And with recent admissions, there were no MacPro, nor Mac Mini in that pipeline at all.
So what trust should we give Tim, when it comes to his word?
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'Constant Negativity' From Pro Users Led Apple to Develop Modular Mac Pro, Which May Not Ship Until 2019
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So what trust should we give Tim, when it comes to his word?
Remember when Steve announced they were dropping Computer from their name as they were focusing on being a consumer electronics company? Remember when Apple was able to lock up flash memory supplies and choke off the supplies from others?
Tim and his team are great at logistics, and they shape development problems in terms of what they're best at: creating a narrow band of products for which they can leverage the supply chain to minimize their cost and avoid copycats in the market. Machines for the pro market, for non-Apple customers, need upgrades every 9 to 18 months. Churning the specs that often limits the extent to which Apple can pressure their suppliers, so they'd rather hold the designs at a certain spec and extract as much profitability as they can while their costs keep dropping.
That's their vision. Or at least, it was until the pros stopped drinking the kool aid.
Tim never explicitly promised anyone new Mac Pros, so he is technically not breaking any promises. His idea of great products likely meant a souped up iMac to replace the Mac Pro.
Despite what the pros are saying on the Mac forums haven't the new touch bar models flown off the shelves? I imagine it would be hard for Apple to turn away from those numbers by changing it drastically in favor of pro requests. Perhaps they'll introduce a completely separate MBP model to please that sales segment.
He certainly did have big shoes to fill and perhaps it was impossible for him to measure up and so he's doing his own thing. I just wish he held some of the same core ideals that Steve did, which shaped Apple. And why wasn't he at this round table meeting? That speaks to his feelings about the Mac IMO.
Think of John Sculley or Steve Ballmer. Both of those guys were disastrous for innovation at those companies. They didn't 'skate where the puck is going to be', putting the company on autopilot. Only when they were replaced by people with talent and vision did those companies thrive again. Then again, maybe this rumoured car is going to be kick-ass, and i'll be eating my words!
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From my experience:
When the MacBook Air was popular and the Retina MBP 13" came out, almost all of my colleagues were walking around with MacBooks.
I have seen two MBP 2016, one without and one 15" with TouchBar.
The TB Owner said the battery life sucks.
On the other hand I have seen people switching to Dell or Lenovo with 4k Touch Screens.
macOS might be important here, but a lot of people were already using BootCamp on their Macs anyways.
So it was not a big deal to switch.
The impetus for Apple's recent Pro announcement was the increased purchases of the 2015 MBPs in response to the release of the 2016 MBP.
ANY design change is likely going to see more purchases from those holding off upgrades, until the new design is released. In this case, a crap ton of people with 2011, 2012, 2013 and 2014 MBPs were holding off on upgrades, until the new 2016 MBP. For some, they begrudgingly bought the 2016, because they simply needed to upgrade. But a good number of upgraders bought the 2015, because they were disappointed with the lack of PRO-ness in the 2016.
$$$ is the ONLY thing that Apple leadership gives a damn about, as they obviously didn't give a damn about Pros, prior to the large number of older 2015 MBPs being purchased.
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This is the first time after 16 years of being a happy customer of apple products that I'm thinking to switch to other brand. The problem is ehich one
:/[doublepost=1492389897][/doublepost]
They just care for the iPhone. The greedy share holders and the inability from Tim Cook to control them and lead the company it is ruining apple innovative vision
This is the first time after 16 years of being a happy customer of apple products that I'm thinking to switch to other brand. The problem is ehich one
[doublepost=1492389897][/doublepost]
Well, this time you'll be switching also the OS ecosystem, but if your initial alternative brand choice turns out to be not that good, it's much easier to simply switch to a different manufacturer inside the same ecosystem.
This is the first time after 16 years of being a happy customer of apple products that I'm thinking to switch to other brand. The problem is ehich one
[doublepost=1492389897][/doublepost]
They just care for the iPhone. The greedy share holders and the inability from Tim Cook to control them and lead the company it is ruining apple innovative vision
It may be Microsoft soon:
https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/02/microsoft-surface-laptop-education/
Thanks for the link! It looks like MS it´s trying to catch up, but I´m not sure if they have the right corporate philosophy to do it. I hope they do, but until MS OS still as crappy as it is now, There is no advantage on better hardware without the right OS. I leave this talk that makes a good point on it.
Really interesting and insightful talk.
However, I don't understand what you mean by "better hardware" in case of the Surface Laptop? Compared to what Mac notebook?
Well, Microsoft is obviously not there yet. But given that Apple is expected to launch its revamped products as early as 2018, if not 2019... there is plenty of time to close the gap.
That's why I wrote "it may be". My Mac mini 2011 turns 6 , my MacBook 3 years old... and windows 10 is not bad at all, given that 80% of my use is Microsoft office and video editing software.
I like what MS is doing more then Apple these days. At least MS is trying hard to push the computer hardware to the next level. Apple, we get emojis and thinner machines.
Windows 10 isn't bad, I agree. I've got Boot Camp Partitions with Windows 10 on both my daily driver Macs, and despite its privacy issues, to me it's a much nicer OS than any Windows before. It's still far from macOS though.
Too late for me. Already jumped ship after a decade of buying (and recommending) macs.
yeah, it's one of those things, if you're a long time Mac user who is comfortable with OSx and it'UI, windows is always going to feel different and like change. generally people don't like change.
But from a performance and actual application / stability standpoint, Windows 10 is as stable/rock solid as OSx is, and currently with my testing, overall is faster and uses less resources than current Mac OS (actually, Windows 8.1 was even better for stability than 10 or recent OSx, but the UI changes were too drastic).
But while most users only know what they see, many of windows 10's advancements and features are ignored because it's "not osx"
so the "far from OSx" is generally pretty much due to subjective experience.
As far as I'm concerned, that opinion doesn't come from Windows somehow feeling different, but from specific and somewhat objective differences in UI quality. There's lots of inconsistencies in both Windows UI and UX, its just all the little things that show whether the people designing the UI actually cared or whether they just did their job.
2 control panels, icons that belong on an Atari 2600, broken hidpi scaling, a bizarre mishmash of visual styles, updates that take an age and fail randomly, while bloating out the system at an incredible pace (hello, winsxs), a ghost town of an app-store and a wide selection of malware to choose from.
"Better than it used to be" is probably the nicest thing I can find to say about Windows 10 and that's only really true of its 2 immediate predecessors before having to look back to something really ancient. At a practical level "a not entirely unusable - if unpleasant - substrate for legacy win32 apps" is really all I require from it and it just about accomplishes that. And before someone resorts to the tired, "you just haven't used it" defense I've been using all versions of Windows regularly since Windows 3 and I use Windows 10 about 1/3 of my working life, though thankfully that figure has been diminishing lately. It's bad. Adding 3d Paint isn't making it any better either.
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What "Windows 10 advancements and features" am I missing that make it so valuable?
"Better than it used to be" is probably the nicest thing I can find to say about Windows 10 and that's only really true of its 2 immediate predecessors before having to look back to something really ancient. At a practical level "a not entirely unusable - if unpleasant - substrate for legacy win32 apps" is really all I require from it and it just about accomplishes that. And before someone resorts to the tired, "you just haven't used it" defense I've been using all versions of Windows regularly since Windows 3 and I use Windows 10 about 1/3 of my working life, though thankfully that figure has been diminishing lately. It's bad. Adding 3d Paint isn't making it any better either.
[doublepost=1495578987][/doublepost]
What "Windows 10 advancements and features" am I missing that make it so valuable?
I hope the new Mac Pro is available before I am retirees. It is really a long time for desperatly waiting users
like Macintosh-Owners have been always. It is mean, it can't be true.
Will I really be waiting for ten years for a new computer ??? My last current Mac Pro is from 2009, trashcan was no option. Well, that`s not what I expect from times of ultra fast technical progress and from a company, which wants to be a spearhead in Computer manufracturing. I mean, ahem, it is just a NORMAL Computer we all want, not the thinnest, lightest, glossiest, shiniest, smartest one more thing. A simple workstation, let`s say a HP Z840 in a nicer case with a nicer OS.
Apple, maybe you make a deal and make a HP z840 a legal hackintosh until 2019???
Maybe with a Apple-PCIe-Card with thunderbolt 3??
Please Apple: Stop the design marathon until 2019 ,make peace with NVIDIA, get a simple box and start to build a COMPUTER. And for my opinion: Please no touchbars. Save the money for development and make the machine cheaper.
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yes, it is a pain... I had to buy Windows-Workstation, because Apple got so lazy in Pro-segment. Windows is a time-thief.
[doublepost=1497215859][/doublepost]even the cheapest super-market-computer is modular. You can exchange CPU, GPU, HDD, SSD, RAM.
Does it really take two years to invent drawers and a case for these components?
Even the trashcan had standard components (in a stupid size).
like Macintosh-Owners have been always. It is mean, it can't be true.
Will I really be waiting for ten years for a new computer ??? My last current Mac Pro is from 2009, trashcan was no option. Well, that`s not what I expect from times of ultra fast technical progress and from a company, which wants to be a spearhead in Computer manufracturing. I mean, ahem, it is just a NORMAL Computer we all want, not the thinnest, lightest, glossiest, shiniest, smartest one more thing. A simple workstation, let`s say a HP Z840 in a nicer case with a nicer OS.
Apple, maybe you make a deal and make a HP z840 a legal hackintosh until 2019???
Maybe with a Apple-PCIe-Card with thunderbolt 3??
Please Apple: Stop the design marathon until 2019 ,make peace with NVIDIA, get a simple box and start to build a COMPUTER. And for my opinion: Please no touchbars. Save the money for development and make the machine cheaper.
[doublepost=1497215470][/doublepost]
yes, it is a pain... I had to buy Windows-Workstation, because Apple got so lazy in Pro-segment. Windows is a time-thief.
[doublepost=1497215859][/doublepost]even the cheapest super-market-computer is modular. You can exchange CPU, GPU, HDD, SSD, RAM.
Does it really take two years to invent drawers and a case for these components?
Even the trashcan had standard components (in a stupid size).
How is the Surface Laptop trying to push anything to the next level?
Apple executives this week made an unusual and surprising announcement, detailing the company's work on an entirely revamped high-end modular Mac Pro that's set to be released sometime after 2017.
No specific information on a potential release date was shared, but OSnews' Thom Holwerda has shared some tidbits heard from "people and sources who know their stuff," giving a little insight into just when we might see the revamped Mac Pro and why Apple decided to renew its focus on professional users.
Ahead of Apple's announcement, Holwerda says the Mac Pro was in limbo, and Apple wasn't sure what was going to happen to the machine.
Apparently, the negative response to the MacBook Pro with Touch Bar, which many complained was not oriented towards pro users, was a major factor. Apple saw a surge of orders for older MacBook Pros instead of the new model, and that, combined with the reaction to the LG 5K display and the "constant negativity" from professional users, led Apple to "double down on professional users."
The decision to move ahead with a modular Mac Pro replacement was made "in recent months" with development starting "only a few weeks ago," suggesting it's going to be a long wait.
Given a rough estimate of the length of time it normally takes to develop a project, it could be late 2018 or even 2019 before we see the machine.Aside from the Mac Pro, Holwerda also believes Apple is working on additional MacBook Pro models sans Touch Bar, and developing other features aimed at professionals, such as pairing the iPad Pro with a Mac so that it can be used as a Cintiq-style drawing tablet.
Apple hasn't shared a lot of detail on the new Mac Pro, but the promised modular design will allow professional users to keep it up to date with new hardware on a regular basis. Apple executives have said the machine will also be able to handle virtual reality software and high-end cinema editing, pointing towards support for higher-end single GPUs, and Apple also plans to ship the machine with an Apple-branded professional display.
Article Link: 'Constant Negativity' From Pro Users Led Apple to Develop Modular Mac Pro, Which May Not Ship Until 2019
Hi all,
I've been reading this thread and loved every second of it! I agree Apple has completely lost it's way. To me, the 2012 generation of Macs were the last truly pro devices. Surprisingly, the last generation Steve probably had something to do with.
Anyway, I've had a slightly different history with computers as most of you seem to have.
I've run AmigaOS from 1987-1997 (loved that), all kinds of Linux versions from 1993 to today, Windows from 3.1 to 10 (1991-now) and MacOS from 1991-today. I've used all of them as everyday machines, so I think I'm quite familiar with all of them.
To me, Windows 10 is nowhere near as fast and stable as both Linux does. Especially when it's just installed (no extra drivers).
I've installed it on 2 laptops (Fujitsu Siemens Kaby Lake i7 system, on which it crashed 5 times in the first hour) and an 2012 Alienware 14 inch (on which it crashes consistently when any application is used full screen on an external display.
You still need oodles of drivers to get it to work reliably usually, still can't find most of the printers in it's network, the mail app is crap and it spies on you (even when you turn everything off).
Linux is stable and fast out of the box. Usually no drivers necessary and only crashed once in the past 10 years on one of my machines. It's interesting that Linux seems to manage the wide variety of hardware way better that Windows does, even though Microsoft has all these brilliant people developing it's system.
MacOS never crashed with me (MacOS X that is). It's fast and everything really 'just works'. Which is why I love MacOS so much, and, when my 2011 Mac Mini died and had to use Windows 10 for a week, was very happy to return to it again. It would be hard letting go if I needed to.
Still, I fully expect both the iMac Pro and Mac Pro to be quite, nice looking devices that will be rediculously expensive (here in the EU that is) and all components to be proprietry hardware. Hope not, but....
Sorry for the rant and the long story, passionate kind of personality I guess
Cheers, Bas.
I've been reading this thread and loved every second of it! I agree Apple has completely lost it's way. To me, the 2012 generation of Macs were the last truly pro devices. Surprisingly, the last generation Steve probably had something to do with.
Anyway, I've had a slightly different history with computers as most of you seem to have.
I've run AmigaOS from 1987-1997 (loved that), all kinds of Linux versions from 1993 to today, Windows from 3.1 to 10 (1991-now) and MacOS from 1991-today. I've used all of them as everyday machines, so I think I'm quite familiar with all of them.
To me, Windows 10 is nowhere near as fast and stable as both Linux does. Especially when it's just installed (no extra drivers).
I've installed it on 2 laptops (Fujitsu Siemens Kaby Lake i7 system, on which it crashed 5 times in the first hour) and an 2012 Alienware 14 inch (on which it crashes consistently when any application is used full screen on an external display.
You still need oodles of drivers to get it to work reliably usually, still can't find most of the printers in it's network, the mail app is crap and it spies on you (even when you turn everything off).
Linux is stable and fast out of the box. Usually no drivers necessary and only crashed once in the past 10 years on one of my machines. It's interesting that Linux seems to manage the wide variety of hardware way better that Windows does, even though Microsoft has all these brilliant people developing it's system.
MacOS never crashed with me (MacOS X that is). It's fast and everything really 'just works'. Which is why I love MacOS so much, and, when my 2011 Mac Mini died and had to use Windows 10 for a week, was very happy to return to it again. It would be hard letting go if I needed to.
Still, I fully expect both the iMac Pro and Mac Pro to be quite, nice looking devices that will be rediculously expensive (here in the EU that is) and all components to be proprietry hardware. Hope not, but....
Sorry for the rant and the long story, passionate kind of personality I guess
Cheers, Bas.