Do you think macOS 12 Monterey is the last OS for the 2014 Mac mini?

[EugW]

Do you think the 2014 Mac mini is on its last macOS version now, at Monterey? Or do you think it will get one more year?

The reason I ask is because the 2014 Mac mini was on the market for so long, until October 2018. I note that Apple says Macs become vintage 5 years after they are discontinued.

In October 2022, the 2014 Mac mini would have been off the market for only 4 years. So perhaps it will get one more year with macOS 13, until 2023 when it gets declared vintage. Then it will get two more years of security updates, until 2025 when it gets declared obsolete.

 

[Amethyst1]

I’d vote for the 2014 Mini to be dragged on for another year.

 

[opeter]

Yes, they will support it at least until 2022* or beyond, but it can also happen, that the actual OS (Monterey macOS v.12) is the last one, the is officially supporting this computer.

* macOS 13 or whatever it will be called

 

[EugW]

OK, it's good to know you guys don't think I'm completely nuts for thinking there is a possibility the 2014 Mac mini might get macOS 13 too.

 

[opeter]

To be honest, I don't know, I am just guessing. ? It is up on Apple, if they want to support it or not.

 

[Amethyst1]

Even if it does not, the community will step in and make an "unsupported" installation possible.

@EugW - Do you have a 2014 Mini, or why do you care?

 

[EugW]

Even if it does not, the community will step in and make an "unsupported" installation possible.

@EugW - Do you have a 2014 Mini, or why do you care?

Well... I just ordered one off eBay in the last hour. Hopefully it doesn't take too long to get here.

8 GB RAM, Core i5-4278U, 1 TB HDD

My Mac Pro was crashing, and so in the meantime I'm using my 12" MacBook as its replacement with my 30" Cinema Display. The performance is quite decent (although the MacBook has 16 GB RAM) and according to Geekbench 5, its performance is almost identical to the Mac mini:

MacBook Core m3-7Y32: 790 single-core / 1590 multi-core
Mac mini Core i5-4278U: 760 single-core / 1660 multi-core

I have a spare 120 GB Crucial BX100 SSD which I could swap into it, but that procedure looks like a pain. I might just want to save some time and effort and do the M2 SSD + adapter cable method instead. The WD Blue SN550 DRAM-less 500 GB SSD is dirt cheap these days. I only need 250 GB but for some reason it's only $3 cheaper. ?

I was contemplating getting a 16 GB Mac mini but since I don't plan on using this long term, I didn't feel the need to spend the extra cash.

 

[nothingtoseehere]

I have a MBP 13" Early 2015 and I do think Monterey will be the last one, as well as for the 2014 Mini. As Monterey will probably get updates until 2024, this will be ok with me, I guess. I mean, I thought that Win 10 would run forever on old devices but even Microsoft goes the Apple way here...

 

[Amethyst1]

according to Geekbench 5, its performance is almost identical to the Mac mini:

I wouldn’t take these scores at face value. The MacBook will probably falter under sustained load as its CPU gets hot and the passive cooling hits its limits (my 2015 definitely does) — the Mini should be able to perform consistently due to much better active cooling.

 

[EugW]

I have a MBP 13" Early 2015 and I do think Monterey will be the last one, as well as for the 2014 Mini. As Monterey will probably get updates until 2024, this will be ok with me, I guess. I mean, I thought that Win 10 would run forever on old devices but even Microsoft goes the Apple way here...

If you go by their release dates, that would make sense, but what I was getting at is the fact that the 2014 Mac mini was on the market for four years.

Early 2015 13" MBP - Discontinued June 2017
Late 2014 Mac mini - Discontinued Oct. 2018

I wouldn’t pay too much attention to that. The MacBook will probably falter under sustained load as it’s CPU gets hot and the passive cooling hits its limits (my 2015 definitely does) — the Mini should be able to perform consistently due to much better cooling.

I was worried about that, but with my business type usage it barely even gets warm. I need more RAM than CPU performance, but if I don't load a bazillion browser tabs, the RAM usage is manageable.

Also, I will point you to my 2017 MacBook 30-minute Cinebench thread.

This is how the 2017 MacBook Core m3, i5, i7 behave during sustained CPU load: 10+ runs of Cinebench

I posted this originally in a different thread, but I think it deserves its own thread. See this post for results of the m3, i5, and i7, with the m3 tested on two different table tops...

forums.macrumors.com

After half-an-hour of continuous Cinebench, the m3 only lost 7% performance (and lost even less when placed on a table that cooled better).

 

[pmiles]

If Apple has transitioned their entire line to ARM before the next OS, then no, the next OS will not run on a non-ARM computer. If they still have some holdouts, then yes, it will baring any hardware limitations (talking EOL machines here).

They're going to transition quickly to a single platform OS. They will continue to support the older OSes for x amount of time, but you will not be able to run newer OSes that aren't ARM compliant once that transition is made. This is not all doom and gloom as a number of people still run OSes that no longer receive such support from Apple. Your machine is not going to stop working because it can't run, say Monterey. It just won't be able to run Monterey. Not the end of the world. Everything that you can do on your computer now you will be able to continue to do as you always have been. You just might not be able to upgrade your current software beyond what it is at now.

Since the Mac Pro has yet to make the transition, you still have at least another year or two before everything is cast in stone.

 

[EugW]

Since the Mac Pro has yet to make the transition, you still have at least another year or two before everything is cast in stone.

They will most likely keep the Intel Mac Pro on macOS for many more years. I expect the 2019 Mac Pro to get full macOS until in the very least 2025, but perhaps even until 2027... with additional security updates after that.

 

[nothingtoseehere]

If you go by their release dates, that would make sense, but what I was getting at is the fact that the 2014 Mac mini was on the market for four years.

Early 2015 13" MBP - Discontinued June 2017
Late 2014 Mac mini - Discontinued Oct. 2018

In general, I would agree that the year of discontinuation is important for Apple‘s schedule. It seems as if seven years after that are the usual minimum for updates. That would fit to your proposal that the 2014 Mini, sold until 2018, could get updates until 2025 and therefore receive macOS 13 as the last OS.
However, there are exceptions for devices sold unusually long. I think here of the last non-retina MBP (Mid 2012) that was discontinued only 2016. It got Catalina but not Big Sur, and Catalina will end 2022 if Apple sticks to its scheme, so we have six years here.
If there were any technical logic in Apple‘s macOS schedules, one could say that the 2014 Mini has the oldest integrated graphics with the Intel HD 5000 and would be the next one to be cut off from updates.
But of course I hope for you that you will get at least one more update!

 

[EugW]

If there were any technical logic in Apple‘s macOS schedules, one could say that the 2014 Mini has the oldest integrated graphics with the Intel HD 5000 and would be the next one to be cut off from updates.

That's a good point. It does have Metal support though of course, and both HD 5000 and HD 6000 are GT3.

I wonder if from Apple's perspective if there is a significant difference between HD 5000 vs. HD 6000 besides speed

 

[Amethyst1]

I wonder if from Apple's perspective if there is a significant difference between HD 5000 vs. HD 6000 besides speed

The HD 5000 doesn't "do" 4K at 60 Hz, the HD 6000 does. That's a pretty significant difference to me.

 

[Amethyst1]

If Apple has transitioned their entire line to ARM before the next OS, then no, the next OS will not run on a non-ARM computer.

If the Intel transition is anything to go by, I'd not be surprised to see at least one more "universal" version of macOS to be released after the ARM transition is complete. Why? The transition to Intel was complete in August 2006, yet Leopard, released in October 2007, still runs on PPC machines. And I concur that they additionally wouldn't want to piss off those who have just recently bought a 2019 Mac Pro by killing OS support too early.

 

[EugW]

The HD 5000 doesn't "do" 4K at 60 Hz, the HD 6000 does. That's a pretty significant difference to me.

Yeah, I noticed the 2014 Mac mini maxes out at 2560x1600 60 Hz, but that's OK for me since I'd be running it with the 2560x1600 Cinema Display. A 2015-2016 model with HD 6000 and 2160p60 would have been preferred, but alas, they don't exist.

Anyhow, I hope to replace this sooner rather than later with a new Mac mini with a new form factor, perhaps an M2 model, or an M1 Pro (8-core) model. I don't need the performance of either of those, so it comes down to the M2 for price, or the M1 Pro to get more ports. Those would also have DRM'd 4K streaming support.

EDIT:

Speaking of DRM, I was only getting 720p Netflix out of my 2007 Mac Pro in 10.11 El Capitan. I was pleased to see proper 1080p Netflix support using my Core m3 MacBook on that 30" Cinema Display. And according to this table, I should get 1080p Netflix from the 2014 Mac mini as well.

 

[Amethyst1]

Yeah, I noticed the 2014 Mac mini maxes out at 2560x1600 60 Hz, but that's OK for me since I'd be running it with the 2560x1600 Cinema Display.

It maxes out at 450 MHz pixel clock, which is enough for e.g. 3520×1980 at 60 Hz using CVT-RB timings.

A 2015-2016 model with HD 6000 and 2160p60 would have been preferred, but alas, they don't exist.

The 2014 Mini should have received quad-core “Crystal Well” CPUs with the Iris Pro 5200.

 

[frou]

The Vintage/Obsolete classification is about spare part availability for repairs by Apple. So although it's always tempting to bring it into the discussion of MacOS system requirements, I don't think it's that relevant

 

[EugW]

The Vintage/Obsolete classification is about spare part availability for repairs by Apple. So although it's always tempting to bring it into the discussion of MacOS system requirements, I don't think it's that relevant

You’re right but nonetheless I think the discontinuation date at least partly influences the decision as to when to drop OS support.

 

[opeter]

Look, macOS 12 Monterey supports the Mac mini 2014 (and the old Mac Pro 2013) only because they were sold many years after they were originally released. Mac Pro 2013 was even sold until late 2019. So somehow it is logical, that they are supporting these.

But if you look closely, they dropped the support for the 12" Macbook 2015. And this machine was released later than the two mentioned above.

My prediction: the next macOS will drop the support for most machines, that were released prior to the year - let's say - 2017 or 2018. Anyway, the intel Macs should be officialiy supported by new macOS versions at least 3-4 years more, or let's say at least until 2023, 2024 or even 2025*.

But this is Apple, you never know, what they are upto...

* Intel Macs were released in 2019 and 2020 too. And they are still selling some models, that have Intel x86-64 CPUs (just look at the larger 27" iMacs, the Mac minis i5/i7 2018 and the Mac Pro 2019 models).

 

[Amethyst1]

But if you look closely, they dropped the support for the 12" Macbook 2015.

Yes, because it was discontinued (replaced by a new model) in early 2016.

 

[opeter]

Yes, because it was discontinued (replaced by a new model) in early 2016.

Yes, that is correct.

 

[EugW]

Here's Apple's list of Monterey-supported Macs. I added the dates to everything that was discontinued. I think I have most of them right but feel free to point out any errors.

I think anything that was discontinued in 2016 is going to get dropped with macOS 13, if it wasn't already dropped. That includes the 2015 MacBook Pros and 11" 2015 MacBook Air. These are marked in red.

Also, I'm thinking anything that was discontinued in 2017 will also likely get dropped. That includes 2016 MacBook Pros, 13" 2015 MacBook Air, 2016 MacBook, and 2015 iMac. These are also marked in red.

That leaves just the two outliers, the 2013 Mac Pro (DC 2019) and the 2014 Mac mini (DC 2018). I'm not sure about either of these. These are marked in blue.

MacBook Pro​

Learn how to identify your MacBook Pro.

• MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2021)
• MacBook Pro (14-inch, 2021)
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, M1, 2020)
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2020, Two Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2020
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2020, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2021
• MacBook Pro (16-inch, 2019) <-- Discontinued 2021
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2019, Two Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2020
• MacBook Pro (15-inch, 2019) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2019, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2020
• MacBook Pro (15-inch, 2018) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2018, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Pro (15-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2018
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2017, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2018
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2017, Two Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Pro (15-inch, 2016) <-- Discontinued 2017
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2016, Four Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2017
• MacBook Pro (13-inch, 2016, Two Thunderbolt 3 ports) <-- Discontinued 2017
• MacBook Pro (Retina, 15-inch, Mid 2015) <-- Discontinued 2016
• MacBook Pro (Retina, 13-inch, Early 2015) <-- Discontinued 2016

MacBook Air​

Learn how to identify your MacBook Air.

• MacBook Air (M1, 2020)
• MacBook Air (Retina, 13-inch, 2020) <-- Discontinued 2020
• MacBook Air (Retina, 13-inch, 2019) <-- Discontinued 2020
• MacBook Air (Retina, 13-inch, 2018) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Air (13-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook Air (13-inch, Early 2015) <-- Discontinued 2017
• MacBook Air (11-inch, Early 2015) <-- Discontinued 2016

MacBook​

Learn how to identify your MacBook.

• MacBook (Retina, 12-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2019
• MacBook (Retina, 12-inch, Early 2016) <-- Discontinued 2017

iMac Pro​

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• iMac Pro (2017) <-- Discontinued 2020

iMac​

Learn how to identify your iMac.

• iMac (24-inch, M1, 2021)
• iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2020)
• iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2019) <-- Discontinued 2020
• iMac (Retina 4K, 21.5-inch, 2019) <-- Discontinued 2021
• iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2019
• iMac (Retina 4K, 21.5-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2019
• iMac (21.5-inch, 2017) <-- Discontinued 2019
• iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015) <-- Discontinued 2017
• iMac (Retina 4K, 21.5-inch, Late 2015) <-- Discontinued 2017
• iMac (21.5-inch, Late 2015) <-- Discontinued 2017

Mac mini​

Learn how to identify your Mac mini.

• Mac mini (M1, 2020)
• Mac mini (2018)
• Mac mini (Late 2014) <-- Discontinued 2018

Mac Pro​

Learn how to identify your Mac Pro.

• Mac Pro (2019)
• Mac Pro (Late 2013) <-- Discontinued 2019

Published Date: November 10, 2021

 

[frou]

I've always thought it's going to be very convenient for Apple when they can raise the MacOS system requirement to T2-equipped Macs and newer.

As I understand it, the way that T2 Macs initialise/boot (and probably a lot of other low-level system functions) is very different to older Intel Macs. So doing so would reduce things from 3 code-paths (Older-Intel, T2-Intel, Apple-Silicon) to 2 code-paths (T2-Intel, Apple-Silicon)