Mascots
macrumors 68000
Yes, there is a logical reason. Just because it's not what you want based only on what you think doesn't make it illogical.
Class Action Lawsuit Accuses Apple of Crippling iPhone 4s With iOS 9 Update
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Yes, there is a logical reason. Just because it's not what you want based only on what you think doesn't make it illogical.
On phones I completely agree, for normal computers I completely disagree! I have a windows desktop from 2008 and a windows laptop from 2011 both work just fine on Windows 10. My CoreDuo MacMini and my old polycarbonate MB nope no updates. As for paying for updates I had to pay to upgrade my Vista desktop machine to Windows 7 but they both got Windows 10 as part of the free promo upgrade.
Apple was today hit with a class action lawsuit (via AppleInsider) seeking over $5 million in damages for deceptive trade practices and false advertising. Plaintiff Chaim Lerman says that he and other iPhone 4s owners became unable to use their devices after upgrading to iOS 9 as the update "significantly slowed down" their iPhones and "interfered with the normal usage of the device."
According to the lawsuit, the plaintiffs were forced to either live with a "slow and buggy" device that "disrupts every day life" or shell out hundreds of dollars for a new iPhone.
The plaintiffs argue that Apple failed to properly warn iPhone 4s users that the update would "significantly interfere" with the performance of their phones. When Lerman and other plaintiffs upgraded their devices, they noticed a significant drop in performance in both third-party apps and basic functions like using the Phone app. Because Apple does not allow iPhone users to easily downgrade their device to a previous iOS version, the plaintiffs feel like they're forced into either using a slower phone or purchasing a new one.
Apple's advertising, the plaintiffs allege, does not mention the potential of slowed performance for iPhone 4s users, instead focusing on performance improvements. The lawsuit points towards Apple's iOS 9 website, which says the update brings "faster performance, improved security, convenient updates, and longer battery life." The plaintiffs argue that Apple must have known about the iPhone 4s' slower performance from internal testing or other means and did not warn users about potential headaches in their advertising.
This isn't the first time Apple has been accused of planned obsolescence, as the company was hit with a lawsuit in 2011 regarding the iPhone 3G and iOS 4. That case was thrown out by the judge who ruled the iOS 4 update was not a "good or service" and dismissed claims of false advertising and deceptive business practices.
Article Link: Class Action Lawsuit Accuses Apple of Crippling iPhone 4s With iOS 9 Update
beanbaguk
macrumors 65816
I haven't read every page but I'm seriously shocked at some of the comments being passed about by a large number of users.
My mothers iPad Mini (1st generation which served her very well until the last iOS update), is now pretty much an unusable brick. Simply typing in characters on the keyboard is slow, with a delay and don't get me started on web browsing. Basically, upgrading iOS has made a previously usable device, completely unusable and that's not fair.
So when I hear people saying "it's a relic, why are they using that", or "just got and get a new phone", it makes me think what an ignorant fool they are.
While many people may have the money to go out and buy a new device or are stupidly prepared to get into debt for a new iOS device, many people simply cannot afford to upgrade their iPad to the latest model or are not prepared to fork out more money and throw away a previously very useful device made inoperable due to Apple pushing an upgrade on them.
Apple do tout "better performance on their upgrades" and lets be frank. Most of the time, unless you have the latest iOS device, it's usually ends up slowing your phone, tablet or whatever. That's misleading advertising and on that alone, the plaintiff has a case.
I really hope this lawsuit is successful and Apple do two things:
Ultimately, people shouldn't delude themselves. We live in a massively unnecessarily wasteful society brainwashed into consumerism and this thread is a depressing example of how people are caught up in this nonsense.
My mothers iPad Mini (1st generation which served her very well until the last iOS update), is now pretty much an unusable brick. Simply typing in characters on the keyboard is slow, with a delay and don't get me started on web browsing. Basically, upgrading iOS has made a previously usable device, completely unusable and that's not fair.
So when I hear people saying "it's a relic, why are they using that", or "just got and get a new phone", it makes me think what an ignorant fool they are.
While many people may have the money to go out and buy a new device or are stupidly prepared to get into debt for a new iOS device, many people simply cannot afford to upgrade their iPad to the latest model or are not prepared to fork out more money and throw away a previously very useful device made inoperable due to Apple pushing an upgrade on them.
Apple do tout "better performance on their upgrades" and lets be frank. Most of the time, unless you have the latest iOS device, it's usually ends up slowing your phone, tablet or whatever. That's misleading advertising and on that alone, the plaintiff has a case.
I really hope this lawsuit is successful and Apple do two things:
- Stop delivering upgrades on devices where there will definitely be a slowdown. Apple are not stupid. They know this happens. If you don't think this is the case, then return to La La Land and keep dreaming.
- Allow users to downgrade their devices not just for a limited period of time following an upgrade. Why shouldn't users be able to downgrade their iOS devices? (This should be the key item on the lawsuit).
Ultimately, people shouldn't delude themselves. We live in a massively unnecessarily wasteful society brainwashed into consumerism and this thread is a depressing example of how people are caught up in this nonsense.
bogg
macrumors 6502
Exactly, free "promo"
beanbaguk
macrumors 65816
Exactly this. My mother has it on her iPad Mini and it's now a joke to use. Completely unusable and Apple flaunt the following:
I say that's false advertising. There's no disclaimer to tell me it doesn't apply to older models.
What a joke. As if Craig Federighi tells his engineers to insert code that will intentionally slow down older devices. People sue for anything and everything these days. Only in America.
Yeah there's no way a multinational corporation would insert deceptive code into their software...oh wait...
I'm kidding, but the whole VW thing makes this scenario a little less crazy.
Sweetfeld28
macrumors 65816
Apple doesn't want people doing this for security, and hacking reasons. If people were able to do this we would have tons of Jailbroken phones around. Also, I wouldn't have any device that has an older version of iOS on it than iOS 8. Apple stated that all iMessages have been fully encrypted since iOS 8. That is worth it for me.
Interesting. We have 2 iPhone 4s models, and we upgraded both to iOS 9.2. Both work fine. OTOH, Apple really should allow users to downgrade back to a previous OS if they want to. There is no technical reason it can't be done. The artificial restriction is Apple being petulant, and it reflects very poorly on the company.
Apple's behavior in this respect is why many of us loyal customers have developed a 'love-hate' relationship with the company. If they continue to do things, like preventing downgrades, that anger customers, the relationship may turn to a 'hate-hate' relationship and they will start to lose customers.
Apple's behavior in this respect is why many of us loyal customers have developed a 'love-hate' relationship with the company. If they continue to do things, like preventing downgrades, that anger customers, the relationship may turn to a 'hate-hate' relationship and they will start to lose customers.
sanke1
macrumors 65816
I seriously think that this time Apple loses big time. They clearly announced iOS 9 to be performance optimization update but instead every device released in 2014 and before that started to stutter and lag. There have also been endless debates about Apple's "Planned Obsolescence" strategy on many Apple based forums. Hope this teaches them a lesson and don't take world for granted. We will get better quality software updates.
Rogifan
macrumors Penryn
Apple's and oranges. What is the benefit to Apple? Poor user experience could be just as likely to make someone leave Apple's ecosystem than to buy a new Apple device.
Except nobody will be able to prove that EVERY older device has performance issues with iOS 9. My iPad Air 2 has no issues running iOS 9.
AFEPPL
macrumors 68030
Exactly this. My mother has it on her iPad Mini and it's now a joke to use. Completely unusable and Apple flaunt the following:
I say that's false advertising. There's no disclaimer to tell me it doesn't apply to older models.
Totally agree with you, I hope this action succeeds personally and apple start allowing "users and consumers" of their devices to make a "choice" and if they so wish to do so, go back to a version of the software that the device shipped with. I'm sure loads of the brainwashed fanboys will say "you had a choice not to upgrade", but thats not the point and its irrelevant.. Im fed-up of having to dismiss the upgrade the popup warning 2 to 3times a day on my 5s to upgrade the software.
Apple are doing everything possible to make it hard for people not to take the upgrades.
AFEPPL
macrumors 68030
Different granted, Yes, but they (IMO) are doing it in hope you'll go out an buy a newer device.
CJM
macrumors 68000
I'll agree that 9.0 was pretty buggy and slow. A lot like Yosemite really. 9.1 fixed things for the most part and my 6 plus feels a lot more snappy.
It'll be hard for the plaintiff to prove Apple do this deliberately. But it's clear that new features added to an OS over time will obviously use additional resources.
That said, if Apple encourages all users to upgrade their software, then it should be able to run at least as fast as the previous version. If that means disabling swanky new animations on some models, then so be it.
It'll be hard for the plaintiff to prove Apple do this deliberately. But it's clear that new features added to an OS over time will obviously use additional resources.
That said, if Apple encourages all users to upgrade their software, then it should be able to run at least as fast as the previous version. If that means disabling swanky new animations on some models, then so be it.
Rogifan
macrumors Penryn
Nope don't agree. This reminds me of those who claim Apple intentionally constrains supply in order to artificially create demand. That's silly. There's no guarantee someone will just go out and buy a new Apple device, just like there's no guarantee someone is going to wait around for a product to become available. There's a good chance they'll just go buy something else or nothing at all. The idea that Apple executives sit around thinking about ways to annoy Apple customers, somehow believing that will result in more Apple product sales is nonsense.
Abazigal
Contributor
Here's my take.
I personally like the idea of as many people being on the latest version of iOS as possible, both from a pragmatic and philosophical standpoint. This way, developers don't have to support so many different software versions and can focus on just always supporting the latest OS version if a large enough number of users are on it. This means they have fewer reservations about including the latest APIs and UI designs because they know that there are enough people using it.
Can you imagine if say, 50% of users were still on iOS 6 and the other half are on iOS 7 or later? A developer would either have to maintain 2 separate versions of the app (one to support flat design, one to support the older skeumorphic design) to ensure that it doesn't look out of place on your device. If not enough people are on iOS 9, they may not consider it worth their time to include newer features like quick reply. If majority of users are still on iOS 7 or earlier, why include extensions if the bulk of their user base won't ever benefit from it?
Given that Apple invests so much time and effort into developing iOS, I can see why they would want as many people on the latest version of their software as possible, both to benefit from security patches, the newer features and simply because they feel it's the best version ever; why shouldn't you be on it?
I admire this arrogant and egoistical and presumptuous aspect of Apple. It's partly why I bought into the Apple ecosystem in the first place (the other reason being that they do work well for me). I admire that Apple marches to its own beat and doesn't care 2 hoots about what other people think (at least under the Steve Jobs era). I don't want this aspect of Apple to ever change.
If I don't like the quality of food served by a particular food store, I will just not patronise it in future. If you don't like what Apple is doing, maybe you should just stop using Apple products and switch to a competing brand.
quackers82
macrumors 6502
iOS 9 has crippled my first gen iPad mini. I'm using it now while I'm waiting for a train, but it's so slow. Web browsing and typing is very laggy. Now at work we have some still sealed first gen minis with iOS 7 on and a few with iOS 8. iOS 7 is very fast and fluid on it, iOS 8 is still faster than 9. It feels like apple never once tested web browsing on the first gen mini with iOS 9. Well Tim Cook says he uses his iPad all the time, how about he try's using an first gen mini on iOS 9 for a whole day and see how many times he gets mad . If I could take it back to 8.0 or 7.0 I would. I doubt that's ever going to happen as an apple iOS engineer told me apple have a very aggressive upgrade policy with iOS updates.
RobertMartens
macrumors 65816
In fact I do live in the first world. However did you guess? I think only first world people say "First world problem.."
I won't provide an opinion on the case - but I do remember being a 4s user, back in the day, and experiencing this first hand. Phone great one day, basically unusable the next.
There were side by side videos showing the pre-post browsing experience. And usable is a fair description.
Keep in mind that when that OS was launched, the 4S was still relatively current - i was using mine within contract.
Good news is I think apple learned the be more cautions with bloated upgrades...
There were side by side videos showing the pre-post browsing experience. And usable is a fair description.
Keep in mind that when that OS was launched, the 4S was still relatively current - i was using mine within contract.
Good news is I think apple learned the be more cautions with bloated upgrades...
beanbaguk
macrumors 65816
You are deluded. Of course your iPad Air 2 has no issues. It's the latest iPad device! Now try iOS 9 on an iPad Mini.
They don't.
roadbloc
macrumors G3
They're clearly succeeding at this though. They've clearly annoyed enough Apple users for talks of a lawsuit to occur and Apple undoubtedly earn a large amount of cash. So yeah, the way I see it, it just might be what they're up to.
beanbaguk
macrumors 65816
Another bizarre comment from you. Do you really believe Apple doesn't restrict demand? You clearly haven't a clue about how businesses operate.
Apple doesn't care one bit about you. All it cares about is making money. Lots of it. Why do you think Apple Watches weren't sold by retailers originally. Apple's excuse of "providing an experience to our users" was absolute bollocks. It was about creating exclusivity and thus increasing demand. Simple marketing techniques which have been proven time and time again by Apple.
The same watches are now sold by anyone now that the hype is over and the demand has dropped. What happened about that experience Apple was so keen to push to it's users I wonder?
Fact is, Apple cares about revenues. It wants you to upgrade and buy the next best thing. Your phone probably has a planned lifespan of just 2 years. I'm sure Apple would want that to be 1 year but I think consumer rights lawyers would pounce on that one and win.
Don't be so blind to a corporation wanting to make money.