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Suture

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Feb 22, 2007
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After about 3 days of playtime, I finished it FO4. It was good, so much stuff to do, but my console was freezing like once an hour so I was done with it. Still don't know why I had such crazy stability on a console. Even Vegas wasn't this bad for me. Regardless, I enjoyed the game. Going to take a little break before moving on to FO76 on my PC.
 
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maflynn

macrumors Haswell
May 3, 2009
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Still don't know why I had such crazy stability on a console.
Weird - as I mentioned on a PS4 it was very stable, I would play FO4 for hours on end, and never see a crash. The only time I see issues like that on the PC is due to loading mods which now I don't do too much.

This is one of those games that have such a richness that you generally want to go back and explore and do various side quests, there's so much to the game, but I get that if its crashing every 60 minutes that can be frustrating.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
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The Misty Mountains
After about 3 days of playtime, I finished it FO4. It was good, so much stuff to do, but my console was freezing like once an hour so I was done with it. Still don't know why I had such crazy stability on a console. Even Vegas wasn't this bad for me. Regardless, I enjoyed the game. Going to take a little break before moving on to FO76 on my PC.
Use any mods?
 

Suture

macrumors 65816
Feb 22, 2007
1,002
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Use any mods?
Nope, no mods. I know there's some really good ones out there, but I wasn't interested. I might go back to the game some other time to do some more side and faction stuff. May check out mods then.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
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May 5, 2008
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The Misty Mountains
Nope, no mods. I know there's some really good ones out there, but I wasn't interested. I might go back to the game some other time to do some more side and faction stuff. May check out mods then.
There are some good ones, like a greener commonwealth, self powered turrets and a relaxed grip on your weapon when you not aiming it. My favorite content mods are available through Nexus mods which provide alternate endings for the main quest, which I don’t think you can access with a consol, there, just Bethesda’s approved mod list. The Beautiful Body mod is great cause you can get your women out of their dirty underwear and into swimsuits if you have a hot tub, which I do. That’s a home mod, Sanctuary Hot Springs. :)
 

madeirabhoy

macrumors 68000
Oct 26, 2012
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in about the middle i think, nah not even that far, of a mammoth replaying of Fallout 4. played the game plus dlc years ago, but this one ive started from the beginnning with all official DLC plus all of the big fan made ones, so

project valkyrie
fusion city rising
outcasts and remnants
atomic radio and tales from the commonwealth
welcome to goodneighbour
Northern sorinfs
A diamond city story
América rising

and its really been a blast, mixing bits ive done before with so many new missions, i honestly think ill be playing for another month. only issues i guess of having so much dlc is i have reached a stage where ive got 150k in cash, all the junk ill ever need, and my guns are top spec, so theres now no real excitement in finding stuff.

also, had to tone it down a bit in terms of firepower. i long ago realised that power armour is over powered, but with so many 3rd party dlc most of which have a companion who is on top of your normal companion, that its easy to become a a 4 woman killing party.


if anyone hasnt tried them yet, honestly the fan built dlc are better than the bethesda ones.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
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May 5, 2008
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in about the middle i think, nah not even that far, of a mammoth replaying of Fallout 4. played the game plus dlc years ago, but this one ive started from the beginnning with all official DLC plus all of the big fan made ones, so

project valkyrie
fusion city rising
outcasts and remnants
atomic radio and tales from the commonwealth
welcome to goodneighbour
Northern sorinfs
A diamond city story
América rising

and its really been a blast, mixing bits ive done before with so many new missions, i honestly think ill be playing for another month. only issues i guess of having so much dlc is i have reached a stage where ive got 150k in cash, all the junk ill ever need, and my guns are top spec, so theres now no real excitement in finding stuff.

also, had to tone it down a bit in terms of firepower. i long ago realised that power armour is over powered, but with so many 3rd party dlc most of which have a companion who is on top of your normal companion, that its easy to become a a 4 woman killing party.


if anyone hasnt tried them yet, honestly the fan built dlc are better than the bethesda ones.
Project Valkyrie and Outcasts and Remnants are fantastic. I always disliked Power Amour, big and clunky, stomp, stomp, stomp. ;) Stealth assassin build is primo, in fact the F4 stealth mechanics are so powerful it can be argued that it is over powered too. :)
 

madeirabhoy

macrumors 68000
Oct 26, 2012
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Project Valkyrie and Outcasts and Remnants are fantastic. I always disliked Power Amour, big and clunky, stomp, stomp, stomp. ;) Stealth assassin build is primo, in fact the F4 stealth mechanics are so powerful it can be argued that it is over powered too. :)

yeah for me its both things, the annoying noises and camera movement of power armour, plus the huge increase in protection. bad enough playing as a lone player, but if you and your companion are both in power armour you are indestructable. even worse if you have all those DLC and have the extra characters as companions, at one stage i had 4 women companions, 5 of us in power armour could stop russia invading ukraine.

im just annoyed that in one of the DLC i picked up Murphy's underarmour which has a defence of 50, and i must have accidentally sold it and not noticed for ages and its too far back in my save games to go back and replay. this will annoy me immensely until i find something similar.
 
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Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
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The Misty Mountains
Answered here because I talk mostly about F4:

I have very little faith in Beschesda post Morrowind. They have butchered one of my favourite RPG francises — Fallout — and more generally, I hold them responsible for doing irreparable harm to the entire genre. Level scaling, poor gameplay wrapped around in eye catching cinematics, sterile story, generic interchangeable environments, removal of player agency — they have systematically destroyed and trampled down all that was good about the RPGs. Sure, they are popular and successful, but popular doesn't always mean good. So yeah, maybe Starfield is different, I don't know, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
Sorry you don't like Fallout at least what it's become. Although I understand as I have been there too, Fallout 4 for me was one of the best RPGs I've ever played. I would like to hear your description of Bethesda destroying and tearing down all that was good about RPGs, not to get into a fight but have a friendly discussion. :)

Yes, everyone has different expectations and demands, I have some critiques, but overall, the main plot knocked my socks off, and I enjoyed settlement building and management, even though I wanted to see more fluid verbal interaction with AI characters. Mods helped the game quite a bit imo. I was really irritated, that although advanced technology existed in the Commonwealth, that the devs decided to relegate dwellings building into piling up junk. Mods helped with that too.

I liked:
  • the setting
  • the main plot
  • sub plots- helping out Vigil, Curie, your companions, and others.
  • the factions and the ability to pursue a variety of faction related quests simo.
  • general combat
  • stealth mechanics
I critique:
  • Bethesda's limitations place upon the main plot as to how it is resolved (can be fixed with a mod).
  • Building settlements with junk.
  • The settlement system, while I enjoy it, is on the shallow side as far as any social complexities.

As role playing games become more advanced, I want to engage more. In F4, I loved it when companions cried on my shoulder, but other than helping them, and while helping them, your ability to communicated with them was practically none existent as any semblance of human relationship. I expect as time goes on, I would expect AI interactions to become more complex while acknowledging that they could over do it, where an RPG transforms into a social simulator and the reality would be plot lines would become more complex and more difficult to complete. Although tactical save files, would help save you if a conversation goes bad.

Although I give Cyberpunk 2077 a thumbs up (and know there is disagreement in this forum about that), I'll use it as an example where a city simulation is created that is visually so good, I'd expect to be able to stop someone on the street and start up a conversation with them, or just bum a cigarette. However, the veneer of the city can be quickly ripped off, if you try to engage anyone outside of a plot line. Then you become aware of how shallow it is. This is not to pick on CD Projekt Red, but to illustrate how difficult and technically out of reach anything approaching a full blown simulation is. So developers have to pick and choose, and it will be cool if and when that happens.
 
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leman

macrumors Core
Oct 14, 2008
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Sorry you don't like Fallout at least what it's become. Although I understand as I have been there too, Fallout 4 for me was one of the best RPGs I've ever played. I would like to hear your description of Bethesda destroying and tearing down all that was good about RPGs, not to get into a fight but have a friendly discussion. :)

So, since you asked, prepare for the incoming rant :D

I think RPGs are defined by two key genre features. First, the wonder of exploration (be it exploring an intricate dungeon, a complex story or simply taking in the landscape) and second, the character ownership — you are the one creating and determining them character personae. And that second feature goes much deeper than just character customisability or ability points. For example, games like STALKER or Deus Ex (the original 2000 one) are definitely RPGs in my book even though they don't have any skill system or levelling mechanics — the character ownership comes from how you play, which equipment you choose and in general how you approach solving the problems the game throws at you. The genius of Deus Ex for example was that you could either sneak your way though the vents to bypass the locked door, fight the guards to get the keycard, hack the computer terminal or just blow the door up with a rocker launcher. And the game would react to your choices in a non-trivial way, like you could choose to fight a key character or to run away at some focal points, which would determine how the game progresses. Mind, this was more than twenty years ago, and Deus Ex still remains an unsurpassed masterpiece in this category. STALKER's story on the other hand is much more linear, but you can customise your character in terms of equipment/playstyle; and where that game excels is the atmosphere and the joy/wonder of exploration (and also a little bit of fear, since you never know what kind of threat will surprise you when you enter that dark lab basement).

Now to Bethesda. My problem with them is that they have been taking the soul out of RPGs and replacing them with mindless mechanics — at least in my perception. Instead of exploring them environment, you are consuming content. Instead of creating a character you tweak some knobs. The original Fallout (1 and 2) was about exploring and navigating a huge, politically complex post-war world and encountering different attempts on rebuilding society. Bethesda's Fallout is literally some randomly spread out dumpsters littered with rubbish (why didn't anyone clean up in two hundred years?) and human carcasses (because it is not a raider base without some severed heads, right — where did they even get them? where does this supply of fresh human heads comes from, there are like twenty NPCs in the entire game?). Fallout: New Vegas was much better in that department, probably because it wasn't made by Bethesda. But that's one of Bethesda's features: they don't have a coherent artistic vision. They have great artists and great developers, but nobody who would put things together so that it fits and makes sense. It reminds me how in the Oblivion's announcement long time ago Howard spend minutes praising the artists for creating a beautiful 3D model of a salmon filet but the game itself was just a bunch of NPCs running around like maniacs and starting awkward conversations out of the blue because "RADIANT AI". So yeah, Bethesda has long dropped the ball when it comes to creating compelling, immersive worlds.

Another design decision that made it even worse was the automatic level scaling. Have to keep the players entertained and challenged, right? Unfortunately, instead of a challenge (because these games are easy as hell), it only creates absurdity, where every lice-ridden raider suddenly wears heavy armour and wields high-end weapons (since when lowly bandits have access to Enclave tech?) and every grace-forsaken dump is sprawling with super mutants — which are supposed to be these extremely rare, enigmatic generically engineered creatures. The point of an RPG is that you are not supposed to know what waits for you around the corner and whether your weapons and tactics will be enough to deal with it. In Bethesda games all this tension is gone — it's going to be just another plasma rifle wielding super mutant which you will dispatch in one shot using the brain-dead VATS.

And finally, let's talk about character and player actions. In the original Fallout (a 1997 game!), you character attributes actually meant something. Have a low intelligence score and your character won't be able to talk properly and NPCs will treat them as a moron they are. Have a high strength and you will be open that jammed door. Have a high charisma and you will have a unique option of seducing the mafia bosses son/daughter and gain access to their secret stash. In a similar wein, insult that mafia boss in a dialogue and his henchmen will open fire on you. Sure, Fallout 4 also has some skill checks, but they are very rare and primitive for what used to define the genre. And sure, you can choose which faction to side with, but none of these choices feel impactful, it's just something you have to do resp. a thing you click on. There is no weight behind any of these things, it feels mechanical and arbitrary.

So yeah, that's how I feel about Bethesda games and why I think they have taken the soul out of the RGP genre.

This is not to pick on CD Projekt Red, but to illustrate how difficult and technically out of reach anything approaching a full blown simulation is. So developers have to pick and choose, and it will be cool if and when that happens.

Sure, it's difficult, exceedingly so, but I don't think that Cyberpunk's problems come from difficulty. I see it more as the same problem that plagues modern Hollywood — the decision power is wielded not by the creatives but by hedge fund managers. Instead of following an artistic vision to deliver a holistic experience one focuses on making safe choices and return on investment. Cyberpunk seems like a typical victim of "how can we make a game more successful? — Ah, GTA is popular, so let's add cars. — Also Borderlands is cool, so let's add a bit of that. — Also, let's have a heroic story and some eastern mumbo-jumbo, people love that. — Also, it's an RPG, so let's give it an overcomplicated skill system that is rendered entirely obsolete and meaningless by the fact that your weapons have levels and ultimately become useless". That kind of stuff.

And don't get me wrong, there is nothing bad about making safe choices or wanting your game to make money. Strong economic fundamentals are of utmost importance, and every studio needs a sane business person to keep crazy creatives in check. But you cannot create art (and yes, games are art, at least from where I stand) based solely on the financial considerations. Because then you end up with one these engineered projects that just combines some market research to leach money from a target group — often commercially successful, but with no real value. And besides, it is clear that strong and consistent artistic vision can yield sustained success. This is illustrated by the phenomenon of Pixar — where creatives are in charge — which allows them to make truly beautiful, innovative projects. Or, if you want an example in the gaming world — FromSoftware, who make extremely punished games that should be frustrating and hated, but instead are loved and admired, because of how well executed they are. Execution is about belief. You can't make something great if your team does not believe in it. And nobody can believe in a game that just hacks together some "popular stuff". That's simply not fun to work on.
 
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garnerx

macrumors 6502a
Nov 9, 2012
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For example, games like STALKER or Deus Ex (the original 2000 one) are definitely RPGs in my book even though they don't have any skill system or levelling mechanics — the character ownership comes from how you play, which equipment you choose and in general how you approach solving the problems the game throws at you. The genius of Deus Ex for example was that you could either sneak your way though the vents to bypass the locked door, fight the guards to get the keycard, hack the computer terminal or just blow the door up with a rocker launcher. And the game would react to your choices in a non-trivial way, like you could choose to fight a key character or to run away at some focal points, which would determine how the game progresses.
Sounds similar to the Metal Gear Solid games, but I wouldn't consider those to be RPGs. Many people class the Zelda games as RPGs, in which case why not Castlevania and Metroid?

I didn't think Fallout 4 was particularly amazing, but Fallout 3 - now that was a compelling and immersive world. I loved everything about it. New Vegas, on the other hand, left me cold. I guess it's all open to interpretation and personal preference.
 
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leman

macrumors Core
Oct 14, 2008
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Sounds similar to the Metal Gear Solid games, but I wouldn't consider those to be RPGs.

I never play Metal Gear Solid, so I cant'r really comment, but from what I understand that series heavily emphasises stealth-focused gameplay, so it's probably not broad enough to be an RGP? But then again, genre definitions are fuzzy and that's good this way.

I didn't think Fallout 4 was particularly amazing, but Fallout 3 - now that was a compelling and immersive world. I loved everything about it. New Vegas, on the other hand, left me cold. I guess it's all open to interpretation and personal preference.

Fallout 3 was a disappointed for me for the reasons I mentioned above. I did finish it, even if it left me a bit hollow. Fallout 4 I tried but didn't get far.

I didn't much like New Vegas either, while the execution was much closer to the spirit of the original series, I cound't really get behind the story. And in general, I consider Obsidian to be a bit of a hit and miss. I loved Knights of The Old Republic II, didn't much care for Pillars of Eternity gameplay-wise (although the story was nice) and was thoroughly disappointed by the Outer Worlds.

Right now the only maker of "classical" RPGs I have hopes for is Larian. Although one of the best RPGs I have ever played will be Elden Ring, that game is a fantastic piece of art and I love everything about it.
 
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madeirabhoy

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Oct 26, 2012
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Sounds similar to the Metal Gear Solid games, but I wouldn't consider those to be RPGs. Many people class the Zelda games as RPGs, in which case why not Castlevania and Metroid?

I didn't think Fallout 4 was particularly amazing, but Fallout 3 - now that was a compelling and immersive world. I loved everything about it. New Vegas, on the other hand, left me cold. I guess it's all open to interpretation and personal preference.

I agree. I loved F3,FNV and F4. always wanted Skyrim and then couldnt get into it, not into swords and magic when you can have guns and modern dialogue.

havent played F3 since I completed it, but played a lot of F4 and FNV due to the various fan dlc that came out, and better than most modern games.
 

garnerx

macrumors 6502a
Nov 9, 2012
623
382
I never play Metal Gear Solid, so I cant'r really comment, but from what I understand that series heavily emphasises stealth-focused gameplay, so it's probably not broad enough to be an RGP? But then again, genre definitions are fuzzy and that's good this way.
I don’t think it’s an RPG either, but it’s a series that has similar qualities in terms of what you said made Deus Ex an RPG - the many ways of approaching a problem, and the way your actions have an effect later on.

Obviously you can choose to fight and you’ll be chased, or try to avoid combat, but there are also some classic examples where you have to think outside the box.

In MGS 1 there’s a psychic boss who can read your controller inputs, and hence is difficult to hit. But if you unplug the controller and switch to the player two port, he’s completely powerless.

MGS 3 has a boss who’s a deadly sniper but is also 100 years old, so you can beat him by saving the game and waiting a week before playing again (or just advance the internal clock) and he’ll have died of old age.

They’re masterpieces of game design, full of stuff like that, but I wouldn’t class them as RPGs. For me an RPG at least needs to have numbers coming out of enemies when you hit them :)
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
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The Misty Mountains
So, since you asked, prepare for the incoming rant :D

I think RPGs are defined by two key genre features. First, the wonder of exploration (be it exploring an intricate dungeon, a complex story or simply taking in the landscape) and second, the character ownership — you are the one creating and determining them character personae. And that second feature goes much deeper than just character customisability or ability points. For example, games like STALKER or Deus Ex (the original 2000 one) are definitely RPGs in my book even though they don't have any skill system or levelling mechanics — the character ownership comes from how you play, which equipment you choose and in general how you approach solving the problems the game throws at you. The genius of Deus Ex for example was that you could either sneak your way though the vents to bypass the locked door, fight the guards to get the keycard, hack the computer terminal or just blow the door up with a rocker launcher. And the game would react to your choices in a non-trivial way, like you could choose to fight a key character or to run away at some focal points, which would determine how the game progresses. Mind, this was more than twenty years ago, and Deus Ex still remains an unsurpassed masterpiece in this category. STALKER's story on the other hand is much more linear, but you can customise your character in terms of equipment/playstyle; and where that game excels is the atmosphere and the joy/wonder of exploration (and also a little bit of fear, since you never know what kind of threat will surprise you when you enter that dark lab basement).

Now to Bethesda. My problem with them is that they have been taking the soul out of RPGs and replacing them with mindless mechanics — at least in my perception. Instead of exploring them environment, you are consuming content. Instead of creating a character you tweak some knobs. The original Fallout (1 and 2) was about exploring and navigating a huge, politically complex post-war world and encountering different attempts on rebuilding society. Bethesda's Fallout is literally some randomly spread out dumpsters littered with rubbish (why didn't anyone clean up in two hundred years?) and human carcasses (because it is not a raider base without some severed heads, right — where did they even get them? where does this supply of fresh human heads comes from, there are like twenty NPCs in the entire game?). Fallout: New Vegas was much better in that department, probably because it wasn't made by Bethesda. But that's one of Bethesda's features: they don't have a coherent artistic vision. They have great artists and great developers, but nobody who would put things together so that it fits and makes sense. It reminds me how in the Oblivion's announcement long time ago Howard spend minutes praising the artists for creating a beautiful 3D model of a salmon filet but the game itself was just a bunch of NPCs running around like maniacs and starting awkward conversations out of the blue because "RADIANT AI". So yeah, Bethesda has long dropped the ball when it comes to creating compelling, immersive worlds.

Another design decision that made it even worse was the automatic level scaling. Have to keep the players entertained and challenged, right? Unfortunately, instead of a challenge (because these games are easy as hell), it only creates absurdity, where every lice-ridden raider suddenly wears heavy armour and wields high-end weapons (since when lowly bandits have access to Enclave tech?) and every grace-forsaken dump is sprawling with super mutants — which are supposed to be these extremely rare, enigmatic generically engineered creatures. The point of an RPG is that you are not supposed to know what waits for you around the corner and whether your weapons and tactics will be enough to deal with it. In Bethesda games all this tension is gone — it's going to be just another plasma rifle wielding super mutant which you will dispatch in one shot using the brain-dead VATS.

And finally, let's talk about character and player actions. In the original Fallout (a 1997 game!), you character attributes actually meant something. Have a low intelligence score and your character won't be able to talk properly and NPCs will treat them as a moron they are. Have a high strength and you will be open that jammed door. Have a high charisma and you will have a unique option of seducing the mafia bosses son/daughter and gain access to their secret stash. In a similar wein, insult that mafia boss in a dialogue and his henchmen will open fire on you. Sure, Fallout 4 also has some skill checks, but they are very rare and primitive for what used to define the genre. And sure, you can choose which faction to side with, but none of these choices feel impactful, it's just something you have to do resp. a thing you click on. There is no weight behind any of these things, it feels mechanical and arbitrary.

So yeah, that's how I feel about Bethesda games and why I think they have taken the soul out of the RGP genre.



Sure, it's difficult, exceedingly so, but I don't think that Cyberpunk's problems come from difficulty. I see it more as the same problem that plagues modern Hollywood — the decision power is wielded not by the creatives but by hedge fund managers. Instead of following an artistic vision to deliver a holistic experience one focuses on making safe choices and return on investment. Cyberpunk seems like a typical victim of "how can we make a game more successful? — Ah, GTA is popular, so let's add cars. — Also Borderlands is cool, so let's add a bit of that. — Also, let's have a heroic story and some eastern mumbo-jumbo, people love that. — Also, it's an RPG, so let's give it an overcomplicated skill system that is rendered entirely obsolete and meaningless by the fact that your weapons have levels and ultimately become useless". That kind of stuff.

And don't get me wrong, there is nothing bad about making safe choices or wanting your game to make money. Strong economic fundamentals are of utmost importance, and every studio needs a sane business person to keep crazy creatives in check. But you cannot create art (and yes, games are art, at least from where I stand) based solely on the financial considerations. Because then you end up with one these engineered projects that just combines some market research to leach money from a target group — often commercially successful, but with no real value. And besides, it is clear that strong and consistent artistic vision can yield sustained success. This is illustrated by the phenomenon of Pixar — where creatives are in charge — which allows them to make truly beautiful, innovative projects. Or, if you want an example in the gaming world — FromSoftware, who make extremely punished games that should be frustrating and hated, but instead are loved and admired, because of how well executed they are. Execution is about belief. You can't make something great if your team does not believe in it. And nobody can believe in a game that just hacks together some "popular stuff". That's simply not fun to work on.
I can’t disagree with a thing you said, and with valid serious critiques-
  • that there are significant inconsistencies in technology, and in the state of the environment 200 years after the bombs fell, wouldn’t most metal junk be rust by now? If electricity and the technology equivalent to power saws exist in the Commonwealth, why would most settlements be relying on junk to build dwellings?
  • and that some tradional RPG elements have been minimized or possibly nerfed to focus on functional combat skills as the source of character development (such as computer hacking skills, or a crazy overpowered stealth element vs a brute power armor build, not to mention how easy it seems to be to kill power armor equipped characters),
yet there were social/intelligence/physical skills that equate to abilities in the game, plus perks:

64894653-3DE4-4A54-9F4D-C9DF0AD32961.jpeg

I think you are saying these skills and consequences for ignoring them have been nerfed, along with the lack of consequences aspect of decisions, and I’m thinking my RPG standards are lower or less demanding than yours, or possibly I was assimilated with the the overall environment, and social freedom because as the game turned out, I found the F4 environment, the narrative, the faction quest lines, the companion mechanics, in many ways to be simplistic, but was able to ignore them to enjoy them and be sucked into this game, especially regarding. things like:

  • companions who did not care if they were dumped for someone new. I was concerned about this until I learned that the group of companions in this game are the most devoted, in love and understanding people on the face of the earth, who, if you leave them behind patiently wait for you to return to them. :)
  • and exceedingly understanding factions who do not care if you were a free agent, someone who could be with all factions, at least till near the end and not feel any pushback, such as assassination for being a traitor (from a faction perspective),
that these elements of the game might be frustrating or infuriating to anyone who has high RPG standards. Yet inexplicably I was drawn in, I could overlook the simplistic, unreal aspects of the narrative, as long as I could build settlements were there were minimal complaints such as not enough food or beds, and ignoring I was basically functioning as God.

These settlers seemed to lack brains, unable to accomplish anything without me doing it for them. Very shallow, simplistic, superficial and unrealistic. It would have been better that when created, settlements would grow on their own, but that building could be accelerated by providing supplies or setting up trade routes.

No it’s not realistic, and at this point I’m wondering how I cound enjoy such a game ;), but it was like I was able to enjoy the game framework, main and other quest narratives. but turn a blind eye to it’s shortcomings. 🤔
 

Huntn

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The Misty Mountains
I agree. I loved F3,FNV and F4. always wanted Skyrim and then couldnt get into it, not into swords and magic when you can have guns and modern dialogue.

havent played F3 since I completed it, but played a lot of F4 and FNV due to the various fan dlc that came out, and better than most modern games.
I loved the game and magic system in Oblivion, that they nerfed in Skyrim, but still I could complete the game and enjoyed it.
 
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Huntn

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yeah for me its both things, the annoying noises and camera movement of power armour, plus the huge increase in protection. bad enough playing as a lone player, but if you and your companion are both in power armour you are indestructable. even worse if you have all those DLC and have the extra characters as companions, at one stage i had 4 women companions, 5 of us in power armour could stop russia invading ukraine.

im just annoyed that in one of the DLC i picked up Murphy's underarmour which has a defence of 50, and i must have accidentally sold it and not noticed for ages and its too far back in my save games to go back and replay. this will annoy me immensely until i find something similar.
Ref: Murthy’s armor. I’m trying to remember if this is the coat you pick up from a vault in a bank, downtown Boston or was that from some other DLC? 🤔
 

madeirabhoy

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Oct 26, 2012
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558
Ref: Murthy’s armor. I’m trying to remember if this is the coat you pick up from a vault in a bank, downtown Boston or was that from some other DLC? 🤔


oh god, i cant remember, it was so long ago. i might not even have put the right name.
 
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panjandrum

macrumors 6502a
Sep 22, 2009
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881
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I'm looking forward to the remaster of Fallout 4, I heard there may include some creation club assets as well.

It's going to have a VERY hard time competing with the fantastic modding community built around Bethesda's titles (a community they clearly rely on to fix their releases.) I'm currently enjoying a modded FO4VR experience, which has been an extremely difficult build due to the title being released when about 1/2 way done. Getting anything resembling a good experience has me at right around 75 mods at this time.
I will say, that if Ralf of vorpX gets the motion-controls really nailed-down (you can use the current beta version of vorpX to add custom gestures to games), then a good install of FO4 (or the remaster if it turns out to actually be well-supported and run well) run though vorpX will probably provide a vastly better experience than FO4VR itself. It's sad when the games you release have to be relentlessly repaired by the gaming community.
 

Huntn

macrumors Core
Original poster
May 5, 2008
23,484
26,601
The Misty Mountains
oh god, i cant remember, it was so long ago. i might not even have put the right name.
Remembering names of stuff and details, I‘m kind of there too. If we are talking about the Murthy’s Law (Mod) I remember he wore a good looking coat, I want to say 50ish armor, and there was a spare laying around his place of business, and then there was Maxum Elder’s coat which was very distinctive (Mod) but I remember a full length Veteran “something” Ranger? coat that was like 75 armor, that I found in a bank vault, and I can’t remember what mod if any, it was associated with. 🤔
I'm looking forward to the remaster of Fallout 4, I heard there may include some creation club assets as well.

i wonder how much they will try to charge for this, I’ll guess $30. As far as Creation Club, I used a mix of that and Nexus Mods. Bethesda did not offer the good content mods as I recall. I listed a bunch of mods back on page 2 of this thread, content wise, project valkyrie, and outcasts and remnants were great mods because they let you fix the ending if you want what I would describe as a more logical solution to the Institute. I thought that Sim Settlements was a fantastic idea, but the problem appeared to be that a lot of/excessive scripting associated with mods could break the game. My last play though I really struggled near the end with the game refusing to load when fast traveling.
It's going to have a VERY hard time competing with the fantastic modding community built around Bethesda's titles (a community they clearly rely on to fix their releases.) I'm currently enjoying a modded FO4VR experience, which has been an extremely difficult build due to the title being released when about 1/2 way done. Getting anything resembling a good experience has me at right around 75 mods at this time.
I will say, that if Ralf of vorpX gets the motion-controls really nailed-down (you can use the current beta version of vorpX to add custom gestures to games), then a good install of FO4 (or the remaster if it turns out to actually be well-supported and run well) run though vorpX will probably provide a vastly better experience than FO4VR itself. It's sad when the games you release have to be relentlessly repaired by the gaming community.
I probably used about 20-30 mods, including things like A Greener Commonwealth, and Powered Turrets. I eventually figured out that walls around your settlements did not make that much difference, but I still built them, because this is what would have been done, and gave myself the material to build them. I decided how much work I wanted to do, played the game on normal and flat out cheated using a modded pistol, and sniper rifle, and I gave myself abundant ammo. The sniper rifle would kill a Death Claw in 2 shots and just about everything else with 1 shot. This was my version of cruising, and it allowed me to enjoy the story more, and help out settlements without my definition of excessive grind. :) Everything else I scrounged for.

The question is, with a remastered game, I would not be surprised if all those mods broke.

Having to do with grind- I’m currently playing Dragon’s Dogma (while cursing it’s save system and propensity to crash during save’s), but I am thankful I always have plenty of arrows because the game does not make you craft them, at least not the basic arrows. I have found packages of special arrows but have not tried them to see if they are expendible. My guess is yes they are.
 
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panjandrum

macrumors 6502a
Sep 22, 2009
709
881
United States
They've done this before, they released a texture pack/image update for fallout 4 before for free.

Its really nice that they offer a free update to such an old (but fun game)

Yes, but the texture pack they released was absolutely massive and made much less difference to the actual in-game visuals than it should have because it was all still too soft and squishy-focused. They would have had to up the 'crispness' of the textures, not just the resolution, to have made much of a difference (especially since the title relies on TAA for anti-aliasing, which is an absurdly soft AA method). A good 2k (or even lower) texture pack like Vivid Landscapes actually looks far better than Bethesda's "4k" DLC. Sure, you if you walk right up to a wall and stare at the texture from 1" away you can tell that the Vivid Landscapes is technically 'lower resolution' than the Bethesda texture, but as soon as you are at a normal viewing distance the Vivid Landscapes textures look *vastly* better and more detailed. Some real incompetence there on Bethesda's part. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoy the Fallout titles, but it's annoying AF that we have to fix them so thoroughly before they really shine. I will stump once again for FO3 and FNV through vorpX - if you have an HMD those are some of the best 'vr' experience to be had.
 
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