Basically Apple has to open NFC because the German banks are too stupid to connect. Lots of other banks are available. I hope apple can stop this stupid regulation from our socialist government
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Germany Passes Law Forcing Apple to Open Up iPhone's NFC Chip to Apple Pay Rivals, But Loophole May Exist
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Just popped into read that the usual rednecks and Tim lover's are now suddenly experts on German legal issues, certainly more expert than German courts and lawyers, and have put across bulletproof arguments as per usual.
Anytown, USA must be so enriched to have you living in it and never stepping outside it's city limits and yet still manage to be the eminent expert on every single thing happening around the world.
Anytown, USA must be so enriched to have you living in it and never stepping outside it's city limits and yet still manage to be the eminent expert on every single thing happening around the world.
Very unlikely, as Germany has over 80M people and it's a market Apple is unlikely to forfeit for Apple Pay even if they have to allow some concessions. Furthermore last I checked the EU antitrust was also looking into this, which means in the future it could very well become an EU-wide regulation.
On top of that, the German regulation has an exemption if opening the NFC capability would compromise security, which is actually Apple's claim. If Apple is telling the truth they can just prove it and be exempt, but if they are not it means the "security" argument is actually a foil and the true motivation is preventing competition.
Good riddance.
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Because most customers (in Gemany) don't use Apple (market share < 30%). And why should German banks be forced to pay Apple. They would rather provide their own service and keep their money.
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My guess: Apple will angle for the loophole, and if it does not get that, it will withdraw Apple Pay from the German market, and not allow any financial systems to access NFC.
Why ? Because Apple owns almost all of the reputational , technical & financial risk for any code running in the NFC subsystem on iOS & iPhone.
NFC processors do not have the range of hardware security features against malware that Apple builds into its A-series processors, and are much more vulnerable.
The security arguement is essentially what they argued the loophole conditions in Australia, although the legal context is different in the German situation.
Why ? Because Apple owns almost all of the reputational , technical & financial risk for any code running in the NFC subsystem on iOS & iPhone.
NFC processors do not have the range of hardware security features against malware that Apple builds into its A-series processors, and are much more vulnerable.
The security arguement is essentially what they argued the loophole conditions in Australia, although the legal context is different in the German situation.
Because Apple Pay is built on crap: credit cards. Obsolete concept, obsolete technology, obsolete service providers, each taking their share for doing nothing.
Exactly.
Apple does not have much to lose in Germany, but a lot to lose globally.
They’ll just pull Apple Pay out of the German market, AND not allow third party access (just like any other market where Apple Pay hasn’t launched)
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Please don’t tell us you are advocating For bitcoin or something.
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I don’t agree here. For Apple, Germany is currently a smaller market than say Australia, they can totally afford to take the hit by pulling Apple Pay put of the German market.
I think they will argue strongly for the loophole, and withdraw if they can’t get that arguement accepted.
Cose there might be someone with a better idea? Apple Pay, like more Apple products/services, are not infallible. I love them, but want to have a free choice who I trust with my payments.
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Absolutely... except they never will... developing common standards has allways proofed to be the better option.
Wow I missed that from WWDC, thanks for sharing! I guess they'll take their time to release an update to support NFC but at least it is possible.
I can only see a positive for Apple here. They currently only have a 20% share in smartphones in Germany. With more choice of payment systems, more people will probably consider getting an iPhone, now that they can use alternatives to Apple Pay. If the choice is to sell a phone and have the user use an alternative to Apple Pay, or to not sell an iPhone at all, I think they're better off making a sale of an iPhone.
I use apple pay, but there are times when others would be more convenient. Give the NFC functionality to the user and let them decide. I'm quite certain any security vulnerability can be fixed, as other hardware manufacturers aren't having a problem.
This began a long time ago when special proprietary tools were required to work on Mac computers. It's incredibly annoying, and there appears to be no end in sight. And make no mistake, it is entirely driven by money, nothing else.
This began a long time ago when special proprietary tools were required to work on Mac computers. It's incredibly annoying, and there appears to be no end in sight. And make no mistake, it is entirely driven by money, nothing else.
The security involves firmware running within the Secure Enclave, which obviously only Apple maintains (and almost certainly only gives a limited number of engineers at Apple access to change)
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More likely their solution would comply, but have some set of the following:
- the companies be required to be based in Germany
- require those companies to pay an ongoing license fee
- third party payments be an app you have to download then manually run
- having the feature fail if the transaction is not taking place in Germany
- requiring the user to opt into 'full NFC control' by an App
- having the OS pop up a dialog saying that Apple cannot assure the user of the security of a financial transaction
and so on.
I suspect instead Apple will just say that third parties cannot write to the Secure Enclave, so it is effectively like asking a bank to make their chip and pin card work for other bank accounts.
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I don't trust apple employees.
Apple Store worker 'texts himself customer's intimate photo'
After a phone screen repair, the woman was shocked to find an "extremely personal" photo had been sent.
www.bbc.com
Nothing like painting a broad stroke with a sample size of one out of 120,000.I don't trust apple employees.
Apple Store worker 'texts himself customer's intimate photo'
After a phone screen repair, the woman was shocked to find an "extremely personal" photo had been sent.
The fact they left a loophole shows how confident they deem themselves in this field.. Just look at our State Minister for Digitization and her track record: <insert tumbleweed-GIF> 
Having said that, I’m with Apple—if it’s a security concern opening up that chip, I expect them to argue strongly against it.
Having said that, I’m with Apple—if it’s a security concern opening up that chip, I expect them to argue strongly against it.
You can do those things as of iOS 13. Your office and the metro need to support loading your details into the iPhone before you can use NFC. Blame them, not Apple.
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Tokenisation absolutely benefits you in bricks and mortar stores as this is where most of the skimming occurs; at compromised terminals. Tokenisation allows a single transaction only per token and all your credit card details are kept private. Non tokenised transactions send all your CC details to the terminal which is what allows skimming to happen in the first place.
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I seem to recall hearing that the NFC hardware on iOS was recently opened for third party use, other than payment solutions.
Here in Australia, my bank has NFC on the ATM. I can select either my debit card or credit card from ApplePay, tap the ATM and withdraw cash without needing a pin. ApplePay is accepted at every NFC terminal. The ones that specifically support ApplePay don’t require a pin regardless of purchase amount (I’ve spent over $2,000 without requiring a pin). Those terminals that don’t specifically support ApplePay require a pin on purchases over $100 - just like tap and go using the card.
I think its a good and the right thing to do to open NFC for other applications that offers the same function as Apple Pay. Good because it opens competition and more options. Think about it, what if iPhone's Bluetooth will only pair with Apple peripherals?
Security and privacy once again is used as an excuse by Apple. Its like Bush in its Iraq war using WMD to scare people and and used it as an excuse to go war.
But anyway, its Germany's law, they should follow it, right? What I found funny is lots of here hate Germany for this and yet supported Apple on the issue about China and Hong Kong because in their defense Apple is just following the local laws in that case no reason to bash Germany here
Security and privacy once again is used as an excuse by Apple. Its like Bush in its Iraq war using WMD to scare people and and used it as an excuse to go war.
But anyway, its Germany's law, they should follow it, right? What I found funny is lots of here hate Germany for this and yet supported Apple on the issue about China and Hong Kong because in their defense Apple is just following the local laws
in that case no reason to bash Germany here