For sure! We will see it at sometime, but not not for a while yet
I guess we'll just have to see how quickly DVD-R drive technology advances, lets hope it quick! 
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G4 iBook at MWNY?
- Thread starter arn
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I guess we'll just have to see how quickly DVD-R drive technology advances, lets hope it quick! oops
Yeah.. sorry to all of you but no G4 iBooks for a while.. and the guy that's looking for an 867G4 in an iBook??? you are smoking the wrong crack!
http://www.whythemacissogreat.com/globalmacnews/specials/20020617-ibookg4.shtml
"Global Mac News - Apple Says No G4 iBooks Anytime Soon.
Apple says that the iBook is a bestseller as it is. Like the Brits would say, "don't change a winning team" (the equivalent for those across the pond is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"), Apple says it'll leave the iBook untouched for now.
MacCentral quotes Apple's Dave Russell as saing "don't expect any major changes anytime soon". A big reason for staying with the G3 is that it doesn't draw much power, and won't heat up easily. Plus, contrary to yours sincerely's experiences, OS X is supposed to run "just fine".
Apple is basing the iBook on consumer and educational experiences and desires - not wild yells for a G4 upgrade and a mega-big monitor."
That last part is directed to all of you I believe.. "not wild yells for a G4 upgrade etc.."
Sorry to stop that train in its tracks!
Yeah.. sorry to all of you but no G4 iBooks for a while.. and the guy that's looking for an 867G4 in an iBook??? you are smoking the wrong crack!
http://www.whythemacissogreat.com/globalmacnews/specials/20020617-ibookg4.shtml
"Global Mac News - Apple Says No G4 iBooks Anytime Soon.
Apple says that the iBook is a bestseller as it is. Like the Brits would say, "don't change a winning team" (the equivalent for those across the pond is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it"), Apple says it'll leave the iBook untouched for now.
MacCentral quotes Apple's Dave Russell as saing "don't expect any major changes anytime soon". A big reason for staying with the G3 is that it doesn't draw much power, and won't heat up easily. Plus, contrary to yours sincerely's experiences, OS X is supposed to run "just fine".
Apple is basing the iBook on consumer and educational experiences and desires - not wild yells for a G4 upgrade and a mega-big monitor."
That last part is directed to all of you I believe.. "not wild yells for a G4 upgrade etc.."
Sorry to stop that train in its tracks!
If only the conductor on the iBook train was working!
I can only pray that you derailed this train!
Its incredible foolish for anyone to think that the iBook would be getting a G4 anything , anytime soon!
As stated by people in the know, its the educational low end consumer laptop, geared for student in cost and other manners.
The G3 works and keeps cost and heat down!
Why was this thread started yet again?
People crying for the G4 iBook need a Ti, so go get one or be happy with the iBook.
You think Apple is going to make a new laptop for the whim of every individual.
They have covered to spectrum here from consumer to pro as best they can!
If you have needs that are not spoken to here, then wait till the G whatever comes out and moves the whole line. its that simple.,
I can only pray that you derailed this train!
Its incredible foolish for anyone to think that the iBook would be getting a G4 anything , anytime soon!
As stated by people in the know, its the educational low end consumer laptop, geared for student in cost and other manners.
The G3 works and keeps cost and heat down!
Why was this thread started yet again?
People crying for the G4 iBook need a Ti, so go get one or be happy with the iBook.
You think Apple is going to make a new laptop for the whim of every individual.
They have covered to spectrum here from consumer to pro as best they can!
If you have needs that are not spoken to here, then wait till the G whatever comes out and moves the whole line. its that simple.,
G4 iBook
Hell, I wanted a PowerBook, because I am more of a power user, but I just could not justify the cost.
Why pay $1000 more for a slightly faster bus, a bit more memory, and slightly better GPU and Altivec? My feelings would be different if the TiBook had DDR RAM, 266Mhz bus, etc etc.
I decided on the 700Mhz 12.1" iBook over the 667 TiBook, because of its smaller size and it feels a lot more sturdy than the TiBook. And I did not have the $$$ for the TiBook.
Who cares about real time effects on the G4 and FCP 3 anyway, you still have to render once you decide to go back to tape, so why bother. Once I get a fast and speedy external firewire drive, I will be testing this next to my souped up B&W (400 G4, 1GB Ram, 2 18gb Ultra160 10,000RPM SCSI, PCI Radeon, PCI OEM RAGE). I have a feeling that my iBook is going to wipe the floor of my B&W. Just my gut feeling. So far it is faster at everything.
-mark
Hell, I wanted a PowerBook, because I am more of a power user, but I just could not justify the cost.
Why pay $1000 more for a slightly faster bus, a bit more memory, and slightly better GPU and Altivec? My feelings would be different if the TiBook had DDR RAM, 266Mhz bus, etc etc.
I decided on the 700Mhz 12.1" iBook over the 667 TiBook, because of its smaller size and it feels a lot more sturdy than the TiBook. And I did not have the $$$ for the TiBook.
Who cares about real time effects on the G4 and FCP 3 anyway, you still have to render once you decide to go back to tape, so why bother. Once I get a fast and speedy external firewire drive, I will be testing this next to my souped up B&W (400 G4, 1GB Ram, 2 18gb Ultra160 10,000RPM SCSI, PCI Radeon, PCI OEM RAGE). I have a feeling that my iBook is going to wipe the floor of my B&W. Just my gut feeling. So far it is faster at everything.
-mark
Re: G4 iBook
Because you have either a genuine need, or a psychological need.
Why even show a preview of your video at all... ho hum... it ain't ready til its ready?
...Folks like the real time effects during the editing process, so they can make a decision whether they want to commit to that effect or not in the final product. And tweak the effect and resulting editing BEFORE burning one.
Because you have either a genuine need, or a psychological need.
Why even show a preview of your video at all... ho hum... it ain't ready til its ready?
...Folks like the real time effects during the editing process, so they can make a decision whether they want to commit to that effect or not in the final product. And tweak the effect and resulting editing BEFORE burning one.
well,the G4 chips AV works on the os also not just the appz you mentioned!
If its all just SLIGHTLY faster then you can see that all the niches are being filled and that there is no need for a G4 in an iBook.
If its all just SLIGHTLY faster then you can see that all the niches are being filled and that there is no need for a G4 in an iBook.
As a PC user sitting on the fence waiting for OS X 10.2 to release before deciding whether continue with a PC laptop running an OS I have used for years or an iBook running 10.2, I would really like to see an iBook Special Edition or a TiBook Lite with the following specs:
*12" display (I like small laptops. Fujitsu P series looks great on the PC side)
*1 ghz G3 (IBM makes it, lets have it. I am curious to see how it performs compared to the current gen TiBook G4s)
*200 mhz front-side bus (the Sahara supports it)
*Support for up to 1 GB DDR RAM (You can never have enough RAM -- at least that is true in the PC universe)
*40+ GB Hard drives running at 5400 RPM (Great performance enhancer)
*ATI 7500 with 32 MB of RAM user upgradeable to 64 (Compaq is offering this with the 2800 series laptops)
*Also, let's not cripple the GPU. I have no use for mirroring but if it's suppored why not keep it there for people that want it.
*USB2 and Gigawire (a little future proofing never hurts)
*SPDIF or other Dolby Digital out (PC laptops have this and they don't have decent software to support it)
I don't think there is anything wrong with the G3. I think the problem is with the the rest of the subsystem. OS X and VirtualPC should literally fly on a machine with these specs.
Oh yeah, no matter what, VirtualPC needs to fly on OS X. Apple needs to work with Connectix to make sure that happens. Switching computers and OSes is an expensive proposition. VirtualPC will allow me and other PC users to gradually upgrade our software to the OS X version as well as keep working with those pesky apps that don't have Mac versions. In fact Apple really needs to look at packaging it with the iBook.
Before anybody gets upset with me for these suggestions, I do ask that you remember I am a PC user and have owned PCs since the 80286 days. I am also very computer literate and I know intellectually the current 700mhz iBook is more than adequate. The problem is, I still think like a PC user. For Apple's current campaign to really work, they need to understand that this how a good number of PC users think and build machines that are overkill.
*12" display (I like small laptops. Fujitsu P series looks great on the PC side)
*1 ghz G3 (IBM makes it, lets have it. I am curious to see how it performs compared to the current gen TiBook G4s)
*200 mhz front-side bus (the Sahara supports it)
*Support for up to 1 GB DDR RAM (You can never have enough RAM -- at least that is true in the PC universe)
*40+ GB Hard drives running at 5400 RPM (Great performance enhancer)
*ATI 7500 with 32 MB of RAM user upgradeable to 64 (Compaq is offering this with the 2800 series laptops)
*Also, let's not cripple the GPU. I have no use for mirroring but if it's suppored why not keep it there for people that want it.
*USB2 and Gigawire (a little future proofing never hurts)
*SPDIF or other Dolby Digital out (PC laptops have this and they don't have decent software to support it)
I don't think there is anything wrong with the G3. I think the problem is with the the rest of the subsystem. OS X and VirtualPC should literally fly on a machine with these specs.
Oh yeah, no matter what, VirtualPC needs to fly on OS X. Apple needs to work with Connectix to make sure that happens. Switching computers and OSes is an expensive proposition. VirtualPC will allow me and other PC users to gradually upgrade our software to the OS X version as well as keep working with those pesky apps that don't have Mac versions. In fact Apple really needs to look at packaging it with the iBook.
Before anybody gets upset with me for these suggestions, I do ask that you remember I am a PC user and have owned PCs since the 80286 days. I am also very computer literate and I know intellectually the current 700mhz iBook is more than adequate. The problem is, I still think like a PC user. For Apple's current campaign to really work, they need to understand that this how a good number of PC users think and build machines that are overkill.
Real time effects
I agree with you that real time effects while editing a project is nice and speeds the process up, but I do not feel like it is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
If your concerned about "true" real time, then you're better off going with a AVID or Media100 Hardware/Software combination that actually truly gives real time online effects.
That is how I feel. At work I use an aging Media100 lx, and I guess I've gotten used to rendering effects and "feeling" how long things should be and learning to use markers to sync stuff to music. I guess that comes with experience. So FCP w/o real time effects does not bug that much, just so long as I can play back stuff that has been rendered in real time, that concerns me more.
-mark
I agree with you that real time effects while editing a project is nice and speeds the process up, but I do not feel like it is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
If your concerned about "true" real time, then you're better off going with a AVID or Media100 Hardware/Software combination that actually truly gives real time online effects.
That is how I feel. At work I use an aging Media100 lx, and I guess I've gotten used to rendering effects and "feeling" how long things should be and learning to use markers to sync stuff to music. I guess that comes with experience. So FCP w/o real time effects does not bug that much, just so long as I can play back stuff that has been rendered in real time, that concerns me more.
-mark
Ibook G6
I want an G6 Ibook running at 2 GHZ .
But for the moment I am quite happy with my 600 MHZ G3 machine
I want an G6 Ibook running at 2 GHZ
.But for the moment I am quite happy with my 600 MHZ G3 machine
about that... i dont know if most of you know this, but the Sahara 750FX is capable of a 200mhz DDR bus. I dunno why apple hasnt started using this, but i think they will, and use a 266mhz DDR bus in the TiBooks!! (edit)nope, it doesnt have Alti-Vec like instructions in the processor(edit)
Re: Re: Re: YES!
i dont think u understand the velocity engine and multithreading too well.
The velocity engine is just another name for Altivec. What Altivec is, is a new set of instructions for the G4 processor that allow it to perform Vector math in hardware. The G4's accomplish this by using a coprocessor which is not part of the original processor, its an extension to it, much like a graphics card is an extension to a CPU. What the Vector coprocessor allows Mac's to do is move around (you guessed it) Vectors via hardware. A vector basically is say... (1,3,0), thats a vector. Now you move this vector. But what if you wanted to move many different vectors around via the same amount. What the Vector Co processor allows you to do, is to perform the same operation to every single vector, without having to do it one at a time. This allows you to move around more pixels, since lots of pixels can be moved at the same time, instead of individually, and this helps out a lot in ... you guessed it, photoshop filters and anything that moves around large numbers of pixels.
Now multithreading... DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT IS?? it has nothing to do with the veloctiy engine. Multithreading is a feature of the Operating System. sure, you need a processor capable of it, but ALMOST EVERY processor is. what multithreading lets you do is, ... say you wanted to burn a iDVD while playing Quake III (not like u would) to be continued...
i dont think u understand the velocity engine and multithreading too well.
The velocity engine is just another name for Altivec. What Altivec is, is a new set of instructions for the G4 processor that allow it to perform Vector math in hardware. The G4's accomplish this by using a coprocessor which is not part of the original processor, its an extension to it, much like a graphics card is an extension to a CPU. What the Vector coprocessor allows Mac's to do is move around (you guessed it) Vectors via hardware. A vector basically is say... (1,3,0), thats a vector. Now you move this vector. But what if you wanted to move many different vectors around via the same amount. What the Vector Co processor allows you to do, is to perform the same operation to every single vector, without having to do it one at a time. This allows you to move around more pixels, since lots of pixels can be moved at the same time, instead of individually, and this helps out a lot in ... you guessed it, photoshop filters and anything that moves around large numbers of pixels.
Now multithreading... DO YOU KNOW WHAT THAT IS?? it has nothing to do with the veloctiy engine. Multithreading is a feature of the Operating System. sure, you need a processor capable of it, but ALMOST EVERY processor is. what multithreading lets you do is, ... say you wanted to burn a iDVD while playing Quake III (not like u would) to be continued...
Uh, no it does not have altivec like instructions. For some reason people keep thinking/wishing it did but my sources tell me there are not any such instructions.
If you can provide information to the contrary, please do so. Until then, please do not spread false and misleading information.
well, back to what i was saying
When you multithread, what the OS will do is seperate the instructions from the iDVD and Quake III into two different threads, each being sent to the processor. Now a problem is if the CPU can properly support this, IE completing two different instructions in one go. But, the G4 and G3 in this area are not different one BIT!
the 700mhz iBooks are more than good enough, and you have to remember, WHY DOES ANYONE USE 32BIT COLOR ON AN iBook or iMac?? seriously, the LCD's can only display 24bits of colors, sure, you can calculate more colors by using 32bits, but your just screwing yourself over. And i really wonder, does an iBook REALLY get only 15fps on Quake III at 1024x768x32?? i would expect AT LEAST 40fps with its hardware setup... maybe BareFeats only had 128mb RAM on it...??? dunno... seriously, the iBooks WILL run Doom III, although only at like 640x480x16... too bad since you cant use the 64bit color calculations ohh well, at least it will run, and BTW!!! Doom III isnt coming out till like December of NEXT(thats right, 2003) year. so by that time, you can get a new ibook or iMac for gaming, or better yet, if you want to play Doom III, get an XBox a Mouse, and a Keyboard, and your set.
When you multithread, what the OS will do is seperate the instructions from the iDVD and Quake III into two different threads, each being sent to the processor. Now a problem is if the CPU can properly support this, IE completing two different instructions in one go. But, the G4 and G3 in this area are not different one BIT!
the 700mhz iBooks are more than good enough, and you have to remember, WHY DOES ANYONE USE 32BIT COLOR ON AN iBook or iMac?? seriously, the LCD's can only display 24bits of colors, sure, you can calculate more colors by using 32bits, but your just screwing yourself over. And i really wonder, does an iBook REALLY get only 15fps on Quake III at 1024x768x32?? i would expect AT LEAST 40fps with its hardware setup... maybe BareFeats only had 128mb RAM on it...??? dunno... seriously, the iBooks WILL run Doom III, although only at like 640x480x16... too bad since you cant use the 64bit color calculations
ohh well, at least it will run, and BTW!!! Doom III isnt coming out till like December of NEXT(thats right, 2003) year. so by that time, you can get a new ibook or iMac for gaming, or better yet, if you want to play Doom III, get an XBox a Mouse, and a Keyboard, and your set.
DAMN YOU!
yes you are right... I just checked IBM.com/powerpc and checked out a pdf they had on the differences between it and the 750CXe... nope, no AltiVec like instructions... i wish it did though...
Sorry, but i just remembered this from an Article from the Register from like January 2002 when we were all predicting G5's for MWSF 2002.. sorry
Re: Re: Re: Re: YES!
yeah, i know what AltiVec and multithreading are. i didn't mean to make them sound like they were related. those were 2 seperate statements. all i meant was that OSX is AltiVec enabled, meaning it's optimised for the G4. SEPERATELY, from what i've seen the iBook doesn't do a very good job of multitasking at all. maybe it's ok to run TextEdit and IE at the same time but try working in Photoshop and Flash on an iBook. If it atleast had the G4 of the RevA TiBooks it would handle multithreading AltiVec enabled apps much better. At the very least the OS would be snappier. PC converts are used to fast(maybe too fast) interface. Most converts will look toward the "i" line of machines. If it's sluggish, as it is now, they walk away.
yeah, i know what AltiVec and multithreading are. i didn't mean to make them sound like they were related. those were 2 seperate statements. all i meant was that OSX is AltiVec enabled, meaning it's optimised for the G4. SEPERATELY, from what i've seen the iBook doesn't do a very good job of multitasking at all. maybe it's ok to run TextEdit and IE at the same time but try working in Photoshop and Flash on an iBook. If it atleast had the G4 of the RevA TiBooks it would handle multithreading AltiVec enabled apps much better. At the very least the OS would be snappier. PC converts are used to fast(maybe too fast) interface. Most converts will look toward the "i" line of machines. If it's sluggish, as it is now, they walk away.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: YES!
i haven't seen the new one's in action yet. i'm sure the new graphics card helps alot too. still, with the release of the Xserve Apple already has 3 types of G4s. meaning, the new chips that support DDR, the Apollo chips, and what ever is is in the TiBooks. I don't see why putting a low speed G4 in the iBook is a bad move. The iBook and iMac could use the current G4s and the new PowerMac and PowerBook could use the new ones with DDR support, L3 cache, etc. I think that would put enough of a performance gap between the 2 lines. The only thing i could see is PC people ignoring a 550mhz G4 iBook based on mhz. Plus, it will be slower if they are not running AltiVec enabled apps. hmmm...
i haven't seen the new one's in action yet. i'm sure the new graphics card helps alot too. still, with the release of the Xserve Apple already has 3 types of G4s. meaning, the new chips that support DDR, the Apollo chips, and what ever is is in the TiBooks. I don't see why putting a low speed G4 in the iBook is a bad move. The iBook and iMac could use the current G4s and the new PowerMac and PowerBook could use the new ones with DDR support, L3 cache, etc. I think that would put enough of a performance gap between the 2 lines. The only thing i could see is PC people ignoring a 550mhz G4 iBook based on mhz. Plus, it will be slower if they are not running AltiVec enabled apps. hmmm...
G4 is toooooo hot.
It is amazing how everyone that does not have an ibook states that an ibook with a G4 is what they need. I have a friend who has a powerbook with the g4 800mhz chip. The thing is so hot, that it freezes and shuts down. Your not going to believe this, but he puts it in the fridge(sealed in plastic) so he can work on it longer-this is true.
I have one of the new ibook G3 700mhz and i have to say that its the best Mac I have ever had. I run it and every program i have under 9.2, and it has yet to freeze or crash on me yet. I run Logic Audio Gold 4.8 on it and it runs everything fine. And best of all, it doesn't get hot.
Another thing, the 12inch is fine just for about everything you do. I use Photoshop, work on my webpages, and do everything on this bad boy.
The only complaint I have about this bad boy is that it wasn't available sooner.
-----------------------------------------------
Technology has made my life complicated because now i have no excuses.
It is amazing how everyone that does not have an ibook states that an ibook with a G4 is what they need. I have a friend who has a powerbook with the g4 800mhz chip. The thing is so hot, that it freezes and shuts down. Your not going to believe this, but he puts it in the fridge(sealed in plastic) so he can work on it longer-this is true.
I have one of the new ibook G3 700mhz and i have to say that its the best Mac I have ever had. I run it and every program i have under 9.2, and it has yet to freeze or crash on me yet. I run Logic Audio Gold 4.8 on it and it runs everything fine. And best of all, it doesn't get hot.
Another thing, the 12inch is fine just for about everything you do. I use Photoshop, work on my webpages, and do everything on this bad boy.
The only complaint I have about this bad boy is that it wasn't available sooner.
-----------------------------------------------
Technology has made my life complicated because now i have no excuses.
Re: G4 is toooooo hot.
There may be some truth to what you say but I think much of people's comments are based off of previous ibooks. Typically a rev in an ibook isn't going to give that big of a performance jump but these latest models seem to be pretty nice. I just wish they would allow for a greater maximum of ram than 640 MB. That's what I find to be the biggest joke. 1 GB should be the lowest allowed in my opinion.
Many of those wanting the G4 is almost for nothing other than for Apple to use as a marketing tool so that it shows they're not stagnating on any single type or speed of cpu. Others would just like to see the line only be distinguished by clockspeed and number of cpu's to simplify things. I've seen true performance as a core reason the least amount of times.
It also sounds like your buddy should be talking to Apple. Anyone placing their laptop in the freezer is a nut in the firstplace. That's not a good thing to do on the electronics in the system so he's doing more harm than good in the long run.
There may be some truth to what you say but I think much of people's comments are based off of previous ibooks. Typically a rev in an ibook isn't going to give that big of a performance jump but these latest models seem to be pretty nice. I just wish they would allow for a greater maximum of ram than 640 MB. That's what I find to be the biggest joke. 1 GB should be the lowest allowed in my opinion.
Many of those wanting the G4 is almost for nothing other than for Apple to use as a marketing tool so that it shows they're not stagnating on any single type or speed of cpu. Others would just like to see the line only be distinguished by clockspeed and number of cpu's to simplify things. I've seen true performance as a core reason the least amount of times.
It also sounds like your buddy should be talking to Apple. Anyone placing their laptop in the freezer is a nut in the firstplace. That's not a good thing to do on the electronics in the system so he's doing more harm than good in the long run.
Re: G4 is toooooo hot.
how is the iBook with Logic? do you get a decent amount of tracks/effects? i use Logic as well. i'm not sure of Logic's AltiVec status but i'd be curious to see how a 700mhz iBook stacks up against my Ti550. i bet your machine is outperforming mine right now. can't wait for OSX. i think we'll see all the major apps with the release of 10.2
how is the iBook with Logic? do you get a decent amount of tracks/effects? i use Logic as well. i'm not sure of Logic's AltiVec status but i'd be curious to see how a 700mhz iBook stacks up against my Ti550. i bet your machine is outperforming mine right now. can't wait for OSX. i think we'll see all the major apps with the release of 10.2
What kind of mumbo jumbo is this about a Ti 800 SOooooo hot that it has to be frozen to work.
I have the Ti 800 , yea it get toasty after a few hours but it never freezes up and putting it in the freezer has never entered my mind, hell the freakin fan rarely even comes on.
Have you been smoking dog fur again>?
Applebesmart ~ you should change you handle to something else more appropiate!
When the new QE comes out everyone will see a huge difference in performance tween the Ti and the iBook , then all these posts will be filled with complaints.
I have the Ti 800 , yea it get toasty after a few hours but it never freezes up and putting it in the freezer has never entered my mind, hell the freakin fan rarely even comes on.
Have you been smoking dog fur again>?
Applebesmart ~ you should change you handle to something else more appropiate!
When the new QE comes out everyone will see a huge difference in performance tween the Ti and the iBook , then all these posts will be filled with complaints.