Google Nexus One Phone Not an iPhone Killer?

[deconstruct60]

You keep talking about openness and that is why Android will succeed. Can you tell me any open source program that has taken the consumer world by storm?

First, Android is an OS not a program. However, for the moment just muddle that into one generic term and lets run with it.

Sure. Home internet routers. Lots of them have Linux on the inside.

Apache. 100's of million of consumer users interact with Apache every day.
(the significance being in what users actually "use" as opposed to which specific machine the cycles are consumed on. )

Firefox ( which is covered in other responses)

-You can only load 512MB of apps on Android. I have almost 3GB worth of apps on my iPhone.

No. You can only load 512 MB of code. Not an app (code + data). Since end users really don't interact with the file systems on iPhone/Android devices anyway why does it matter if the code and data are stored in different places on the file system. No one is looking at it and has no signficant impact on running the application.

-Because no one pays for Android apps, no dev is going to that platform unless they can live off of ads

For someone who is waves off sweeping generalizations you sure seem to leverage them yourself. The majority of App Store stuff is free too.
As mainstream consumers pick up Android devices there is no reason that will change. yeah, right now there is a higher than average presence of hard core open source folks on Android but the App store is suffering from a very similar sustainability problem of very low (or free ) prices couple with non 6-7 digit purchase volume numbers for a substantial number of developers.

-In the US T-Mobile's 3G coverage is far worse than AT&T

Why is Android restricted to just one 3G network. It is on Verizon's network whose 3G coverage is wider than AT&T. Android is cell service vendor neutral unlike iPhone (in the US). If coverage is a major issue that's a minus for the iPhoneOS.

BTW, the iPhone platform hasn't suffered because of the tablet. It has actually been Mac OS X that has suffered because of the iPhone and probably the tablet.

Not really. iPhone OS revenues help pay for shared core OS code. Additionally, OS and developer fees also help to spread the development tool development over a wider base of users. There is a mostly transferable skill base that can also be used for Mac OS X software.

Mac OS X devices primarily compete in the $1000 and up space. The iPhoneOS devices primarily compete in the less that $1000 space. ( the only overlap in pricing is the Mac mini which is a quirky space filler that Apple is somewhat committed to. Clearly they are conflicted about the product. )

 

[ChazUK]

It looks like crap and there's no multitouch.

So because you think that Android looks like crap it is "an alpha build of a touchscreen UI no one really wanted".

Android 2.1 (and 2.0) support mutitouch at an application level so there is no reason for developers not to use it (HTC added multitouch on the Hero at Android 1.5).

The thing is with Android, you aren't stuck with the default apps when it comes to core functionality. If you don't like the default app because of its lack of multitouch, there are alternatives (like Dolphin Browser which has multitouch on the Droid thanks to Android 2.0).

Multitouch isn't the be all and end all of a mobile OS (what Apple default apps even use multitouch? The picture viewer and Safari from what I remember).

 

[deconstruct60]

As a developer, the reason I've avoided android is rampant piracy, and their free trial policy.

What free trail policy?

http://www.android.com/us/developer-distribution-agreement.html

"...Such free trials for Products are encouraged. However, if you want to collect fees after the free trial expires, you must collect all fees for the full version of the Product through the Payment Processor on the Market. ..."

How is that significantly different than the Apple app store?

Or you talking about refund policy. (where folks use app for hours and then want money back after they got their giggles)

http://www.pcworld.com/article/171259/developers_complain_about_android_sales.html

 

[cmaier]

Multitouch isn't the be all and end all of a mobile OS (what Apple default apps even use multitouch? The picture viewer and Safari from what I remember).

Maps.

 

[cmaier]

What free trail policy?

http://www.android.com/us/developer-distribution-agreement.html

"...Such free trials for Products are encouraged. However, if you want to collect fees after the free trial expires, you must collect all fees for the full version of the Product through the Payment Processor on the Market. ..."

How is that significantly different than the Apple app store?

Or you talking about refund policy. (where folks use app for hours and then want money back after they got their giggles)

http://www.pcworld.com/article/171259/developers_complain_about_android_sales.html

Sorry. I guess technically i was referring to the refund policy.

 

[ChazUK]

Maps.

Aah yes, maps. I still don't know how android is as bad as LTD is portraying it.

 

[cmaier]

Aah yes, maps. I still don't know how android is as bad as LTD is portraying it.

Actually, EVERY built-in app supports multitouch - the keyboard is multitouch. I believe the on-screen Android keyboard is not?

 

[deconstruct60]

The issue is that many people use and enjoy an app for 24 hours, get well more than 99 cents of value out of it, then return it.

That is not piracy. That is not delivering something with an agreed upon value. If they return the app they are quite happy with not every playing it ever again. It is kind of hard to argue you delivered something with significant perceived value when the customer has that attitude.

If had a free-trail and paid for app this would substantive disappear. The customers that want one offs will do free and the ones that have shared perception on value will pay. At prices like $0.99 are in part trolling for the former population rather than the latter.

Likewise volume matters if trolling for users who want to use a "2 hour of utility" application. There will be more of those folks as the population rises and the phones are placed in the hands of folks who are easy come easy go with their money.

 

[ChazUK]

Actually, EVERY built-in app supports multitouch - the keyboard is multitouch. I believe the on-screen Android keyboard is not?

I'm not sure if the Android keyboard is multitouch capable (My HTC Hero uses HTC's own keyboard so I am not able to test the default Android keyboard) but I can't say I've ever had difficulties writing on either the iPod touch, iPhone 3g or my Hero with or without multitouch.

Regardless, this still doesn't explain why Android is "an alpha build of a touchscreen UI no one really wanted".

 

[MacFly123]

Apologies, it was Q1 2011. It was assumed, however, that if MS announces it for Q1 2011 that it would be pushed back to later that year, as per MS fashion. Some of the loyal WinMo sufferers, however, claim Q4 this year, and a few of them are claiming "any time in the next couple of months", and that "it will be mind-blowing."

LOL. That's really all that can be said at this point: LOL.

I have never seen such a powerful company drop the ball so badly and be so pathetically positioned for the future when such a HUGE shift in the industry is happening!

I think it is going to be like Vista. Way too little, way too far behind, and way too late!

Honestly the ONLY thing Microsoft has keeping them from complete irrelevance right now is Windows 7 which they lucked out on and finally improved after a HUGE DISASTER. Besides that, the XBOX still isn't anywhere near a money machine, and they have the vapor ware of the 'Courier'. They are in BAD SHAPE!

See the problem is Microsoft has never really had to truly COMPETE. After they got lucky with locking all the OEMs into a Windows monopoly, all they have been doing is trying to invade anything that threatens that stranglehold. But usually it is too little too late. And now with this shift to mobile computing and their absolute ineptitude, I think we are going to see a HUGE decline in the power of Microsoft! Unless they make some BIG changes in leadership and otherwise they are going to be very screwed on all fronts.

So in getting back on topic haha, I don't love Google, but I thank them for freeing us from the monopolistic mediocrity of Microsoft in the industry little by little!

 

[cmaier]

That is not piracy. That is not delivering something with an agreed upon value. If they return the app they are quite happy with not every playing it ever again. It is kind of hard to argue you delivered something with significant perceived value when the customer has that attitude.

That's like going to the movies, walking out when the credits start rolling and demanding your money back because you didn't stay for the whole film. The iPhone proposition is that you pay your 99cents and the transaction is done, and hopefully you get 99cents worth of enjoyment out of the thing (which isn't a very high threshold to meet). If not, leave negative feedback. Many apps fall into the kind of situation where you run them a few times. Maybe keep them around and run them once a month for a specific query.

On android this doesn't work because the developer can't get paid. Even if it's a use-once-a-month thing, the buyer/returner will just download a competitor's version next month (for <24 hours), and continue the cycle.

That's all fine and good for customers, but it's not great for developers. If you keep something for 24 hours, chances are you got your 99 cents out of it. I think the best solution would be time-locked trial apps (apple does this already with ad hoc distributed apps), where you get to try them for, say, 1 hour, or you get to launch them once.

 

[LagunaSol]

Home internet routers. Lots of them have Linux on the inside.

Apache. 100's of million of consumer users interact with Apache every day.

Wow, you're seriously going to use router firmware and Apache server software as examples of Linux success in the consumer space? Really?

Now that's dedication/desperation.

 

[LagunaSol]

I have never seen such a powerful company drop the ball so badly and be so pathetically positioned for the future when such a HUGE shift in the industry is happening!

Why the surprise? Microsoft has always been impotent when they haven't had a competitor's product to emulate.

Remember, they were late on that whole "Internet thing" too. Thank heavens for the great equalizer of monopoly power.

 

[newcronos]

Makes sense.

I suppose this is all generated by the same press machine that are desperate for page hits and ad clicks.

A lot of Apple fanboyz (some of which you can find right here ) absolutely love the term 'iPhone killer' too. It's their favorite overused bashing term for any new device that is coming out. Saying that such and such device would *never* be an iPhone killer because of this and that seems to thrill them greatly. Most of these people don't really know what they're talking about though, and apparently they need repeated justification (to themselves?) for their ownership of the iPhone

 

[saturniphone]

Obviously they're all out to make money. No kidding. But Apple's commitment to certain standards when it comes to tech is unique in the industry. Steve Jobs is concerned with quite a bit more than just doing a job and making a buck. I should certainly hope that the industry's best and brightest, hand picked by Jobs, are the same.

At Apple it isn't just about about making money. It's about making great products and redefining markets. it's about the product, not the dollar. The by-product, naturally, is profit. But Apple's spectacular success doesn't come from making the quickest buck from the least effort possible. That's for the Acers and the Dells.

if you think Apple is no different than any other tech company, then you (like so many) are somehow baffled by the secret of Apple's success (there really is no secret), or are being deliberately blind in order to effect an air of mock objecitivity.

This geek obsession with self-appointed honor is incredible. It must be the same reason they tend to love games with medieval themes. The idea that the people who work at Apple are sufficiently smarter, more qualified, more interested in "doing the right thing" whatever that means (hint, it doesn't mean anything since it's completely subjective) is just nonsense.

I am by absolutely no means baffled by how Apple makes money. They have defined a niche market and captitalized on it through the same principles that every capitalistic company does. I love, though, how Apple's success is due to their capacity for revolutionary behavior yet Microsoft's success is due to their propensity for evil.

It just blows my mind that a group of people who lust after a company who's tagline is "think different" can't seem to comprehend that lusting after a company because of some product they come out with is the very definition of conformity.

 

[cmaier]

Wow, you're seriously going to use router firmware and Apache server software as examples of Linux success in the consumer space? Really?

Now that's dedication/desperation.

To be fair, lots of consumers use routers. And lots of consumers use web sites that run on apache, or which use perl or python, etc.

 

[alexhasfun28]

I hope Nexus One could bring something to the table. Just so the competition could stir up a little, and see what Apple could bring/add in their 4th generation iPhone(if there's still time.)
But who knows, these are just rumors, and time will tell if all these rumors are to be true or switched up a bit.
Other than that i've honestly never liked the Android software. It's too cluttered, and confusing, and it doesn't have the that mind of "simplicity."
I see Palms WebOS as a "fun" software, and Apple's as a "smart", "more simple", software.

As for Google, I'm shocked & happy that they're competeing and putting themselves out there as an "iPhonekiller."
Atleast they're not acting like Motorola, and are claiming theor device as thee "iPhonekiller" and obviously, and truly won the crown of embarrassment, and not an iPhonekiller.
Don't get me wrong, the Droid is a nice phone. But!, it didn't meet the full standards of what a consumer was expecting. Like THEM claiming the Droid to BE a "Robot!"

Lies!!

 

[chstr]

it's gonna be an interesting month in tech

 

[*LTD*]

This geek obsession with self-appointed honor is incredible. It must be the same reason they tend to love games with medieval themes. The idea that the people who work at Apple are sufficiently smarter, more qualified, more interested in "doing the right thing" whatever that means (hint, it doesn't mean anything since it's completely subjective) is just nonsense.

Really?

Look at what came out of Apple over the last decade. Look at what everyone else churned out.

Apple seems to have a monopoly on talent (not just compliments), or at least the knowledge of how to exploit it effectively.

Something is going on in Cupertino. And it aint mediocrity.

 

[alexhasfun28]

it's gonna be an interesting month in tech

Hell yeah it will be!

 

[GQB]

I agree to some extent but one company to succeed another has to fail. The problem for Android is that all of the available oxygen is being sucked up by RIM and Apple. The devs will run to the platform with large marketshare. For all the press that Android and Palm has received, their influence on the market share has been minimal at best.

As right now the Nexus does some things better than the iPhone: better resolution, twice the RAM, better notification system, animated wallpapers and multitasking.

I'm glad there is competition. Hopefully it will force Apple to address these absent or lacking features.

Oh my god!!!
What so EVER will I do without animated wallpapers?
Apple is truly Doomed!!! DOOMED I SAY!!!

 

[ChazUK]

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; U; Android 1.6; en-us; Archos5 Build/Donut) AppleWebKit/528.5+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.2 Mobile Safari/525.20.1)

I agree to some extent but one company to succeed another has to fail. The problem for Android is that all of the available oxygen is being sucked up by RIM and Apple. The devs will run to the platform with large marketshare. For all the press that Android and Palm has received, their influence on the market share has been minimal at best.

As right now the Nexus does some things better than the iPhone: better resolution, twice the RAM, better notification system, animated wallpapers and multitasking.

I'm glad there is competition. Hopefully it will force Apple to address these absent or lacking features.

Oh my god!!!
What so EVER will I do without animated wallpapers?
Apple is truly Doomed!!! DOOMED I SAY!!!

I take it the rest of his points are just as silly as you completely ignored those.

 

[saturniphone]

Really?

Look at what came out of Apple over the last decade. Look at what everyone else churned out.

Apple seems to have a monopoly on talent (not just compliments), or at least the knowledge of how to exploit it effectively.

Something is going on in Cupertino. And it aint mediocrity.

If that is how you see the world or even think that concerning yourself about the perception of a company and its employees is a worthwhile use of your time then I have nothing left to say. Good luck.

 

[GQB]

Please tell these guys that their platform is closed.
http://htcpedia.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=55
http://android.modaco.com/category/409/htc-hero-hero-modaco-com/
http://forum.xda-developers.com/

There are hundreds of people involved in hacking and creating their own software and roms on various Android devices.

Oh, they're absolutely 'open', meaning any hacks they've done become applicable to a tiny sliver of the market. Apple's consistency (call it closed if you want) assures that work done by a developer has an audience of millions.

Guess which approach is going to garner more developer attention.

 

[*LTD*]

If that is how you see the world or even think that concerning yourself about the perception of a company and its employees is a worthwhile use of your time then I have nothing left to say. Good luck.

Why should I be concerned with that? I'm merely explaining something to you as part of the discussion.

It's really the only explanation. Someone at Apple is doing something right, and their #1 priority is making a great product, not making a quick buck. This should be obvious. Now either Apple has a jump on the competition with respect to talent, or how that talent is trained or otherwise exploited, OR there exist technology gods somewhere up in the sky and they speak to Steve directly, LOL. It doesn't take a whole of brain cells rubbing together to realize that "the Apple way" is probably different from the rest of the pack and is key to their success, in however many respects. Apple is a model for the rest of corporate America.