Apple shouldn’t be needing to do any work whatsoever when another company is creating an alternative app store, or, for that matter, apps. It is Apple’s own choosing to force a business relationship in that case.
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EU Probes Apple's Decision to Shut Down Epic's Developer Account
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Because nobody can realistically go and create another mobile OS from scratch and expect anyone to use it. That's the point of defining entrenchment. Apple gets to say "you can make money from the mobile app marketplace, you can, you can... you can't".
It didn't used to work that way on PC or Mac.
It didn't used to work that way on PC or Mac.
I thought the whole point of this was to make other business less dependent on Gatekeepers / level the playing field?
Apple may have the right to cut business ties with Epic (as an example) but they should not have a say over whether or not Epic makes its own store with its own rules, otherwise nothing really changes and business X is still depending on what the Gatekeeper says?
Oh well, no need to really argue. Thats up to the EU to decide
Apple may have the right to cut business ties with Epic (as an example) but they should not have a say over whether or not Epic makes its own store with its own rules, otherwise nothing really changes and business X is still depending on what the Gatekeeper says?
Oh well, no need to really argue. Thats up to the EU to decide
Exactly, that’s the way it works. If the EU want to flip that on the head, they'll need to be consistent with all app stores.
Maybe MacPaw will be forced to provide a store for Epic and let them use it for free.
It is, if you put barriers and can veto—without cause—who can publish such a store.
Think of it like this: if a supermarket chain requires third-party companies to use the chain's own delivery tracks (managed as a different contract) for them to move stock, but then decides to cancel a logistics contract—and, by de facto, allowing the company with said contract to sell their stock—then they may be acting as a monopoly. Particularly, if said supermarket is in a dominant position and instead stocks up competing first-party products.
You do not, this is factually false. Notarisation is not required and you can distribute mac apps without having any relationship whatsoever with Apple.
I think you misread my comment. I’m saying that Apple has only to blame themselves when they are forcing a business relationship onto app and app store providers.
Indeed! The Gatekeep requirements are, thankfully, significantly lower than the ones of a monopoly. This only adds to my original comments. ;-)
What game is Apple competing with Epic on? I get the Spotify argument, but Epic is entirely different. Apple aren’t competing with them.
It is actually one of the rules that 3rd party app stores need to allow other 3rd party apps like Meta could not just release a Meta Store and only sell Meta apps
Not a lawyer, but I can't see how the EU can force Apple to allow anyone to be able to install apps (a third-party app store is an app) on iOS. There are potential security and privacy issues. Could the EU force Apple to allow web-based stores that push apps to devices? Doubtful, again, because of security and privacy issues. They can't tell Apple that they have no say over what a developer does, that would open iOS to malicious developers creating app stores, which Apple couldn't block, and which would be much more harmful to users than any financial limitation for selling apps.
So you’re saying the new rules can force an alternative App Store to host 8.93 million apps?
In this case, it is about access to publishing an App Store. Don't forget Apple has Arcade and a good revenue from selling games in their own App Store. If Epic is set to release its own App Store, then they can publish games and/or other apps.
Amazon does that all the time. Supermarkets are not in any way required to sell products from any company. They choose what they want to sell.
Nope. Apps need to be notarized to run on macOS (or users have to jump through hoops to run them).
So they don't need to be notarised - exactly my point
The enormous amount of iOS users that carry their phone on them, making bank payments, sharing location, making phone calls etc. is what makes iOS a prime target for bad actors (as have been proven again and again by the (state sponsored) exploits out there). MacOS... not so much. That's why Apple is very very protective of iOS and the iPhone.
Epic behaved as a bad actor in Apple's eyes by deliberately breaking the developer agreement in order to trigger a law suit. Had Epic simply started their law suit in order to force Apple to change their App Store rules it would have been a different case in my eyes. Sonos disagrees as well with Apple, but they behave according to the App Store rules.
Also: an external App Store in iOS still requires an app to be developed and that app needs to be compliant with the (EU) App Store rules. Would you expect an untrustworthy developer to comply even with the new EU rules? Or would you expect them to further stretch and break the rules in order to get what they want?
The EU should be very clear in their rule making. I do think it is true that there need to be rules for very large companies with significant market share, but it won't be easy due to all the technical intricacies. I'm glad I'm not a law maker... And don't get me started on encryption and government backdoors, that can of worms is now being served in the UK.
If your business wants to be associated with meta? I doubt 8.93 million want to.
Either way, META already said they will not bother with its own store on iOS
This is really what its all about.
Apple ****** Arcade, another failing service from Apple.
If you got epic games or xbox game pass on iOS, game over for Apple Arcade and they know it.
Apple are a monopoly and everyone knows it, they want Spotify, epic and anyone else who competes with their services gone or disgraced.
Apple sell inferior services and know the only way to win is to get rid of the others.
They're hoping users will just switch if they can't get what they want.
Tim and his cronies are a disgrace.
Sending out Phil the Shill to bad mouth Epic and their CEO is hilarious and desperate, they know the EU wont stand for this.
This could go on forever. But Spotify compete directly with Apple with Music streaming (obviously). I can’t see Apple have entered the same type of gaming style in any way other than they supply Games through the Arcade store, which to my knowledge have not been developed in anyway by Apple.
By going down this route, it'd be Apple not being allowed to compete with any app simply because they own the OS.
What do they not understand about these 40+ yr OS designs like MacOS / Windows is that they are inherently insecure! The reason iOS is designed the way it is and has been the most secure mainstream OS known to man is because it doesnt have the "doorways" to exploit in the first place!
I think its not that EU advisors dont know how computers work, its rather than they ignore the issues in order to get what they want. Its silly really.
It’s not a matter of doubting. If they can force an app store to host 8.93 Million apps then the app stores need to comply. They can’t have it both ways. If the EU wants a fair market then they have to be equal. Bit let’s face it. We know this isn’t about fairness. It’s about Ferrari driving execs trying to show they have big… DMA's
Don't think I entirety get your first point. Apple is now (by law) allowing alternative marketplaces on iOS - EPIC can go to any other marketplace (or create their own) and have their apps installed on Apple's Ecosystem.
Therefore Apple, in their right as the dev agreements of the Apple App Store policies, can stop a dev account from publishing without justification. If App Store would be the only store that is possible to tap into the iOS market, EPIC would have been in their right to demand answers for this move that this is hindering their go-to-market.
Has Apple Removed EPIC dev account globally? Because I am under the impression that they removed their Swedish account. If Apple does not allow Epic to have dev accounts outside of the EU where DMA is in place, then they have no right to do that.
Let's at least give Apple credit here. They could have hired Victoria Nuland as their EU spokesperson. She always finds the right words for the EU.