Epic Games Wins 'Total Victory' in Google Play Store Dispute

[Naraxus]

Apple has always tried to position the iPhone as being different from the Mac for privacy and security reasons, but I think it's a thin argument.

It's not a thin argument imo.

True or False: Most people do their banking, store/purchase tickets for various events, make reservations and so on, on their iPads or iPhones rather than a laptop/desktop device?

Imo the answer is unequivocably yes which makes privacy & security on those devices a critical area to protect & a high priority for Apple

 

[surferfb]

It's not a thin argument imo.

True or False: Most people do their banking, store/purchase tickets for various events, make reservations and so on, on their iPads or iPhones rather than a laptop/desktop device?

Imo the answer is unequivocably yes which makes privacy & security on those devices a critical area to protect & a high priority for Apple

And I’d argue the Mac/PC model is clearly worse for most users. Just because we’re tech enthusiasts who can work with the guardrails off doesn’t mean it’s better for everyone.

 

[turbineseaplane]

Since we are discussing the Apple App “vetting”

Adam Demasi (@kirb@hachyderm.io)

Attached: 1 image This is your regular reminder that apps aren’t “vetted by Apple”. They check them for a handful of violations to do with in-app purchases and how the app requests permissions. They’re not lawyers sifting through privacy policies to decide if they look ok, and they’re most...

elk.zone

 

[FriendlyMackle]

If Target was the only company that owned land for the state of New York and got to dictate where, when, and how Walmart could build their stores, what they could sell, and even whether or not Walmart could build a store, we would all agree that would be bad.

Apple in the case of the iPhone is the land owner. They control what other stores are allowed to operate and how they sell their goods or services, same with google for the most part.

Saying “just leave the iPhone” is like saying “just leave New York” in my target example.

Also there are stores within a store. Starbucks inside Target, Toys R Us inside Macys, Malls in general. I am dumbfounded why people advocate against consumer choice.

Those ‘stores within a store’ PAY handsomely for the privilege of being able to highlight their products within a large merchant’s space.
No ordance mandates that they do so.

 

[germanbeer007]

If Target was the only company that owned land for the state of New York

You moved into the land where Target is the only company that owned land for the state of New York. You should have done your research.

I am dumbfounded why people advocate against consumer choice.

I am puzzled why people need to involve a judge to fix their mistake in doing zero research before moving.

 

[FriendlyMackle]

It's not a thin argument imo.

True or False: Most people do their banking, store/purchase tickets for various events, make reservations and so on, on their iPads or iPhones rather than a laptop/desktop device?

Imo the answer is unequivocably yes which makes privacy & security on those devices a critical area to protect & a high priority for Apple

Also, to follow what you said—hundreds of millions of people use iphones (update: 3 billion!) vs a few million(?) Mac and iPad users. The iphone is a leading target for malicious actors due to the number of users.

 

[germanbeer007]

If Ford was the only one allowed to open dealerships then yeah they should. Imagine Ford buying all the land in a state and then dictating that no other dealerships could operate in the entire state.

If Target is the only store to buy your essentials and Ford is the only store to buy a car, you wouldn't move into that land.

 

[AlterZgo]

These comparisons of the google/android ecosystem to land is funny. We are talking about the internet. The land is infinite and android is not locked down like iOS. Epic can make their app store available anywhere else they'd like. Google should not be forced to put Epic's store within Google's own store.

 

[Naraxus]

And I’d argue the Mac/PC model is clearly worse for most users. Just because we’re tech enthusiasts who can work with the guardrails off doesn’t mean it’s better for everyone.

That's precisely why my mom's main device is an iPad. She does have my old MacBook Air for those times when she absolutely needs it but 99% of the time she uses either her iPad or iPhone.

She doesn't need it to do anymore than what it currently does. A desktop Mac/PC would be complete overkill and utterly useless for her needs.

 

[Naraxus]

Also, to follow what you said—hundreds of millions of people use iphones vs a few million(?) Mac and iPad users. The iphone is a leading target for malicious targeting due to the number of users.

This is why I'm so apprehensive about drivers licenses - if Apple continues to add other forms of identification to the Wallet app in iPhones & iPads & these tech-retarded governments continue to weaken iOS/iPad security......it's a recipe for disaster.

 

[FriendlyMackle]

This is why I'm so apprehensive about drivers licenses - if Apple continues to add other forms of identification to the Wallet app in iPhones & iPads & these tech-retarded governments continue to weaken iOS/iPad security......it's a recipe for disaster.

I totally agree. The problem isn’t Apple, but it will be that the various governmental/state implementations, their poor security & data practices (+ lack of oversight AND insider access by random idiots appointed to ‘improve’ and ‘streamline’ systems and data) will lead to massive public data dumps and dark-web aggregation and sales of critical personal data for all of us. And it’s not like we can opt out, if you have any kind of government/federal/state/local ID (which of course we all do), then that data is extremely vulnerable to theft and misuse.

 

[ricom2ger]

So Google is forced to support other stores on their stores with their 3% market share with Pixel.

 

[Adysubman]

Store-within-a-store - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Nice but that’s a commercial agreement between a store and someone who wants to utilise a pop-up store. They’ll be required to pay for the floor space and/or take a percentage of the sales.

They OP was inferring Ford will be forced to give up floor space to Chevy or whoever regardless if they want it or not.

 

[uacd]

Not enough lawsuits for Google. They are worse monopoly than Apple tbh

 

[Velli]

Epic is such a trouble maker. I have such distaste for that company.

When two kids are fighting in the schoolyard, you don’t actually have to root for any of them.

 

[GrassShark]

Nice but that’s a commercial agreement between a store and someone who wants to utilise a pop-up store. They’ll be required to pay for the floor space and/or take a percentage of the sales.

They OP was inferring Ford will be forced to give up floor space to Chevy or whoever regardless if they want it or not.

I know that’s what he meant. Its also a completely fictional scenario that’s never going to happen, so I wouldn’t worry about it too much.

 

[atoqir]

I really want Valve to sue Epic for not allowing them to sell Steam games inside the Epic store. Or for Microsoft to sue Sony for not allowing the Xbox game store on the Playstation (or vice versa). Etc...

Things like this already are happening today.

There are games on the epic store that require you to install the Ubisoft Connect store. There are games on the Microsoft Xbox Store that require you to install EA Play store etc.

Also Microsoft is currently one of the biggest publishers on the Playstation store with Forza, Sea Of Thieves and other games.

Sony exclusive published games are on Steam and Helldivers 2 is coming to Xbox.

You can also buy disc games in all kind of stores as well for different prices.

All those companies I listed are not anti competitive monopolies or duopolies like Apple and Google.

Microsoft is also already beta testing that you can use your existing stores and game libraries (including Steam) on the next Xbox and that new ROG handheld that will come out in the near future. All those companies are working together, the only ones that are constantly go to court are Apple and Google because they don’t want to negotiate anything with third parties.

 

[piccolamela]

Wasn’t a jury, was a judge. And she ruled correctly (except, ironically, on the one part she ruled in favor of Epic on - she ruled the anti-steering provision violated California law, but a California court later said it didn’t, the appeals court agreed it didn’t. But unfortunately for Apple, they didn’t rule until after the federal case was done).

The reason Apple won and Google lost was well explained by Ben Thompson, but it’s behind a paywall. Apologies for the long quote:

Thank you for that summary!

I'm very happy the anti competitive Google practises were revealed and will bring more choice for users and developers.

 

[laptech]

So Epic sues Apple and Google for the exact same reason, monopoly of their app store. Apple wins but Google loses. How Google opperates it's app store is no different to how Apple run's it's app store but a jury finds Google guilty of a monopoly on it's app store but yet a jury found Apple not guilty of running a monopoly on it's app store. Just goes to show that jury's can be biased towards Apple.

 

[svish]

Not sure whether an appeal from Google will change anything again. For now Epic seems to have won. Looks like many changes are coming to Android too.

 

[transpo1]

When two kids are fighting in the schoolyard, you don’t actually have to root for any of them.

And yet, when you know who started the fight, you actually do root for one of them. 😉

 

[thefrost]

Does this guy ever rest?

 

[Vistaus]

And I’d argue the Mac/PC model is clearly worse for most users. Just because we’re tech enthusiasts who can work with the guardrails off doesn’t mean it’s better for everyone.

That's why people opt for choice. Make it secure for people that aren't tech enthusiasts and offer the option remove the guardrails for those that are. This is like buying a bike with training wheels attached to them and no way to remove them once they aren't needed anymore.

 

[mrochester]

So Epic sues Apple and Google for the exact same reason, monopoly of their app store. Apple wins but Google loses. How Google opperates it's app store is no different to how Apple run's it's app store but a jury finds Google guilty of a monopoly on it's app store but yet a jury found Apple not guilty of running a monopoly on it's app store. Just goes to show that jury's can be biased towards Apple.

Google pretends the marketplace for android app stores is open to all then does shady deals behind the scenes to prevent any competition from existing.

Apple does neither.

 

[AppliedMicro]

When I buy a subscribe and save item like toothpaste from Amazon or any other company offering that type of savings program do you think Amazon isn’t getting a cut of that toothpaste cost every month when they reship it?

When I buy a MacBook from Amazon, did Amazon get a cut of the “iTunes” purchases I made on that device?
When I buy a printer, does Amazon get a cut of all future toner/ink purchases, for that initial “acquisition”?

No.

So tell me where I’m wrong then.

Does Amazon give away and ship most items on their shop for free?
Or do most manufacturers of toothpaste only pay a $99 yearly subscription?

Not really, no.

They both offer a store to buy stuff.

…and Apple restricts customers’ ability to buy through other stores.

And they keep a portion of the costs when someone buys through their store.

It't not a portion of costs - it's a portion of the sales prices.
And furthermore, Apple also want a portion of the sales price when customers buy elsewhere.