You’re missing a key detail there.
Apple didn’t lose. They settled due to the bad PR it was generating.
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iPhone 17 Does Apple install malware to slow your old phone down?
- Thread starter Merkava_4
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Apple didn’t lose. They settled due to the bad PR it was generating.
uacd
macrumors 68000
If corporations have not been forcing these updates upon us there would have been way less conspiracy theories that “updates are made to make phones slow”.
I for example refuse to believe that “well, if this update lags then your phone is slow for this update”, well then why it glows red in settings and nags me to install it every day even if I discard or delete it? I suppose if my phone supports it poorly why can’t I just dismiss it once and forever?
Oh btw isn’t it a malware practice to download something on your device what you had not asked for? These updates literally auto-download by default.
If I don’t wanna be forcefully fed with “newest security fixes and features”, why can’t I just live like that?
Also it is quite sad that Apple iOS updates include all stock apps. I.e. you cannot install Safari separately without installing iOS, thus when JS becomes obsolete sites fail to open. If not this issue I would have probably never updated my phones. Android for example is very different, I guess you can install newest Chrome on something as ancient as Android 7.0
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iHorseHead
macrumors 68020
Who is she? Unfortunately, this also blew up on IG etc.
Also, people usually sign NDAs. So um… Anyway, I can't find anything about her. I can't even verify her Linkedin (not that it'd be real evidence, because I could put myself as CEO at Apple on Linkedin)
Didn't want to link her to generate clicks for her. But since blowing up...
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And they listen to your conversations and know where you live, and who you talk to, and what you do, and where you go and and and and now they decipher your un-encrypted messages and track and track and track and track.
The phone and computer is an extension of yourself Get it Got it GOOD!
Don't let your phone tell on you!
The phone and computer is an extension of yourself Get it Got it GOOD!
Don't let your phone tell on you!
gaggle
macrumors member
No, Apple is not slowing their phones intentionally. It's a classic category-mistake.
Apply Occam's Razor: The implication of the intentional slowdown hypothesis would require the silencing of thousands of engineers over the years and risking a near trillion-dollar market by a public company. Versus the much simpler explanation that Apple isn't overly concerned about new software not running optimally on older phones.
The latter is an entirely plausible dynamic: Apple (like other big tech companies) move fast and constantly evolve new abstractions (new SDKs, new features, etc.). And if a new feature runs fast on new phones but older phones suffer some single-digit percent performance penalty, that might be seen as acceptable. No one has intentionally made old phones slower, but the effect compounds over the years. And especially Apple is clearly running a strategy of constantly evolving and moving its ecosystem forward (unlike Microsoft, which insisted on 100% backward compatibility for decades). There are very nuanced tradeoffs in those opposing strategies so I'm not claiming one over the other, but I will die on the hill that Apple's success is partly shaped by its commitment to move everyone forward, because it's how they've kept their ecosystem of apps being reasonably well maintained. I think this same strategy also manifests in their hardware, e.g. they dropped disk-drives, USB-A, etc. before others.
Apply Occam's Razor: The implication of the intentional slowdown hypothesis would require the silencing of thousands of engineers over the years and risking a near trillion-dollar market by a public company. Versus the much simpler explanation that Apple isn't overly concerned about new software not running optimally on older phones.
The latter is an entirely plausible dynamic: Apple (like other big tech companies) move fast and constantly evolve new abstractions (new SDKs, new features, etc.). And if a new feature runs fast on new phones but older phones suffer some single-digit percent performance penalty, that might be seen as acceptable. No one has intentionally made old phones slower, but the effect compounds over the years. And especially Apple is clearly running a strategy of constantly evolving and moving its ecosystem forward (unlike Microsoft, which insisted on 100% backward compatibility for decades). There are very nuanced tradeoffs in those opposing strategies so I'm not claiming one over the other, but I will die on the hill that Apple's success is partly shaped by its commitment to move everyone forward, because it's how they've kept their ecosystem of apps being reasonably well maintained. I think this same strategy also manifests in their hardware, e.g. they dropped disk-drives, USB-A, etc. before others.
Dirk Pieters
macrumors 6502a
100% agreed. People may complain that their 3yr old phone is getting slower all the time but forget that every processor update comes with an average speed bump of - what? - 10-15% on average? Compound that over 3 device updates and see the difference.
That 3 year old phone is also ... 3 years old. After 3 years battery health has already taken a hit. Just checked and my iPhone 14 Pro is at 88% health.
The only thing Apple can do is to prevent "heavy" new functionality on older devices. Our Apple TV, for example, gets tvOS 26 but not the Liquid Glass UI.
Which people then of course interpret as "apPLe dOeS tHis tO mAkE mE Buy A nEw deVicE OMG I hAte ThEm"
eyoungren
macrumors Nehalem
You have articulated how I feel about this. For me, what I do with my phone has been the same since 2009. Calls, texts, email, light web browsing, some light music streaming. If I take pictures, it's not to preserve posterity, so I hardly care about what Apple made the camera able to do now.
But there is the crowd who use their phone as a substitute for just about everything - and then they expect their old device to do the same thing in the same way on new versions of iOS. And it doesn't. So it must be a conspiracy, not that Apple didn't optimize things for their older device.
It's fake! It's all over TikTok by various so called ex employees. Apple should sue them.
FeliApple
macrumors 601
Come on. I agree with this, but I disagree on your viewpoint on Apple’s culpability.
If Apple deems that slight YoY performance and battery life drop acceptable, which compounds (I agree, this is what happens), but the end result of an iOS device is always garbage AND THEY DISALLOW DOWNGRADING, they might as well be doing it on purpose and maliciously.
If it’s not deliberate but the end result due to the effects compounding is always the same and the one tool users have to revert this (downgrading) is deliberately and maliciously subverted, how is this not Apple’s fault?
They provide garbage and refuse to allow the user to uninstall the garbage.
Still, as I have repeatedly stated, users have a portion of culpability here. Stay behind. You can. I do it. If you install malware with every iPhone or iPad you have and never stay behind, you deserve to use garbage every single time.
FeliApple
macrumors 601
I don’t need battery replacements because I don’t update.
And no, replacements improve relative to a downgraded battery on an updated iOS version but they do NOT restore battery life to what it had when the original iOS version was installed. This is a myth perpetuated by people who never stay behind, which convinces users to install Apple malware on their iPhones which can’t be removed.
This is nonsensical.
I highly doubt Apple installs malware on any phones. They would have been exposed already and it would really upset their massive customer base.
So all fake news spewers then... not how to promote yourself lol
eyoungren
macrumors Nehalem
I am largely of the belief that Apple locks out downgrading not because they are maliciously preventing people from rolling back and trying to get them to upgrade. But, because they wish to have as many customers as possible on the same version of iOS.
If it was a malicious thing in the past, I think it was largely to prevent jailbreaking - which Apple hates, but has now largely come to terms with.
The reason for having most customers on a current version of iOS would be so that if you bring your phone to Apple, the geniuses can realistically expect to be dealing with a current version of iOS. Solutions come based on that. Apple doesn't want to waste time and resources having to deal with multiple versions of iOS for troubleshooting.
It's a primary reason why they almost always tell you to update your phone before they will offer assistance.
Conspiracy theorists don't need a reason to come up with one as they're not one to be bothered by evidence.
Your refusal to believe something is your prerogative, but it doesn't make it a fact. Every new iOS version adds more code which stresses the processor more compared to the newer processors. You can't expect one person to handle the tasks designed for two. It's basic physics
There's an option to disable the auto-download as well which should do the trick. Equating a notification to nagging is something I've heard before but never made sense.
What is the Unread badge count on your Mail app? Is it zero? If not, does that still count as nagging?
I've never heard of the term "malware practice" but not one commenter on this thread calling iOS malware knows what exactly defines a malware. Throwing the word around without understanding the definition is something I wouldn't suggest.
You can live with that just like some people. Not every iPhone user is updating to the latest. Don't see a problem here.
I can't speak to this specifically as it involves diving into more technical details. While I do support updating individual apps with a fix, it's not how Apple does things. And we all know that so I'm not going to start complaining about it now. Maybe they'll rewrite iOS at some point in the future to accommodate that but if that's a dealbreaker for you then Android is evidently an alternative for you.
Parowdy
Suspended
It’s a little rude to call anyOS 26 malware but ok, fair enough.
In all honesty, I don’t believe her claims until they can be independently verified.
And there are many research groups digging through Apple‘s operating systems, why would this only now come to light because of a random unverified employee?
This smells fishy even against the wind.
And then the claim „this was PROVEN IN COURT when battery gate happened“… that’s a totally different thing and I immediately stop paying attention whenever someone uses this as a gateway to whatever conspiracy inside Apple. Just ridiculous.
In all honesty, I don’t believe her claims until they can be independently verified.
And there are many research groups digging through Apple‘s operating systems, why would this only now come to light because of a random unverified employee?
This smells fishy even against the wind.
And then the claim „this was PROVEN IN COURT when battery gate happened“… that’s a totally different thing and I immediately stop paying attention whenever someone uses this as a gateway to whatever conspiracy inside Apple. Just ridiculous.
Parowdy
Suspended
Thanks for going the extra mile and looking her up AND sharing with us here.
Another bs thread I can forget now.
FeliApple
macrumors 601
This is possible, but my question is… what percentage of users seek Apple support? And from the userbase, how many would take the trouble to download a signed IPSW, downgrading, and starting fresh? (since, like you know, you cannot install backups from newer iOS versions onto older iOS versions)
How many would know this is possible if Apple just silently signs everything and provides no support? I reckon it wouldn’t change all that much for Apple support. Maybe I’m mistaken, I don’t know.
Downgrading would be a golden ticket for the minuscule, reasonably tech-savvy userbase who either doesn’t upgrade often (like me) or keeps devices for a long time (also me) without curtailing device quality.
In fact, the minuscule portion of users who would downgrade arguably already stay behind.
Funnily enough, if Apple allowed fully downgrading anything today, I wouldn’t downgrade much. Every iOS device I have runs the original iOS version barring 3:
Two Apple-forced A9 devices from iOS 9 (my iPhone 6s was forced to iOS 13 and my 9.7-inch iPad Pro was forced to iOS 12) and an iPhone 5c on iOS 10 that is garbage anyway because it has 8GB and I have four other iPhones for music.
So I’d just downgrade those two to iOS 9 (if Apple fixed activation), or iOS 10 (if they didn’t).
I reckon many here would go back to 18 because 26 is controversial, but most people here knew what iOS 26 entailed and updated anyway. Many update now. I don’t think the impact would be that massive, but it would be device-saving for those of us who’ve been forced out or those who regretted updating.
Or funnily enough (and this is key), those who have older devices with a specific purpose (like music) and their devices have been by updates. If somebody has an iPhone 6s Plus on iOS 15 for music, they’d triple or quadruple battery life just by going back to iOS 10 (or 9). If somebody just uses Apple Music they don’t need 15. That would be device-changing for them. Otherwise compatibility just forces a semi-recent version anyway. I want older versions for my secondary and music devices; in fact, I want them to be as old as possible, the closer to the original the better.
They do tell you to update immediately. I say that’s not an option and Apple support has tried to help me anyway. Which I appreciate.
Contact_Feanor
macrumors 6502a
This thread can be answered by Betteridge's law: Any headline that ends in a question mark can be answered by the word no.
Contact_Feanor
macrumors 6502a
Imagine experiencing a phone that's great for at least 6 years and then go on complaining about how they "deliberately" install malware and degrade the battery etc. Are you just ignoring your own experience in favor of stupid narratives you read online?
An iPhone 6s is generally over 10 years old. How long would anyone reasonably expect the battery to last? Is that really your reference about intentional degradation?
Contact_Feanor
macrumors 6502a
and defy his own experience, he had a phone that was great over iOS 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 AND 17, but then he had to upgrade because they "intentionally" ruin it with malware every version.
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They did not “throttle old phones” - they limited power draw of degraded batteries to prevent unexpected shutdowns (something every laptop and phone manufacturer has been doing forever). Frankly, the entire thing is ridiculous and a big failure for Apples PR. It is also a great illustration how you can do a reasonable thing and still get blamed for all possible and impossible reasons.
As to the premise of this thread, that’s all a lot of nonsense. The current iPhone is over 50% faster compared to the iPhone12 in terms of the CPU, 2x faster in terms of the GPU, and I’m not even talking about image processing capabilities or the machine learning acceleration. Of course software built with modern phones in mind will perform worse on the older ones. You don’t need any”malware”, you just need to take advantage of what new models can do.
eyoungren
macrumors Nehalem
I've got to stop going to the Apple store I've frequented since 2012 and try one of the other places local to me then. I've dealt with more jerks at that store than I have nice people.
I've been nice, or at least I thought I have anyway. Maybe it's the fact that most of the time I'm asking them to deal with a device that isn't current. IDK.
Last time I was there the genius tried to tell me that the LB on my 6+ was the reason the battery was dying. Because he wanted to sell me a new phone. This, despite the fact that I'd already told him that my 6+ was a tertiary phone, not even secondary or a backup. Tertiary. Which should have implied that my PRIMARY phone wasn't that phone and therefore I didn't need to be sold a new phone.
I had a third party replace the battery and it's been fine since - proving the genius wrong about the LB. What I learned from that, was Apple customer reps don't appreciate being challenged.
So, maybe it's just different elsewhere.
About as likely that Elvis will be nominated for the next secretary general of the united nations, elected pope, disclose that he's an alien, and announce that the inspiration for all of his music was Perry Como.