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Epically greedy losers.
My impression is that Epic seems to me quite generous for developers and users. Free-to-play Fortnite. Free Unreal Engine until $1M in revenue and then just 5% fee. In wikipedia there's other examples when they lower fees or made something free.

But I don't now them personally, so of course it's just like it look like to me from outside.
 
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My impression is that Epic seems to me quite generous for developers and users. Free-to-play Fortnite. Free Unreal Engine until $1M in revenue and then just 5% fee. In wikipedia there's other examples when they lower fees or made something free.

But I don't now them personally, so of course it's just like it look like to me from outside.

It's called promotion to grow the base. Then hit them with the new business model that involves crazy amount of micro transactions, loot boxes and all that crap.
 
It’s not a tax, it’s a service fee. Apple is not a government and can’t tax anything or anyone.
The think is that Apple is governing the software for your iPhone and iPad, so it's ok to see it as a tax.

But the thing is that, that if developers would rise their app fees with this Apple service fee, then the market could start working accordingly.
 
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My impression is that Epic seems to me quite generous for developers and users. Free-to-play Fortnite. Free Unreal Engine until $1M in revenue and then just 5% fee. In wikipedia there's other examples when they lower fees or made something free.

But I don't now them personally, so of course it's just like it look like to me from outside.

Epic couldn’t make a profit on iOS with a 30% cut.

Epic offered an alternative payment system that paid Apple 0%. That was their solution.

Apple said that doesn’t work either.

So, Epic and Apple brought it to the courts and the courts said Epic has to pay Apple 30%.

And there’s your answer. You can’t put a game like Fortnite on iOS.


And the reason Apple couldn’t allow 0% is because each Fortnite update is at least 100MB.

100 MB * 10,000,000 / update = 1 petabyte in server traffic on the App Store. That obviously was hurting Apple.

Now there is a court ruling that says you can’t stream console games on iOS or Android. Tough luck. Sorry not sorry. Buy an Xbox.
 
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It's called promotion to grow the base. Then hit them with the new business model that involves crazy amount of micro transactions, loot boxes and all that crap.
Yeah, but you have an option not to buy that and still use the game, no?
 
Epic couldn’t make a profit on iOS with a 30% cut.

Epic offered an alternative payment system that paid Apple 0%. That was their solution.

Apple said that doesn’t work either.

So, Epic and Apple brought it to the courts and the courts said Epic has to pay Apple 30%.

And there’s your answer. You can’t put a game like Fortnite on iOS.

If Epic could’t turn a profit on selling imaginary hats and virtual dance moves to people at 70% of their original price then they are idiots with a fundamentally flawed business model.

I mean, how much does an imaginary hat cost to “produce”?

Epic could and did make plenty of profit on iOS, they just wanted to keep all of it instead of most.

It’s sleazy of them to think Apple owes them something for nothing, and the way they went about intentionally getting their game banned by breaking the contract they’d willingly signed was extra sleazy. Turning around and whining — after things went exactly as they’d intended — about how they were the victims was super duper sleazy.

Fortunately, the judge called them on their entitled BS in no uncertain terms.

If you enter into a legally binding agreement and end up hating it, too bad. Maybe you can back out of it, maybe you can’t.

The honorable thing to do is to just take your licks and keep your word. Epic instead decided they’d just do whatever they wanted — and in Apple’s house, no less, while they were enjoying Apple’s hospitality.

The App Store puts your product in front of a great many eyes. It handles customer service and security, processes payments, and basically frees developers to focus on making their apps rather than babysitting their distribution and sale after they’re in the wild.

That’s worth something. Perhaps not what Apple sees fit to charge, but something. Epic wanted it all for free.
 
If I get it right if you order taxi through your app or pizza delivery Apple doesn't get 30% fee but if you order some virtual pizza, or some service in SaaS software there's 30% cut. Does it make sense?
 
Yeah, but you have an option not to buy that and still use the game, no?

No, the direction that these type of games are going in will force people to pay or at least try to. You will have the basic game for free but if you want better levels, or progress, or change your character's weapons they will eventually demand more and more and more money from you.

This is a very bad direction. A game should ideally give the whole experience to players and should be an affordable experience.

The other bad idea some of these web3 crazy people are pursuing is NFT games. This means every character or weapon or level can be unlocked buy purchasing an NFT, which is just a digital receipt.

The more higher the value of the NFT the more features you can access and better upgrades you can purchase.

That means in the end the stinking spoilt children of rich people will have the best gaming and the children of poor people are treated like a fifth class citizen.

We want equality. We don't want a kind of elitist fascist caste system.
 
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No, the direction that these type of games are going in will force people to pay or at least try to. You will have the basic game for free but if you want better levels, or progress, or change your character's weapons they will eventually demand more and more and more money from you.

This is a very bad direction. A game should ideally give the whole experience to players and should be an affordable experience.

The other bad idea some of these web3 crazy people are pursuing is NFT games. This means every character or weapon or level can be unlocked buy purchasing an NFT, which is just a digital receipt.

The more higher the value of the NFT the more features you can access and better upgrades you can purchase.

That means in the end the stinking spoilt children of rich people will have the best gaming and the children of poor people are treated like a fifth class citizen.

We want equality. We don't want a kind of elitist fascist caste system.
Ready Player 1?

Edit: And BTW, that’s why the whole “white privilege” is a smoke screen. No matter what changes are made to the racist system, the children of the rich and famous and politically connected won’t be denied access to anything. They will always be the aristocracy. It’s a whole “don’t blame me, look over there!” movement.

As an example, if Harvard wasn’t forced to accept a group of “the little people” each year a long while back, they wouldn’t do so. But since they must in order to qualify for government kick backs, they are simply shuffling out one group of “unwashed” for another. But their degrees still won’t carry the same weight as the connected Harvard graduates who write their own ticket to anywhere to do whatever they want to because of Daddy.
 
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No, the direction that these type of games are going in will force people to pay or at least try to. You will have the basic game for free but if you want better levels, or progress, or change your character's weapons they will eventually demand more and more and more money from you.

This is a very bad direction. A game should ideally give the whole experience to players and should be an affordable experience.

The other bad idea some of these web3 crazy people are pursuing is NFT games. This means every character or weapon or level can be unlocked buy purchasing an NFT, which is just a digital receipt.

The more higher the value of the NFT the more features you can access and better upgrades you can purchase.

That means in the end the stinking spoilt children of rich people will have the best gaming and the children of poor people are treated like a fifth class citizen.

We want equality. We don't want a kind of elitist fascist caste system.

Ok. Fortunately unlike in one real world we can develop as many different game worlds as we want to behave differently and making different rules to play them and being "born" in them. That's a good think.
 
Each person is supposed to pay Microsoft $120 a year to play online games on Xbox.


Apple doesn’t have such a program.

Fortnite on iOS was forced to use Epic’s servers, to host the game. For free.

Epic said they could do this, but only if they paid Apple $0.

Apple said they can’t afford $0 because they’re losing something like $500k on each update.

Angry “soccer moms” want the free Fortnite for the kids on the used iPhone 6s they bought for $120.

 
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Ok. Fortunately unlike in one real world we can develop as many different game worlds as we want to behave differently and making different rules to play them and being "born" in them. That's a good think.

If only companies thought like that. They don't make independent decisions.

They often have the same investors and banks behind them. So if the investors have a bad idea then all the major game studios follow.

People follow trends, even awfully bad ones, without thinking about what will happen next.

That's why Facebook and other social media have been such a big problem. Their investors didn't want anything to change because all that hate, anger, misinformation and extreme stuff was making them money.
 
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If only companies thought like that. They don't make independent decisions.

They often have the same investors and banks behind them. So if the investors have a bad idea then all the major game studios follow.

People follow trends, even awfully bad ones, without thinking about what will happen next.

That's why Facebook and other social media have been such a big problem. Their investors didn't want anything to change because all that hate, anger, misinformation and extreme stuff was making them money.

Yes, everything has a samce cycle niche -> mainstream -> if you just consider money you can create hurtful programs.

The good think there's much more competition in gaming than in social networks. And gaming developers came from underground, artists and quite nerds, so I believe there will be still new opportunities and unique game worlds.

But at the end power lies in every customer what we want to experience and spend money on. That's the beauty of free market.
 
Each person is supposed to pay Microsoft $120 a year to play online games on Xbox.


Apple doesn’t have such a program.

Fortnite on iOS was forced to use Epic’s servers, to host the game. For free.

Epic said they could do this, but only if they paid Apple $0.

Apple said they can’t afford $0 because they’re losing something like $500k on each update.

Angry “soccer moms” want the free Fortnite for the kids on the used iPhone 6s they bought for $120.


Thanks for history of negotiation. I hope they find win-win-win (3rd win is customer) solution.
 
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My impression is that Epic seems to me quite generous for developers and users. Free-to-play Fortnite. Free Unreal Engine until $1M in revenue and then just 5% fee. In wikipedia there's other examples when they lower fees or made something free.

But I don't now them personally, so of course it's just like it look like to me from outside.

Fortnite makes about $5 billion per year. It might look "free" from the outside, but they are absolutely not giving it away for free.
 
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Ready Player 1?

Edit: And BTW, that’s why the whole “white privilege” is a smoke screen. No matter what changes are made to the racist system, the children of the rich and famous and politically connected won’t be denied access to anything. They will always be the aristocracy. It’s a whole “don’t blame me, look over there!” movement.

As an example, if Harvard wasn’t forced to accept a group of “the little people” each year a long while back, they wouldn’t do so. But since they must in order to qualify for government kick backs, they are simply shuffling out one group of “unwashed” for another. But their degrees still won’t carry the same weight as the connected Harvard graduates who write their own ticket to anywhere to do whatever they want to because of Daddy.

I truly empathize with people who can’t afford a $500 Xbox, a $120 Xbox Live membership, and a $60 game.

But using Apple like a bank, to give you the same luxury experience, on a used iPhone you bought second hand, is not fair either.

And the courts agree, you have to pay Apple 30%.

And as a compromise, Apple lowered their premium to 15% for the first $1 million.
 
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Conditioning lmao. One only needs to take lessons from history.

Tobacco companies claim cigarettes don't cause cancer. Oil companies claim carbon emissions don't cause climate change. Nestle claims water being a human right is an extremist viewpoint. Enron and Lehman Brothers did nothing wrong. And I guess Apple eschews profits in favor of their customers. ? Believing corporations care about you ignores history and is simply allowing the wool to be pulled over your eyes. Sorry, but I'm not that ignorant or gullible.
You may not be ignorant or gullible but you just painted everything with one broad brush stroke..also known as all or nothing thinking.
 
The other bad idea some of these web3 crazy people are pursuing is NFT games. This means every character or weapon or level can be unlocked buy purchasing an NFT, which is just a digital receipt.

The more higher the value of the NFT the more features you can access and better upgrades you can purchase.

User-owned, transferrable content is a great idea. Right now, if you buy a virtual hat it fortnight, you are just giving money to Epic. You can't resell it and you can't transfer it to another game. The idea behind web3 is that if you purchase a digital asset, like a virtual hat, it is yours. You can resell it and other games can choose to support it.

This gives the value of the transaction to the user. This has created opportunities for people to actually "play to earn" at a large scale. The players, not the company, get the benefit of the time they spend in the game.

"Pay to win" is a separate mechanic, and it is present in plenty of games without web3. It is a different thing.
 
Fortnite makes about $5 billion per year. It might look "free" from the outside, but they are absolutely not giving it away for free.
Sure, just look like they are very successful in what they do, don't know if they are greedy - never played fortnite.

How does any greedy company stay in market for a longer time if they don't fulfil customers desires so, that means that market will find fair price?

I know just about our established governments could do, because we decided it's fair that we can't to stop paying taxes.
 
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Imagine you run a pizza shop.

The local school (Americans) wants to have a pizza party for the children. They have a budget of $40. They need 10 pizzas.

The delivery guy (Epic) says he can make this work, for the kids, but only if he pays you 70% on each pizza.

What would you (Apple) say?

Do you take a profit loss to make school children happy?

EDIT: The answer is clearly no. The courts have ruled that you must pay Apple 30%.
 
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It is Apple's App Store and Apple's iPhone. They can do whatever they want with it.

Apple should have the courage and listen to MR comments, pull out of South Korean Market!.
 
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