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Facebook Takes Out Full-Page Newspaper Ads to Attack Apple's iOS Privacy Changes

That first line should read:
"At Facebook, spying on you is our core business"

Apple should make a counter ad:
"At Apple, our users' privacy is at our core business"

guzhogi said:
While I want to support local businesses, I also want to keep some privacy.

I also find the attached picture ironic. Probably the most trackers by far I've seen compared to many of the other sites that I've been to.

View attachment 1695428
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I get only 2 trackers but I am paid members of macrumors which give me the site without ads. Only $25 a year I believe. Thats about the price of 2 monthly magazine issues...for 12 months of daily news! Not a bad deal!
 
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ajalbawab said:
It's a diversion tactic. Yes of course, personalized ads genuinely target people on a much smaller cost basis. Unfortunately, Facebook uses that data for other reasons. I'm interested to see if all the tech giants take down each other (domino effect) or if one giant, Facebook in this case, speaks up and loses popularity.

What's funny is that Facebook used a non-personalized ad in the Wall Street Journal - showing their ability to not need personalized ads! 🙂
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This advert, in this publication, is aimed at one particular group - politicians who may be influenced and will definitely be the subject of significant lobbying by FB. I wonder how many editors will be looking to run articles that explore and explain what’s really happing for their readership?
 
Apple is just giving the people a choice over their privacy. Its not like apple is completely preventing them from tracking people, its the user’s choice in the end. Why is facebook being such a greedy cry baby? 🤮
 
Is it Aprils 1st already?

But seriously its a hard sell to complain Apple's iOS is too secure and protecting peoples privacy.
 
sideshowuniqueuser said:
Well, a lot of the content on the internet has to be paid for somehow, so it's either upfront payments, or advertising. Most people would prefer advertising, so that's the way it's gone. And if you don't like that, then adblockers work very well.

As for privacy, I'm curious, how does advertising companies tracking your web usage actually impact your life? I mean, I know I'm being tracked, but none of those advertising companies actually care about me or anything about me except to have bots decide what ads to send my way. Is there something I'm missing? What exactly, and why, should I be concerned?
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Yeah that’s fine, and if you want to be tracked then just say yes when asked.
If I don’t want to I want to have the right and possibility to say no.
If a business model depends on something most people will refuse if they knew the implications, then maybe it is neither honest or good.
The thing is that it is easy and lazy to use hidden trackers, they are based on lying and stalking you.
If you work a bit harder as a business I know you can get the personalized attention you want without using coercion and shady practices (meaning literally shadowing).
 
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Abazigal said:
I don’t know why you posted the same response thrice.

Either way, I go back to my earlier point. The problem isn’t that the user is being tracked, but that they are being tracked without their knowledge and their consent.

If your opposition to this is that the user is going to not give consent, then what does that say about the honesty and integrity of such a business model? You know that users would (rightfully) object to being tracked, which is why you support a company like Facebook continuing to do so surreptitiously and wantonly?

I don’t use Facebook, and this is what I have to contend with on a daily basis, and the number of trackers being blocked seems to only increase.

I am fast losing my patience here and my message to the companies and businesses who would be affected is as such:

Time to start finding a new business model and manner of reaching out to consumers that is more respectful of our privacy. Else, it doesn’t matter how useful or relevant your product is to me - I don’t want any of it.
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I agree. Tracking in this case should be transparent and consensual. I'm okay with some companies learning about me so that they can show only stuff I'm interested in. However, not all companies have my best interests at heart. I've heard airlines track which other airlines you've visited so they that they can jack up the prices and gouge you for as much money as possible. I'm afraid of what more nefarious companies would do.
 
Superhai said:
Yeah that’s fine, and if you want to be tracked then just say yes when asked.
If I don’t want to I want to have the right and possibility to say no.
If a business model depends on something most people will refuse if they knew the implications, then maybe it is neither honest or good.
The thing is that it is easy and lazy to use hidden trackers, they are based on lying and stalking you.
If you work a bit harder as a business I know you can get the personalized attention you want without using coercion and shady practices (meaning literally shadowing).
Click to expand...
No one is going to say yes though, because of the way it's worded. There might be a vastly different response if it was worded to say "If everyone turns add tracking off, then your favourite sites will no longer be free, as they won't be supported by adds. Do you want to turn add tracking off?". Or perhaps a simpler way would be to have tracking by default, and anyone who actually really cares can easily turn it off in settings. I would be any money that the vast majority of people would never bother to turn it off, because the vast majority of people simply don't care.

You avoided my question about how tracking actually impacts your life in a negative way?
 
Abazigal said:
Well, for starters, my iPad Pro and iPhone 8+ have run noticeably faster and smoother even since I installed the lockdown app and started blocking all those trackers. So the sad reality its that all this use of trackers does impose a performance penalty on my iOS devices.

I am fine with the extra data usage, since I have 30gb of cellular data shared between my mobile devices.

I also remember visiting certain websites back then (think it was Windowscentral?) and the sheer number of ads it tried to load literally brought my 2016 iPad Pro to its knees. Like this had 2gb ram and A9x processor, and it couldn’t get past the first page. Install an ad-blocker and the website loaded and ran so very smoothly.

Then, there are also news of how a Muslim dating app was selling user data to the US military. So it does make me wonder what exactly is being done with my data that is floating around on the internet.

Right now, the problem is that the options available to me are binary. It’s either opt not to be tracked at all, or consent and have every aspect of me tracked to hell and back. There is no middle-ground (eg: being served far less invasive ads), so don’t blame me for siding with the lesser of two evils here.

So for me at least, the best way of ensuring that as little of my user data is abused is to ensure that as little of my user data leaks out as possible. Maybe this is ultimately a Sisyphean task, but I for one am not going to just give up without a fight.
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It seems you've solved your problem with the lockdown app.

What's most concerning about your examples is that the US military is buying muslim dating site data!!!! The land of the free doing freedom the free way again! Christ almighty, what a sh*t show!
 
sideshowuniqueuser said:
It seems you've solved your problem with the lockdown app.
Click to expand...

The downside is that I still have no inkling of how effective the app is or just what percentage of trackers it is successful in blocking overall.

I look forward to the day when people will no longer have to rely on ad blockers to safeguard their privacy online.
 
sideshowuniqueuser said:
FB provides an advertising platform for zillions of small businesses. People on this forum keep pooping on Google, FB, and Insta, but it's those companies that actually allow individuals to run a profitable small business that competes with the big online shops. People on this forum also complain about Google and FB's privacy invasion that allows targeted advertising. But if you look at it from a small business perspective, the business doesn't want to waste it's time and money advertising to anyone that won't be interested in the product, so targeted adverting is actually best for everyone. The businesses only spend on ads to people who are interested, and people only get ads about things they are likely to be interested in. If you are a small business, then you can only possibly sell to people if the people know your product exists. Sure, people can search on google, but your product won't necessarily come up high on their search, so the business can only reach them with targeted ads, especially the smaller and newer the business is. I'm not a great fan of FB per se, but in this case, I think they are dead right, Apple are being sneaky and greedy, as usual of late, and creating a situation where all the small businesses will have to pay Apple in order to reach customers. And Apple are into creating a monopoly situation so they can pump up the Apple tax, so it's bad bad news for small businesses.
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Ah, that's a solid "the ends justify the mean" argument.

not a fan.

The super smart people that started Google and Facebook can figure out a way to do targeted advertising without doing shady things like collecting data from people without alerting them to the practice. This could be accomplished in part by people opting in who want targeted ads. That won't have he same reach as before when Google Facebook kept their data collection a secret, but that's good for people.

if we want to look at small business, let's ask the question "why do small businesses want to support their business by participating in shady data collecting?"

that's pretty messed up for businesses to willingly participate in that. Sounds like a situation that should be curbed and good for Apple curbing this behavior.

sorry. Facebook and Google get no sympathy doing shady things. The ends don't justify the means.
 
JM said:
Ah, that's a solid "the ends justify the mean" argument.

not a fan.

The super smart people that started Google and Facebook can figure out a way to do targeted advertising without doing shady things like collecting data from people without alerting them to the practice. This could be accomplished in part by people opting in who want targeted ads. That won't have he same reach as before when Google Facebook kept their data collection a secret, but that's good for people.

if we want to look at small business, let's ask the question "why do small businesses want to support their business by participating in shady data collecting?"

that's pretty messed up for businesses to willingly participate in that. Sounds like a situation that should be curbed and good for Apple curbing this behavior.

sorry. Facebook and Google get no sympathy doing shady things. The ends don't justify the means.
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Fair argument.
 
Abazigal said:
The downside is that I still have no inkling of how effective the app is or just what percentage of trackers it is successful in blocking overall.

I look forward to the day when people will no longer have to rely on ad blockers to safeguard their privacy online.
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Ha well, nice to dream of utopia. The beauty of the internet IS that it is very difficult to control and contain. It was actually designed that way by the US military to make it impossible for any entity to take control of it, or destroy it.
 
Someone is really *****

They do have a point of taking away adverting, but the thing they miss is, Apple is not "forcing" not tracing.. Its an "option" users choose

Facebook hasn't understood that part yet.
 
sideshowuniqueuser said:
Fair argument.
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I realized after reading your response, that it's on Facebook and Google to advertise about the value of collecting personal data to serve targeted ads.

if they truly believe in what they are doing is good for people then they will market it as such.

Facebook taking out the ad to try and argue that Apple is hurting small business makes it seem like they don't know how to market it to people that data collection is a good thing for consumers.

Or, Facebook and Google don't want people to know just how much their data is worth, that we all are giving to them for free.
 
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sideshowuniqueuser said:
No one is going to say yes though, because of the way it's worded. There might be a vastly different response if it was worded to say "If everyone turns add tracking off, then your favourite sites will no longer be free, as they won't be supported by adds. Do you want to turn add tracking off?". Or perhaps a simpler way would be to have tracking by default, and anyone who actually really cares can easily turn it off in settings. I would be any money that the vast majority of people would never bother to turn it off, because the vast majority of people simply don't care.

You avoided my question about how tracking actually impacts your life in a negative way?
Click to expand...

It does not turn off ads, it is just that they can’t “personalize” them. It is the sites, ie. the businesses that have to figure out their model for income, not the users. I don’t think users in general are that stupid that they don’t understand the implications of saying no to tracking.

If the businesses are not able to sustain without turning to covert practices, I am happy to see them fold. If the “free” sites are disappearing, paid sites will be available if there really is a market for those.

I did not address if tracking affects me negatively because that was not what I was replying to.

But to be clear I find it abhorrent that businesses do things behind my back.

And to be more specific, I find no value in having ads “personalized” except when I am actively looking for something.

Tracking is not only used to spam me with the last item I visited, but also to inflate prices or to exploit habits or personalities based on a profile.
 
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