Desperately need a new computer, but my eyes are not cooperative

[Timpetus]

Make sure you're following the 20/20/20 rule, whatever else you do to solve this problem. Look at something at least 20 feet away for 20 seconds every 20 minutes. Your eyes need to change their focus occasionally or they'll degrade much faster and you'll have vision issues even during the 8 hours you're apparently not looking at a screen.

 

[FatLouie]

This is your problem in a nutshell. Staring at a screen all day is going to knacker your eyes. Dry eyes from not blinking are the least of your worries.

This is something best discussed with an optometrist well versed in occupational eye strain. Anything else is skirting around the issue. The optometrist should also give you pointers in what sort of screen to pick as well.

Yep. That is why I mentioned the Oasis eye drops in a previous post. My eye doc was adamant about me understanding that when we use a computer, we tend to stare and not blink as often as we do when we are watching TV from across the room, or speaking with someone. The end result are dry eyes, blurry eyes, irritated eyes.

OP says he spends 16 hour days on the computer, no doubt his eyes are drying out.

 

[RedTomato]

I have considered using this iMac as a makeshift monitor, but the panel is starting to deteriorate and flicker now and then, which is quite irritating in itself. So I don't see this being a long-term solution. I may have to see if I can acquire an old Lightning display off ebay if I want to go that route. The only other option is to see if the new 24" imacs are any different... or wait and see what comes out in the future. Maybe I'll have to sit and wait to see what comes of the oled macbooks rumored to come out next year. Not sure what else I can do, really.

You've already tried so many monitors I honestly don't think it's worth waiting for a new Mac to come out. It will NOT be what you want. I suggest putting in place something you already know works.

1. Buy another iMac 2010 the same size as the one you already use. This will be your new screen. You already know it works fine for you.

2. (trial) Test it with a borrowed M-series computer (Mac mini or MacBook) to see if the 2010 iMac accepts displayport input. Some responses here say it won't, some say it will. (You can test with your current degrading 2010 iMac, you don't need a new one for this test.)

3. If the test works, great, keep your new 2010 iMac and use it as an external screen for the Mx Mac. A M1 Mac mini is dirt cheap used nowadays and will work fine for you.

4. If the test fails, buy one of the last Intel Macs to use with your new 2010 iMac in Target Display mode. Any Mac model made 2019 or so will do, and they're getting quite cheap now. Use a modern SSD as a system drive, will give it a speed boost. Will be far better than than your current 2010 iMac.

5. Consider buying a second 2010 iMac to keep as spare.

 

[drrich2]

I'm not familiar with all the models you listed having tried. I share some concerns with other posters, and I'd like to know...

1.) Have you tried a high refresh rate display? People have mentioned flicker can irritate some people; perhaps a high refresh rate would help?

2.) Have you tried an OLED display? Perhaps one with high refresh rate? You said the Samsung odyssey g7 (which is QLED and 240-Hz refresh rate), and that "...thought I returned that because it had other issues that I wasn't able to accept..." What other issues? Was it okay for your eyes? Note: I think QLED is a type of OLED technology).

3.) Have you tried blowing up the text and viewing a display from farther away? I'm well into my 50's and my eyes are different even from each other. I crash in a plush recliner with my eyes about 4 - 5 feet from a 27" 4K display; I hold down the Command key and tap + until most online elements blow up to comfy viewing. I suspect less eye strain. Perhaps some distance would help offset the unpleasant experience you get from matte as opposed to glossy.

4.) I was going to ask about what brightness levels the displays you tried had, but the Apple Studio Display is capable of high brightness, so subtle straining to cope to lower brightness probably isn't your issue?

I get that the 2010 iMac didn't give you eye strain, and newer displays do, so it stands to reason something is different. Yes.

 

[drrich2]

Better Display is a GitHub app (with a free version) which allows FRC to be turned off.
Which helps some people.

Had no idea Better Display could do that; a little Googling turned up this page:

Eye care: prevent PWM and or temporal dithering​

From the article:

"In order to prevent PWM flicker, you first need to figure out the hardware brightness threshold below which PWM is activated. For most displays this is somewhere between the 30% and 50% range. You can use various techniques to figure out the exact treshold or you can simply assume 40% which should be safe for most displays.

In order to prevent the display to use hardware brightness levels below the PWM threshold and use BetterDisplay's software dimming instead (which does not trigger PWM), you should change the Combined brightness - minimum allowed hardware brightness level setting under the display's Advanced control settings section (make sure Combined brightness is enabled for the display)."

Note: Recent Intel era iMacs were capable to pretty strong brightness (I used to use a 2017 27" iMac), higher than come non-Apple displays. The mid. 2010 27" iMac, on the other hand - Typical brightness: 375 cd/m2.

Also:

"Preventing temporal dithering on Apple Silicon Macs​

Note
In app version v3.x the GPU Dithering option mentioned below can be found under the Color Mode menu.
Apple Silicon Macs automatically select the best available color depth for a display connection - this usually results in 10-bit color depth with no option to change this and thus prevent temporal dithering (or FRC - a high frequency switching between color levels to achieve an interim color).

Starting with version v2.3.0 you can toggle GPU Dithering under Image Adjustments to turn temporal dithering on and off for Apple Silicon Macs. This option is available and useful both for the built-in and external displays. Please note that this setting changes GPU side dithering and disables dithering for built-in Apple displays - external displays that have their might have their own additional hardware temporal dithering algorithms (still disabling GPU dithering helps)."

Yeah, I should clarify that I've been searching for a substitute for a couple of years now. I've tried and returned many monitors including the Studio Display.

Something just dawned on me. Maybe irrelevant, but I gotta ask. That list of displays you tried over a couple of years; what computer were you using to try them?

See, I just assumed you were using a computer that could drive whatever the display's capabilities were (e.g.: 144-Hz refresh rates). Were you using the mid.-2010 27" iMac? If so, your graphics system was one of these two per Apple's product page:

• 3.2GHz
  • ATI Radeon HD 5670 graphics processor with 512MB of GDDR3 memory
• 2.8GHz
  • ATI Radeon HD 5750 graphics processor with 1GB of GDDR5 memory

Quick Googling didn't tell me what resolution/frame rate combo. the Radeon HD 5670 supported, but...the year 2010... Consumers started getting 4K t.v.s in 2012. 4K Computer displays started rolling out in 2013 (from online searching). So what might a 2010 iMac drive?

Big question - what computer were you driving those displays with?

 

[Nguyen Duc Hieu]

No, no you can't! Read the Apple Support article which one of you mentioned https://support.apple.com/en-us/105126
This says:

• The iMac used as a display must have macOS High Sierra or earlier installed.
• The other Mac that you're connecting it to must have been introduced in 2019 or earlier and have macOS Catalina or earlier installed.

It can only work when both Macs are "old".

Yes yes you can.
I've used my iMac 2010 27" as a monitor for a Windows PC, using DisplayPort to miniDisplayPort (the easiest set-up)
Many other people have confirmed that they could use Macmini M1, M1 Macbook to output video to iMac 2010. They used the Thunderbolt port, not the HDMI port.
As long as the source devices (Mac, Windows PC, Linux PC) can send video signal to minidisplayport protocol, the iMac 2010 can act as the display. It will automatically switch to TDM upon receiving the signal,, at the log-in screen of High Sierra.

 

[gilby101]

Yes yes you can.

Ok, I was only reporting what Apple supports. Your experience says otherwise, so that sounds good in this case.

 

[mac57mac57]

This sounds interesting...

I have a 2012 iMac, 27", which has a beautiful display. Right now, it is loaded with Mavericks.

Can I use this as a display for my G5s, via a DVI to Miniport adapter, or some other means (not at the machine right now - can't check if it even has a Miniport in input)?

 

[PaulD-UK]

@mac57mac57 "Can I use this as a display for my G5s, via a DVI to Miniport adapter..."

ERRATA: The following only applies to the use of a 2009-10 iMac 27" as a display.
A 2012 iMac 27" is a Thunderbolt 1 system, and can only be used as a display with A TB1/2 input cable.

Because the iMac has a 1440p screen I think it would need to be an Active adapter, with internal conversion electronics.
99.999999% of the active adapters ever sold were MiniDP (TB1/2) to DVI adapters, to connect a MiniDP or TB1/2 Mac (which Apple sold from the mid 2000s to 2015) to a DVI monitor, which everyone, including Apple, sold back then.

I've never heard of a mDP to DVI adapter, or a bi-directional one with the input/outputs interchangeable.

Maybe you could fit a newer GPU in the G5 which has a mDP output?

 

[mac57mac57]

I have found a DVI to Thunderbolt connector, with an integrated conversion chip in it. LOOKS promising, and not too expensive. I will try it and see. That would really free up some desk space!

 

[okkibs]

Let's try something different: Can you try out a MBP or Studio Display with the nano texture option? It reduces reflections in a way that I personally find to reduce eye strain significantly. It might be all you need, really. And Apple's nano texture is the best looking option I have seen to date meaning that it doesn't impact visual quality so it really doesn't do anything other than reduce eye strain.

Even at night in a dark room I find the nano texture display to be more pleasant to look at.

As mentioned before, when trying any Mac or display connected to a Mac, please use the app Stillcolor that allows to disable Dithering and make sure the checkmark is set to disable dithering in the macOS menu bar at the top.

The iMac I'm using now is the mid 2010 27"

Alright, I realized a problem with looking up details about it - nobody tested iMac displays in-depth back in 2010 and nobody tests an old 2010 display in 2025. So there isn't any data that could tell me why that particular display is great for your eyes.

Dell s2721qs - This one, unless it is a false claim, was said to be using a true 10-bit monitor.

Unfortunately it is a relatively cheap monitor that cannot be true 10-bit at this price point. It seems to be a mistake in the specs as it is indeed advertised as being true 10-bit.

I recommend you to test 2 particular monitors, the ProArt PA279CRV which has a regular static backlight and claims true 10-bit and if that doesn't work you can try the ProArt PA27UCGE which on paper seems worse for eye strain as it's got dimming miniLED but I think you haven't tested miniLED yet.

I don't see any better quality monitors you could try if these don't work out. You could try a completely different technology and get an OLED monitor but OLED is unfortunately more likely to cause eye strain than anything else. If you have a smartphone it's likely using OLED and you might have noticed the issue already.

The only other option l see is tasking a good quality repair shop to turn your old iMac into an external display with displayport inputs. It certainly can be done and they will charge you a lot for it since they'll need to source new display electronics and you'll have to find a place that's willing to give it a try. I am not sure if such electronics are available anywhere.

 

[gillblates]

Just to chime in here: I bought a new M4 MBA 15, and there is something going on with the screen tech that is driving my eyes crazy - its not eye strain. It happens within the first few minutes of looking at the screen, and an intense headache sets in. Tried an app called Stillcolor to disable Temporal Dithering (the author admits some of it cannot be disabled, its either hardware or system side- only Apple can disable it), and it made little difference. It could be PWM?

No other screens at home or work seem to cause this, although all of those are a few years old.

 

[PaulD-UK]

@okkibs "I recommend you to test 2 particular monitors, the ProArt PA279CRV which has a regular static backlight and claims true 10-bit and if that doesn't work you can try the ProArt PA27UCGE..."

According to DisplaySpecifications.com both those are 8+2bits with FRC.

"...task a good quality repair shop to turn your old iMac into an external display with displayport inputs."

That is not without quite major problems best solved by someone with time to troubleshoot 🥺 :

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/display-brightness-of-my-old-imac.2366331/post-33858310

 

[Nguyen Duc Hieu]

I have found a DVI to Thunderbolt connector, with an integrated conversion chip in it. LOOKS promising, and not too expensive. I will try it and see. That would really free up some desk space!

There is no success story for an upstream conversion from anything to Thunderbolt protocol....
The only option works for iMac with Thunderbolt is from another Mac with Thunderbolt protocol...
You would just waste your time.

 

[gilby101]

The only option works for iMac with Thunderbolt is from another Mac with Thunderbolt protocol...

I am wandering a bit from the OP's situation with a 2010 iMac.
Are you saying that any Thunderbolt iMac (e.g. 2019 iMac) can be used as monitor for any other Thunderbolt Mac (e.g. M4 Mac mini)? All it needs is the right Thunderbolt 3 cable?
If so, why is there lots of activity, in other threads, about conversion kits for turning later 27" Intel iMacs into monitors?

 

[Nguyen Duc Hieu]

I am wandering a bit from the OP's situation with a 2010 iMac.
Are you saying that any Thunderbolt iMac (e.g. 2019 iMac) can be used as monitor for any other Thunderbolt Mac (e.g. M4 Mac mini)? All it needs is the right Thunderbolt 3 cable?
If so, why is there lots of activity, in other threads, about conversion kits for turning later 27" Intel iMacs into monitors?

Sadly, TDM are not supported with 5k displays.... You have deducted too far, my friend.
You are limited to 2k display, which are available in 2011, 2012, 2013 models.

 

[PaulD-UK]

@mac57mac57
Unfortunately, I overlooked that you have a 2012 iMac, which as @Nguyen Duc Hieu has pointed out, can only work as a display with a TB input. My mistake. ☹️

 

[okkibs]

According to DisplaySpecifications.com both those are 8+2bits with FRC.

That's unfortunate. I looked around some more and as far as I can see the true 10 bit panels are just too expensive and true 8 bit panels aren't available in 4k at all. The Proart PA278QV is 2560x1440px and 8 bit: https://www.displayspecifications.com/en/model/3fef1e5b

So maybe that is the way to go and it should at least be of similar or slightly better quality than the 15 years old iMac display...

 

[Andrey84]

I'm not sure if it's already been suggested,

You can buy an old Apple Cinema Display, which uses exactly the same screen as your iMac, and connect it to a new Mac Mini. This way you can change the display without changing the display if you know what I mean.

Or you use your iMac as a display, using the Target Display functionality.

Your eyes being fussy is probably a sign of eye strain, so in any case try to understand what is straining your eyes and gradually reduce that. My eyes used to also only accept certain monitors, but this has massively improved by working less.

 

[MrTSolar]

Try an Apple Vision Pro. It appears to have flicker-free displays and renders in true 3D. With a newer Mac, you can use the AVP as a monitor. Place the virtual monitor far away and stretch it as large as comfortable.

I’ve noticed that long days on the computer leave me strained and feeling cross-eyed. However, using the Vision Pro doesn’t do this. I do require more frequent breaks mostly due to heat and moisture buildup around my eyes, but there is zero eye fatigue after several hours of using it.

Get the cheapest one. 256 GB is plenty since the Vision Pro relies heavily on iCloud.