Am I wrong or does the current MBPr 15" have the Iris Pro 5200? Is there much of a difference?
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OS Neutral Dedicated vs Integrated Graphic Game Performance
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Am I wrong or does the current MBPr 15" have the Iris Pro 5200? Is there much of a difference?
FYI, these are current and near current video card options, abstracted from the passmark tables
r9 m295x: 5024
r9 m290x: 2547
r9 m290: ?
r9 m370x: 1668
755m: 1569
750m: 1362
6100: 953
5200: 1189
Of course, Passmark is a opaque, and possibly irrelevant means of ranking video cards.
Consider this data from the similarly credulous gpuboss
nVidia 780m (once used in top end imacs): passmark 4120. Crysis 3: 29 fps Bioshock Inf: 46.8 fps
r9 m290x: passmark 2547. Crysis 3: 23 fps Bioshock Infinite: 46.8 fps
Suddenly, that huge advantage in passmark scores becomes whittled down into meaninglessness.
The MacBook Pro 15" comes with an intel 5200 and can be optionally equipped with an r9 m370x card.
r9 m295x: 5024
r9 m290x: 2547
r9 m290: ?
r9 m370x: 1668
755m: 1569
750m: 1362
6100: 953
5200: 1189
Of course, Passmark is a opaque, and possibly irrelevant means of ranking video cards.
Consider this data from the similarly credulous gpuboss
nVidia 780m (once used in top end imacs): passmark 4120. Crysis 3: 29 fps Bioshock Inf: 46.8 fps
r9 m290x: passmark 2547. Crysis 3: 23 fps Bioshock Infinite: 46.8 fps
Suddenly, that huge advantage in passmark scores becomes whittled down into meaninglessness.
The MacBook Pro 15" comes with an intel 5200 and can be optionally equipped with an r9 m370x card.
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When I went to the passmark site earlier today and again just now to confirm I got these curious results when comparing the GeForce GTX 775M and the GeForce GTX 780M where the former scored 4480 and the latter scored 4120.
The 780M was the top end option less than two years ago with late-2013 iMacs. That is not very long ago. There was quite a discussion in the iMac forum about the 775M vs the 780M, was the added $150. worth it, etc. that ran some 5 pages and got ugly in places. It was kind of interesting at the time but rereading it now I could not stop laughing and ultimately all I could think of was how less than two years later it really comes down to paying $150. more to suck a little less depending on what you want to compare it to. So, I just had to necro the thread and point that out while mentioning I just wanted some validation for my choice to go with the 775M. That's a little joke in reference to I think the first reply the original poster got.
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Yes you are correct. The score of the 5200 is 1,189 according to the previous link.
See also this thread from 2013 and this 2013 Anandtech review of the iMac
But until Apple releases a computer with 2015 era iris pro (HD 6200, or Iris Pro 580), it's kind of a moot point. At this point, the amd r9 graphics are palpably superior to any integrated graphics available in a mac.
But until Apple releases a computer with 2015 era iris pro (HD 6200, or Iris Pro 580), it's kind of a moot point. At this point, the amd r9 graphics are palpably superior to any integrated graphics available in a mac.
I will say, a lot of games work quite well on my (lame) Iris 6100 equipped 2015 MBPr 13.
Something to be mindful of is your expectations.
The cost delta between a 2015 MBPr 13" and a 2015 MBPr 15" with dedicated graphics is considerable.
You're going to have to take into consideration bang for buck, will the lower model suffice.
It does for my needs but you're going to have to look at what you want: games, resolutions, budget.
Something to be mindful of is your expectations.
The cost delta between a 2015 MBPr 13" and a 2015 MBPr 15" with dedicated graphics is considerable.
You're going to have to take into consideration bang for buck, will the lower model suffice.
It does for my needs but you're going to have to look at what you want: games, resolutions, budget.
Passmark is very outdated in terms of ranking GPUs, notebookcheck.net has much better benchmarks like real games and 3Dmark.
Also bare feats has mac specific benchmarks, here you can see the 750M vs Iris 6100:
http://barefeats.com/rmb12i2.html
Also bare feats has mac specific benchmarks, here you can see the 750M vs Iris 6100:
http://barefeats.com/rmb12i2.html
I have an Intel i5 4690k with integrated intel HD 4600 graphics, and theres a massive didderence between it and my GTX 970
Definitely if you are talking desktop class GPUs it is no contest.
Mobile, there are other things to consider like heat and power consumption and the discrete mobile GPUs from a few years ago aren't much better than current integrated.
That said, i had a problem with my regular desktop GTX760 and popped an old 8800 GTS into the machine temporarily and also compared to the integrated HD4600 in it. The 8800 GTS and HD4600 were about the same performance.
The HD5200 or HD6100 in the current MBPs are a fair bit faster than that.
I have a mid 2015 15-inch MacBook Pro with the AMD R9 M370X discrete graphics, runs most Steam games smoothly on highest settings. Also played Bioshock Infinite (Mac App Store version) on high graphics smoothly, but the FPS appears to decrease slightly over time since it gets so hot and needs to throttle down.
If you want to play any modern games on great looking graphics quality, Intel's integrated graphics solution will no doubt disappoint you.
If you want to play any modern games on great looking graphics quality, Intel's integrated graphics solution will no doubt disappoint you.
I think there will always be a noticeable difference between integrated and dedicated GPUs. Although you gotta admit, Intel is trying hard to close that gap somewhat, which of course is a commendable effort.
Definitely - in terms of power per watt intel is doing great things. People say "intel GPUs suck" but you have to take into consideration the power budget - the mobile discrete GPUs have the same power budget as an entire quad core intel CPU (about 45 watts or so).
The HD6100 for example shares 28 watts with the rest of the CPU in the 13" RMBP.
You're never going to get 45 watt discrete GPU performance out of that power/thermal budget, given equal process tech (i.e., comparing 2015 iGPU to 2015 dGPU).
The current intel integrated GPUs are pretty damn amazing when you consider what they're actually doing and the resources they are doing it with; the HD6100 in my 2015 13" machine feels similar in performance to the HD6750 in my 2011 15" with the stuff i've tested them both with. in 1/3 the CPU + GPU power budget...
I am looking forward to seeing what kind of GPU performance is going to come with the Skylake processor onboard graphics. I am giving serious thought to making a Mac mini my next Mac rather than blowing three grand for a top of the line 27" iMac. I'd spend the savings on a good gaming monitor that supports HDMI television input along with DVI input, etc. and hook up a PS4 to it on my desktop for a lot of my gaming.
By the time I would be shopping for a mini, my current system will be 2 to 3 years old depending on how soon I go to do this. Sooner is tempting as my late-2013 27" iMac will be worth more presumably the sooner I sell it which I can then put towards the mini, etc. Naturally, I have to wait and see when there is a refresh and what that refresh offers.
I am still on the fence about this change and it is early but some of the things that really appeal to me about it are how flexible such a setup would be going forward. It's worthy of note that a great number of games I own are classics and other games that are not especially demanding on the MAS, Steam, GOG, Origin, Blizzard, etc. and a lot of my present holdings would probably run decently enough to suit me on a next gen mini. Don't get me wrong there. I don't delude myself thinking I am going to get desktop gaming PC performance by any stretch. I am okay with that. But most of my games are older titles that don't need that class of machine to run.
The nice thing about this is I get my cake and I get to eat it too in terms of having a nice Mac for all the regular computing things I do and it could play quite a lot of games I own just fine. The GPU would be driving a 24 inch screen at 1080p but I could turn it down as needed for some stuff. Again though, so many legacy games that are still good games don't need much in the way of hardware compared to new AAA releases and that is what the PS4 would be for.
Going forward, I could potentially if desired build a Windows gaming box and put it under my desktop. It is easy enough to use a KVM switch for the systems to share peripherals and sound.
The initial outlay for a top of the line mini BTO, the screen, a PS4 and an upgrade from my Bose Companion 20s to a Bose Companion 5 sound system would be considerably less than a new iMac. Granted, I am trading off a fancy IPS panel but honestly, it isn't that big of a deal to me. I do not do anything professionally with graphics images, etc. where color accuracy is highly important. My old eyes wouldn't know the difference unless the two screens were next to each other and that won't be happening so whatever. It'll be more than good enough for me.
While I have no affection for Microsoft adding an Xbox for Halo and Gears of War games would be tempting also. Even adding that it still comes in under 3 grand total with Applecare on the mini.
A plus with doing this is that I won't feel any pressure to upgrade the mini on the same sort of schedule I would an iMac due to an aging GPU that cannot be upgraded. In the mini with consoles and possibly a PC later on it does not matter as I would not buy anything new that it could not run decently. I'd just get whatever it was for a system where it could such as the PS4.
So because I am thinking like this for a year or so down the road, maybe a little more, I am very interested in what comes out next from Intel for onboard GPUs and how well they do manage to perform. It will be nice if a good deal of what I currently own runs well with one which should be true as I always tend to buy games that have aged and gone to deep discounts, in other words I have very little that is current and demanding to begin with.
By the time I would be shopping for a mini, my current system will be 2 to 3 years old depending on how soon I go to do this. Sooner is tempting as my late-2013 27" iMac will be worth more presumably the sooner I sell it which I can then put towards the mini, etc. Naturally, I have to wait and see when there is a refresh and what that refresh offers.
I am still on the fence about this change and it is early but some of the things that really appeal to me about it are how flexible such a setup would be going forward. It's worthy of note that a great number of games I own are classics and other games that are not especially demanding on the MAS, Steam, GOG, Origin, Blizzard, etc. and a lot of my present holdings would probably run decently enough to suit me on a next gen mini. Don't get me wrong there. I don't delude myself thinking I am going to get desktop gaming PC performance by any stretch. I am okay with that. But most of my games are older titles that don't need that class of machine to run.
The nice thing about this is I get my cake and I get to eat it too in terms of having a nice Mac for all the regular computing things I do and it could play quite a lot of games I own just fine. The GPU would be driving a 24 inch screen at 1080p but I could turn it down as needed for some stuff. Again though, so many legacy games that are still good games don't need much in the way of hardware compared to new AAA releases and that is what the PS4 would be for.
Going forward, I could potentially if desired build a Windows gaming box and put it under my desktop. It is easy enough to use a KVM switch for the systems to share peripherals and sound.
The initial outlay for a top of the line mini BTO, the screen, a PS4 and an upgrade from my Bose Companion 20s to a Bose Companion 5 sound system would be considerably less than a new iMac. Granted, I am trading off a fancy IPS panel but honestly, it isn't that big of a deal to me. I do not do anything professionally with graphics images, etc. where color accuracy is highly important. My old eyes wouldn't know the difference unless the two screens were next to each other and that won't be happening so whatever. It'll be more than good enough for me.
While I have no affection for Microsoft adding an Xbox for Halo and Gears of War games would be tempting also. Even adding that it still comes in under 3 grand total with Applecare on the mini.
A plus with doing this is that I won't feel any pressure to upgrade the mini on the same sort of schedule I would an iMac due to an aging GPU that cannot be upgraded. In the mini with consoles and possibly a PC later on it does not matter as I would not buy anything new that it could not run decently. I'd just get whatever it was for a system where it could such as the PS4.
So because I am thinking like this for a year or so down the road, maybe a little more, I am very interested in what comes out next from Intel for onboard GPUs and how well they do manage to perform. It will be nice if a good deal of what I currently own runs well with one which should be true as I always tend to buy games that have aged and gone to deep discounts, in other words I have very little that is current and demanding to begin with.
Yup, I actually returned my discrete GPU MBP to Apple and grabbed a used IGP MBP recently because of this. The 5200 is pretty solid, about the same as a Nvidia 640m, which was pretty good when I had one in a Sony Vaio.
Grid 2 runs 900p Ultra Low Settings at 45 fps in OSX. IMO it still looks good enough to skip boot camp entirely. Pretty sure I could bump up to Medium in Windows on the same hardware.
Borderlands 2 also runs good on medium settings.
If I could just have my Mass Effect, Elder Scrolls and Fallout games in OSX I would be happy.
Exactly the same reason i went for the 13" machine this time around.
it's no gaming powerhouse, but neither is any discrete GPU macbook either. But I have had 13 hrs of battery life, which no discrete machine will touch.
Seven years later, I am looking to upgrade my 2016 MBP. There is another thread here about it and gaming:
Honestly gaming on my Mac (see sig) has been a complete bust, especially when you can afford an adequate and less expensive PC too.
Out of curiosity, can anyone educate me on Apple’s integrated graphics with their new M1? I’m actually in a quandary about my next Mac purchase if there is one…I’ve got a 2016 MBP which is mostly useless for gaming and struggles working with Unreal Engine so I don’t, just take notes, surf, pay bills and manage images. Yes I‘ve always preferred the MacOS as a comfortable environment, and I just tolerate Windows because of gaming, and currently educating myself with UE.
For my next laptop update, I could update to $1999 14” MBP and face the same struggles that have always existed with gaming on a Mac or spend $800 (under a thousand) ASUS laptop and abandon the comfort of the MacOS and associated programs I use that are Mac only.
Now keep in mind, I used to travel frequently for work, and there was a time I was willing to pay $2400 for a MBR that ran Bootcamp, and a played most games (that I wanted to play) in a passable manner, (no not great or in some cases not good) but it was not that often I ran into this. For example ARK: Survival Evolved was close to being a slide show in 2016.
Also I have a home built PC laptop, built in 2013, upgraded in 2019, which for 99% of the time, fulfills both my gaming and working in Unreal Engine (building gaming environments) needs.
I do like the MacOS, when I’m on vacation really I should have better things to do than play on my computer.. I might just say the hell with it, and go with a lesser MBP. But then it chaffs my butt that I have to spend $2000 to get 3 thunderbolt ports instead of 2 ($1200). I flashback to my 2012 MBP that had a dedicated graphics card and cost $2400.
Thoughts?
nanoreview.net
Honestly gaming on my Mac (see sig) has been a complete bust, especially when you can afford an adequate and less expensive PC too.
Out of curiosity, can anyone educate me on Apple’s integrated graphics with their new M1? I’m actually in a quandary about my next Mac purchase if there is one…I’ve got a 2016 MBP which is mostly useless for gaming and struggles working with Unreal Engine so I don’t, just take notes, surf, pay bills and manage images. Yes I‘ve always preferred the MacOS as a comfortable environment, and I just tolerate Windows because of gaming, and currently educating myself with UE.
For my next laptop update, I could update to $1999 14” MBP and face the same struggles that have always existed with gaming on a Mac or spend $800 (under a thousand) ASUS laptop and abandon the comfort of the MacOS and associated programs I use that are Mac only.
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Now keep in mind, I used to travel frequently for work, and there was a time I was willing to pay $2400 for a MBR that ran Bootcamp, and a played most games (that I wanted to play) in a passable manner, (no not great or in some cases not good) but it was not that often I ran into this. For example ARK: Survival Evolved was close to being a slide show in 2016.
Also I have a home built PC laptop, built in 2013, upgraded in 2019, which for 99% of the time, fulfills both my gaming and working in Unreal Engine (building gaming environments) needs.
I do like the MacOS, when I’m on vacation really I should have better things to do than play on my computer.. I might just say the hell with it, and go with a lesser MBP. But then it chaffs my butt that I have to spend $2000 to get 3 thunderbolt ports instead of 2 ($1200). I flashback to my 2012 MBP that had a dedicated graphics card and cost $2400.
Thoughts?
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This pretty much sums up AS gaming graphics performance.
Consensus is going dual-platform. $1999 14" Macbook Pro 14GPU for non-gaming/YouTube content creation and PC laptop with at least 3060 for gaming/everything else that's faster than most expensive $3100+ Macbook Pro 32GPU.
Consensus is going dual-platform. $1999 14" Macbook Pro 14GPU for non-gaming/YouTube content creation and PC laptop with at least 3060 for gaming/everything else that's faster than most expensive $3100+ Macbook Pro 32GPU.
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Ask yourself what games you want to play and if these are available for macOS in the first place. If not, then there’s little point trying to use a Mac as a gaming machine. The base 14” Pro won’t get you really far when it comes to gaming performance for games that have modern graphics. Older games like Diablo 3 or the typical App Store mobile games type graphics works well. But I wouldn’t expect anything from newer games with “realistic” graphics.
That being said, if you want a laptop you can use for most average games (when it comes to graphics), you’re much better off with a Windows PC/laptop. But why the full switch? We used to say “Mac is for working, Linux for networking and Windows for Solitaire”, so how about grabbing the smallest MBA for work and an additional Windows system for gaming? Or wait for WWDC and see what Apple is going to do with the iPad, maybe that’s enough for work related tasks.
As for UE5, I wouldn’t expect too much. Some of the UE5 features won’t work in macOS properly or at all, if they ever will remains to be seen. Forget about Windows, you can’t run Bootcamp. The best you can do is run the ARM version of Windows in macOS, which is pointless for gaming. No game using DirectX 12 will work on M1 based hardware, not with Parallels, not with Crossover, not with anything. If that’s ever going to change remains to be seen.
So in the end, the question you have to answer for yourself is how happy would you be with the limited selection of games on the Mac and can you live with it?
That being said, if you want a laptop you can use for most average games (when it comes to graphics), you’re much better off with a Windows PC/laptop. But why the full switch? We used to say “Mac is for working, Linux for networking and Windows for Solitaire”, so how about grabbing the smallest MBA for work and an additional Windows system for gaming? Or wait for WWDC and see what Apple is going to do with the iPad, maybe that’s enough for work related tasks.
As for UE5, I wouldn’t expect too much. Some of the UE5 features won’t work in macOS properly or at all, if they ever will remains to be seen. Forget about Windows, you can’t run Bootcamp. The best you can do is run the ARM version of Windows in macOS, which is pointless for gaming. No game using DirectX 12 will work on M1 based hardware, not with Parallels, not with Crossover, not with anything. If that’s ever going to change remains to be seen.
So in the end, the question you have to answer for yourself is how happy would you be with the limited selection of games on the Mac and can you live with it?
This is where I have been:
But why the full switch? We used to say “Mac is for working, Linux for networking and Windows for Solitaire”, so how about grabbing the smallest MBA for work and an additional Windows system for gaming?
…since 2016. In 2013 I built a gaming PC (since upgraded + graphic card in 2020), then in 2016, after an Apple price hike that enraged me kind of, I downgraded from my 2012 MBP with dedicated graphics to 2016, when I still paid $2000 for this MBP with integrated graphics. Macs are expensive. Why not get a MBAir? I wanted the extra hardware connectivity via ports.
Why not get a <$1000 PC Gaming laptop? I ca’nt bring myself to go totally to the dark side, that’s why…
Where before $2400 got you dedicated graphics and acceptable gaming via Bootcamp, in 2016, Apple had raised the price for dedicated graphics in a MBP to roughly $3k and as a result I threw in the towel on Mac gaming. Now going even cheaper, I might be able to scrape by with two USB ports. it’s spend $1200 or $2000 to surf, manage finances and photos…