Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Facial Recognition Startups Report Increased Interest in Their Tech After Apple's Reveal of Face ID
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
NFC never shares your real CC number, only a one time token. Sam Pay is exactly the same as swiping your CC.
Long beard —> train faceID
no beard —> train faceID
This transition happens very seldom, and therefore should not be a heavy burden.
Done.
Your Digital Security
Remember a year or so ago when we were all urging Apple to not give away the security keys to the iPhone? Well, with facial recognition, Apple just gave everything away. Now, anyone, including unauthorized law enforcement officials without search warrents, can easily “open” your iPhone X and access any of its contents, on any pretext, against your will, by simply pointing the phone’s facial recognition “camera” at you. It recognizes you and, bang, the contents of your iPhone are exposed for any snoop to prowl through. Apple just gave away the privacy of every iPhone X buyer, and yet you don’t see a word about it in the press! iPhone X is for Sheeple!
Eyes, nose, mouth (where hopefully is no hair) seem to be the focus point on this Face ID. And I would worry, I would be shocked if someone from Apple have not thought man can grow/style/cut beards.
And this why I wouldn't use it to open my phone...only my apps. I don't even use TouchID on my 6+ to open it. Not that there is anything nefarious on it...Passcode is still the most secure way to keep my stuff mine.
That's just not true. Samsung Pay uses a digital card number when you use it whether in NFC or MST. It is just as secure either way.
Face ID does not unlock the iPhone or function normally with the eyes closed. So the girlfriend is locked out.
This is so uninformed I don't even know why I am bothering to respond. First, if you aren't looking at the screen directly it will not unlock so just pointing it in your direction will not unlock your phone. Second, according to some of the hands on videos apple has implemented a system where when you press the home and volume button at the same time it disables face ID and requires a password. In this case if law enforcement may want in your phone you simply push two buttons and now it requires a password that they cannot force you to give.
I and my family used to use Google Wallet. Even talked about it here, but of course since Apple didn't have NFC payments no one cared very much
Ditto for other NFC abilities.
They have little choice. Apple defaults to using FaceId instead of using TouchId.
All the app programmer can do is read the biometric type and change their prompt from "Touch" to "Face".
Or sure, they could turn off biometric authentication altogether. Which you can imagine would go over like a lead balloon with users. Figure the odds.
Samsung Pay is also tokenized. Even its MST magnetic emulation.
Btw, the account token in Apple Pay is not one-time. Once assigned, it does not change. This is a common misconception. What changes with each transaction is a different code, somewhat similar to the 3-digit card security code on the back, that is unique per purchase.
Last edited:
In the second iteration of Touch ID, the recognition got so fast people assume touching the button is same step. It actually unlocks so fast you can’t remove finger from home button before it thinks you want to open.
This was actually a complaint some had when it was rolled out.
If the signal unlock from secure enclave is the same how will app know how the phone validated the the person. Whole point of secure enclave is that no, none, ever, even Apple has access to secure enclave or how it operates. Only the “OK” signal goes to outside apps.
What would bank object to that instead of 1 in 50,000 false positives are oked ow it is 1 in 1,000,000.
A bank can’t go by the marketing materials. I’m am suggesting that they may need to independently verify the effectiveness of Face ID before allowing it.
This could mean that many security sensitive applications won’t support Face ID at launch.
Assuming the security performs well, it should be enabled shortly afterwards.
This is Apple's genius: they can take an existing concept - in this case facial recognition - already available on other products (Windows Hello) and not only create the popular belief that Apple invented it, but that any company which continues to sell products with that concept are copying.
I was delighted to see the enthusiastic expression of that sentiment on this thread. It's what makes this site so irresistible.
I was delighted to see the enthusiastic expression of that sentiment on this thread. It's what makes this site so irresistible.
So the apps would have to know what version of iPhone they are on. Figure they would know what version of software. Just not sure they are so specifically hardware savvy to know ID unlock signal comes from. 6, 6s, 7, 8, or X. Any app developers out there know?
Course all I have to go by is bank’s marketing materials. How secure they are, customer satisfaction, teller quantity, software security, etc. interesting world we live in.
Samsung Pay doesn't pass on your actual card number when using NFC or a simulated swipe.
It uses a one time token just like Apple Pay does.
I don’t believe there is a wide spread belief by forum participants that “facial recognition” was invented by Apple. I credit the forum members with more intelligence.
What I do see is that Apple developed, and engineered a robust facial recognition process using 3D scanning, in infrared, with 30,000 facial data points, employing secure enclave calculations and comparisons directly within your phone with no outside data base or communications. That, they surely invented and put together, over and above the earlier lack luster implementations attempted by other suppliers.
In a way, you are saying all other phones than the original Motorola cell phones are copies and not worthy of note. Because they all use the word phone.
Just like no credit should be given to the thousands of engineers that worked to turn the Model T Ford into a 200 mph Shelby GT. And Ford didn’t invent the automobile, Daimler did.
If an app cares to, it can access the biometric type being used. Can't change it, but it can read which one it is.
I think if there's a worry, it would be more about how easy it is to fool. And even then, so what. TouchId was very easy to fool if you had a good print and a few hours to make a copy. Making a 3D head would be even "harder" (unless you have a nice 3D scanner and printer).
In any case, I don't know why people think banks care that much about TouchId. They just want people using their credit cards, and TouchId made it more convenient.
iOS automatically uses FaceId in place of TouchId. So current TouchId apps can be unlocked with FaceId from the very beginning. For an app maker to later remove biometric authentication if the phone uses FaceId, would likely tick off a lot of users.
In short, apps do not have to add FaceId support; it's automatic. They can only remove it.
Basically, Apple has heavily stacked the deck in favor of FaceId adoption.
Last edited:
Imagine yourself sitting in an interrogation room and the cop is holding your phone and pointing it directly at your face. He doesn’t hand it to you so you can disable face recognition, he just says “look at the phone, now.”
You never are given the chance to push your two magic buttons. Your phone is now open.
How on earth could you make it to an interrogation room or have handed over your phone without having a chance to lock it? I can think of no situation where I wouldn't have a chance to disable face ID especially if I am concerned about it. This is a silly non issue concern.
Last edited:
Get in habit of pushing the two buttons as police approach, traffic stop, warrent. Hey you know what you need to hide, don’t wait till under interrogation.
Waiting to read alien abduction scenarios. Detractors are getting a bit desperate to dis face ID.
I can think of a lot of such scenarios, especially if your phone is in your pocket (or off your person) and the cops yell "Hands up now or we shoot!".
You seem to be assuming you'll have lots of warning. Not always the case.