'Constant Negativity' From Pro Users Led Apple to Develop Modular Mac Pro, Which May Not Ship Until 2019

[zapnyc]

My fave MPro concept is still this one ....which seems like a no-brainer for them...

(from http://www.macsessed.com/posts/will-apples-next-mac-pro-look-like-any-of-these-concepts/)

 

[Royksöpp]

The cool-aid diet is unwise. The very phrase, "Emoji bar" is evidence enough that you don't own one of these machines, or understand the functionality of the touch bar. Just another glory-seeking troll. God, I'm sick of the pretentious, condescending, judgmental trolls. Go back to Microsoft or Linux or whatever self righteous platform strokes your ego.

I'm not a high-end Pro user. It's not underpowered for my needs and professional usage. I use MacOS, not Windows in my work environment, and so YES, the current MacBook pros are wonderful for my (and many other people's) useage scanarios.

I know that you assume that everyone in the world operates according to your paradigm. But step back from the narcissistic perspective for just a second and realize - not everyone is just like you.

I'm not someone who does 4K video editing on the go for a living. People in high-end professions need a Pro machine that exceeds the capabilities of the current Apple "Pro" lineup. But these people are not the majority of users. The majority are folks like me, who need mid-level power on a well-constructed machine with good battery life. The current lineup supplies that well, and so provides ample power for what we need. We're plenty happy with Apple's current offerings.

Those in the genuinely Pro professions need more.

That's it. For many, myself included, the current offerings are more than adequate. For those who need more, Apple is finally recognizing the need to step up.

No need to be pretentious. Buy a Windows machine if you're convinced that Apple is a bad value for *anyone* and *everyone*. Why are you wasting your time on a Mac forum when you see no value in Macs? Whatever. Get a life.

I appreciate your input! Thanks! Have a nice day!

 

[maflynn]

My fave MPro concept is still this one ....which seems like a no-brainer for them...

(from http://www.macsessed.com/posts/will-apples-next-mac-pro-look-like-any-of-these-concepts/)

Yeah, but I think Apple has moved on from the cheese grater design

 

[NT1440]

My fave MPro concept is still this one ....which seems like a no-brainer for them...

(from http://www.macsessed.com/posts/will-apples-next-mac-pro-look-like-any-of-these-concepts/)

You're right, no brainpower at all was required to come up with those designs.

 

[ChrisCW11]

Well, an Apple that listens to customers could be the start of a new era for Apple, most likely will help to improve a lot of their under performing divisions. If you are not selling much of product X, and customer don't like product X, then stop releasing incremental minor changes to product X and calling it a day. Seems obvious Apple can't keep assuming the status quo for their entire Mac division is going to endear them to customers that have been complaining for years that Apple is being left behind for performance and innovation compared to their competition.

Apple may have had the ability to know what customers wanted before customers knew what they wanted and stave off customer demand of features that other competition had for good reasons, but that era is over once Steve Jobs passed away. NOBODY at Apple today can claim to have the kind of skill Steve Jobs had of being able to predict what customers would covet a few years in the future and come out with a product that might not be well received at first, but helped to define an industry a year later.

Today, Apple has to start listening to their customer base and make important decisions to move product lines forward with innovations customers expect and demand rather then keep selling a 5+ year old product with a few new parts in them.

It is obvious Apple woke up this past few weeks and realized that outside of iPhone, Apple is trailing in every other market segment, things like Apple Watch are moot for company growth, and the mind share of consumers are drifting away and largely that has come at the cost of ignoring customer demands and arrogantly assuming that a product that is 5+ years old is still what customers want and need today. I am not saying they have to cave in to everything customers want, but obvious attempting to sell a soda can as a professional product that can't actually fit in the state of the art equipment driving professional desktops today is not going to succeed for them anymore.

It will be interesting to see what Apple defines as "modular", but I think if they do it right they could re surge back into the mind share of professionals demanding uncompromising performance, features and upgrade potential. The worst thing that Apple could do is to try and shoehorn PC components into a fancy glossy tiny box and consider "modular" meaning to select one or two limited options from Apple.com when you add it to the cart; that will alienate professionals and they will lose in that market completely.

 

[DanBig]

2

What's there to fire? The hardware dept oversees everything. As of the end of last year,

The iPhone installed base has grown by 500M users.
The iPad installed base has grown by 175M users.
The Mac installed base has grown by 50M users.
Apple introduced Apple Watch, the company's first wearable product. Approximately 18M Apple Watches, a device positioned as an iPhone accessory, have been sold to date.
Apple is earning more than $6B per year of revenue through app sales via the App Store.
Apple successfully made the difficult jump from a paid music download model to streaming and is approaching 20M paying Apple Music subscribers.
Apple continues to push forward with Apple TV. The company is approaching 10M units sold since the device was updated in 2015.
Apple continues to develop key services including Apple Pay, Messages, and Maps.

You can't just look at the neglect of the Mac in a vacuum and claim that someone's head needs to roll because of that.

Agreed, its not a generic failure! It's the foundation of the future that's in trouble!

Once the market is saturated where do you go? If you can't offer scalable improvements within a given product sector you can't persuade people to upgrade what they have and they also need some good reasons if the status-quo meets their needs. Apple had two failures here meeting the needs of its Pro market (MacBook Pro & Mac Pro).

The core Pro's are the ones that are pushing the envelope with content as well as applications which in turn gain traction in the Prosumer and amateur markets which are the bigger buyers!

Think of it this way the small pebble you roll down the hill knocks other pebbles which before you know it creates a land slide! Apple has no small pebbles here to start the next land slide. All they see now is the older land slides still tumbling down. Once it stops ...

 

[imronburgundy]

I wonder if a resurgent Microsoft had something to do with this too? I watched the Surface Studio launch absolutely in awe. Such clever and carefully considered design with very real practical applications for creatives. And to top it off, the guy unveiling it did so with passion and a clear understanding of the work habits of pro users. It made the MBP launch with the guy DJing on the touch bar look like an embarrassing joke and showed how out of touch Apple really is/was. First time in over a decade I started to seriously consider the switch to Windows.

If you're in the market for a desktop, come on over. The future is bright over here.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

It took Apple THREE YEARS to figure out that the bitching and carping about the trash can wasn't just people with a beef against trash cans?

And now it could be TWO MORE YEARS before they FIX IT?

How many 'pro users' will stick it out that long? How many pro users will now make the decision they have had in the back of their minds for THREE YEARS and dump Apple. (How many already have? It hasn't been a big seller)

The trash can has been a three year odyssey, about to be a FIVE year odyssey. And this from a corporation who once described themselves as 'nimble' and 'able to out maneuver their competition'. (The big bad IBM)

Apple sure has changed. They have become cowards, and their disjointed product development is disconnected from reality. The new MacBook Pro is a screaming example. It's 'thin', with a wonky gizmo at the top of a really powerfully obnoxious, yet incredibly skinny, keyboard, with NO real easy expansion for people stuck in the 'here and now' with investments in such silly things as USB drives, and sticks. The 'skinny at all costs' has become a sick obsession of their hardware designers. Someone needs to make a comparison to the 'skinny' Apple products and stick thin emaciated Auschwitz victims. Thin is killing their products! 'Bendgate'? The new obnoxious keyboard... And their rant of being closed is too!

When making a great product becomes secondary to making a 'skinny product', and a closed product, there is something wrong in the design process somewhere. The choices that are being made are shortchanging their already thin market share. The idea that people are using wireless keyboards in meetings and at school because the keyboard sucks so bad is painful to hear. Almost as painful to hear as the keyboard in the families new MacBook Pro, and the carping about how noisy it is around here...

AND the 'New New iPad'! Nuff said...

Five years? What happened to 'innovation', 'nimble', 'technology for the rest of us'?

 

[kazmac]

We all want it though, the Mac for the rest of us, it might happen now that Apple's core focus is iOS and cannibalizing among the Mac product lines is no longer a threat to investor greed.

It might happen due to the collective light bulb finally going off at Cupertino too.

 

[TomA]

Do you actually believe that "none of the top Apple brass" use a Mac or can you see what an absurd statement that is? What's your source? A random blogger with a chip on his shoulder?

I dunno. Does an interview with Tim Cook count as "A random blogger with a chip on his shoulder?"

In an interview with U.K. newspaper The Telegraph, Apple's CEO was incredulous that anyone would continue to buy a PC in a world where his company's iDevices are available. And that goes double for businesses.

“I think if you’re looking at a PC, why would you buy a PC anymore?" he told the paper during a trip to visit Apple's flagship store in London for the debut of its powerful big-screen tablet, the new iPad Pro. "No really," he said, "why would you buy one?”​

http://fortune.com/2015/11/10/apple-ceo-tim-cook-pc/


I wonder if Tim Cook has ever tried to create anything more than a basic Keynote presentation on an iPad? Sorry, but the guy is an idiot.

 

[maflynn]

It took Apple THREE YEARS to figure out that the bitching and carping about the trash can wasn't just people with a beef against trash cans?

That's my issue, its not like the complaints from day 1 of the Mac Pro just started reaching Cook's ears.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

I'm a desktop/laptop person, and I cannot do what I need in iOS. Not knocking that OS, its just too limiting for my needs.

I'm hoping for some nice improvements in OS X being detailed at WWDC this June. I'm not sure I'm able to wait for Apple to catch up to my needs on the hardware side though.

I remember the rumors about Apple pushing everyone onto a total iOS standard. I sure hope that died the rightful death it richly deserved. There are so many things that iOS just can't even come close to accomplishing. Heck, the only reason the Surface has a chance is because it's not a closed box, and their OS isn't a hobbled mess of restrictions and limits.

The iPad Pro should have had slots, more ability to expand. Should have...

 

[TomA]

It took Apple THREE YEARS to figure out that the bitching and carping about the trash can wasn't just people with a beef against trash cans?

And now it could be TWO MORE YEARS before they FIX IT?

How many 'pro users' will stick it out that long? How many pro users will now make the decision they have had in the back of their minds for THREE YEARS and dump Apple. (How many already have? It hasn't been a big seller)

How many of ANY users will? I just had to buy my first WinPC ever just to run Oculus Rift. (And on the way I've discovered Win10 isn't half bad... its come a long way since the old days. I still prefer MacOS, but not if I have to use antiquated hardware.)

BTW if any of you are in my position with a MacLaptop and a Win10 desktop, being able to control your PC as a separate monitor with your MacBook Pro keyboard and trackpad is awesome.
https://symless.com/synergy

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

How many of ANY users will? I just had to buy my first WinPC ever just to run Oculus Rift. (And on the way I've discovered Win10 isn't half bad... its come a long way from the old days. I still prefer MacOS, but not if I have to use antiquated hardware.)

For me it's not 'antiquated hardware' but 'closed hardware'.

Closed systems are user abusive. No shorter than that. They abuse the user, the customer, the person paying their money. Having no way to upgrade and extend the life of the products flies in the face of their back slapping over being so 'green'. Yet 'most' users won't care. So Apple is marketing closed boxes to people with closed minds. Is that their new slogan?

'Think different' is dead...

 

[TomA]

For me it's not 'antiquated hardware' but 'closed hardware'.

Closed systems are user abusive. No shorter than that. They abuse the user, the customer, the person paying their money. Having no way to upgrade and extend the life of the products flies in the face of their back slapping over being so 'green'. Yet 'most' users won't care. So Apple is marketing closed boxes to people with closed minds. Is that their new slogan?

'Think different' is dead...

Closed hardware becomes antiquated hardware rather quickly, but I see your point.

This part was Steve Jobs' doing though. I had a Mac 128. There has never been a more closed system made. He actually created special tools and fasteners so that no one would have the right tool to open the case.

 

[MikeFromTexas]

This "awakening" at Apple may already be too late. People/business/technology moves on. Not sure how realistic it is for Apple to say "wait a year or two we will figure something out and it will be way cool!"

 

[viktore]

Trying hard to stay positive, but THIS is exactly the source of why Apple is frustrating for the Pro. If it takes them this long to develop a new desktop, it means it will probably be packed with old technology. This is why there is no iMac with USB-C or Thunderbolt 3 ports. By the time the new iMac comes with these ports and the new Mac Pro is released, they will be behind again.

I know technology changes fast and you can never catch up, but by the time Thunderbolt took off and companies started to finally catch up (external Thunderbolt hardrives and audio interfaces), then Thunderbolt 3 came, of course with different connectors, making all these newly released Thunderbolt 1 and 2 products obsolete! STOP CREATING NEW CABLES AND CONNECTORS SO WE DON'T HAVE TO CHANGE YOUR COMPUTER EVERY 2 YEARS. Oh wait, that's the strategy...

 

[TomA]

It's funny. I haven't really been around here for a long time... I guess about 3-4 years or so. When I said something critical about Apple's direction back then, I got shouted down by fanbois.

Now the fanbois are getting shouted down by the critics. haha... my how times have changed.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

My fave MPro concept is still this one ....which seems like a no-brainer for them...

(from http://www.macsessed.com/posts/will-apples-next-mac-pro-look-like-any-of-these-concepts/)

I liked the smaller box version of the 'old Mac Pro'. I remember seeing it here, and thinking that I'd almost kill for one of those. It was small, more compact, and expandable. A great solution. I have to admit that the 'old Mac Pro' is a beast! It's HUGE! It also holds four drives, and a lot of memory...

The 'Mac Pro as Mac Mini' actually looks frightening to a point. Heat pops into my mind first. Expansion second. Having worked with some hard CAD designers, they want expandability, the ability to swap out video cards is a show stopper for them. If they can't, they look elsewhere. Pure and simple.

The trash can so weds the GPU to the whole guts of the unit, swapping video appears to be just about impossible. Buy another trash can? When other manufacturers add such innovative tings as industry standard 'slots'? Apple just isn't in the running, I'm sure...

And it's going to take two more years? Hell the Concordia could be turned quicker, and it still hit the rocks and sank. Two years is five years too long...

 

[DanBig]

This picture was always complete BS.
Optical disks were dead even by 2013 - Pic shows 2
3 Separate External disks.
A breakout box with a freaking RS232 Connector.
A firewire Connector - also obsolete.
An Audio Break out controller - which has nothing to do with anything. You'd need that on both
Oh and the Bluray - also would need it on both

The fact is 90% of the old Mac pro's I've used in studios were run stock and never upgraded. 1 or 2 Spinner HHDs - stock Ram they came with and worse the stack GPU.

This is often the same with PCs - They are bought from Dell/HP/BOXX or whoever and then not touched - Quite often because I.T don't wan't to mess with warranties.

Sure SOME independent do upgrade. I did... Maxed out my 2008 with RAM and a Hacked GPU

But this image was always complete BS. I work on my nMP with a single Thunderbolt going to an array in my garage... with over 40TB storage. Currently 5 x 8TB Drives.

I do very high end TV and film animation on my nMP perfectly happily... and Render anything beyond tests off site at a renderfarm ( 5000 CPUs - beat that! ) I work locally on the nMP using the internal Drive as a working drive then offload to the Array when complete. And i've made about 600K since I bought it... I also have a second in a flight case with a built in monitor I can take to a shoot.

People keep saying it's not pro... and I agree it's now outdated - They should have updated the GPU at least - Utterly stupid they have not. But it's still pretty damn powerful if you are using the right apps.

Agreed! We have 6 Trashcan's still pumping away across RAIDED SSD's for our video work. As you noted the real problem is the GPU not the CPU's today. its 4K thats killing our editing time. This fall we need to see direction from Apple on what they are going to do. We need see a foundation that will lead us to 8k as thats the next frontier And even that maybe not enough!

My boss wants to create a VR image cube room where all 6 sides are projectors allowing someone (a small group of people) to walk though a CAD model as if they were there!

 

[Val-kyrie]

Well Apple only stated that it won't happen in 2017, so it's quite possible that even 2018 may be out of the question

Hopefully it will happen in 2018. That is FIVE years since the last MP! How long does Apple think it's users will wait before transitioning away, if they haven't already, especially with not even an ETA?

I think it was the groundswell of their most dedicated fanbase threatening to leave the fold. So it's not just MacRumors but many others who have complained. Basically the 2016 release seemed to have such an unprecedented level of negativity.

I have had multiple discussions with Apple representatives. Let's just say I have been less than enthusiastic concerning the nMBP in my comments. I also questioned Apple's commitment to its Pro users. I was told I was not the only one expressing that opinion.

The old architecture wasn't legal to be sold in the EU anymore. Something about the fans being dangerous ....

Yes, rabid Apple fans are a dangerous lot

This is easily the best news I've heard on this site in 18 months (basically since the SE announcement). Maybe in 5 years.

I'd been making contingency plans and figuring out how to switch platforms if things continued in their current direction regarding laptops. An Apple that actually listens to their users is an Apple I'll keep buying from.

I will stay my opinion about how well Apple is listening. This whole meeting smells like a big CYA move to me. It seems Apple only hears $$$ and acts only when it affects enough of their customers--MP and MBP. In was told the MBA is by far the best seller for Apple, although I am not sure if that was only for my local store. It seems Schiller's(?) prior boasting of nMBP sales figures is more PR than reality.

Bring back the gorgeous G5 tower and load it with modern specs. You will sell out on day 1.

But please no water cooling.

 

[PinkyMacGodess]

This "awakening" at Apple may already be too late. People/business/technology moves on. Not sure how realistic it is for Apple to say "wait a year or two we will figure something out and it will be way cool!"

Totally agree.

Apple will have to work overtime to try to entice their once loyal pro users back.

Was it the focus on the iPad and iPhone that distracted them? The internecine political turf wars that seem more and more evident? Was it the new mother ship construction? Either way, it seems that Apple was seriously distracted from what a mess the Mac Pro was from birth. It's damned tragic. Yet the new MacBook Pro came out of the same tone deaf corporation structure too.

Maybe Apple has lost its mojo, and the tragic part is there is no Steve Jobs to come back and save them.

I think the drive for a new iPad every year, a new iPhone every year, a new OS every what, year, with embarrassing updates having to be cobbled together in the interim? I'm sad... I guess it had to happen. Damn...

 

[trainwrecka]

Forgetting about your core is easy when you are making a lot of money, but those same people that converted co-workers, friends and family members over to Apple (before and after iPhone) are not the people you want to short-change. Most of Apple's users are fickle and would use a product they feel is superior. The core is more loyal and will stay with you through the ups and downs, but when the core only gets down, down, down... Well, then it's much harder to stay positive.

 

[wilsonlaidlaw]

Classic error by Apple - if it ain't broke, don't fix it. There was nothing wrong with the previous Mac Pro format before some idiot design guru/geek got hold of it and made the Mac Dustbin. I have recently sold my 2005 PowerMac for a reasonable amount of money. It was still working perfectly and I had been able to upgrade the internals a number of times with bigger hard drives, more peripheral cards, a better video card and larger DIMMs as they became available. It was very easy to disassemble and clean any dust out of the internals. A beautiful bit of industrial design, with the near absence of cables floating around.

 

[jdawgnoonan]

Take the old Power Mac/Mac Pro case, make it Space Gray, put a modern motherboard, processor, RAM, graphics card, storage in it, and sell the SOB! That was an awesome case design.