Craig Federighi Acknowledges Confusion Around Apple Child Safety Features and Explains New Details About Safeguards

[hans1972]

Err no, many experts have stated the system is very easy to trick. And of course, the scanning list will be injected with other things it needs to find, without the knowledge of Apple and others. At which point, a person at Apple will be able to see the image, not a hash, the actual image.

I think those experts will be proven wrong. It's pretty hard to be sure when Apple hasn't released the code or the gritty details of it. It's impossible to know for sure how good NeuralHash is without testing it. The only one who has is Apple which is why I trust them more until there are actual tests outside Apple.

Also, it's not easy to insert new hashes into an iPhone without Apple's knowledge. There are many ways to check if the hash table has been tampered with.

In addition, Apple can overwrite the hash table with a new version every time you update the OS.

 

[Theo Belk]

In corporate-speak, "customer disagrees" = "confusion" (confusion, because if you understood what we are doing you'd agree)

Exactly correct. It could never be true that what [the corporation] is doing is wrong. After all, the management and probably some lawyers decided that it was right.

Apple has been doing this kind of thing for years and only rarely backtracks. Usually they double down. It took them 5 years to tacitly admit the 2013 MacPro was not all that good. The video industry was just confused about an actual need for processing power and storage. As a result of this, and the earlier monkey business with FinalCut X, Apple largely lost the video industry to Windows. Eventually they released a new cheese grater with a reference display only to fall flat on their faces at the finish line with the optional monitor stand. It turns out we were all just confused about the exceptional quality of the stand. And some of us were confused about the need for a stand and whether it was any of our business if some suckers would pay for the stand regardless.

There are many examples.

 

[InVinoVeritasty]

and now we have this, make no mistake this is the start of where we will end up. Someone or something watching your phone for a dodgy photo is only the beginning. The devices can already track movements and exercise, how crazy would it be for it to be mandated we have to exercise to meet certain quotas for insurance and work. What if the photo scanning was able to detect a burger, what if it could detect to men standing next to each other etc etc.

The irony is breathtaking

 

[mw360]

Way he said “around 30” made me wonder if they are rewriting code to raise it from a lower number or already are taking heat to drop it from a higher number.

his lack of precision was deliberate and unsettling.

But the issue isn’t if 10, 30 or 50, the issue is it’s being done at all.

If I understood the design correctly (and I only skimmed it) there are a small number of false positives injected into every account, so that it’s impossible for employees (or bad actors) to differentiate between accounts with some matches and those with none. I believe it was up to 10% of the threshold amount. So possibly the unlock threshold varies. 30 in some cases, 27 or 33 in others.

 

[grjj]

Craig! How are you defending Apple when you said "Privacy is a human fundamental right"! Come on man. You woke up on the wrong side of the bed too or what?

“At Apple, we believe privacy is a fundamental human right,” said Craig Federighi, Apple’s senior VP of software engineering. “We don’t think you should have to make a tradeoff between great features and privacy. We believe you deserve both.”

If your iPhone is checking your images and nothing leaves your iPhone, then where's the privacy invasion?

Your iPhone has been scanning all your photos for years, how do you think it knows "Sam" is in the photo?

 

[citysnaps]

Way he said “around 30” made me wonder if they are rewriting code to raise it from a lower number or already are taking heat to drop it from a higher number.

his lack of precision was deliberate and unsettling.

But the issue isn’t if 10, 30 or 50, the issue is it’s being done at all.

And likely due to him being under government order to not disclose.

 

[Soccerrick10]

People say they want to protect the children from child abuse

What happens when they want to protect the children from gays and lesbians?
What happens when they want to protect the children from African-Americans or Chinese?
What happens when they want to protect the children from Muslims, or Jews, or Catholic?
What happens when they want to protect the children from art and music?

Do you see the slippery slope?

The reason I’m most appalled is that I trusted Apple with my privacy. I won’t give them the chance in the future.

 

[magicman32]

That is semantics. No one thinks an apple employee is going to their house to manually review their phone. Apple created a software mechanism to categorize photos. “Naughty” “nice”. If you have too many “naughty” things they call the cops. That is oppressive.

And case in point of why some people don’t understand the system in place here and tend to oversimplify things. I’m not defending or justifying if but this right here is the problem in understanding if anyone cares to.

”Naughty” and “nice” isn’t even close what’s going on here. I have plenty of the “naughty” variety and you know why I won’t get reported to the cops? Because they aren’t illegal pictures.

C’mon man, stop with this juvenile misrepresentation of what’s going on here. Talk about how misinformation gets spread. Could be disinformation, who knows with some of you people here.

You havent the slightest idea of what it’s like to be oppressed, truly, as some people have, so, please, just give the melodramatics a rest.

 

[speedyg256]

Thank you, Craig! I wonder if Craig woke up and read my comment from the previous article haha!

Craig Federighi Acknowledges Confusion Around Apple Child Safety Features and Explains New Details About Safeguards

Apple's senior vice president of software engineering, Craig Federighi, has today defended the company's controversial planned child safety...

www.macrumors.com

All jokes aside! Craig, you do not know what you are talking about when all you did was praise how important privacy was. Stay away from my PRIVACY, please. It is my HUMAN RIGHT. Craig! please, give us an Opt-Out option from CSAM, please. Let our voices be heard. I will not appreciate Apple scanning my iCloud photos whether it's through AI or Hash.

It sounds like Apple is using "Protecting Children" as an example to be spying on the consumers.

STOP this mass surveillance to be launched. Apple you are not a Law Enforcement organization. Stop acting like one. Apple, how are you not getting the point. You are violating our privacy. Over 7000 signatures were collected. Stop playing with our privacy and human right.

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appleprivacyletter.com

I don't use iCloud for images, never have. Doesn't that mean I'm opting out? (not arguing legitimate question)

 

[turbineseaplane]

If your iPhone is checking your images and nothing leaves your iPhone, then where's the privacy invasion?

It's comparing my data on my phone, against a third party external database, for the purpose of "looking for things" that third party wants to find.

It's a complete invasion of privacy whether any of my content goes anywhere or not.

Don't let Apple or anyone downplaying this move the ball on you.

The act of scanning my own data for external purposes and goals of "seeing if I have anything they are looking for" -- is a massive privacy invasion

 

[Mega ST]

Entering my device for their interests goes too far.
My photos don't need to be checked by Apple because they are mine (and legal). Apple should not assume that ALL of their customers are criminals including the ones with iCloud set to "off" that still get their search database force installed.

 

[jons]

Yes. In a perfect world.

I’d like to keep us building toward that world instead of giving up. Resisting against measures like this go toward that IMO. It may be futile, but it might not be, at least we can be on the side of human rights.

 

[rme]

If your iPhone is checking your images and nothing leaves your iPhone, then where's the privacy invasion?

Your iPhone has been scanning all your photos for years, how do you think it knows "Sam" is in the photo?

In other words : 'don't do anything that might upset anyone and you'll be fine'
Maybe you're ok with that, but I don't want Uncle Sam in my phone.

 

[BreakingKayfabe]

The kind of man who demands that government enforce his ideas is always the kind whose ideas are idiotic.

H. L. Mencken

Loving the self-projection.

 

[hans1972]

You don't. I turned off both iCloud photo and iCloud backup. I turned off the messages function too. I'm back to encrypted backups on my M1 Mac, which I will likely be staying with Big Sur on.

And that's good. But where were the uproar when Apple introduced the iCloud backup feature?

To me, it's important to be consistent.

 

[bobob]

Sorry, this won't help the people who are on the fence or already have decided that Apple is no longer the way.

Which smartphone and which cloud service will these people be migrating to?

 

[bobcomer]

Let's see... Apple scanning a table of unique hashes (numbers that can't be reconstructed into anything) against hashed photos (also numbers that can't be reconstructed into anything) on my phone. Or, the government having access to all of my jpeg photos on iCloud.

Well, OK... But I'll still go with the first option.

Not me, the first can be expanded to scan for anything on my phone, even if I don't sync it with iCloud. For iCloud, it's not mine and if I want to use it, they already have permission to scan their own computers, so there's no expectation pf privacy...

 

[usagora]

I think you lack a basic understanding of technology.

There will be a scanning system on your device.
At any moment that scanning system can be used to scan.... for something else.
Its simply a matter of changing lines of code.

Thats the problem.

No, you lack a basic understanding of logic. With absolutely ZERO evidence, you're just assuming this technology will be used for nefarious purposes. Why would Apple even announce anything and create this huge snow job if they intended to use this technology for "evil" purposes? They'd just sneak it in there without telling you.

 

[mikethemartian]

The timing is perfect now for Rockwell to recycle his one hit “I always feel like Tim Cook is watching me”.

 

[Theo Belk]

If your iPhone is checking your images and nothing leaves your iPhone, then where's the privacy invasion?

Your iPhone has been scanning all your photos for years, how do you think it knows "Sam" is in the photo?

But data can now leave your phone. Until now your phone has never been able to report to any authority that "Sam" is in your photos. Now that this will be possible, all of your other data is vulnerable.

If your local authority decided that Apple must scan your email or SMS messages for certain criteria and report the contents, Apple can no longer refuse on the basis that it's simply impossible. They can also be coerced by government to keep such invasions secret.

 

[jgdeschamps]

If the US govt cared about child abuse they would've sent seal team 6 to Balmoral to pick up Andrew.

Mmh... ok... I guess? I really can't make anything out of your reply that could relate to what I posted.

 

[hunapu]

Which smartphone and which cloud service will these people be migrating to?

There is no point in answering that when the reply will be "But they do it too..."

 

[hans1972]

Way he said “around 30” made me wonder if they are rewriting code to raise it from a lower number or already are taking heat to drop it from a higher number.

his lack of precision was deliberate and unsettling.

But the issue isn’t if 10, 30 or 50, the issue is it’s being done at all.

You don't really rewrite code when you change a threshold value.

THRESHOLD = 50
If # of safety voucher >= THRESHOLD THEN
'Do something

They they do some more work on this and finds that a lower number is better.

THRESHOLD = 33
If # of safety voucher >= THRESHOLD THEN
'Do something

Most programmers wouldn't call this rewriting code. You just changed a constant.

He doesn't want to say the exact number to make it a bit more difficult to know and react to that number. Now the number is likely 25 to 34.

 

[hgmDQnmScv(5^8d>]

Which smartphone and which cloud service will these people be migrating to?

I think currently, the best option is to keep your iPhone, remain on iOS 14 and sign out of iCloud, making sure to delete all data stored on it. Next look at cloud storage providers such as Tresorit as an alternative. ProtonDrive is also an option, but as far as I know it does not yet have an app for macOS or iOS. Tresorit does and can upload your photos.

If like me you use apple email as your main address, set it to forward to a proton address or elsewhere. You can also add the account manually so you don't have to be signed into iCloud to get the email.

 

[Geepaw]

People say they want to protect the children from child abuse

What happens when they want to protect the children from gays and lesbians?
What happens when they want to protect the children from African-Americans or Chinese?
What happens when they want to protect the children from Muslims, or Jews, or Catholic?
What happens when they want to protect the children from art and music?

Do you see the slippery slope?

The reason I’m most appalled is that I trusted Apple with my privacy. I won’t give them the chance in the future.

Slippery slope arguments are logical fallacies. You can deal with these issues separately. Apple should do what it can to stop perverts from hurting kids.