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Tiger is the latest OS. Vista is the latest OS.
Panther is not supported. XP is supported.

WTF? This is just Apple looking to make $$$ off of people who wouldn't otherwise upgrade. It's not like Panther can't work with the new iPod, it just needs the appropriate driver support. This is Apple being greedy, plain and simple. I don't get why everyone is defending apple for not supporting their current gen -1 OS.
Thank you.

And 10.3 wasn't legitimately replaced two years ago. They just added wigets to it. It's the same exact OS.

Let him buy a Zune...

It will serve him right.
Lol, I have incurred the wrath of fanboy nation for my awful sin of not buying every unneccesary product that Apple spits out. Listen to yourself.
 
Thank you.

And 10.3 wasn't legitimately replaced two years ago. They just added wigets to it. It's the same exact OS.
Right, right. How's 10.3 running on your Intel machine?

Oh that's right. 10.3 won't run on any Mac made in the last year.

Spotlight perhaps? Guess not. Front Row? Ugh. Automator? Optimized kernel? Launchd for faster reboots? Core Image? None of that in 10.3? Really?

Thankfully you're a gifted musician as your skills in pointing out non-visual differences in an OS aren't the best.
 
Automator? Optimized kernel? Core Image?
For all I know you made those terms up. I'm on 10.4 right now on my wife's laptop and I don't see evidence of any of those things. Looks, feels, and smells the same to me, except if I mouse over the corner, a calculator and a dictionary pop up.

I'm sure optimized kernel is awesome, but to me, it's $80 spent on widgets.
 
For all I know you made those terms up. I'm on 10.4 right now on my wife's laptop and I don't see evidence of any of those things. Looks, feels, and smells the same to me, except if I mouse over the corner, a calculator and a dictionary pop up.

I'm sure optimized kernel is awesome, but to me, it's $80 spent on widgets.

No-one here is saying you're wrong to still be running Panther, you looked at what Tiger offered you and decided it wasn't worth the upgrade, fair enough. But, if you choose not to keep up you can't expect to be supported indefinitely, especially as you are a few weeks away from being two OS's behind. If you were two OS's behind in Windows you'd be running Windows ME, and how supported is that?
 
For all I know you made those terms up. I'm on 10.4 right now on my wife's laptop and I don't see evidence of any of those things. Looks, feels, and smells the same to me, except if I mouse over the corner, a calculator and a dictionary pop up.

I'm sure optimized kernel is awesome, but to me, it's $80 spent on widgets.

No, he didn't 'make those terms up'. They're all here.

Really, it sucks to be you right now. You bought an iPod, yet your to stubborn to make it work. Ha. Get real.
 
If you were two OS's behind in Windows you'd be running Windows ME, and how supported is that?
I bought my computer in 2003. If I had bought a Windows computer instead, it would be supported. In fact, if I had bought a Windows computer in 2001, it would be supported.

It seems like a logical conclusion that if I were to buy a computer today, it would be smarter to buy a Windows computer. If I did, I would get Vista, and Apple will probably support this OS for the next 6-8 years. If I bought a Mac today, I would 10.4, and Apple will support this only for the next 2 years.

Am I wrong?
 
For all I know you made those terms up. I'm on 10.4 right now on my wife's laptop and I don't see evidence of any of those things. Looks, feels, and smells the same to me, except if I mouse over the corner, a calculator and a dictionary pop up.

I'm sure optimized kernel is awesome, but to me, it's $80 spent on widgets.

Core image is "under the hood" and can't be seen but allows applications to do some amazing things.

As for Automater, open up the applications folder on your wife's comp and look for an icon of a robot holding a beam. Underneath it will say automater.

Out... For now
 
I bought my computer in 2003. If I had bought a Windows computer instead, it would be supported. In fact, if I had bought a Windows computer in 2001, it would be supported.


Am I wrong?

That is besides the point... Vista was delayed, delayed and then delayed some more...

Are you asking Apple to come out with a new OS every 6 years? If so maybe a PC would be better suited for you.
 
I bought my computer in 2003. If I had bought a Windows computer instead, it would be supported. In fact, if I had bought a Windows computer in 2001, it would be supported.

It seems like a logical conclusion that if I were to buy a computer today, it would be smarter to buy a Windows computer. If I did, I would get Vista, and Apple will probably support this OS for the next 6-8 years. If I bought a Mac today, I would 10.4, and Apple will support this only for the next 2 years.

Am I wrong?

I bought my computer in 2002 and my computer is supported. I also have tiger. But hey I like to keep as current as I can, and as the OS has gotten faster on my system with each major OS release it is an incentive to upgrade for me, but your milage may vary. :rolleyes:
 
It seems like a logical conclusion that if I were to buy a computer today, it would be smarter to buy a Windows computer. If I did, I would get Vista, and Apple will probably support this OS for the next 6-8 years. If I bought a Mac today, I would 10.4, and Apple will support this only for the next 2 years.

Am I wrong?

And if you bought a Mac in November, it'll come with 10.5. You're making an unfair comparison, Microsoft just released their new OS, Apple hasn't yet, but is just about to.

That being said, Microsoft does support Windows longer than Apple supports Mac OS - however, that's only because they have to - they don't release new versions nearly as often as Apple. Microsoft also charges substantially more than Apple does for upgrades.

Mac OS X - $129
Vista Home Premium Upgrade - $145 (Courtesy Newegg)
Vista Ultimate Upgrade - $240 (Courtesy Newegg)

If you're a gamer, Microsoft has already left you behind - games such as Halo 2 and Shadowrun require Vista. There's no reason for it, MS is just using them to push their platform. Sure, if you're not a gamer, this doesn't affect you, but if MS can do this to gamers, you can be sure they'll do it to others as well, whether its software or hardware that ends up being unsupported with the next OS release.

So you can switch platforms if you want, but MS is just as bad as Apple in this case. A platform switch is going to be more costly than the $129 to upgrade Mac OS X.

I bought my computer in 2003. If I had bought a Windows computer instead, it would be supported. In fact, if I had bought a Windows computer in 2001, it would be supported.

Your computer from 2003 probably wouldn't even work with Vista - if it did, you certainly wouldn't get all the pretty effects of the new interface. Macs older than your 2003 model are able to run the latest OS X versions (I think the Quicksilver PowerMac G4 from 2001 is going to be eligible for Leopard). A Windows PC typically sees one MS OS over its lifetime, maybe 2. That G4 started with OS 9.2, and has so far lasted through 10.0, 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, 10.4 and I believe it'll work with 10.5. That's 6 UPGRADES, 7 OS releases in total.

One last thing to consider. Apple has been planning these iPod updates for some time - they likely had a September release in mind back when they began planning the upgrades (iPod updates seem to occur every September now). Mac OS X 10.5 should have been released in the Spring, but it was delayed. So when Apple began designing these new iPods, they likely expected that 10.5 would have been released. They'd have been supporting 10.4 and 10.5 - the latest release, and the previous release. I don't know that there's a technical reason these new iPods require 10.4 (I kind of doubt it, except for maybe the iPod touch and iPhone), but if they initially expected 10.5 to be released by the time these new iPods were released, it may explain why they targeted 10.4 or later.
 
Not compatible

I just received Metroid Prime 3 today.

The damn thing requires a Wii and won't work on my Gamecube. Damn you Nintendo for not making your brand new game work on my 4-years old console! ;)

---

Seriously though, don't compare Mac OS versions and Windows versions. Microsoft took over 6 years to release Vista and a four-years old PC would never run it (or barely).

Either wait and upgrade to Leopard, or if your Mac really is 4 years old, wait for Leopard then buy a Mac mini, it'll be worth it (G4/G5 to Core 2 Duo).

Or if you're really low on cash you could wait for Leopard then buy Tiger at a discount (I'm assuming Tiger will drop in price once Leopard is out).
 
I can easily see why they still support XP. Let me tell you... Vista has only been out for one year and it has some of the worst (and mind you some good) reviews. My friend has vista and it has it's problems, that is why I bought XP (like two weeks ago) to install on my Macbook vrs. Vista! Vista has only been out for not even a year yet. OSX 10.4 has been out for two years for craps sake! I can understand that *and unlike Vista, osx actually works and doesn't feel like a beta test*
 
Wow, this has got to be the most inane discussion/argument I have ever heard. You can complain all you want, but it comes down to the fact that you have 3 choices:
1. Upgrade your OS (it's worth the $129, but you can probably buy Tiger on Ebay for like $50 now),
2. Go buy a PC, or
3. Return the iPod.
I guess complaining is an option too, but in the end it doesn't solve your problem. People on here are trying to be helpful, but attacking them and/or Apple does nothing except diminish their desire to help. So there are your three choices. Pick one and stop complaining.
 
Wow. I'm surprised how much ignorance and Apple fanboyism there is in this thread.

Have you all forgotten that it was just months ago that Steve Jobs said 25% of Mac users were running Panther? How are some of you even comparing 10.3 as the equivalent of Windows ME or Windows 3.0??

You have an OLD OS... Over 2 years old in fact...
2 years is old for an operating system now?? We're expected to shell out a couple hundred to upgrade our OS every 2 years? That makes OS X way more expensive than Windows is.

And is it really SO MUCH to assume Apple would support just a 2 year-old OS??

For the record, I completely agree with the topic poster. I'm still on 10.3, and nothing in Tiger has made me want to upgrade, I was waiting for Leopard. Yet I've been waiting for a touchscreen iPod and ordered it immediately. There aren't just a few users out there using 10.3, it's millions, and a lot of those will be buying iPods.

As far as I can see it, Apple has justified me pirating my OS while I wait for Leopard. As much as I despise piracy they've just pissed me off so much.
 
Be nice. I know there is a lot of anger this week, but calm down, please.

Apple sometimes makes arbitrary requirements with products and software and it's extremely frustrating. What Apple did with Java and is still doing with Java bothers me. I know that there are certain times when the requirements are real but there have been plenty of time they've pushed us to upgrade. Such is the case with Java.

For all we know this requirement for the new iPod nano is no more than Apple saying that they want us to pay to upgrade to Tiger or later. I'm on Tiger but I don't benefit from a lot from the significant features like Dashboard and Exposé. In fact, Dashboard always caused my system to run poorly so I stopped it from running.

It's surprising that Apple didn't say 10.3.9 or later. Nothing in the operating system has changed so much that they couldn't have, at least, from my knowledge of the internals.
 
The thing is, we have no idea how iTunes interacts with iPods, and how iTunes interacts with the operating system.

Could Mac OS 10.3.9 work with the new iPods? Probably. Would it require Apple to keep legacy code around? Perhaps. Unlike Microsoft, Apple does not seem to hesitate to cut bridges with old versions (soon to be "current OS - 2"), maybe for the sake of legible and maintainable code.

Because if "backward compatible" means your software is hard to maintain and is unstable, then you're putting yourself in trouble with current and up-to-date users for the sake of users of old versions.

And yes, it does mean Apple could decide that my G4 Mac mini won't work with Mac OS 10.6.
 
just wanted to throw in some support for the OP... I'm shocked that 10.3 isn't supported. We shouldn't be expected to pay an effective subscription to continue using our hardware... maybe once leopard comes out apple should offer tiger at a much reduced price, since they are removing support for Panther
 
just wanted to throw in some support for the OP... I'm shocked that 10.3 isn't supported. We shouldn't be expected to pay an effective subscription to continue using our hardware... maybe once leopard comes out apple should offer tiger at a much reduced price, since they are removing support for Panther

To be fair, Apple isn't asking the OP to pay for Tiger to "continue using his hardware". His current hardware should still be working fine.

His new iPod isn't something he had last week. It's something that he bought without checking the requirements.

His options are:
- return his new iPod (shouldn't be any fees since it's not even a week, not sure how laws work in USA)
- buy Tiger (new or used - if he can wait a few weeks/months then it'll be even cheaper)
- wait and buy Leopard
- switch to Windows XP

I don't think that talking about his problem on MacRumors will make Apple suddenly add Panther support. Then again I could be wrong, who knows.

As for Tiger being "Panther with widgets", let's not reduce an OS to its GUI alone. Tiger added 200+ features, some of them used by programmers, which may be the reason why the new iPods require Tiger.
 
Basically it comes down to this:

Apple is supporting two operating systems on each platform. XP and Vista, and 10.4 and 10.5. It's just on the mac side, 10.5 doesn't ship for another month. It would be nice if they supported 10.3 now, but since that support would only last about a month, it would probably be a waste of resources.

It is an awkward situation for those still on 10.3 who want one of these new ones now.

Personally, I'd wait until Leopard ships and get the ipod then. This will be especially easy with the Touch since it doesn't ship until close to Leopard anyway.

If you bought one and really don't want to pay twice to upgrade, take it back and ask them to waive the restocking fee since you can't use it. Or just borrow 10.4 from a friend and buy 10.5 in a month or so. And read the system requirements next time.

Just to be clear, 10.4 is 2.5 years old, and 10.3 is almost four years old. There's no question that they'd be dropping support for 10.3 when 10.5 ships, they're just doing it about a month early.
 
Wow. I'm surprised how much ignorance and Apple fanboyism there is in this thread.

Have you all forgotten that it was just months ago that Steve Jobs said 25% of Mac users were running Panther? How are some of you even comparing 10.3 as the equivalent of Windows ME or Windows 3.0??


2 years is old for an operating system now?? We're expected to shell out a couple hundred to upgrade our OS every 2 years? That makes OS X way more expensive than Windows is.

And is it really SO MUCH to assume Apple would support just a 2 year-old OS??

Is it really 2 years old... OR has it been replaced for over 2 years now... The actual OS is almost exactly 4 years old!!

Just for a point of reference... The war on Iraq started in 2003. Every says that seems like forever ago.

For the record, I completely agree with the topic poster. I'm still on 10.3, and nothing in Tiger has made me want to upgrade, I was waiting for Leopard. Yet I've been waiting for a touchscreen iPod and ordered it immediately. There aren't just a few users out there using 10.3, it's millions, and a lot of those will be buying iPods.

As far as I can see it, Apple has justified me pirating my OS while I wait for Leopard. As much as I despise piracy they've just pissed me off so much.


Apple does something you don't agree with so you are going to go out and do something illegal.. Mature!

Funny thing is you started off this post calling other people ignorant... Haha :cool:
 
Clever sarcasm, but a new mac OS is just a fee to pay to use the ipod, and widgets. It does nothing else.

If I buy a new PC, then I've got all new hardware and compatibility with all sorts of software that doesn't work on this mac. Do I really want to pay 10% of the cost of a brand new computer as a fee for using an ipod?

do what I did, go buy a acer aspire 3680 for $400. wi-fi, SD card slot, Vista. and cheap..

Apple is supporting two operating systems on each platform. XP and Vista, and 10.4 and 10.5. It's just on the mac side, 10.5 doesn't ship for another month. It would be nice if they supported 10.3 now, but since that support would only last about a month, it would probably be a waste of resources.

consider XP is 6 years old...

also I wonder what exactly prevent apple from supporting 10.3, business? or technology?
 
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