Germany Urges EU to Require 7 Years of Updates and Repairs for iOS Devices

[mr_jomo]

I don't know why some of our US friends on this forum are so upset about this potential legislation?

If anything, Apple is grinning all the way to the bank:
1 - Apple already has the software development capacity in place and are essentially in compliance at marginally
increased cost
2 - with Apple's existing buy-back programs and long-lived repair services the company is very well positioned for the spare-parts/time to repair requirements.

If anything this initiative will make Apple even more competitive in the EU ... maybe it is time to buy stock? (not advice ... obviously 🥳).

 

[hagar]

I doubt the EU has the courage to impose these laws to ANY Chinese tech company like Huawei or Xiaomi..... they'd be bankrupted if they were legally forced to "support" (tech support, material support, parts and labor repairs) their old devices from 4 years past.

Again, the EU being selective hypocrites... they are singling out the big successful US companies. No surprise here.

You obviously haven’t read the article. This proposal would clearly affect all manufacturers, not just Apple.
Both Samsung and Huawei have already expressed concerns. Your complaint about the EU has no validity. No surprises here.

 

[hagar]

Again, my problem is that EU countries seem to have a problem with American tech companies.

A great example is Spotify complaint to the EU about Apple. Even though both were competing in the American market. Spotify went to the legal venue they thought they would have the best luck in




If Apple were to exit the market, the EU would lose more than Apple would.

Why would Apple ever consider exiting the EU market. That’s just absurd and not how businesses work. If Apple has no issues dealing with China or the US, it should definitely have no issue with the EU.

 

[dumastudetto]

Apple what are you going to do when they come for you? 7 years is a very long time in computers. What happens to the EU if no one will sell their phones there?

I'll almost be impressed if Apple is confident enough to pull out of an annual $68bn market, to avoid having to provide a few security patches and refurbished parts for old devices. I doubt investors would be equally so impressed as me.

 

[Whathappened]

Yes, and we’re free to criticize the EU.

Who said you weren’t free to do that?
Is this you simply unable to realize the weakness of the original poster’s argumentation or is this already a sign of the new reactionary alt-right bs?

 

[Grey Area]

I don't know why some of our US friends on this forum are so upset about this potential legislation?

If anything, Apple is grinning all the way to the bank:
1 - Apple already has the software development capacity in place and are essentially in compliance at marginally
increased cost
2 - with Apple's existing buy-back programs and long-lived repair services the company is very well positioned for the spare-parts/time to repair requirements.

If anything this initiative will make Apple even more competitive in the EU ... maybe it is time to buy stock? (not advice ... obviously 🥳).

Agreed. I would hope this could finally put some serious pressure on Qualcomm to extend their very limited support phase for their chipsets - a major reason for the poor update situation on Android.

 

[Whathappened]

Guess only time will tell if mobile devices will reverse back to the 1990s when laptops are at least 3 times current price range. Part of the reason for those price (back then) was the Operating Costs for extensive parts storage as well as lack of economy of scale to run small quantity parts production when sudden surge runs the existing stock dry (esp. entering the 4-5th year). Back then, some laptop manufacturers had a 7 or 10 years parts available policy. But the parts are damn costly due to several factors.

Good luck EU. Ever wonder why the same iPhone retails at higher price in US and EU than some parts of the world? And maybe rest of the world if manufacturers decide to penalise all consumers in blanket policies instead of only those in EU.

Apple has largely been meeting this 5-years product cycle (software and hardware wise) so Apple is lesser impacted if the new regulation/law stays on 5 years. Android devices will be in for a serious rough journey given their business model have always been short runs with limited quantities + short lifecycle/lifespan and then move on to new models.

Quoting Steve Jobs: It is all about trade-offs.

Yes, Apple is less impacted and nobody said that possible law would be aimed at Apple exclusively.
It will force android phone makers to improve.

 

[danny842003]

Security, yes. Repair parts, maybe not so much. Apple could probably do it, but android makers don’t build in the same quantity that Apple does.

I really dislike the EU dictating to American companies.

Then don't operate in the EU problem solved.

 

[Shanghaichica]

Apple already provide 5 years of software updates so they are doing well already.

 

[macfacts]

So you are angry that the EU could force a company to offer you spare part for your broken phone?

Interesting.

"Right to repair", a lot of people are against that.

 

[joecomo]

This could have interesting impact for the Apple/Android ecosystems.

Fulfilling the law would be quite easy for Apple, but a real buttpain for
Android. That could push prices for some phones with others just not available in
Europe anymore. This could mean a big win for Apple.

On the other hand long term viability was a big plus of iOS in the past.
This competitive advantage would be driven down by the regulation, which might help Android
(at least the top segment)

 

[Swift]

Let's see: iOS 15 is compatible with the iPhone 6s. It came out in 2015? So it still works, and will, I presume, not able to updated with software after that. The truth is, the idea of being able to replace all parts at all times, is not possible, without making a phone the size of a brick. But basic things like a new screen, a battery, etc., are quite feasible. But being able to put in a new board? Really? I think governments at some point miss the facts of the growing miniturization of the chips and so on that are critical to progress in phones.

 

[twistedpixel8]

I was thinking the same thing, just like recycling, I throw away amazon boxes etc, I have neighbors coming over and telling me how bad of a person I am because I don't recycle. they even tried to pull them out of my trash can, I called the cops. cops told them to stay out of my trash LOL. I only did it to be petty, and was annoying to see them acting like raccoons in my trash

stupid tree huggers.

but seriously, its their choice to do whatever they want with whatever they own. I support this fully, don't care about its wastefulness, it isn't your say in anything someone else does.

/endrant on people trying to take away my freedoms just to better their opinion

A few years ago I would have been absolutely certain you were mocking him but these days you need to be really careful as there are a lot of wack jobs that actually think like that.

 

[Swift]

"Right to repair", a lot of people are against that.

Not against it. But there are many things most Apple people prefer to endless refurbishing of an old phone. Apple is now going to have 4 nm systems on a chip. They are insanely complex. I prefer to keep innovation going on. I believe Apple should make parts available to third-party techs, but there's a limit to what can be done. The worst of busybodies seem, at times, to think they want progress of the iPhone-- and the others -- to end somewhere that just more convenient to users. Apple buyers want the progress to continue.

 

[MhaelK]

Honestly, I see then biggest treat to Apple in this that Android phones then will come with mandatory updates for 7 years compared to the current 1-3 year upgrades on most products.

One major Selling point for NOT going Android has been the uncertainty about the lifespand of the up-to-date software on the phones. With that uncertainty gone, cheaper mid-range Android phones with great(okay)ish specs, oled screen and modern designs might become a competitive force. Apple will have to update the design of the iPhone SE from outdated.

 

[bmot]

Maybe it’s mainly US citizens who rather pay less initially and opt for Apple Care if they want additional peace of mind? While in Europe it’s more common practice to have robust legislation to protect the consumer from corporate greed. Just a guess.

At no point was argued that paying less is something that people in the EU don’t like. Actually they would love to, because Apple products here are significantly more expensive than in the US.

 

[MhaelK]

This could have interesting impact for the Apple/Android ecosystems.

Fulfilling the law would be quite easy for Apple, but a real buttpain for
Android. That could push prices for some phones with others just not available in
Europe anymore. This could mean a big win for Apple.

On the other hand long term viability was a big plus of iOS in the past.
This competitive advantage would be driven down by the regulation, which might help Android
(at least the top segment)

As stated just above. I believe this would make many android phones more competitive if they were forced to comply with this.

 

[bmot]

I personally don't want repairability if it means sacrificing innovation. I would rather have a disposable iPhone if it was cream of the crop technology. people need to get over the fact that things are going to be too sophisticated to be broken down anymore. I will support voting in anyway I can to take away right to repair to keep things innovating smaller/sleeker.

Looks like you got brainwashed too into believing that those two things mutually exclude themselves. More complex technology does not mean more complicated repairability. If companies build their devices more modular replacing one part could be done by anyone. It is just a matter of will and approach. Apple does not want you to be able to repair their products. They want you to buy a new device. That is the only reason why their products are a mess to fix. They are just very good at telling you otherwise. And they spend a lot of money to make you believe their stories.

 

[joecomo]

As stated just above. I believe this would make many android phones more competitive if they were forced to comply with this.

Yes - but with a reduced cost advantage and less choice (as some low end offers would just vanish from the European market). So I would assume this only helps the high-end Android offerings.

 

[Shirasaki]

Again, my problem is that EU countries seem to have a problem with American tech companies.

A great example is Spotify complaint to the EU about Apple. Even though both were competing in the American market. Spotify went to the legal venue they thought they would have the best luck in

Probably has a bit of something to do between 2016 and 2020. Not to say they are closely related but could mean something.

 

[Shirasaki]

but those same customers don't realize that the bulk of those warranty extensions and storage costs are gonna end coming out their own pockets.

Much like amazon screwing up sellers selling products on their platform when issue happens, same happens here, just that EU screws up manufacturers. Someone is going to be loser one way or another.

Besides, for mega corps, they have unlimited resources to be able to tackle the issue nicely while still complying with local law. That number won’t be 30%-40%. The requirement is they keep a number of parts available, or offer longer term repair services whenever available, or offer better incentives for trade-in old devices. There’s a lot of ways to handle this warranty issue EU is trying to address.

 

[InTeCredo]

Apple are the only phone manufacturer I know of that provide software updates for 5 years.

I hope they ask the same of smart TVs. They are even worse than Android phones for updates.

As an owner of SONY flatscreen TV, I concur with this statement. When Germany switched from DVB-T1 to DVB-T2 a few years ago, my TV no longer can receive the new signal. I had no idea of its glaring issue and that my TV was at its end of product cycle when I bought it. I have either to buy the tiny converter box (they don't always work consistently), to subscribe to the VDSL TV service, or to replace it with newer TV that can receive the DVB-T2 signal. SONY doesn't provide any upgrades or updates for its not-so-legacy TV sets. Like Apple, SONY would rather want you to buy new TV set...and keep with Johnsons.

 

[5232152]

Again, my problem is that EU countries seem to have a problem with American tech companies.

A great example is Spotify complaint to the EU about Apple. Even though both were competing in the American market. Spotify went to the legal venue they thought they would have the best luck in




If Apple were to exit the market, the EU would lose more than Apple would.

The EU has a problem with rampant financial companies that will abuse and reduce any liability to get more money. You think Apple pays for the roads their employees use to go to work? Of course not, they end up offshore. What you are defending is not just European countries being against abusive behavior against citizens in the EU - but even more so in the US.

Oh and the EU would be fine without Apple, just like it once was. There are plenty of alternatives. But Apple like the idea of 445 million people living with more money than the majority of Americans and also the social and political stability, which you can hardly say America is having a lot of these days.

 

[MhaelK]

Again, my problem is that EU countries seem to have a problem with American tech companies.

A great example is Spotify complaint to the EU about Apple. Even though both were competing in the American market. Spotify went to the legal venue they thought they would have the best luck in

Wait, So you don’t think Apple and Spotify was/is competing in the European Market?

Spotify has close ties to EU, so why wouldn’t they complain to the EU about unfair market competition.

1) Spotify (/ˈspɒtɪfaɪ/; Swedish: [ˈspɔ̂tːɪfaj]) is a Swedish audio streaming and media services provider founded on 23 April 2006 by Daniel Ek and Martin Lorentzon.[5]

2) Spotify is listed (through a Luxembourg City-domiciled holding company, Spotify Technology S.A.[1]) on the New York Stock Exchange in the form of American depositary receipts.

I fail to see how this is a great example of EU having a problem with American tech companies. The EU only cares about American Companies breaking laws within the EU or when companies operates online directly towards EU citizens. And if you feel that a company breaks the rules of a certain region, why would you take it to court in another region - that doesn’t make any sense, do you think that is how American companies do it?

 

[AlexESP]

Who is we?

Any of us.

Who said you weren’t free to do that?
Is this you simply unable to realize the weakness of the original poster’s argumentation or is this already a sign of the new reactionary alt-right bs?

There’s a tendency here to examine the finger instead of pointing at the moon. We all know Apple must comply EU laws, the question itself is whether the proposal is good or bad, ”Apple can get out of the EU market” has nothing to do with that. Same with people saying “If you don’t like X from Apple, don’t buy it”. We’re here to discuss precisely that kind of things. And why do you think that has anything to do with politics?