How hard is it to understand they are different devices with completely different focuses with regards to the UI? That’s why they aren’t the same device. This is why Surface Pros are terrible. They are sporks with half the tines broken off, and bad ones at that. It is the worst tablet experience you will ever have, having owned one of them, thinking at the time that a desktop OS would be great on a tablet. That experience disabused me of that notion. I consider that Surface Pro to be my worst tech purchase of the last 10 years.
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Craig Federighi Explains Why Apple Won't Merge iPad and Mac: 'We Don't Want to Build Sporks'
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
The usual dialogue of deafs here...
People who want MacOS on iPad don't want MacOS instead of iPadOS but MacOS in addition to iPadOS (just like you can run Windows virtualized on a Mac without ruining MacOS in the slightest...). They don't want a Surface pro.
And to the pointless reply "buy a Mac", those same people probably already have a Mac but they want to carry 1 device, not 2 (sometimes they know they are going to want the iPad most of the time and the Mac only every now and then or viceversa).
That's a legitimate request. Will it happen? Never, it's not in Apple's interest.
People who want MacOS on iPad don't want MacOS instead of iPadOS but MacOS in addition to iPadOS (just like you can run Windows virtualized on a Mac without ruining MacOS in the slightest...). They don't want a Surface pro.
And to the pointless reply "buy a Mac", those same people probably already have a Mac but they want to carry 1 device, not 2 (sometimes they know they are going to want the iPad most of the time and the Mac only every now and then or viceversa).
That's a legitimate request. Will it happen? Never, it's not in Apple's interest.
Psychological regression at play here. It's easy to be told what to do, because in doing so we abdicate responsibility. It's easy to accept the dominant order, because it removes from us the necessity to test new things, or think in different ways. 17th-century philosopher Spinoza: "Why do men fight for their servitude as stubbornly as though it were their salvation?"
I started using Ubuntu on an old Thinkpad Yoga. It's a tablet, its a touchscreen computer. I have used a Macbook Pro as my main device for decades. Since using the Yoga, I split my time between MBP & TY. I now strongly, STRONGLY disagree with Apple's self-serving position. Having a touchscreen -- if you use your portable in a lot of different ergo positions -- is fantastic. Now, when I am on my MBP and end up touching the screen when it is the better, now more natural, option... I laugh out loud. It really is so useful and natural depending on how your are holding your MBP. (Note: this is ignoring the tablet mode the Yoga provides which is another dimension of usability.)
Your comment "What real world practical use would you personally use a touch screen computer for?" assumes everyone uses a computer same as you. Apple is clearly siloing the MBP so that they can avoid cannibalizing iPad sales. All these arguments about tired arms, sporks, etc. are just... Absurd.
I would advise you to get an older Yoga and run Ubuntu on it, but these devices have really held their resale value. It appears -- even running Windows -- that I am not alone WRT my appreciation of the Yoga if resale market values are believed.
Let some people carry only one device instead of two.
Let some people save some money by buying one device instead of two.
Many other companies at least give people an option to do that.
For example, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Asus, Dell, etc, make both traditional
non-touch laptop, touch-laptop together for consumers for years.
I do not use pen on laptop all the time,
but occasionally I do need inking on laptop.
Let some people save some money by buying one device instead of two.
Many other companies at least give people an option to do that.
For example, HP, Lenovo, Samsung, Asus, Dell, etc, make both traditional
non-touch laptop, touch-laptop together for consumers for years.
I do not use pen on laptop all the time,
but occasionally I do need inking on laptop.
Craig sure came prepared with a lot of ways to avoid saying: if iPad runs Mac apps we don’t get 30%.
Well, he *is* supposed to avoid saying things that are cynical bs, so I don’t see the problem.
I think Old apple used to try to make a perfect spork.
Iphone is a good spork(phone+ipod+internet). See 2007 original iphone presentation.
One way: Apple can make good spoon and fork by allowing seamless OS switching(macos and ipados) on ipad.
Iphone is a good spork(phone+ipod+internet). See 2007 original iphone presentation.
One way: Apple can make good spoon and fork by allowing seamless OS switching(macos and ipados) on ipad.
Many other companies do a lot of things Apple doesn’t. And yet, somehow, people still buy and love Apple. Makes you wonder, right?
Then ask for a Mac that has those features (I certainly wouldn’t mind a Mac with Pencil support). Don’t ask for an iPad to be something it’s not.
iphone = phone + ipod + internet connect
macpad = macbook + ipad(touch,pen) + cellular connectivity
Same can be done but profit …
So they literally lift their hand off their mouse to slide their greasy fingers across the screen instead of just rolling their scroll wheel? I don't even see an advantage in the accuracy/speed of the scrolling compared with a mouse. Absolutely bizarre behaviour IMHO.
I really don't like working on laptops by themselves. In the decade that I was issued a laptop for my old desk job I also had a large external display and external KB/mouse. I tried arranging the screens side by side, but my preferred arrangement was up and down. I'd elevate the external display so its bottom edge was at the top of the laptop screen, overlapping the bezels to minimize the blank space between them. Mostly I worked on the big screen straight in front of me while the laptop served as a secondary place for reference documents, email, instant messaging, etc.
He can hem and haw to save face all he wants, but with his release, he already took back a lot of his "philosophy" BS. Thankfully this foolish dogma is getting chipped away so he can say whatever he wants. I'll play along Craig, sure, whatever you say, Craig, just keep your "philosophy" out of the way from making us more productive, and keep it coming. More like iPad26, please.
Last edited:
Exactly. Grand Canyon backpacker speaking here. That spork is a practical and cuts down on weight. Nothing wrong with multi-functionality and flexibility. Apple could accommodate that on the iPad but as the comment with the most reactions said they will not sacrifice the extra 30% they earn in the AppStore.
Well, if you want iPad being iPad and Mac being Mac, then M4 iPad Pro shouldn't exists. iPad Pro with M4 is overkill, because of the limited iPadOS. Apple is working hard to make uses case of iPad Pro by making iPadOS closer to MacOS.
By the current implementation of windows management on iPadOS, it doesn't looks great.
I love my Surface Pro 7. Touch experience is acceptable and I can confidently say that I can use Surface Pro 7 on tablet mode.
ok... then give developers an easy option to move their apps lock, stock and barrel to the iPad; and the same for iPad users to install Mac apps on their iPad. Call it... Universal Binary or something. Let's even get crazy and throw a "3" on the name for some reason. Nobody will ever know why. Universal Binary 3. That's what people really want. Their fully fledged programs.
Yup... Apple's 1+ Billion active and repeat customers, making the company one of the most successful consumer tech companies in the world, speaks volumes. Clearly, Apple is making devices it's customers love to purchase and use. Year after year after year.
Apple knows what its doing. And Craig F hit the nail on the head for not having a tablet that runs macOS. I (and likely millions of others) would never purchase such a device.
Such a device would rank up there with Mac III, Lisa, Apple iPod Sox, 20th Anniversary Mac, Macintosh TV, PowerMac G4 Cube, Newton, Pippin, iPod HiFi, etc. All introduced and released by the previous Apple CEO.
Last edited:
There are 1.4 billion active and repeat Windows customer, making Microsoft one of the most successful tech companies in the word, speaks volumes. Clearly, Microsoft is making software that people love to purchase and use. Year after year after year.
Is that right?
I actually appreciate the rationale for holding off on menu bars. Surface devices never quite lived up to their promise. I think some of it, like the files app limitations, was unnecessary and limited the appeal to business users. It’s like Apple finally realized that people want to do work on iPads, not just consume Netflix.
I like Split View but inadvertently triggering Slide Over can result in lost Safari tabs if you don't extricate yourself carefully.
100%. A Mac should not feel like iPad software wise, and Mac laptops should not get a touch screen layer. iPads are already the touch screen computer system. Mac laptops should focus on precision, work and productivity, while iPads can be more simplified, rounded and touchy. Something like giving iPadOS a Finder on the left side of the dock is totally fine, but both devices should feel different. Macs should have more square windows and more complex tools, and the prior Settings app design should return to Macs. Regardless of features I think this release shows them as being too similar in feel. They should explicitly feel different. iPadOS is improved this time around, but UI wise macOS has taken a few steps back. Finger seized icons in Control Center on Mac is not needed.
Last edited:
Craig - I love you like a brutha BUT you are WRONG. Running macOS on the iPad should DEFINITELY at least be an OPTION - perhaps even a paid option?
MacStories' Federico Vittici, who is known for his focus on the iPad as a main computing device, recently did an interview with Apple software engineering chief Craig Federighi. Federighi and Vittici did a deep dive into the iPad and the changes that are coming to iPadOS this fall.
Federighi said that figuring out multitasking on the iPad has been a multi-year task that's required experimentation.
Apple wanted to ensure that users didn't have to worry about managing apps, and that led to the first implementation of Slide Over and Split View multitasking, which was limited. Federighi said ensuring that the iPad's simplicity and interactivity stays intact has always been "job one." Touch first experiences are "the non-negotiable in the whole thing," according to Federighi.
When Stage Manager came around as the next major multitasking change in 2022, Federighi said that the iPad and its OS were well-established and developers had a solid understanding that the iPad was distinct from the Mac, so Apple "felt a little more flexibility" to add multitasking options for those who wanted them.
Apple's long path toward more Mac-like multitasking features seems to reflect a fear that adding Mac capabilities to iPad would limit what developers might do on the iPad. Federighi suggested that if the iPad had app menu bars to begin with, developers might have tucked functionality away, and Apple wanted to encourage a simpler experience.It has taken time for Apple to establish how people are using iPads, and the decision to update iPad multitasking in iPadOS 26 was made to meet the needs of different kinds of iPad users. There are some users who want a simple iPhone-like interface with a fully immersive, single window, but there are also iPad users who want more control and more functionality beyond the tablet interface. "We came to the point of saying, 'Let's recognize that audience,'" Federighi said. "I think we've been on a journey of finding the right interface for iPad, along with our users," he said. "And I think it actually has been important that it's been considered a journey."
Federighi explained that with a new device and a different kind of user in mind, Apple needed to guard against the urge to "pull the old thing off the shelf and put it here because maybe that feels right." Instead, it was important to discover the "essence of iPad," and what windowing might be like on a touch-first device if the Mac had never existed. Apple is now trying to strike a balance.
Apple has long been resistant to merging iPadOS and macOS, and Federighi used a spork analogy to explain why. Apple's aim is not to displace the Mac, and each device has a different purpose.
Federighi went on to say that while the iPad can be "inspired" by Mac elements, he does not believe that the iPad should run macOS.
Vittici's full interview with Federighi goes into much more detail, and it is well worth a read over at MacStories.
Article Link: Craig Federighi Explains Why Apple Won't Merge iPad and Mac: 'We Don't Want to Build Sporks'
