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good riddance os X Lion

Nameci said:
Then stick with Lion if that serves you best. I have Lion on an old macbook and I don't have any issues connecting on a windows network...
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His point was you can't stick with Snow Leopard if you have to buy a new machine. Its another short coming of how apple handles its OS upgrades, but until now didn't matter to much because their new OSes were improvements... now thats simply not true.
 
jameslmoser said:
Again, both of you.. I never said have to, not having to is an option, an added feature.. Unlike with lion it's shoved down your throat if you want it or not. And you guys seriously need to discover open source software. I didn't mean pay for any of it. Apple uses so much open source software to put together their os it's not funny. They didn't write the whole thing.
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You can generally not use the features that irritate you. But admitting that would destroy your argument. Since you asked, I don't use much of Apple's software beside iTunes and the Mac App Store. I don't use iCal, Address Book, or Quicktime. Instead, I use options from other sources, such as LibreOffice, VLC, and so on. Why do you keep jumping to conclusions about what other people use?

jameslmoser said:
And you say windows like its a bad thing.. Compared to lion it is not. And I am quite happy with snow leopard. iOS X Lion isn't an upgrade, so snow leopard is still the best version of os x.
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Lion is not iOS X, no matter how much you want to pretend otherwise. Your belief that Snow Leopard is the best version of OS X is an opinion, also no matter how much you believe otherwise. SL is certainly a fine OS – but it is not the last word in desktop OSes. Neither is Lion. At this point, everything you write reads like you're complaining just to complain.

jameslmoser said:
I work in IT. I know of no one personally who likes lion over snow leopard, or any one who switched to macs because of lion. I do know people who are going to windows because of lion. Also, since lion has been out about 6 months now and Mac os share in total is declining, and snow leopard is still over 50% of the Mac share while lion is less than 20%, I would like to know what you are basing your wager on.
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Anecdotal evidence is awesome, isn't it? I know plenty of people who like Lion over Snow Leopard, and more of the people I know switch to OS X from Windows every month.
 
Mackilroy said:
Anecdotal evidence is awesome, isn't it? I know plenty of people who like Lion over Snow Leopard, and more of the people I know switch to OS X from Windows every month.
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Who is being patronizing now? I didn't provide anecdotal evidence... look it up. The stats I gave are available online.

http://insights.chitika.com/2011/operating-system-market-share-report-november-2011/
http://insights.chitika.com/2011/mac-os-x-lion-fails-to-roar/

Here some more actual evidence to support my "opinion":
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1297875/

There are more examples, but I'm not going to bother looking them up for you, you probably won't bother looking anyways.

You can say "why would I buy additional software to do what the new OS provides", which was dumb, because you had to buy the new OS. And if people didn't have the latest version of Office and so many other programs, they probably had to spend money on that too. By your own admission, most of the software you use is opensource free software, so I don't know why you ever brought up that cost arguement.

As far as not using the features that irriate me, thats "a false arguement" as you would say, too! I used spaces, and I use expose, sometimes together, but mostly not. I had those options. I don't any more.

I share files between my windows machines and macs all the time... Lion doesn't want to work with windows... how do I not use that feature??? Hmm?

There are more holes in all of the arguements you provided than there was in any or mine. And yes most of what I say is my opinion, so is what you say your opinion. I started commented on this thread because I agreed with the OP, who also shares my opinion (judging by the threads that have been on going since Lion was released, we are far from the minority). So yes, I will complain. WTH are you still here?

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Joos24 said:
Yeah, Cut, Copy N Paste in Finder, especially the way it works in Lion. Windows 7 doesn't even do Cut, Copy N Paste the intuitive way Lion does it. So show me that 3rd party piece of software for Snow Leopard that will do this Mr. Balmer. :p
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I thought this was a joke, but I'm starting to think people are taking this seriously? Its almost an insult to all versions of Mac OS X to even bring this up.
 
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Joos24 said:
Yeah, Cut, Copy N Paste in Finder, especially the way it works in Lion. Windows 7 doesn't even do Cut, Copy N Paste the intuitive way Lion does it. So show me that 3rd party piece of software for Snow Leopard that will do this Mr. Balmer. :p
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Windows 7: Right click on file select cut/copy, click on other Explorer window right click select paste, done.

Yeah I guess thats not intuitive.
 
Mackilroy said:
False argument – you do not have to. You may want to, but you certainly do not have to. I didn't want to, as Lion works perfectly fine for me.
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Also, if you want to keep using your .Mac, err.. MobileMe,... er iCloud, right now you do HAVE to upgrade to Lion when June comes. If enough people "complain" then maybe Apple will actually do something, like release the fabled 10.6.9. The only reason they haven't already is because its one of the few things Lion has going for it over snow leopard.
 
Then you're better off using Apple's feedback page and writing them a well-reasoned, thoughtful note. Complaining about it here is as useful as spitting into the ocean.
 
Mackilroy said:
Then you're better off using Apple's feedback page and writing them a well-reasoned, thoughtful note. Complaining about it here is as useful as spitting into the ocean.
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Complaining about my complaining some how is more useful? At least my complaining was supportive of the thread topic.

I already gave them feedback...
 
Mackilroy said:
Then you're better off using Apple's feedback page and writing them a well-reasoned, thoughtful note. Complaining about it here is as useful as spitting into the ocean.
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Not really. I'd argue that a lot of current and future Mac owners read these forums and will base their next purchasing decision - at least in some part - on what sort of feedback is provided by those who already have experience.

I find other people's "real-world" experiences invaluable when deciding on which bit of hardware or software I'm next likely to buy.

After all, you can complain all you like to Apple, but it doesn't mean they'll fix it . . . Not unless people start voting with their wallets and stop buying a product because so many people are complaining.

Here's a great example of the power of persuasion: Lion uptake has almost flatlined

These forums have a lot more influence on the company's decisions than you probably give them credit for. Especially this one, as it's been around for years.
 
Mopar said:
Here's a great example of the power of persuasion: Lion uptake has almost flatlined
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Funny, only three days later Lion has doubled in percentage.

I would argue that the average computer user neither knows about these forums nor cares. They're more likely to ask someone they know in person whom they assume knows more about technical issues (which could easily be someone on this forum, which partially supports your point) or to go to a big box store such as Best Buy and try the devices they want in person.

And you certainly can vote with your wallet, but the problem for the people who despise Lion is that their vote is a drop in the bucket. Despite the gnashing of teeth and wringing of hands on multiple forums Apple's sales have kept going up (22 percent growth for the Mac unit this year, compared to 2.8 percent for the general PC market). That's pretty good.
 
Mackilroy said:
And you certainly can vote with your wallet, but the problem for the people who despise Lion is that their vote is a drop in the bucket.
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There you go again, doing what you are telling others not to.

By the source you gave, mac market share is still declining... most be a very BIG drop in that bucket.
 
Mackilroy said:
I would argue that the average computer user neither knows about these forums nor cares. They're more likely to ask someone they know in person whom they assume knows more about technical issues (which could easily be someone on this forum, which partially supports your point) or to go to a big box store such as Best Buy and try the devices they want in person.
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Whereas I'd argue that many people looking to buy a new Mac are likely to Google up a bit of research and end up at a site like this (though not necessarily this one - it could be the Apple Support forums, which have just as many people complaining about Lion). I think you underestimate the power of online review and opinion. Everyone is online now. Everyone has access to sites like these. I research almost everything I buy online, and I know a lot of people like me. The number is growing, too. How do you think we all ended up here?
 
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jameslmoser said:
I thought this was a joke, but I'm starting to think people are taking this seriously? Its almost an insult to all versions of Mac OS X to even bring this up.
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Why don't you quit while you're not ahead. That's why you keep getting rated down so often. No jokes.

rocknblogger said:
Windows 7: Right click on file select cut/copy, click on other Explorer window right click select paste, done.

Yeah I guess thats not intuitive.
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Oh, how I just love the lack of knowledge from these armchair technicians. On Lion you select "Copy" then go anywhere in the system and either Paste the object or Move it to that area. All this is done in one sequence. It makes it very proficient and productive for the user when they want to paste the same object in multiple files and/or completely move it. In Windows you can only either Copy n Paste or Cut n Paste, but you don't have the option to do both in one sequence.
Oy Vey, even on a Mac forum we have to be careful not to offend the Windows lovers. :rolleyes:

I never said Windows 7's cut n paste was unintuitive, but Lion does it much better. :p
 
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Mopar said:
Whereas I'd argue that many people looking to buy a new Mac are likely to Google up a bit of research and end up at a site like this (though not necessarily this one - it could be the Apple Support forums, which have just as many people are complaining about Lion). I think you underestimate the power of online review and opinion. Everyone is online now. Everyone has access to sites like these. I research almost everything I buy online, and I know a lot of people like me. The number is growing, too. How do you think we all ended up here?
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A good many people end up here or on Apple's forums because they have an axe to grind. Or because they have a genuine problem. Unless you're otherwise interested though, why would the average person sign up for an electronics forum? Even then, wouldn't the average person read a tech review site over a web forum? I know a lot of people in real life who are like you too – but they're a niche. They have always been a niche. They may not always be a niche, but they certainly are now.
 
About six years ago Mac OS Tiger was introduced. Some people balked at the changes and stubornly decided to not upgrade. In retrospect, was this a good decision?
 
Mackilroy said:
A good many people end up here or on Apple's forums because they have an axe to grind. Or because they have a genuine problem.
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Or because they want to read what real people in the real world have to say about a product - not just the professional reviewers.

Mackilroy said:
Unless you're otherwise interested though, why would the average person sign up for an electronics forum?
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You don't have to sign up to read most forums.

Mackilroy said:
Even then, wouldn't the average person read a tech review site over a web forum? I know a lot of people in real life who are like you too – but they're a niche. They have always been a niche. They may not always be a niche, but they certainly are now.
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Then we'll have to agree to disagree. Have a look at all the comments at the bottom of almost any review site - that tells you online research is not a niche anymore.

This thread has already had 7200 views. That's a lot.


Shazaam! said:
About six years ago Mac OS Tiger was introduced. Some people balked at the changes and stubornly decided to not upgrade. In retrospect, was this a good decision?
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I know I skipped OSX10.0 and 10.1 when they first came out more than 10 years ago. I certainly wouldn't recommend upgrading to Lion to anyone who doesn't need to. I'd recommend they wait until it gets sorted first.
 
A good many people end up here or on Apple's forums because they have an axe to grind. Or because they have a genuine problem.

Or because they want to read what real people in the real world have to say about a product - not just the professional reviewers.
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Macrumors would be the last place I would come for a product review. Like one poster mentioned, too many people with axes to grind. Can't really get an unbiased opinion from here. Both pro & con about Apple products.
 
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