EFF Says iOS 11's Wi-Fi and Bluetooth Toggles in Control Center Are Misleading and Compromise Security

Discussion in 'MacRumors.com News Discussion' started by MacRumors, Oct 6, 2017.

  1. fmillion macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2011
    #226
    I don't mind so much that it just disconnects and keeps the radio powered. I do mind that it turns the toggles off on its own at a preset, non-changeable and non-disable-able time.

    I guess No does not mean No. No simply means "No until 5 AM."
     
  2. Tech198 macrumors G4

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Location:
    Australia, Perth
    #227
    There is an really easy way to fix all of this now.... Get into the habit of turning off devices instead of leaving them on but locked.

    I do that to my iPad all the time,, not because of iOS11,, but i'd do that regardless.
     
  3. Regbial macrumors 6502

    Regbial

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    #228
    This is deceptive, and pretty much makes the toggles moot for most people. I mean only Airplane Mode has any meaning (which I guess it was lacking?)

    It's deceptive, and I hope Apple gets sued. Their attitude lately is so obnoxious, it's like they are turning into Google (or Nintendo). They need to be humbled.

    They killed off the iPods and now removed the simple functionality of uploading your running info from iPod Nanos to NikePlus from iTunes. Why? OHHH RIGHT!!! They want to force you to buy their nearly-uselesss smartwatches!!
     
  4. plantemichel macrumors newbie

    plantemichel

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2014
    #229
    I don't think Apple made a great choice for choosing what's good for us. Ex: dropping the jack audio support.
     
  5. flat five macrumors 603

    flat five

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Location:
    newyorkcity
    #230
    the reason i like it is this:

    at home, a few times a day i go out front to the stoop.. at work, at least once a day, i go for an extended bathroom break (for lack of better description while trying to maintain forum etiquette ;) ).. all of which are phone using moments.

    both of these situations have me out of range for decent wi-fi while in range to still be connected..
    pre iOS 11, i'd turn off wifi to switch to cellular then turn wifi back on later once i'm back inside (when i remembered to).

    now, i hit the wi-fi switch when the signal is too weak.. and that's it.. i'm on cellular then it reconnects back to wi-fi automatically when i go back inside.

    (and you're not getting the popups "location accuracy will improve if wi-fi is on" etc anymore)

    ----
    i'm not sure if this is a reason for Apple to make the change but if not, a good side effect reason for me..
     
  6. jm001 macrumors 6502a

    jm001

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2011
    #231
    Control Centre basically just disconnects them while settings (which is really where one should go) disables them. I'm not sure why some people are freaking out about this. Just go to settings and disable it there. Yes Apple should have been more forthcoming and informed the public of the differences, but I think it's a non-issue now. It's not like you CAN'T disable it, ever - it's just people don't want to do a very minor extra step.
     
  7. KrispE00 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2016
    #232
    Very well said. If you have a MR account and make comments on here, you are not the average user. The average user sees the WiFi and Bluetooth button and thinks that because it’s no longer highlighted that it has been turned off. This is because, for the past 4 years, it has worked this way. Changing the function of a familiar button is always unintuitive.
     
  8. mytdave macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2002
    #233
    I'm in agreement with EFF on this one. I'm glad I read this, now I know I can't trust control center.
     
  9. KrispE00 macrumors member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2016
    #234
    The less than average user doesn’t know control center exists, so none of this matters.
     
  10. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 68040

    PinkyMacGodess

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Location:
    Midwest America.
    #235
    But it sort of makes sense. 'Control Panel' is transient, like Airplane Mode. It's turned on after the glaring of the Flight Attendants (fascist nazi's) and turned on just before the wheels touch the ground (I've seen people doing that). If you want it OFF, go to 'Settings'. Maybe Apple will change this int he future, but maybe not.

    Settings is for 'permanent' device mutations. Apple could have made that more prominent I suppose...
    --- Post Merged, Oct 6, 2017 ---
    It is what it is... I've always had the idea that 'Control Center' is transient. My idea won't change. But anyway...
     
  11. Finnaqua macrumors newbie

    Finnaqua

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2016
    Location:
    Lisboa
    #236
    Agree. We are the Admin of our own devices, so if we want Wifi/BT OFF, be OFF untill we decide to turn it ON again. It's a silly idea to put the Settings change itself only because we move to another place or if is 5 AM.
     
  12. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 68040

    PinkyMacGodess

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Location:
    Midwest America.
    #237
    But, look at this article. Airplane mode no longer kills WiFi and Bluetooth.

    HAH!

    The first time I tried to use 'inflight WiFi', I had to turn off Airplane Mode. HELLO!!! Now, Airplane Mode kills the cellular modem, not WiFi and Bluetooth. I was panicked that I'd be found using my iPhone with Airplane Mode turned off. Now we don't have to worry about that, although killing the Bluetooth isn't a bad idea (except for the Apple Watch).

    Chill on the 'OMG!!! Airplane Mode doesn't work!!!'...
     
  13. chucker23n1 macrumors 6502a

    chucker23n1

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2014
    #238
    It totally does for me. And it does according to Apple, too. Sounds like a bug. (And given that the article is based off iOS 11 b2, I don't even really know what to say.)
     
  14. iLLUMI macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    #239
    so if I have an older iPad for example, and no Apple Watch and no Apple pencil etc which I don't need to connect/sync together then it will still always be on?
    Never mind that I cannot connect any devices to it via Bluetooth so what's the point Apple?

    Oh wait, I just read the "MANUAL" ..... "iOS 11 users can still completely disable Wi-Fi and Bluetooth for all networks and devices by toggling them off in the Settings app. A device can also be placed in Airplane Mode with Wi-Fi and Bluetooth disabled."

    Whatever happened to "it just works!" ??

    So why don't they just add a 3D touch option to Control Centre to completely disable them rather than having to go into settings? Come on Apple!
     
  15. matrix07 macrumors 68040

    matrix07

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2010
    #240
    I say one tap disable, another tap disconnect, another enable. On and on like a loop.
    I know why Apple doing it this way but they just didn't think thing through. It's just not easily understandable.
     
  16. flat five macrumors 603

    flat five

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Location:
    newyorkcity
    #241
    sued for what, exactly? deceptive about what, exactly?
    i feel like some people aren't really thinking this through.


    say you were deceived into disconnecting from a network via control center and unknowingly left wi-fi on.
    what , exactly, is the scenario where this is going to result in damage to you?

    i don't get it.. what are you suing for?
    are you talking some sort of hypothetical scenario or something that will actually affect you?
     
  17. HopefulHumanist macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2015
    #242
    Lmao it’s called life experience. How would I prove it to you, with a poll? :rolleyes:
     
  18. Regbial macrumors 6502

    Regbial

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    #243
    Hypothetically and also it's hyperbole. Damage? Long term damage and faster wear of the battery, because it is using wifi and bluetooth even when the user thinks s/he has turned them off. I use an iPod touch, which uses Wi-Fi for location data. What's the point of the toggle if it will still use the Wi-Fi and battery to determine location?

    And I have thought it through, I investigated and saw in the settings how it says "New Wifi connections have been turned off from Control Center" (like, what does this even mean? especially with people in this thread saying they connect to wifi when they change locations? that does smell like lawsuit and deceit, sorry) instead of "off". It also says that when you use the toggle itself "disconnected" instead of "off". Yes yes, this is all good, but there is still no clear explanation or instruction of how or why it works this way from Apple. It's just there and most people are non the wiser about the issue. Apple is behaving like a snake.
     
  19. flat five macrumors 603

    flat five

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2007
    Location:
    newyorkcity
    #244
    oh.. i meant 'damage' because you were talking about suing.. people sue for damages..
    i didn't meant damage as in physical damage such as broken glass.

    anyway, it's cool.. i don't feel like arguing about this right now so i should of left it be earlier.. thanks for the further clarification regarding the questions i asked.
     
  20. ventricle macrumors member

    ventricle

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2016
    Location:
    Oz
    #245
    But it just works! For Apple.
     
  21. Regbial macrumors 6502

    Regbial

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    #246
    Oh ok, sorry. Yeah I guess there's no real lawful damage. I just wish they were clearer with this stuff...

    I guess all of this just upsets me, the iPod nano feature killing much more so. Anyway you have yourself a good weekend. :)
     
  22. GoodWheaties macrumors 6502

    GoodWheaties

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2015
    Location:
    Colorado
    #247
    The reason your wifi and Bluetooth stay on when Airplane Mode was activated is because in iOS 11 it remembers your previous setting in Airplane Mode. So you must have had it that way the last time you used it. Quite nice personally.
     
  23. paradox00 macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2009
    #248
    https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208086

    It does exactly what Apple says it does. In iOS itself, there are three icons: each representing connected, disconnected, and off. Those are also self explanatory. What is challenging, is that seeing the text for the statuses requires a force touch, and having one mode only accessible through settings is not intuitive. Frankly, those should be minor quibbles though. The outrage seems incredibly disproportionate.

    Your earlier suggestion that this new functionality somehow degrades the battery sufficiently quicker to be lawsuit worthy was completely unsubstantiated. Maybe the battery requires service seconds or minutes earlier, good luck proving that. Even a couple days would be insignificant. I honestly don't think a study could find a statistically significant difference. Wifi and bluetooth simply don't drain a lot of power relative to everything else, especially if they're not trying to connect. It might even save power if a user frequently forgets to turn their wifi radio back on when they get home, and instead uses the higher power cellular radio (me). On a similar note, this could potentially reduce cellular data usage. Generally that's a plus on limited plans.

    Apple really has nothing to gain from this change, it doesn't seem to make them money. The most reasonable explanation is that they simply felt it was better for users based on the usage data and feedback they have. Frankly I'd agree.
     
  24. nia820 macrumors 68000

    nia820

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2011
    #249
    Basically those toggles are there for decoration.

    Honestly this was the last straw for me that made me go back to Android. Apple has found new ways to sandbox it's consumers.
     
  25. MEJHarrison macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2009
    #250
    That's an interesting stance. The way I see it, Apple appears to have given users more options. Before we only had on and off. Now we also have disconnect for those who find that useful (myself included). Granted, I think it could have been implemented much better. But I'm not sure I get the same sense of doom and gloom from having more options and more control that you seem to be getting.
     

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