[Games Forum] Moderation Request

[FleurDuMal]

Unfortunately, from what I can see, the users in that forum that post the most frequently are all perceived as being too partisan one way or the other. As a result there would be constant complaints that whoever is chosen as moderator was acting in a biased manner whenever they acted in a way which would seem to reinforce their percieved partisanship. Their authority would be completely undermined as a result.

The only solution as far as I can see is to have two or three mods, one from each 'camp', so to speak, so everyone is seen as represented.

 

[OutThere]

<snip>

Off topic I know...but thanks for the chuckle at your avatar and location. I did a triple-take and then laughed.

 

[zap2]

Unfortunately, from what I can see, the users in that forum that post the most frequently are all perceived as being too partisan one way or the other. As a result there would be constant complaints that whoever is chosen as moderator was acting in a biased manner whenever they acted in a way which would seem to reinforce their percieved partisanship. Their authority would be completely undermined as a result.

I think that idea was put out there, and shot down(I had thought it was a good idea at first) but then the Nintendo Mod would see MS and Sony fans as trolls, and Sony fans would see MS and Nintendo fans as trolls and MS fans would see Nintendo and Sony fans as trolls..they would go hunting for them!(Mac gaming is really involves in the hate between consoles..maybe some hate between Mac/PC gamers vs Console gamers, but I don't think is a big problem in OUR forum for games_


I think a Mod who either likes them all alot(as close as one can be to equally a fan of all of them) or someone who doesn't care about what system/computer they play, but the still know things about games.

 

[thedude110]

The recent thread on DVD playback on a future version of the Wii is a good example. I think these accusations tend to be the real flames, rather than the comments that prompted them.

Just had a good read through that thread, and granting that it may have already been moderated, I also see nothing over the line in it. It seems like a typical message board -- people giving their opinions, talking past each other and generally not doing a very good job of listening to each other. But all in a civil enough way.

To those agitating for more mod attention to the games forum: Would love to see a link to a still open thread that you perceive to have gone "over the edge" -- this thread is dying for examples.

 

[MacNut]

If there was going to be a "Game Mod", it would be better that that person not have a bias either way but was truly impartial to all gaming and would have a clear head and would be rational about policing that forum.

 

[WildCowboy]

If there was going to be a "Game Mod", it would be better that that person not have a bias either way but was truly impartial to all gaming and would have a clear head and would be rational about policing that forum.

Speaking generally, the mods do a great job of being impartial in whatever they do. As previously mentioned, they can't read every post by themselves. I think you'd find that almost any bias exhibited by the mods would be rooted in disproportionate reporting of posts by people in the different camps. I don't mean to start a reporting war between the camps, but if it's primarily anti-Wii people doing the reporting (just as an example), you may see more pro-Wii posts being moderated.

 

[jsw]

Of course, the other option - and keep in mind that I have nothing to do with forum administration, so this is simply an observation - is to eliminate the non-Mac gaming threads entirely. If they become too time-consuming and problematic, it wouldn't surprise me to see that happen. The consoles have nothing to do with Apple, and the threads are allowed simply to try to satisfy member interests. That would allow the various fans to post on more dedicated forums.

Of course, that still leaves issues with Mac gaming (including gaming on Macs running Windows), but it would help.

I guess what I'm saying is that, if something is so problematic as to apparently require one (or more) dedicated moderators to keep things in line, it might be better to eliminate it.

 

[MacNut]

But then it will bleed into the community forums and it will just annoy a bigger amount of members.

 

[PlaceofDis]

this thread is dying for examples.

i agree.
does the gaming forum need its own moderator? i doubt it.
could for the forums need one or two more mods in general, perhaps.

the report post button is the best way for things to be self-moderated really. use it often if you must. but it will help. there is a lot of activity on this site and its hard to take in everything, especially considering how many mods we do have, and that its their free time. its great of them to give themselves to the site and help out. but its not an easy task by any means. they do a great job. we can and should be helpin with the report post button.

 

[jsw]

But then it will bleed into the community forums and it will just annoy a bigger amount of members.

True, unless arn decides not to allow discussion of console games, in which case such threads would get Wastelanded, members would get warned, and it'd all be a big mess.

The best solution is to report bad posts within the Games forum, self-police to the extent possible, and try to make it so it's not considered to be a problem. I think that any forum which believes it requires a dedicated mod is probably one which needs some fixing instead.

 

[MRU]

I guess what I'm saying is that, if something is so problematic as to apparently require one (or more) dedicated moderators to keep things in line, it might be better to eliminate it.

I think that would be a bit draconian tbh. I'm a mac user foremost ('i'm sat at one every day working, and at one every evening relaxing / chilling) but I'm also an avid gamer.

A gaming regardles of format (mac/console/pc) section for 'mac users' is not a bad thing, I've said this before on the the gaming section regardless of differences in opinons - being mac users is the one thing they have in common.

Just banquishing the gaming section will leave a lot of users with no other choice but to go elsewhere. Not great for site traffic.

It would be like a department store removing the womens clothes section because patrons bickered over which clothing label was best. All that happens is they'd go elsewhere and the store loses a lot of its patrons..

 

[0098386]

Sometimes I feel yourself and myself (and Oni too) are like 'peace activists' standing amongst a raging battlefield of hormones & insecurity - waving our little white flags trying to create order out of the chaos.

I'd hate to say it, but all 3 people mentioned above have shown fanboy sides in the past. More so Oni, less so you, MRU. Actually... why did you say Oni? He's a top guy but it's probably been less than a week since mentioning something about "Nintendo" and "Kiddy games".

If it does go ahead then picking a moderator for such a purpose would be difficult. One from each camp wouldn't work. That would just be messy. Though it feels fine the way it is. Good ol' Report Button.

 

[jsw]

It would be like a department store removing the womens clothes section because patrons bickered over which clothing label was best. All that happens is they'd go elsewhere and the store loses a lot of its patrons..

Um... OK. That would imply that those members are here primarily to post about console games. If that's the case, I'm not sure that the loss of said members would be a problem. If, in fact, they're primarily here because of an interest in Apple products, then they'd stay here and just wouldn't post about Nintendo/Sony/MS consoles.

I'm just saying this: things which are problematic have historically been dealt with without requiring new moderator positions. The political forums have post minimums and don't count towards post totals, the Market place is similar, etc. There are no other forums or sub-forums which require a separate moderator, and if this (primarily non-Apple-related) one does, I wouldn't count on getting a new mod as the solution to the problems, esp. as I can't see any mod, no matter who is picked, being seen as acceptable by all involved.

 

[Lau]

It would be like a department store removing the womens clothes section because patrons bickered over which clothing label was best. All that happens is they'd go elsewhere and the store loses a lot of its patrons..

I think it would be more like a department store having a playroom that the kids kept getting out of hand and bickering in and they decided to get rid of because it wasn't worth the effort, as all the adults were happily going about buying clothes.

 

[MRU]

edit.. damnation I deleted my post when I merged the two. I hope I remember exactly what I posted. I apologize in advance for any discrepancy.

Um... OK. That would imply that those members are here primarily to post about console games. If that's the case, I'm not sure that the loss of said members would be a problem. If, in fact, they're primarily here because of an interest in Apple products, then they'd stay here and just wouldn't post about Nintendo/Sony/MS consoles.

Ok not what I meant. But say a poster spends 70% of their time in the gaming section. With that gone, they go to another site to discuss gaming, but there is a chance that they may never come back after a while. Whilst that may be a good or bad thing it is a bad thing for site traffic...

I'm just saying this: things which are problematic have historically been dealt with without requiring new moderator positions. The political forums have post minimums and don't count towards post totals, the Market place is similar, etc. There are no other forums or sub-forums which require a separate moderator, and if this (primarily non-Apple-related) one does, I wouldn't count on getting a new mod as the solution to the problems, esp. as I can't see any mod, no matter who is picked, being seen as acceptable by all involved.

I agree I dont think a SPECIFIC moderator is needed, but maybe a moderator who generally has more interest and spends more time in gaming than one that merely dips in and out as duty requires.

I dont want this thread to turn into us against them mentality, all your mods work it appreciated.

I'm just agreeing with some of the issues raised by Abulia, and putting my viewpoint / perspective out there in the ether, and it's up to yourselves if you think it has any valid merit.

I think it would be more like a department store having a playroom that the kids kept getting out of hand and bickering in and they decided to get rid of because it wasn't worth the effort, as all the adults were happily going about buying clothes.

Priceless...

But without the playroom to dump the children, the parents go down the road to the other store with creche facilitys. who wants to drag the kiddies around the grown up sections

More so Oni, less so you, MRU. Actually... why did you say Oni? He's a top guy but it's probably been less than a week since mentioning something about "Nintendo" and "Kiddy games".

Because he's one of the few on the forum who though usually I guess we would think of as a Sony supporter, he actually has / will have all of the consoles. A lot of users in the section only have 1 and seem to base all opinion and negatives of opposing formats on the one they own, rather than from experience of all the formats.




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I think that almost to a tee what I lost

 

[Lord Blackadder]

I think that any forum which believes it requires a dedicated mod is probably one which needs some fixing instead.

I agree.

I guess it comes down to the fact that people should report problems whenever they happen rather than letting a flamewar develop. If the mods get reports action will be taken.

 

[MRU]

I guess it comes down to the fact that people should report problems whenever they happen rather than letting a flamewar develop. If the mods get reports action will be taken.

I always use the report tool when i catch one in time, but there are times where your offline for a while (earning some pennies ) and in the interim period a flame war has broken out, so when you come back you feel damage has already been done, what is the point of reporting it at that stage.

as an analogy..

It's like catching someone planting a bomb (at that point I report straight away) , but if I come back after the bomb has gone off and people are picking up the pieces and battling over the subsequent mess , i dont see the point in reporting it at that stage..

maybe I should. Its just that theres usually some reasonable points from posters mixed in with the vitriol...

 

[MacNut]

Maybe if those certain members are banned for a day or 2 then maybe they might get the hint and behave.

 

[bousozoku]

This is probably the 10th thread on this subject and it seems that they're only posted after someone has gotten slammed by someone else.

Unfortunately, people seem to be so enthusiastically defending their platform that they don't consider reporting or walking away.

It's been mentioned that no moderator responds or they rarely respond to reports. In the year that I was a moderator, I would say that there were 15 reports from the Games forum and those were mostly where someone started a flamefest and reported it when it got too hot for them.

The only time I found real problems was when I was reading the forum threads because I was seeing it without bias.

Perhaps, the forum should be closed temporarily and all gaming threads in other parts of MacRumors should be deleted when created. It would probably be a good idea to limit gaming threads to Mac OS X or Windows.

 

[MRU]

Perhaps, the forum should be closed temporarily and all gaming threads in other parts of MacRumors should be deleted when created. It would probably be a good idea to limit gaming threads to Mac OS X or Windows.

That would be re-active stance rather than pro-active.

Where do you draw the line. Close down community threads because they aren't mac based topics ? Close down music discussion ? In fact why allow windows discussion, this is a mac forum....

I think thats a tightrope your walking on if you do that and it doesnt benefit anyone, and censorship on that scale is totaly draconian.

 

[MacNut]

The difference is that people in the community threads get along and don't have flame wars.

 

[MRU]

True, but put it this way. To close down the gaming section completely, and then close down any thread that even mentions or brings up gaming, is going to require a lot more moderating and time that just appointing an extra mod or two too keep any eye on that section.

Its a complete dichotomy. We dont want to mod more than we have to, but we'll close down the section and in future we will keep an eye on every post and erase / close any threads that start discussion on that subject, which means we will end up moderating a lot more..

 

[MacNut]

Just make the games forums like the political forums, no post counts.

 

[WildCowboy]

I always use the report tool when i catch one in time, but there are times where your offline for a while (earning some pennies ) and in the interim period a flame war has broken out, so when you come back you feel damage has already been done, what is the point of reporting it at that stage.

Because at a minimum, reporting it later can get the flame war stopped. Yes, it's best to stop it early, but later is better than not at all. And it alerts the mods to the degree of the problem and points out potential problem posters to them.

The mods have said many times that they'd rather have too many post reports than too few.

 

[Abulia]

But I dislike how moderators (who give up their own time to sort the forum out) get hassle for asking us, as the users of the forum, to help out by reporting posts. They really can't be expected to read every thread.

Hence the request to have a moderator who represents/visits the games forum on a regular basis.

A forum is like a community. It has ebbs and flows. When you read a particular forum and someone posts the 10th anti-PS3 thread within two days it doesn't take a lot of imagination to see where it's going to go. Also, someone who is familiar with the regular posters and knows "who the troublemakers are." (I've no idea if the moderators keep a private "tick sheet" of offenders.)

It's something I think would be good for the whole forum, although it seems the Games forum has more problems than the others, and it's because of this bickering I tend to stay clear.

Gee...it almost sounds like having a moderator that visits the Games forum and helps keep things orderly might be a good idea... Perhaps I should mention that sometime...again.

A mod to delete posts like as soon as they are spotted, that would stop that as it keeps the thread on topic. Closing your eyes and making loud noises doesnt make the trolls go away. A more pro-active rather than re-active stance, albeit that uses commonsense.

MRU gets it.

I dont think this request for more moderation on the gamer section should be seen as a 'complaining against the mods' stance. Mods do a great job and their help is appreciated by many, we know its a voluntary position and have utter most respect for that. Asking for a little extra help isn't a bad thing.

Agreed. Yet by asking for perhaps more moderation or at least a moderator who frequents/is familiar with the forum in question is apparently be viewed as "hassling" the moderators.

I've no axe to grind here with the moderators (I've never been on their bad side) but if I knew the turn this discussion was going to take I'm not sure I would have posted it, in hindsight.

I guess what I'm saying is that, if something is so problematic as to apparently require one (or more) dedicated moderators to keep things in line, it might be better to eliminate it.

Wow. Just...wow.

I think that any forum which believes it requires a dedicated mod is probably one which needs some fixing instead.

Okay, for the third time since it's been missed we're not asking for a "dedicated" mod. We're asking for a moderator who reads/visits the forum in question with some regularity and can do some pro-active moderation.

And for the statement that there couldn't possibly be anyone who could do the job and remain objective, I can think of at least three people who I'd personally have no problem with being a mod, and I rarely agree with them.