Feb 28th Products: Intel Mac mini and iPod Hi-Fi?

[uae]

DVR is dead. Apple will never make a DVR as it competes with the iTunes Music Store.

Video on demand is the future.

 

[tom_s]

Unless Apple has fired Jonathan Ives I'd say this pic is a concept done by 2ndEdison..

Also, Apple wouldn't use a 1st gen. iPod in their photos (or is it 2nd?).

 

[thejadedmonkey]

Also, Apple wouldn't use a 1st gen. iPod in their photos (or is it 2nd?).

It could be either, as there is no physical difference on the front that you would be able to see.

I'm thinking some sort of wireless reciever for iTunes would be amazing. Right now I have a server in my basement for 2 reasons. The first is to host a website, but the 2nd is to power the 5.1 surround system. If Apple could make some sort of boom box that could power my speakers, I could host my site on my mini, and finally sell this PoS computer in my basement.

 

[BritinNC]

This is sorta what I've been talking about

If you haven't seen the Microsoft Origami video at http://www.d-kitchen.com/main.html (enter, Work, Brand Theatre, Microsoft Origami, play: origami), it's worth having a look to see how useful and hip a wireless tablet/entertainment/media device could be.

If Apple came out with one Tuesday (bit of a timing coincidence that Microsoft is supposed to be announcing theirs on Thursday), it would be a tablet, it would be a new kind of iPod, it would be a media center, and it would certainly be fun. So everyone could be right.

And it would almost certainly be better than Microsoft's...

...but obviously much better done than this. The form factor is about right but I would expect it to be a little smaller and thinner and generally better looking. It will need some space on the sides for some key buttons and holding but not as much as this device shows.

Just for the record (and I realize I'm not going to make any friends here), I don't think we'll see a video iPod like the 'fake' or (dare I say it) a Mac mini DVR. With respect to the Video iPod, I have a 5G and I find I don't use it for watching video anymore than Steve thought I would. It's uncomfortable to hold for long periods and doesn't prop up easily on a desk or whatever. I still maintain the video iPod will appear in the form factor like the thing above since it is easier to hold for long period and can easily be propped up.

On the DVR side, I guess I just don't get it. I have had a DVR for a number of years now and I don't think I'd spend good money on a computer and stick it in Hi-Fi closet. Also, what more can you do with DVR? My Time Warner one does what it needs to do to be honest (at $6.95 per month), the only thing I'm missing is the ability to take the video somewhere (and the Mac Mini wouldn't do that for me).

So that brings me back to the MacPod. A Mac companion product, in addition to a video Airport Express, would be a video iPod, could have DVR functionality that is portable (and therefore unlike anything else out there), would have some PDA functions to tie into the event picture, would be wireless to allow me to email and iChat anywhere (including a built in iSight of course), and a bonus at work where I could use it for presentations and note taking. Not a full computer, just a companion to my Mac and iPod, retail under $1000.

Interesting point about MS announcing Origami on Thursday. Makes me think that SJ will do to Bill what he did to Motorola. Let's face it the guy loves to upstage people, and all for the benefit of us!

Out on a limb, but I'm sticking with the MacPod for Tuesday!

 

[d.f]

but

It could never be the quality of a CD with it encoded, for it to be CD quality it would have to be AIFF which currently has not DMR. Let alone probably 95% of humans cant even tell the difference any way....

you will tell the difference if this 'boombox' is designed to be used with decent Hi Fi speakers.

 

[sunfast]

Unless Apple has fired Jonathan Ives I'd say this pic is a concept done by 2ndEdison..

[edit] more on this product.. The picture shows " nxt speaker technology".This technology came out in 2001 and has been updated and is now called Distributed Mode Loudspeaker (DML) technology now commonly referred to as ‘flat panel’ loudspeakers. see http://www.nxtsound.com/index.php?id=372

The above product is an OLD concept from 2001.
[/edit]

The fact it's an old iPod (1st or 2nd gen) in the pic confirms this too

 

[Evan_11]

Mac Media Center

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1930237,00.asp

I'm wanting Apple to release something like this. Basically a screenless iMac on it's back. They wouldn't even have to do much redesign on the mobo as the overall dimensions on the existing iMac are roughly the same as as a typical stereo component.

With this type of design they can incorporate all of the power of the Core duo iMacs without sacrificing performance. With the current mini enclosure, while it's very cool and compact you're severely limiting performance.

Cost would be around $1,000 so that still leaves room for the existing mini. That's fine. I don't think by adding a new product such as a Mac Media Center would dillute sales.

Also I wanted to add that I don't think it's out of the question to see an Apple Plasma with a built-in Mac. Walk into Best Buy and what's at the heart of the store? The TV department. If Apple had a 42" iMac "on steroids" that looked all slick like one of their cinema displays but with Front Row as a GUI I think it would really sell. Apple has connections to get deals too on Plasma displays I'm sure just like they do on Flash memory.

 

[haleyvan]

First Post..

I still think Apple will release a number of new things having to do with iPod and iTunes, but I also think that whatever they release that's entertainment-based, they should also release the new MacBooks. First, the new MacBooks are projected to be released with a 13" widescreen, widescreens are primarily made/used for better visuals with feature films (iTunes update). Also, the new MacBooks should have Front Row, "the entertainment capital of your world" as Apple describes it. Whatever "fun" new products are released on Tuesday I predict will most likely be accompanied with the new MacBooks, to execute the fun new products. It seems the smartest way to go since the iBooks are the "consumer" notebook. Right? As far as the iCal icon...I agree with a previous post that mentions it might just refer to a date change - MacBooks earlier than expected. It better happen...ever since Apple announced the switch to Intel, I've been planning on ordering the new iBook/MacBook immediately upon its release.

 

[ezekielrage_99]

Like all the rumors out at the moment, I would love to see Apple release them however I don't think all of them are realistic or feasible for Apple to release over the next few months.

 

[dongmin]

straight from Apple Design Labs (not!)

http://homepage.mac.com/dshim/PhotoAlbum8.html



Specs:

-60GB HDD
-wireless syncing
-wireless streaming via AirTunes
-rechargeable LiPo battery
-3.5" color display
-full photo and video features
-stereo-out, video-out, ethernet

 

[yoshi31]

yeah i can't help but keep thinking that to really have a "media center" of any kind it's gonna need some substantial (and fast) storage, some pretty serious video hardware, and decent amount of processing power. all these things are exactly what the mini is NOT. i can't see Apple beefing up the mini enough to support all this stuff and still keep it affordable by mini standards. media center maybe, but i don't think it will be called the "mini".

I agree. It's not going to be the "mini". But what about this: the MediaCenter is going to be called the "BoomBox" - they're one and the same. And it is going to have the "substantial (and fast) storage, some pretty serious video hardware, and decent amount of processing power" needed. Just a thought...

 

[demallien]

When listening on a high-end stereo, most people will be able to notice the difference.

The point being of course that the vast majority of us DO NOT listen on a high-end stereo.. For true audiophiles, CDs are still the way to go. But please, don't think Apple is going to make those like me suffer downloads that take 10 times as long so that the few that do use high-end equipment can fell warm and fuzzy. Ain't gonna happen. Thankfully.

A little off-topic, but I find all the talk about poor sound-quality / video resolution from iTMS products quite amusing. I use both a lot (iTMS video is the only TV that I have in my home), and I find the quality the equal of other sources that I have used in the past....

 

[ScottB]

Maybe there the same thing? One super product? they sound it.

Edit: Sorry if it's already been mentioned.

 

[sunfast]

the MediaCenter is going to be called the "BoomBox"

I really hope apple don't call anything the "BoomBox". It sounds awful!

 

[ScottB]

I really hope apple don't call anything the "BoomBox". It sounds awful!

Agreed. It'll probably start with a undercase 'i' and have a snazzy name that related to the iPod afterward. But I think the whole 'i' thing is a but old now.

 

[ScottB]

Whatever "fun" new products are released on Tuesday I predict will most likely be accompanied with the new MacBooks, to execute the fun new products.

I can wish, whatever they do release will probably be the exact opposite of what I thought it was going to be.

 

[BoyBach]

For what it's worth...

I think that Tuesday will begin with a billion downloads news and then a new version of iTunes with a massively expanded TV show/movies content (Disney/Pixar full movies and short cartoons?) The boombox?

Even better would be TV shows and movies available in the UK - hey I might even buy a new iPod then!!

Almost forgot...

One more thing!

 

[johan_tanying]

The Intel Mini! Or?

(I have not read all the posts in this thread - sorry if it is mentioned before)

The Intel Mini - sorry, the imini - has been on the market since Christmas in China. But it is not manufactured by Apple and is not running OSX... And it is not cheap.

I have posted on the Swedish forum 99mac, in this thread. They have several models with both Pentium M and Celeron M (USD 1250-1500) and with the Win Media Center OS. Plenty of billboard advertising in Beijing in January.

Here is one picture, more in the above mentioned forum thread.

 

[milo]

why would apple be making their own if it already exists?

Why would apple make their own mp3 player if they already exist? Why would they make their own audio player app if they already exist? Why would...

If Apple wants the Mini to be a DVR, then it would have to have a huge 3.5" hard disk. That is because to use your T.V. as a computer monitor, it better be High Definition.

For those planning to use a TV as a computer monitor, that's exactly what front row is for. If they go that route, I'd expect a TV rez version of the finder as well.

At this point it looks like the intel mini is a go. But no confirmation of DVR stuff, it may just be a core solo version with frontrow with no other specs changed. Appleinsider has been most reliable lately, and they are very confident about intel mini, but make ZERO mention of DVR in their article.

Will this have the DVR?
Will this have solo or duo (or some in each model...or something else)?

Those are pretty much the questions I'm interested in right now. Sadly, I suspect we'll only get Front Row on a slow single core chip, not much beyond that.

The smartest choice for apple is probably to make the DVR version of the mini as cheap as possible. Give it a codec chip to encode/decode video (h.264 most likely), and it won't need a fast processor, might as well give it something cheap and slow since many people will only do basic stuff on it.

Or maybe even better: instead of making a mac with tivo features, just make a DVR box that runs via airport express, and needs another mac in the house to handle storage and some processing. Imagine one of the eyeTV boxes combined with an airport express. The airTV has just a tuner, a codec chip for encode/decode, and input/output for audio/video, apple remote, wired ethernet and airport. It works almost as a dumb terminal, simply streaming data to and from the "server" computer elsewhere in the house. Onscreen interface is simply Frontrow (with simple DVR menus), run via the server computer in a way similar to timbuktu or the apple remote app. The DVR can be pretty cheap, and it doesn't need to be a computer anyway. Any mac elsewhere in the house can provide processing power, internet connectivity and hard drive space.

Maybe this is the "boombox"?


Even though we "know" the intel mini will be announced, we still know practically nothing since depending on how they configure it, it could be a completely different machine.

 

[-hh]

Am I missing critical details here? For all those who say a macmini is way too underpowered for DVR and would have to be much more expensive to function properly, the current 80 gb TiVo costs $220 (without the discount, apparently you can get it for 60 bucks now). How is a full-functioning mac-mini not powerful enough to do what a $200 machine has been doing for years?

Because you're not making a correct comparison.

The Mac is useful without a service contract, but a service contract is required to make the TiVO useful.

For TiVO, you're in for at least $156 ($13 per month with a one year commitment required) or their $299 "lifetime" fee in addition to the "sticker price" of the product, so a "$200 machine" is really a $356 - $499 machine.

High-Def may be an issue but its certainly not a large enough deterrant from such a large market space. I feel this rumor is definitely plausible.

Glad you mentioned this, as what I've not seen mentioned in skimming this thread is any meaningful discussion on the following:

NTSC IS ON ITS WAY OUT. HIGH DEFINITION TV (ATSC) IS HERE.

So for anyone who's looking at getting into the television market, the transition from HDTV to ATSC (digital television) is a huge technology transition that's occurring *right now*.

As such, this is the wrong time to be introducing a new product that is NTSC, because it is a technology that will be 100% obsolete in 35 months from right now.

On February 8th, President Bush signed Congressional legislation that set a hard deadline for transitioning to digital television ("DTV") legislation when the House on February 1 passed budget reconciliation legislation that includes provisions requiring TV broadcasters to relinquish their analog spectrum by February 17, 2009.

This legislation also provides up to $1.5 billion to assist consumers in purchasing DTV converter boxes that will allow their analog TV sets to receive digital signals after the transition is completed.

Now consider how many people out there have standard (NTSC) television sets, which over the next 18 months are going to start to really, really seriously think about getting an "HD Box" (ATSC receiver) to avoid the cost of replacing their TV's.

Note that while they might buy a new Plasma for the Den, all legacy TV's have to have a converter box, or else they'll head to the landfill.

This is known as a "must buy".

FWIW, I've looked at getting an ATSC receiver box for a legacy TV. Do you have any idea how EXPENSIVE these things are today? The cheap ones are roughly $200 each. For example, Amazon.com has the "HUMAX Digital ATSC TV Tuner for HDTV Reception" for $204, which isn't the latest generation chipset.

Therefore:

Think "next generation High-Definition TiVO with ATSC Receiver built in"

Think $1.5B federal hardware subsidies.

Think Apple looking for their next Killer product.


YMMV, but given the adoption rate curve of the iPod to use as a business model, *right now* is the right time to introduct a convergence device of an ATSC receiver with High Definition TV "TiVO" recording capabilities.

It doesn't even have to perform the "personal computer" role in the conventional scheme of things, but between iTunes music and Front Row & video teleconferencing, it probably would be.

And combined with an upgrade to .MAC to include TiVO-like programming, you then have your monthly revenue stream to help limit hardware costs above and beyond however much the Fed's kick in. The business opportunity here is very, very interesting ... and compelling to bust open the marketplace.


-hh

 

[Damek]

instead of making a mac with tivo features, just make a DVR box that runs via airport express, and needs another mac in the house to handle storage and some processing. Imagine one of the eyeTV boxes combined with an airport express. The airTV has just a tuner, a codec chip for encode/decode, and input/output for audio/video, apple remote, wired ethernet and airport. It works almost as a dumb terminal, simply streaming data to and from the "server" computer elsewhere in the house. Onscreen interface is simply Frontrow (with simple DVR menus), run via the server computer in a way similar to timbuktu or the apple remote app. The DVR can be pretty cheap, and it doesn't need to be a computer anyway. Any mac elsewhere in the house can provide processing power, internet connectivity and hard drive space.

Maybe this is the "boombox"?

See, I don't get this. Why have yet one more device to attach to a TV that duplicates some of the functions of a TV? OK, if it's not a real DVR, then the "server" elsewhere is duplicating the TV functions. Or rather, the "server" is duplicating your Cable TV functions, or adding DVR to the Cable TV functions...

The way I see it, I just want one box (dream Mac mini) with two TV tuners, SuperDrive & big Hard Drive in it, connected to a big wide screen. Said box will function as my server, cable box, DVR, DVD player, music player, game machine, etc.

What screws this up is the cable company's insistence on scrambling most of the cable channels, so you need a descrambling box to connect to the dream mini, which messes up the whole "two TV tuners" thing, the point of which is to be able to watch one channel whilst recording another. Since you need a separate cable box to access and tun cable channels, you can only watch/record whatever it's tuned to, so you may as well off-load the DVR functionality to the cable box as well. Then the only thing I'd want the dream Mac mini to do is to be able to receive and record video from the cable box, which one TV tuner could accomplish I guess, so a tuner-less Mac mini coupled with an EyeTV is sufficient.

So the existing mini is sufficient, until all TV channels are unscrambled and then I can demand Apple put TV tuners into the mini so I only need one box instead of three.

Still no need for a full-blown TV, though.

 

[ScottB]

My second guess is it's a new piece of software. Apple Paint.

 

[peharri]

Agreed. It'll probably start with a undercase 'i' and have a snazzy name that related to the iPod afterward. But I think the whole 'i' thing is a but old now.

The name comes from trademark filings by Apple.

I agree the name sucks. I'm having a hard time they're preparing a major press conference for a speaker system, but, hey, if you'd asked me about the original iPod when it came out, I'd probably have done a CmdrTaco on it, so my views are probably more meaningless than normal.

 

[milo]

See, I don't get this. Why have yet one more device to attach to a TV that duplicates some of the functions of a TV? OK, if it's not a real DVR, then the "server" elsewhere is duplicating the TV functions. Or rather, the "server" is duplicating your Cable TV functions, or adding DVR to the Cable TV functions...

I don't think you understand. The "server" doesn't do ANY TV functions, it only handles storage and maybe some processing for the interface. The machine used as a server doesn't have any TV specific hardware.

The box hooked to your TV needs to have a tuner in order to be able to record. There's no way around that, without a tuner it simply can't do its job. Same with a VCR, it has to duplicate the tuner functionality of the TV. One advantage of this is you can watch one show while taping another (assuming the device is single tuner).

The way I see it, I just want one box (dream Mac mini) with two TV tuners, SuperDrive & big Hard Drive in it, connected to a big wide screen. Said box will function as my server, cable box, DVR, DVD player, music player, game machine, etc.

That would be cool. But it would also be fairly expensive (the price of a computer, not the price of an AV box). And to be able to use the computer functions well, you'd want to have it hooked up to either an HDTV or a computer screen. So for users with plain old NTSC, they'd either be stuck with poor computer display or they'd need to have a computer monitor next to the TV. Even HDTV monitors usually have a lower resolution than computer monitors that are far cheaper. Also, the computer can't be used for anything else while it's doing TV, with a client/server model you could use one machine for both (assuming the performance hit isn't too bad).

The eyeTV is a good solution now. But apple could absolutely do it better if they wanted to. Although I wouldn't mind seeing them just buy eyeTV, apple-ize it a bit (combine with FR) and start bundling with macs.

It could never be the quality of a CD with it encoded, for it to be CD quality it would have to be AIFF which currently has not DMR.

If they wanted they could do apple lossless. Saves some space, could use DRM, and it is CD quality. But they probably won't.

 

[YunusEmre]

Remember that the "TiVo-Killer" rumor came from Thinksecret. Their record has been absolute crap the last few go-arounds. They've lost most of their credibility in my book.

Anyways, people who're wishing for a full computer with DVR functionality and large HDs in a Mini form factor are living in never-never land. Something's gotta give. Knowing Apple, they'll stick to their CD-case form factor which rules out including a beefy 3.5" HD. I also don't think Apple will go the TiVo. As many have argued, the DVR model contradicts the current iTMS video-on-demand model. At best, you'll see some interface and performance improvements to Front Row, but I wouldn't expect a whole new model of content management.

Well said.

I gave up trying to explain people here that a Mini as a DVR is not a Mini and a DVR needs more than Front Row and Program guide etc. etc.