think the MSUV's success is definitely warranted. They've taken a massive vehicle and made it handle in a way that people literally can not believe. That's a large part of the ///M Spirt -that's why the E60 and E39 cars were so great. They were massive and they handled like nothing else. They were surprising -and it's literally impossible to argue that either the E60 or E39 weren't true M cars.

I had a E46 M3, a standard E39, and drove the E60 M5 (and M6) at the M school in Spartanburg. All great cars.

I still think the X ///M cars are a joke and diminish the ///M brand. A lot of people agree with me.

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

I still think the X ///M cars are a joke and diminish the ///M brand. A lot of people agree with me.

That's great that people agree with you, but why the dislike of the X5M? How does it dilute the M brand? It's fast and handles well.

 

[poundsan]

Lx 570

What about lexus LX570? i would recommend that . It is really nice and good to ride. We have one LX570 in burma. Buy Lexus LX570 in US. Cause in burma,it is around USD450,000 including tax .

 

[RaceTripper]

That's great that people agree with you, but why the dislike of the X5M? How does it dilute the M brand? It's fast and handles well.

Because ///M cars have the potential to be race cars. The SUVs don't fit. The M means motorsports...racing.

 

[Sankersizzle]

I had a E46 M3, a standard E39, and drove the E60 M5 (and M6) at the M school in Spartanburg. All great cars.

I still think the X ///M cars are a joke and diminish the ///M brand. A lot of people agree with me.

Yes, but a lot of people don't agree with you as well. Given what I see at Bimmerfest and on BMWBoards, the consensus is that they're alright because they perform so well.

The XMSUV's aren't a joke, they are the best handling/fastest SUV's you can buy right now (save for a Turbo S maybe). I've also had an E39 and currently drive an E46 and E60 (okay the E39 and E60 were my dads, but only I drove them ). We also currently have an X5M like we stated in this thread, and I ensure you hopping into one and then other you can feel the same DNA in every car. Sometimes my friends and I take them all to the track and drive the piss out of all of them, and after you do that you can feel that the X5M is exactly where it needs to be. In fact, I like the X5M more than the E60 because the E60 is so vulgar and brash (very unlike M cars), and the X5M is the most sleepy looking out of all the current M cars.

Because ///M cars have the potential to be race cars. The SUVs don't fit. The M means motorsports...racing.

You kinda just avoided my statement when replying to it there. If you use this train of logic into judging the XMSUV's then the E39 and E60 would be affronts to the M brand as well. Those are big and definitely not race cars. Around a track could be smoked by a few cars in their class -but the X5M would be faster around a track and only has 1 true competitor, the Turbo S. Maybe a SRT8 if you don't mind your wheel falling off after a few laps. Just because they're not race cars doesn't mean they're not successful in accomplishing the M goal.

Have you ever driven an X5M or X6M? I'm sure your tune would change.

 

[RaceTripper]

We'll just have to agree to disagree. It's rather pointless to continue arguing when we're clearly both fixed in our opinion.

 

[Sankersizzle]

The important thing is that we share the ///M love.

Can we both agree to hate on AMG?

 

[RaceTripper]

The important thing is that we share the ///M love.

Can we both agree to hate on AMG?

Yes. And at the moment Porsche who are about to get really silly with a 7-spd manual shift.

I can see the rich dweebs, who have no clue how to drive, money shifting those all over the place.

 

[iJohnHenry]

Yes. And at the moment Porsche who are about to get really silly with a 7-spd manual shift.

I can see the rich dweebs, who have no clue how to drive, money shifting those all over the place.

That is just insane.

Porsche owners don't give a **** about fuel economy, and that's what 6 and 7 speed transmissions are all about.

And if you're gonna say something about staying in the power curve, that will drop-out pretty quickly as they row about for yet another gear.

Go with an auto, if you must.

 

[GfPQqmcRKUvP]

Yes. And at the moment Porsche who are about to get really silly with a 7-spd manual shift.

I can see the rich dweebs, who have no clue how to drive, money shifting those all over the place.

Six speed manuals are well-established. All it adds is an overdrive. Gears 1-6 are for normal/aggressive driving and the 7th is just for cruising; there is nothing wrong with this.

Besides, most people will opt for the PDK anyway.

 

[kellen]

Between the RR and BMW X, I would go for the X. For piece of mind throw the extended maintenance and warranty on it before the warranty runs out in 4 years. Think it can be up to 7 years or 100,000 miles if I recall.

Currently looking at an X, but maybe the diesel version or the base 6 cylinder. The M seems kinda overkill, as I would rather have a different car for that kind of speed. Also I can't afford it.

Let us know what you pick.

 

[RaceTripper]

Between the RR and BMW X, I would go for the X. For piece of mind throw the extended maintenance and warranty on it before the warranty runs out in 4 years. Think it can be up to 7 years or 100,000 miles if I recall.

Extended warranty/maintenance is 6 years or 100K, whichever comes first, and is really not worth the high cost over what is included with the 4 yr. maintenance, 50K warranty. You pay an awful lot for what effectively extends what you get included by only two years, and you still have a deductible and exclusions. It's not worth it.

Every time I bought a MINI or BMW they push that, because it's such a great profit item for them.

 

[kellen]

Extended warranty/maintenance is 6 years or 100K, whichever comes first, and is really not worth the high cost over what is included with the 4 yr. maintenance, 50K warranty. You pay an awful lot for what effectively extends what you get included by only two years, and you still have a deductible and exclusions. It's not worth it.

Every time I bought a MINI or BMW they push that, because it's such a great profit item for them.

True, but some people don't want to deal with anything when it comes to their vehicles, which the OP kind of sounds like to me. May be worth it on a

You are right about the 6 years though, I have been car shopping myself and I can't keep things straight.

 

[fcortese]

BMW or Range Rover-depends on the closest for service. Where I live I'd have to go to town for service so that would be a deterrent when thinking about a car purchase. Did that once before and it was a major pain in the neck and that was when gas prices were half of what they are now!

 

[RaceTripper]

True, but some people don't want to deal with anything when it comes to their vehicles, which the OP kind of sounds like to me. May be worth it on a

You are right about the 6 years though, I have been car shopping myself and I can't keep things straight.

Have you priced the extended warranty for a bimmer? It's really very expensive. When I bought my E46 M3, it would have been around $4K to get both warranty and maintenance extended.