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Case for Upcoming Low-Cost iPhone Shows Up at Best Buy With Alleged April 5 Stock Date
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I just went to the .nl store (https://www.apple.com/nl/shop/) and selected the series 5 watch, which is $399 here, €449 there (including btw as shown in the cart).
Oh my god STOP LYING! You are
comparing Apples to Oranges!
That Apple watch isn’t $399 when I want to buy it! That’s the price WITHOUT TAX! Something EVERYONE has to pay at check out.
So the REAL price of that 399 apple watch is 434 dollars which translates, ask our friend Siri, to 393 euros. That’s 56 euros LESS compared to the Netherlands. That’s more than 12% in price difference.
That’s huge.
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Apples price is €1,035. That’s $1,140.
Your government adds €224 btw (VAT), or $247
$1,140+247 does equal $1,387, that is true. But Apple only gets $1,140. The other $247 they give to your government.
[automerge]1585707244[/automerge]
You’re embarrassing yourself and insulting me. Please stop.
Not all states have sales tax. Five do not, including Oregon. If you use 97201 (Portland, Oregon, as an example) as the zip code, you will see the checkout price is $399.
It is precisely because the taxes Apple is required to collect (and send to the taxing authority) are different that the only way to compare prices is to look at the pre-tax amount.
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I did, although it was tempting to stop when you insulted me and all other Americans. Though I must say, insulting us because we understand how your VAT works, whereas you apparently do not, seems a little weird.
As I said, if you’re getting screwed, it’s by your government. If you would rather pay a higher income tax instead of VAT, take it up with your government and get it changed. Then you can pay the same or even much less than we do here for Apple products 🤷♂️
PS Why make this about Apple products at all? That makes zero sense. It’s not just that you pay more for Apple products, you pay more for ALL products—Apple, Samsung, Huawei, whatever. Apple has nothing to do with it. If you want higher income taxes and no VAT, get your laws changed.
Saying you pay more for Apple products than we do in the US is saying nothing more than Apple is required to collect more tax for your government there than they are here. So what?
What’s your point? That phones, no matter who makes them, are overtaxed? Ok, well I’m sure Apple would absolutely love not to have to charge you VAT. Get your laws changed and that can happen.
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As an American living 20 years in Europe, and traveling frequently within Europe and to USA, I am quite experienced with various VAT/btw/sales tax etc and $ to € to £ conversion.
I now do not like USA‘s practice of marking prices in stores and on websites before sales tax. Love in Europe how the price I see is what I pay.
But....I understand why it has to be before tax prices in USA.
The sales tax in USA is actually more complicated than 0% to ca. 10.5% range in the 50 states. This is because within many or most states, there are different sales tax rates in different cities. So, it’s not just 50 different sales tax rates in USA, it is actually many thousands of different tax rates.
If price in stores was marked after tax, and the store moves some stock to a store in another city only 20km away, they would very likely have to remake all the price tags. So they mark prices before tax.
A website like apple or amazon or any other, has no choice but to show price before tax, and then add sales tax to it when you provide your state and city location at checkout.
I now do not like USA‘s practice of marking prices in stores and on websites before sales tax. Love in Europe how the price I see is what I pay.
But....I understand why it has to be before tax prices in USA.
The sales tax in USA is actually more complicated than 0% to ca. 10.5% range in the 50 states. This is because within many or most states, there are different sales tax rates in different cities. So, it’s not just 50 different sales tax rates in USA, it is actually many thousands of different tax rates.
If price in stores was marked after tax, and the store moves some stock to a store in another city only 20km away, they would very likely have to remake all the price tags. So they mark prices before tax.
A website like apple or amazon or any other, has no choice but to show price before tax, and then add sales tax to it when you provide your state and city location at checkout.
you didn't seem to understand, not even the second time.
I was saying that its not apples fault after I explained why its more expensive. You seem to have missed that part.
I've also said, that Apple products are cheaper in US than in europe - again, that is a fact. I've also said that because you showed calculation how its almost the same. (maybe on paper but not out of the pocket)
So, you didn't read (or understand) my post correctly so can we now settle this that we are both saying pretty much the same?
I was saying that its not apples fault after I explained why its more expensive. You seem to have missed that part.
I've also said, that Apple products are cheaper in US than in europe - again, that is a fact. I've also said that because you showed calculation how its almost the same. (maybe on paper but not out of the pocket)
So, you didn't read (or understand) my post correctly so can we now settle this that we are both saying pretty much the same?
I understand you perfectly. If I need any clarification, I’ll be sure to ask for it. However, based on your post it’s you who again doesn’t understand. We aren’t saying the same thing at all.
Again you say, “Apple products are cheaper in US than in europe”.
Sure, as far as that portion of the whole truth goes, it’s true. But by omitting the whole truth, you are implying that this is particular to Apple. It’s not, is it?
Stop calling out Apple as if there’s something different about them. There’s not, is there? Why do you continue to single out Apple? Apple, Apple, Apple yet you ignore the complete truth. Why? It is misleading, and apparently deliberately so.
As I said, it’s not just that you pay more for Apple products, you actually pay more for ALL products—Apple, Samsung, Huawei, whatever. Because your government taxes you higher. Apple has nothing to do with it. Neither do LG or Motorola or Samsung or any other cellphone manufacturer.
Can we agree on that? Because if you were to say “Apple, Samsung, Huawei and all other manufacturers’ products are cheaper in US than in europe”, that’s certainly something I could agree with, because it’s a true—and complete—statement.
If you insist in calling out only Apple—while ignoring the fact that all other companies are also required to collect tax for your government—I’m very likely to try to explain to you once again how your VAT works. Maybe you understand now and that won’t be necessary? One can only hope.
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I buy a new phone every year, and keep the old phone in a shoebox when not using it for on-device testing
I didn’t mean to say holding onto a phone is a bad idea. I’ve done it in the past. All I was pointing out was that sometimes holding onto an old phone is not necessarily the cheapest method of having a backup phone.
Nowadays, however, you need to switch providers to get the best deals and then you can expect to fight with either of them on the phone for a day asking why the deal wasn’t as advertised. Depends on so many things. In my case, not a question. $1000 for an iPhone 7? Yes please.
Coming from an american?! Lol whatever.
I’m gonna finish this discussion cause it ain’t going nowhere.
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Yeah, absolutely.
And some customers still prefer the home button. I know the design is stale and those bezels looks weird in 2020, but you have people with iPhone 6 and 6s than want to upgrade and will be fine with a phone similar to the one they own with more battery life and way faster processor.
My father owns a 6s, once I'll find a good deal on the new iPhone, maybe next year, I'll buy it for him, as he's familiar with TouchID and doesn't seem a fan of FaceID and the swipe gesture.
It gone as far as it’s apparently going to go: you incorrectly calling me a liar, not apologizing for being wrong and running away with a cheap parting shot.
Nice trifecta. Good job 👏
It is not only about taxes, that are way higher in Europe and especially in my country. If you own a small business you can deduct VAT for certain purchases, so you don't pay it. But even then, prices are higher.
Apple is likely taking into account currency fluctuations, they keep prices a little higher in the EU so even if the Dollar is weak, they keep their margin. I'm sure other companies adopt similar policies.
The problem with Apple is they like to keep the price constant during a product lifecycle, at least until a new model is launched, so products like the iPhone are overpriced in Europe.
Not a big deal, Apple is free to ask whatever price it wants in the EU. The point is they can't expect to have a market share similar to the one they have in the US here. Products are simply too expensive, in part for their choices, in larger part due to taxes.
In 2012 I came to the US for a vacation, and I bought a Macbook Air. I saved about $400 compared to the price I'd have payed in my country and I bought in NY, so I did pay some taxes. I could have saved even more buying it on another state I guess.
Yes you’re right, Apple does usually keep a buffer to hedge for FX fluctuations. In fact right now the Euro pricing is equivalent to about $735 for the iPhone 11 priced here at $699, and the 11 Pro Max at the equivalent of $1,140 is priced at $1,099 here.
Apple always addresses the effect of FX on profits in the quarterly conference call. Sometimes (across all currencies) they will have a favorable impact on profits, sometimes there are “headwinds” that cost them a little bit.
It rarely goes more than 0.5% either way. This quarter will probably be an outlier due to all the large swings with various currencies weakening more than they’d planned. Apple already raised prices in many countries to compensate.
+1
It's frustrating (but understandable) the way pricing is displayed in the US. When I travel across, I have to mentally add approx 10% to the price (noting some items don't attract sales tax, so it's a nice surprise to pay less than what you expect to pay!). And then there's tipping (which is another discussion in itself!)...
Possibly. I though I had read they were contemplating $449 due to the current cash flow environment. Perhaps I was mistaken.
Thanks.
Yes, we can agree on that. But man, I never started this and never was against Apple on this. I reacted to your response to another person. So here lies the misunderstanding.
I know its not Apple, I know its a tax thing because I had economics on high school and I also know that Apple products are cheaper in US because of that. I'm not (and never said) saying that its only Apple.
I just responded to your calculation which you did for someone else.
Comparing prices pretax is just not adequate for the end customer. Regardless where the precise problem is.
You walk into a store, you walk out the store - the money you are missing is how much that was. Nothing more, nothing less.
I live in Canada now and its super frustrating to not know how much you will pay in total when you go shopping. Sure, you can calculate etc. and that works fine for 1-3 or so things but once you do a big shopping and some items have different taxes its just insane for me as a customer. Europe doesn't have that problem, what you see on the price tag is what you pay. Its the most sensible and logical thing to do and I have precise control what I'm going to pay out of my pocket.
Sure, the system in US sucks (as someone explained) because its so complex that it would be a logistic nightmare to do the european model but that doesn't change the fact that it SOOOO NICE to see a price and pay just that.
I know its not Apple, I know its a tax thing because I had economics on high school and I also know that Apple products are cheaper in US because of that. I'm not (and never said) saying that its only Apple.
I just responded to your calculation which you did for someone else.
Comparing prices pretax is just not adequate for the end customer. Regardless where the precise problem is.
You walk into a store, you walk out the store - the money you are missing is how much that was. Nothing more, nothing less.
I live in Canada now and its super frustrating to not know how much you will pay in total when you go shopping. Sure, you can calculate etc. and that works fine for 1-3 or so things but once you do a big shopping and some items have different taxes its just insane for me as a customer. Europe doesn't have that problem, what you see on the price tag is what you pay. Its the most sensible and logical thing to do and I have precise control what I'm going to pay out of my pocket.
Sure, the system in US sucks (as someone explained) because its so complex that it would be a logistic nightmare to do the european model but that doesn't change the fact that it SOOOO NICE to see a price and pay just that.
That's not what that means. It's saying that it dropped tested to 2x's the drop requirement for military drop testing.
However, it doesn't say that that was done for the phone. They could have just drop tested the case itself...
The day they announced the SE was discontinued, I went to the Apple Store and picked up a 128GB space grey. First time I've ever bought something like that just to sit on the shelf as insurance. But that was also when the Mac mini was lost in limbo and I didn't know whether I'd ever see one as good as the 2012 quad-core again, and the MacBook Pros were all butterfly-y and touch-bar-y, and the Mac Pro reboot hadn't been announced yet and the cylinder was still selling at its original 2013 price, and I thought: get one when you can, because Apple is screwing up everything it makes and they may never make another computer or phone you want to buy.
@%<
I know what it meant. I was joking. I thought that was obvious, but my mistake.