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Design Ethicist Imagines How Apple Could Help Combat Tech Addiction in Future iOS Updates

Should we be worried to know there is even such a thing as a Design Ethicist?

Do we need or want companies like Google, Facebook and Apple telling us what is moral? ( right and wrong )

Could a push to combat digital “addiction” become an issue of censorship?

Will Design Ethicist decide not only the content that is allowed on devices but also who is allowed to have access to such devices?
 
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MacTiki said:
Should we be worried to know there is even such a thing as a Design Ethicist?

Do we need or want companies like Google, Facebook and Apple telling us what is moral? ( right and wrong )

Could a push to combat digital “addiction” become an issue of censorship?

Will Design Ethicist decide not only the content that is allowed on devices but also who is allowed to have access to such devices?
Click to expand...

No, not really. Why should we worry?

Who said that was going to happen?

Of course not.

Where did you get that idea?
 
jav6454 said:
It is a parent's job to monitor kids phone usage, not a corporation's.
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Well said and I totally agree...and why is there a focus on the "hardware"...I'm not on my phone for the Apple software (for the most part). I'm using social media, news feeds, games, etc. -or- I'm working on my phone (ie emails, actual phone calls, etc). Go back a decade or so... the TV manufacturers were not building in dialog boxes telling people they were watching too much TV. it always comes down to personal responsibility.
 
How did this even get published? This sounds like an old person claiming "kids these days spend too much time on their devices" This was never done with macOS...why would they do that on iOS? An incredibly poor idea.

Also, how would the system know what is "valuable" and what is a "time-waster"? "Phineas, you spent 6 hours in Mail this week. Would you like me to interrupt your work this week?"
 
macOS and Windows have had tools for a very long time to allow parents to monitor and limit children's usage.

Please explain to me, exactly, how iOS should be different.

Also, please don't invoke "personal responsibility", because you damn well know kids defy their parents. You did, I did, we all did.
 
BigMcGuire said:
People who rely on their phones for social aspects of life are being damaged imo. I despise Facebook and Instagram and Snapchat. I use my phone to read books, watch youtube videos usually to learn how to do something, and to catch up on Macrumors. It depends on how you use your phone imo - but Facebook can be very dangerous.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I only use Facebook to check on 1 private group on a self development subject I am learning about. I never do any scrolling on my timeline of any kind, and I have all notifications / badges turned off. Total time spent per day is maybe 30 minutes. As for Instagram and Snapchat, they are the bane of my existence.

Other than the small caveat, and 20 minutes per day on MR, practically 100% of my time is spent for financial gain & learning.
 
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Phineasgage1848 said:
How did this even get published? This sounds like an old person claiming "kids these days spend too much time on their devices" This was never done with macOS...why would they do that on iOS? An incredibly poor idea.

Also, how would the system know what is "valuable" and what is a "time-waster"? "Phineas, you spent 6 hours in Mail this week. Would you like me to interrupt your work this week?"
Click to expand...

The problem with the article is, it sets up the discussion this way:

I got to thinking about Apple’s responsibility last week when two large investors wrote an open letter asking the company to do more about its products’ effects on children. I was initially inclined to dismiss the letter as a publicity stunt; if you’re worried about children and tech, why not go after Facebook?
​
Then proceeds to quote experts who do not talk about children-focused controls at all. He used the children issue to jump off into another topic without ever coming back to the topic at hand. That's where I take issue with the article.
 
jav6454 said:
It is a parent's job to monitor kids phone usage, not a corporation's.
Click to expand...

Yes, but phone manufactures can make parent's job easier, say offering report on how much time their teens spend on the phone, and on which apps, letting parent lock certain apps during certain time of the day, etc

To be fair, Apple is much less an offender than Facebook(Instagram) and Google (Youtube) which designed their product to make teens addicted. They are worse than big Tobaccos.
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rlewisphilly said:
Well said and I totally agree...and why is there a focus on the "hardware"...I'm not on my phone for the Apple software (for the most part). I'm using social media, news feeds, games, etc. -or- I'm working on my phone (ie emails, actual phone calls, etc). Go back a decade or so... the TV manufacturers were not building in dialog boxes telling people they were watching too much TV. it always comes down to personal responsibility.
Click to expand...

Apple develops the OS and approves all apps running on iPhone. It has the ultimate control over everything on iPhone, more so than any other phone manufacturers.
 
SuperMatt said:
Google has over 80% smartphone marketshare. They also profit off of having your constant attention. But let's go after Apple to fix all of society's problems!
Click to expand...

Thats because with Google, the end user is not the customer but the product. Google doesn't care whose device you use to access their services, they just want your eyeballs on their product so that they can sell ads.
 
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IJ Reilly said:
No, not really. Why should we worry?

Who said that was going to happen?

Of course not.

Where did you get that idea?
Click to expand...

Hope my reply does not sound too Orwellian.

For me a red flag pops up when words like Design Ethicist are used.

“I do think this is their time to step up,” said Tristan Harris, a former design ethicist at Google who now runs Time Well Spent, an organization working to improve technology’s impact on society.

From http://www.tristanharris.com

“How do you ethically steer the thoughts and actions of two billion people’s minds every day?”

“is currently developing a framework for ethical persuasion,”

Do you want someone telling you what size soda you can buy?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sugary_Drinks_Portion_Cap_Rule

Do you want someone telling you what you can or cannot do due to their moral beliefs or philosophy?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_law

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_county

Could companies that utilize Design Ethicist or similar such practices endanger a persons Freedom of Thought?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_thought

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethicist

An ethicist is one whose judgment on ethics and ethical codes has come to be trusted by a specific community, and (importantly) is expressed in some way that makes it possible for others to mimic or approximate that judgment. Following the advice of ethicists is one means of acquiring knowledge (see argument, argument from authority).[1][2]

The term jurist describes an ethicist whose judgment on law becomes part of a legal code, or otherwise has force of law. This may be due to formal (de jure) state sanction.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethics

Ethics or moral philosophy is a branch of philosophy that involves systematizing, defending, and recommending concepts of right and wrong conduct.[1] The term ethics derives from Ancient Greek ἠθικός (ethikos), from ἦθος (ethos), meaning 'habit, custom'. The branch of philosophy axiology comprises the sub-branches of ethics and aesthetics, each concerned with values.[2]

Ethics seeks to resolve questions of human morality by defining concepts such as good and evil, right and wrong, virtue and vice, justice and crime. As a field of intellectual enquiry, moral philosophy also is related to the fields of moral psychology, descriptive ethics, and value theory.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality

Morality (from the Latin moralis "manner, character, proper behavior") is the differentiation of intentions, decisions and actions between those that are distinguished as proper and those that are improper.[1] Morality can be a body of standards or principles derived from a code of conduct from a particular philosophy, religion or culture, or it can derive from a standard that a person believes should be universal.[2] Morality may also be specifically synonymous with "goodness" or "rightness".
 
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kyeblue said:
Yes, but phone manufactures can make parent's job easier, say offering report on how much time their teens spend on the phone, and on which apps, letting parent lock certain apps during certain time of the day, etc
Click to expand...

But not enacting the types of controls these people want. They want a way to lock out a child. What's wrong with just telling them "Hey (insert child's name here), it's enough phone for today, go play outside"
 
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Very much for this. Apple -at least in public- has been fairly progressive on privacy whereas we basically haven't heard a peep from Google Facebook or Amazon. **** those companies for that. I see apple pivoting toward health before the others as a relatively altruistic move. Apple has, as far as I can tell, led the way on recyclability at this scale despite their having a long way to go.

If apple continued to build its reputation on doing the right thing, I would have renewed faith in them. As of right now, they just make products that ride on their old reputation of being rock solid. Bring back rock solid, add altruism and they'll be put back on top.

To those yacking about how anti-profit a move like this would be, I think you're vastly underestimating the value of brand trust. It's apple's bread and butter. In fact it's all they've got at this point!

Beyond this, internet addiction, is as real as any other type of addiction. Putting the things this society virtually requires you to have like email and a cell phone functionality in the same package with addiction machines like facebook and candy crush isn't fair to users is like putting a bar at an AA meeting and blaming alcoholics for relapsing.
 
jav6454 said:
It is a parent's job to monitor kids phone usage, not a corporation's.
Click to expand...

I wonder how parents dealt with TV addiction in the 20th Century... I don't believe parents asked the TV Stations to do something about it.

And I don't recall anyone asking Tobacco Companies to do something about tobacco addiction either.
What about alcohol addiction? Who's responsible for controlling this?
 
MacTiki said:
Hope my reply does not sound too Orwellian.
Click to expand...

No, it seems to me more like somewhat paranoid. It was the choice of the writer of this piece to talk to this "Design Ethicist." I have never heard of this specialty before, and I suspect I never will again. I've pointed this out at least three times already, but once again, his comments have no real connection to anything Apple has been asked to do. What Apple has actually been asked to do, and has expressed a willingness to explore, is giving parents more control over how their kids use their products. As nearly as I can tell, the argument against this doesn't exist, and that doesn't change because some writer shifts the frame of discussion to something else, either deliberately or through carelessness.

BTW, have to say I hope I never get to a place where the word ethics or the concepts it embraces seem at all scary.
 
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ThisBougieLife said:
And many parents don't want to step up to the plate, especially if they are addicted to tech themselves. My friend gives her 5-year-old son an iPad to keep him quiet and it's no surprise that he becomes enraged when she tries to take it away (after he's been at it for hours).
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The iPad is their Nanny, a very inexpensive Nanny.

Electronic devices have suddenly become the 2010 decade's new parental choice of nanny and pacifier.
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sza said:
I love to work on developing apps on iOS, is that an addiction that I have to get rid off?
Click to expand...
Please get rid of it once iOS is no longer relevant... :D
 
audiomatt said:
To those yacking about how anti-profit a move like this would be, I think you're vastly underestimating the value of brand trust. It's apple's bread and butter. In fact it's all they've got at this point!
Click to expand...

If Apple does what it has been asked to do, it wouldn't be entirely (if at all) out of the goodness of their collective hearts. Lots of parents are concerned about how their kids are interacting with tech. Giving them some control over it would be a real selling point for those parents.
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jav6454 said:
But not enacting the types of controls these people want. They want a way to lock out a child. What's wrong with just telling them "Hey (insert child's name here), it's enough phone for today, go play outside"
Click to expand...

What's wrong with parental controls?
 
Swampthing said:
Sometimes these people don’t think things through. What financial incentive would there be for Apple to help people use their product less?

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
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I’d be willing to bet Apple would make more money if they introduced this as a feature, as it improves the user experience and the quality of the time spent.
 
Or you could just tell your kids to get off and go play, like I do if they have been on their iPads for a while.
 
First thing came to my mind: "Hey, teacher leave them kids alone!"
Then I realized - how about you can see summary as daily text from your kid(s) phone?
Initially it should be informational tool, then preventive - to restrict timer for daily or weekly use.
It may have it's applications:
- Dad, can I play now - homework is done early
- Sure, kid, let me text you 2 hours allowance for your game.....
:D:D:D
 
I think Apple has been making great strides. I find using my apple devices more and more boring each and every day, since every new device they come out with is almost exactly the same as devices they've had for the past 4 years.

They are doing a terrific job of keeping me off my devices, and curbed my desire for wanting new ones.
 
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