G5 iMac?

[BakedBeans]

So I checked out that "consumer" machine you're throwing around. Here's the acutal specs for what you're getting:

Dell Dimension 2400
Intel Pentium 4 2.66ghz on 533mhz FSB
XP Home
128M PC2700 Shared Memory
40GB ATA/100
48x CD-ROM with no burning software and no media
WordPerfect and MS Money
Norton Internet Security 90-Day Trial
17" CRT
Intel 3D Extreme Integrated Video with shared memory
"Integrated Audio" - 2.0, no mixing or editiing input/output, poor music and gamins support (admitted under "Help Me Choose")
Dell A215 basic speakers
PS/2 Keyboard and non-optical mouse
$100 Mail-In Rebate (actual price $599)

If you spec a computer to equal the eMac...

Dell Dimension 4600
Intel Pentium 4 2.8ghz on 533mhz FSB
XP Professional
MS Plus! for XP and Digital Media Edition
256MB PC2700
40GB ATA/100
48xCD-RW/DVD-ROM Combo Drive with RecordNow! and MyDVD Deluxe
WordPerfect Office 11
McAffee Security Center with VirusScan, FireWall, Privacy (1-Year)
17" CRT
GeForce FX 5200 128MB
SB Live! 5.1
PS/2 Keyboard and USB optical mouse
Dell A215 basic speakers (as opposed to Harmon Kardons)
Dell JukeBox PLUS
Dell Picture Studio and Photo Album Plus
IEEE 1394 Adaptor

Cost: $918

For that money, you can get the SuperDrive eMac. Hmmm. Looks like we're not so far off after all. Or, to be completely fair, we can knock about $100 off the price for the difference in graphics cards and processor. That's still ridiculously overpriced and *gasp* not expandable, because three of the fixes I had to do to equal the mac need slots.



It was sacrificed to the heat gods, in order that the line may live.

since when the hell is an emac that fast????
2.8 pentium 4.... please the 1.25 isnt that fast

 

[thatwendigo]

I didn't understand why you upgraded the processor, so I specced a system out myself to match the low-end eMac ($799) as close as possible, and after the rebate that Dell offers, I came to ($808), which is still more expensive than the eMac and doesn't run OSX (which really is the most important issue here anyway). Point taken.

It was a forced "upgrade" because it's the bottom of the line for the 4600 machine, which I moved to so I could do something other than "Intel Extreme" integrated graphics and shared RAM.

That being said, I'm glad you understood my point.

since when the hell is an emac that fast????
2.8 pentium 4.... please the 1.25 isnt that fast

Do you actually read my posts, or is there some part of you that just picks one point to single out while ignoring everything else? If you read the text after I showed the systm I configured, I took off money for the comparison because of the difference in CPU and GPU. Read and comprehend before you attack me, please.

 

[imac_japan]

WOULD YOU STOP POSTING THIS!!!!!

I'm sorry, but you got flamed to death on your petition thread elsewhere.... when are you going to realise that a set top box is not the way forward!

No, I wont ! and I didn't say "Set top box" !! I said "Low cost computer..."

http://www.petitiononline.com/rumi04/petition.html

 

[jayscheuerle]

No, I wont ! and I didn't say "Set top box" !! I said "Low cost computer..."

http://www.petitiononline.com/rumi04/petition.html

What you've said is that you want it to run on your television and television's inherent resolution is not high enough to run OSX. HDTV is another story, but I don't think that's what you're talking about because if you could afford an HDTV set, you wouldn't be worried about the cost of your Mac!

 

[Squire]

No, I wont ! and I didn't say "Set top box" !! I said "Low cost computer..."

http://www.petitiononline.com/rumi04/petition.html

I have a couple of points/questions about your device that will "save" Apple from this apparently horrible situation it is in.

I believe that the most common configuration for TV sets is on a console or stand about 30 to 50 centimeters above the floor. My monitor, on the other hand, is about one meter above the floor. Where would the mouse and keyboard go? A coffee table is also too low to comfortably use for computing tasks.

While I'm sure a lot of people connected their C64 systems to a TV, a lot of others opted for the optional RGB monitor. Those who connected it to a TV probably had an extra TV (i.e. an old one) kicking around the house. Apart from the OS, the allure of a Mac is its beautiful design. How would that design look sitting next to a crappy old TV (or ugly CRT display)?

And, on a personal note, why the crusade? Is it just that you want a Mac but can't afford one? Or do you really wish they had a greater market share? If so, why?

Squire

 

[oldpismo]

I'm amazed at people's focus on the semantics of an iMac needing to be "all in one". Let's call it a "PeopleMac" or "MyMac" (or something like that). Have the PowerMac for pros and power hounds and the MyMac for consumers that don't need PCI slots or more than one internal drive, put a fanless G4 in it. Essentially, make it a "headless iMac", but without the laptop sized parts. Put enough room into it for people to upgrade the graphics card and add RAM, but that's it. It would be minimal, but not necessarily cheap. Firewire and USB2 ports make machines expandable to put on extra drives, so there really shouldn't be an issue here. Start at $700, like the $799 eMac but with $99 off for the lack of a monitor and a smaller enclosure. I'd upgrade my trusty beige G3 if only for the chance to run Panther. PowerMacs are overkill for my home use. iMacs are too expensive. eMacs are too big. I've already got a nice lcd. Apple is forcing me to work eBay because they have this gaping hole in their product line.

Surely what you want is a second hand powermac? Maybe someone who bought one of the early 1.6/1.8 ones and now upgrades. It has the room for expansion, no monitor, and should be cheap.

I wonder if this is the reason that apple doesn't sell a machine into this area, because while there is a need for them people can sell their not very old machines at a reasonable price and upgrade to the new latest greatest offering.

Also, what is the obsession with getting rid of the monitor that everyone seems to have here. I currently have a PC at home (not for much longer hopefully) and the only PC I bought as a whole was the first one in '89. All upgrades from then on have been modifications to the existing equipment. Now however I am at the point where time is more valuable than money to me, and I want to buy a machine that doesn't require upgrading, and that has a nice little monitor built in that can sit in the living room and act as a digital hub. The iMac would be ideal for this, especially if they put in a single 1.8 or 2 G5.

Keep the monitor on the iMac, keep the iMac (but make it better). If you don't want a monitor then buy a powermac, or ask for lower spec'd powermacs but leave the poor iMac alone.

 

[thatwendigo]

No, I wont ! and I didn't say "Set top box" !! I said "Low cost computer..."

http://www.petitiononline.com/rumi04/petition.html

From this misguided petition:

A cheap "Mac" around $500 or $600 will start the ball rolling. A perfect example would be to build one that you can plug into your TV !! That will save costs.....No monitor, a small HD, 128 to 256 meg of memory plus a keyboard and mouse. It could be the next Commodore 64 ! It could be the "Mac" to save us all.

In order:

1. TVs do not possess the resolution to display computer graphics, unless you're talking about HDTV, which starts around $360 and up for a capable set. Oops. Strike one.
2. Small HD? Something like the eMac's 40GB HD? Strike Two.
3. 128MB of RAM is not enough to run OS X, and 256MB is a bit slow. Strike Three.

Do your research before starting pointless, poorly informed crusades.

 

[instantypo]

iMacG5 is the new Cube

Nope. The Cube failed because it was ridiculously overpriced by around $500-$700. If you bought one, you were paying for the design, not the machine inside.

If a head were included it sure wasn't overpriced. Hence, it failed because it was headless.

 

[Nemesis]

They will

The iMac would be ideal for this, especially if they put in a single 1.8 or 2 G5.

They will. Updates are due next week.
G5 iMac comes!

 

[Squire]

They will. Updates are due next week.
G5 iMac comes!

Is that a guess or a fact?

If it's the latter, how about the form factor? Significantly different?

Squire

 

[titaniumducky]

They will. Updates are due next week.
G5 iMac comes!

The iMac G5 will be major - it will almost definitely be announced at a major conference (WWDC, MWP, MWSF, etc.)

 

[BornAgainMac]

since when the hell is an emac that fast????
2.8 pentium 4.... please the 1.25 isnt that fast

2.8 Pentium 4 is slow. Great for Wordprocessing and Internet though.

 

[Borg3of5]

The waiting is OVER!

I finally made up my mind and ordered a refurbished Dual 1.8 last night. I don't consider myself a poweruser; i.e. all I normally do is web-browsing, emailing, iPhoto work, iTunes, getting into digital photography, so I'll start learning Photoshop, et al.

$1,999 plus free shipping for a Dual 1.8 G5 can't be beat. That is of course, when the Rev.Bs are announced the current models will probably drop $300.

For the time being, I'll be hooking it up to 4+ year old 17" CRT. I figure in September when my loan deferrment is processed I'll get a 23" HD Cinema display with the Student discount. And even though I'll have to pay 6.5% sales tax, that still will come to $1,911. Not bad, the difference can be used towards a 300 GB external hard-drive.

I just hope I did the right thing, as with all the rumors floating around that the top of the line G5 won't be quite 3.0 GHz, probably 2.6 GHz, AND I don't do any mathematical or scientific calculations, I should be more than pleased...I hope.

 

[Nemesis]

Improved

Is that a guess or a fact?
If it's the latter, how about the form factor? Significantly different?

Form factor somewhat changed.
Different. Better!

 

[aswitcher]

Form factor somewhat changed.
Different. Better!

I could have told you that

You have any HARD info? You know stuff we can refer back to and say you were right or wrong?

 

[Nemesis]

Form factor somewhat changed.
Different. Better!

Well, the thing is that my old friend, who works for Apple for more than a decade, doesn't like to tell me any detail. For good reason! I can understand that, and I devise my own ways of finding out interesting stuff. But from I understood by his denials, and my bits and pieces to complete the picture, new iMac will have

* detachable screen
* very similar form factor
* new processor

which means, iMac becomes a low-end G5. And more than that!

We'll have variety of screens to choose -- 15", 17" (already used in PowerBooks, so this too cuts costs down), 20" (low-end Cinema Display), and several iMac configurations. So instead of locking youself with a certain iMac and screen size, like we had in iMac G4, new iMac can be combined as we wish because new design allows screen to be detachable. So you can choose whichever screen you like. New iMac configs will no longer be based on screen size, but on processor speed.

BUT, if you don't want detachable screen, you can hook your iMac to a Studio Display Screen! That's cool, man, so with this new machine, we'll get both traditional all-in-one iMac and new, headless Mac, to be hooked onto anything you'd like!

They did that not only to give more choices to customers, but also to make transportation and productions costs down. Computer base (body) will be somewhat wider, and will change its colour.

To what colour exctly, I don't have a clue!

 

[aswitcher]

Well, the thing is that my old friend, who works for Apple for more than a decade, doesn't like to tell me any detail. For good reason! I can understand that, and I devise my own ways of finding out interesting stuff. But from I understood by his denials, and my bits and pieces to complete the picture, new iMac will have

* detachable screen
* very similar form factor
* new processor

Ok. These are all things that have been under discussion for sometime...should be interesting to see if it comes off.

which means, iMac becomes a low-end G5. And more than that!

We'll have variety of screens to choose -- 15", 17" (already used in PowerBooks, so this too cuts costs down), 20" (low-end Cinema Display), and several iMac configurations. So instead of locking youself with a certain iMac and screen size, like we had in iMac G4, new iMac can be combined as we wish because new design allows screen to be detachable. So you can choose whichever screen you like. New iMac configs will no longer be based on screen size, but on processor speed.

BUT, if you don't want detachable screen, you can hook your iMac to a Studio Display Screen! That's cool, man, so with this new machine, we'll get both traditional all-in-one iMac and new, headless Mac, to be hooked onto anything you'd like!

They did that not only to give more choices to customers, but also to make transportation and productions costs down. Computer base (body) will be somewhat wider, and will change its colour.

To what colour exctly, I don't have a clue!

Ok, well we have been thinking this might happen for the reasons you mention. I hope the base is a little taller to allow the cd tray/slot to clear the keyboard. I also hope that most of the ports get front mounted or at least what we see with the G5. I think if this happens then that would be excellent.

As for the body colour. It could be they do iPod mini shells to put over the base to allow personalisation. It could be they have perfected that plastic that can change colours which would blow everyone away

 

[ingenious]

To what colour exctly, I don't have a clue!

it'd be nice if they let you pick the color like with the original iMacs and the iPod minis. right like that will happen

edit:

As for the body colour. It could be they do iPod mini shells to put over the base to allow personalisation. It could be they have perfected that plastic that can change colours which would blow everyone away

i guess aswitcher beat me to it....

 

[ingenious]

No, I wont ! and I didn't say "Set top box" !! I said "Low cost computer..."

http://www.petitiononline.com/rumi04/petition.html

do we have to go thru this AGAIN? we settled this before. i will act responsibly here and not call him any names (nonprofane), but come on! you've been disproved over and over! give it a rest!

 

[Nemesis]

I could have told you that

You have any HARD info? You know stuff we can refer back to and say you were right or wrong?

That's right, but my expectations were different.
I know for sure they've tested both 1.4 and 1.6 GHz G5 PowerBooks, and were ready to introduce them in a case Motorola screws with latest G4 updates. Yes, we'd have to wait for them at least 2 months to start producing, and that would screw up whole quarterly financial results - no PowerMacs, PowerBooks delayed, iMacs still in production preparation. With slightly modified laptops, they'll get very good quarter, despite other product delays.
Like in this case -- It's my wish to see this iMac introduced next week, but maybe they'll hold them for more than month, for some stupid SJ's reason.
That man has stopped SO MANY brilliant ideas come to market during the last few years!

 

[aswitcher]

That's right, but my expectations were different.
I know for sure they've tested both 1.4 and 1.6 GHz G5 PowerBooks, and were ready to introduce them in a case Motorola screws with latest G4 updates. Yes, we'd have to wait for them at least 2 months to start producing, and that would screw up whole quarterly financial results - no PowerMacs, PowerBooks delayed, iMacs still in production preparation. With slightly modified laptops, they'll get very good quarter, despite other product delays.
Like in this case -- It's my wish to see this iMac introduced next week, but maybe they'll hold them for more than month, for some stupid SJ's reason.
That man has stopped SO MANY brilliant ideas come to market during the last few years!

So your saying the G5PBs are ready to go?

I don't understand whats the hold up? Marketing or production?

Its going to piss ALLOT of people off to have them appear within 2-3 months of the latest G4 PBs if this is true...including me...unless their allot more expensive...

 

[ingenious]

That's right, but my expectations were different.
I know for sure they've tested both 1.4 and 1.6 GHz G5 PowerBooks, and were ready to introduce them in a case Motorola screws with latest G4 updates. Yes, we'd have to wait for them at least 2 months to start producing, and that would screw up whole quarterly financial results - no PowerMacs, PowerBooks delayed, iMacs still in production preparation. With slightly modified laptops, they'll get very good quarter, despite other product delays.
Like in this case -- It's my wish to see this iMac introduced next week, but maybe they'll hold them for more than month, for some stupid SJ's reason.
That man has stopped SO MANY brilliant ideas come to market during the last few years!

that last line kinda destroyed ur credibilty with me.

 

[Squire]

It could be they have perfected that plastic that can change colours which would blow everyone away

Wait...wasn't there a patent over something like that not too long ago?

The iMac Chameleon.

Squire

 

[thatwendigo]

which means, iMac becomes a low-end G5. And more than that!

Wrong.

The G5 is not the only processor that might be used in the iMac, and there's a far better power/performance option in both the VX and the e600 chips. Both chips are supposedly far lower heat for higher clock and performance than the dumbed-down 1.6 or 1.8ghz 970. As such, I find it both to be stupid and remarkably blindsided if Apple just sticks a 970 in a revised case rather than moving with better technology.

We'll have variety of screens to choose -- 15", 17" (already used in PowerBooks, so this too cuts costs down), 20" (low-end Cinema Display), and several iMac configurations. So instead of locking youself with a certain iMac and screen size, like we had in iMac G4, new iMac can be combined as we wish because new design allows screen to be detachable. So you can choose whichever screen you like. New iMac configs will no longer be based on screen size, but on processor speed.

I call BS on this, too, because Apple doesn't have the inventory control to manage a system like this. They don't do enough volume to maintain a nearly complete BTO system and that means all kinds of costs coming out of the effort. On top of that, unless the displays have some kind of external hookups for cords, then these screens are not detachable, because the prohibitive cost and lack of functionality in wireless units is already something pretty ridiculous. Phillips makes a "smart display" that's basically a tablet PC with an Intel processor, RAM, Flash, and 802.11 wireless, but it can't display video because of how low the bandwidth is. Never mind that the thing costs $1,300-1,400 a pop.

BUT, if you don't want detachable screen, you can hook your iMac to a Studio Display Screen! That's cool, man, so with this new machine, we'll get both traditional all-in-one iMac and new, headless Mac, to be hooked onto anything you'd like!

So Apple's going to ignore how ugly it would make the iMac to have cords dangling off the machine? I don't believe it.

Computer base (body) will be somewhat wider, and will change its colour.

The one thing that makes any sense in all of this is that the formfactor will be revised to something larger. That's it.

I know for sure they've tested both 1.4 and 1.6 GHz G5 PowerBooks, and were ready to introduce them in a case Motorola screws with latest G4 updates. Yes, we'd have to wait for them at least 2 months to start producing, and that would screw up whole quarterly financial results - no PowerMacs, PowerBooks delayed, iMacs still in production preparation. With slightly modified laptops, they'll get very good quarter, despite other product delays.

That continues to make little to no sense, because a 1.4ghz G5 would be a slower chip than a 1.5ghz G4, especially in the power-limited framework of a laptop. The 970 is hotter than a G4 at the same clock, and if you bring it down towards the same clock rate, it becomes a pretty comparable performer. As such, it would be foolish at all to put the hotter, more power-hungry G5 into a laptop when the 7447A was coming 3 months ahead of schedule.

Like in this case -- It's my wish to see this iMac introduced next week, but maybe they'll hold them for more than month, for some stupid SJ's reason.
That man has stopped SO MANY brilliant ideas come to market during the last few years!

There's the final proof we needed that this is inane speculation and nothing else. Jobs? Stopping ideas? The man has been nearly singelhandedly responsible for saving Apple from the financial wreck it was about to become in the late 90s.

Mmmmhmmm.

So your saying the G5PBs are ready to go?

I don't understand whats the hold up? Marketing or production?

Why are you taking this seriously, switcher? You know that none of that stacks up?

Its going to piss ALLOT of people off to have them appear within 2-3 months of the latest G4 PBs if this is true...including me...unless their allot more expensive...

This, however... Get used to business. In the PC world, this happens all the time, and while Apple doesn't have the resources to start doing things like this regularly, they will if they grow as hugely as some people want.

 

[Nemesis]

Yes, he is guilty!

that last line kinda destroyed ur credibilty with me.

Just because many people believe he's God's ambassador on Earth. Nope, man. He's both great and crazy. Great is because he indeed has a nose to sense what market wants, but crazy because of that stupid CEO syndrome. When someone from development team brings some cool idea, SJ will put him on mental torture first, then he'll dislike the idea, then in one year he'll love it! Strange man.
When he came back in Apple, he stopped Apple's internet service, only few weeks before launching. Then again, in couple of years he lounched it agan.
.Mac you call it.
Guys from development both hate and like him. And yes, he ideed DID STOP many great concepts and ideas hit the market. Also he neglected the whole Mac line during the last two years because of the iPod and iTMS. Guys from marketing believed they can get more new users by introducing one or two more Mac lines, to bring more horsepower and dimnish the border between Pro and Consumer lines. To give people more choices. But no -- he didn't like the idea and kept separating Mac line. And that's why we have so stupid situation on the Mac market today, man. Machines are overpriced cr*ap, all except for dual G5 and iBook which bring good choice for reasonable money. And, look at the miracle, they're absolute hits and best selling Apple computers! Users are not stupid, SJ!
I bet he'll stop this new iMac concept. Did you guys know that this was ORIGINAL idea too, before iMac G4 introduction? To build iMac as users want, not Apple ...? Well ... only heaven knows how that company endures. Thanks to iPod, I suppose.