I do not agree at all. I think mobile apps are the future platform (which is here now). Think about it... what do most people use the browser for? Email, checking sites, research, etc.... why can't that be done on the mobile app? Duh! of course it can! Just the speed is not there yet... maybe when 4G comes out we will be there. I think the future is mostly mobile apps, not to say that web apps are going away. I think it will be hybrid between web and mobile. Apple has opened up the facet for this new wave of mobile computing!
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Google: The Web, Not App Stores, is the Future Of Mobile Development
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
what is this mobile app you speak of?
The debate here is web based vs native, both of which can be "mobile".
Mr. Gundotra: Let me remind you about Google Gears before Google goes off too far in distinguishing between native vs web.
I have had a 3G since launch, doesn't mean i am blind. Don't assume that because i don't bow down and praise all things apple, doesn't mean i don't own any products
What a load of ignorant crap, Jesus.
Palm had an app store a decade ago already and there are literally dozens of app stores for many years now, selling Palm, WinMo, Symbian, RIM or even Java apps.
Apple simply took this one step further and back at the same time: further by integrating to the OS and back by locking out any other than its own store.
Web apps are the future, regardless of what a bunch of clueless Macfans think, it's coming, big time.
Apple has little choice here, they have to embrace it or they will be left behind - just like iPhone is playing catch-up with others when it comes to features.
what is this mobile app you speak of?
The debate here is web based vs native, both of which can be "mobile".
Hell, I don't even understand his arguments - take this part, for instance:
"Email, checking sites, research, etc.... why can't that be done on the mobile app? Duh! of course it can! Just the speed is not there yet.."
WTF, since when "speed is not there yet" for email etc?
That might be a little harsh, but what i mean is the frame work to execute this is already in place. The hardware and infrastructure is no longer the setback, all we are missing is the software to tie it together.
Time to get serious
Okay, it's time to get serious and look at the real threat to our data, in the event of an Electro Magnetic Pulse attack on the areas where the data is stored - something no-one seems to have mentioned here yet.
Over dramatic? Do your own research and ask yourself which weapon will be used when the human rights lawyers ban the use of any ordnance that causes human collateral damage.
Now let's look at the prospect of an attack taking out EVERYONE'S Cloud-based apps all at once! And just for those who live in the USA who think the rest of us are still pushing handcarts, we're also at risk too. If that happened, the whole World would come to a grinding halt - until someone breaks out an old Mac, some old app DVDs and winds back the clock 2, 3, 4, 5 years.
Life in the Cloud? It's not sensible and it's not clever. What's happening now, in the real world, is that portable storage is increasing in capacity to cope with our needs. Soon there will be no need for mechanical drives as NAND flash memory is getting cheaper all the time. NAND flash drives are inherently more stable, and a lot less prone to damage, making them perfect for portable devices.
The reality is... we don't need the Cloud for our apps. It's that simple.
Google understands a lot of things. Google people are very clever. But they think like geeks. The majority of people just want a simple solution that works. And Google have only created and successfully monetised three business models: Ads in Search, Ads in Mail, Business Search. Everything else is wishful thinking... unless we flock like sheep from MS to the next Big Brother.
The big danger is that Google will try to become Microsoft. Maybe they already are. As an Apple user who's interest in Apple goes back to 1985, I can see the patterns developing already. When the people at the top of a company start predicting the future - based on what they're working on... which just happens to put all the competitions current business models in the trash, it's time to call in the guys in white coats.
Gates spent his entire career doing it - then every time ended up either steeling or copying Apple. The guys at Google are smarter, but not any more business-minded. Oh, and before I get flamed, Gates was just greedy, unscrupulous... and lucky, there was never any clever marketing plan.
If you want to see clever marketing, see Apple post '97 via iMac [USB, internet ready], PowerBook, iBook, iPod, iTunes... iPhone. One long run of flawless success in pure commercial terms.
Google entered a market dominated by incompetence. Remember Altavista? That was my search engine until someone sent me a link to the early Google. Again, no clever marketing. We needed Google. We don't need Cloud/Chrome et al.
Okay, it's time to get serious and look at the real threat to our data, in the event of an Electro Magnetic Pulse attack on the areas where the data is stored - something no-one seems to have mentioned here yet.
Over dramatic? Do your own research and ask yourself which weapon will be used when the human rights lawyers ban the use of any ordnance that causes human collateral damage.
Now let's look at the prospect of an attack taking out EVERYONE'S Cloud-based apps all at once! And just for those who live in the USA who think the rest of us are still pushing handcarts, we're also at risk too. If that happened, the whole World would come to a grinding halt - until someone breaks out an old Mac, some old app DVDs and winds back the clock 2, 3, 4, 5 years.
Life in the Cloud? It's not sensible and it's not clever. What's happening now, in the real world, is that portable storage is increasing in capacity to cope with our needs. Soon there will be no need for mechanical drives as NAND flash memory is getting cheaper all the time. NAND flash drives are inherently more stable, and a lot less prone to damage, making them perfect for portable devices.
The reality is... we don't need the Cloud for our apps. It's that simple.
Google understands a lot of things. Google people are very clever. But they think like geeks. The majority of people just want a simple solution that works. And Google have only created and successfully monetised three business models: Ads in Search, Ads in Mail, Business Search. Everything else is wishful thinking... unless we flock like sheep from MS to the next Big Brother.
The big danger is that Google will try to become Microsoft. Maybe they already are. As an Apple user who's interest in Apple goes back to 1985, I can see the patterns developing already. When the people at the top of a company start predicting the future - based on what they're working on... which just happens to put all the competitions current business models in the trash, it's time to call in the guys in white coats.
Gates spent his entire career doing it - then every time ended up either steeling or copying Apple. The guys at Google are smarter, but not any more business-minded. Oh, and before I get flamed, Gates was just greedy, unscrupulous... and lucky, there was never any clever marketing plan.
If you want to see clever marketing, see Apple post '97 via iMac [USB, internet ready], PowerBook, iBook, iPod, iTunes... iPhone. One long run of flawless success in pure commercial terms.
Google entered a market dominated by incompetence. Remember Altavista? That was my search engine until someone sent me a link to the early Google. Again, no clever marketing. We needed Google. We don't need Cloud/Chrome et al.
So much bitterness
But after... however many years, Palm still only have some 18 aps., Android - 4,900, Nokia - 1,088, Blackberry - 1,030. And the Blackberry has also been around TEN YEARS!
It's incredible how you're aware of the problems [see above, plus "...there are literally dozens of app stores"], and who's come up with the solution, yet you still feel the need to attack the people who follow the company that solved these problems!
And there's no backward or regressive element to the App Store model. Apple are preventing compatibility issues by locking it down. 65,000 apps, and 1.5 Billion downloads in 12 months says all you need to know about which model DEVELOPERS and USERS prefer.
You're behaving like a bundle of bitterness - willing on this Cloud fetish like some Apple-killing plague. Sorry to disappoint you, but the group most likely to follow the crowd are the MS Windoze sheep, who will flock to join the Linux geeks who're already there!
But after... however many years, Palm still only have some 18 aps., Android - 4,900, Nokia - 1,088, Blackberry - 1,030. And the Blackberry has also been around TEN YEARS!
It's incredible how you're aware of the problems [see above, plus "...there are literally dozens of app stores"], and who's come up with the solution, yet you still feel the need to attack the people who follow the company that solved these problems!
And there's no backward or regressive element to the App Store model. Apple are preventing compatibility issues by locking it down. 65,000 apps, and 1.5 Billion downloads in 12 months says all you need to know about which model DEVELOPERS and USERS prefer.
You're behaving like a bundle of bitterness - willing on this Cloud fetish like some Apple-killing plague. Sorry to disappoint you, but the group most likely to follow the crowd are the MS Windoze sheep, who will flock to join the Linux geeks who're already there!
1. You have not been stolen from because you are not a leading corporation and your data is not anywhere near as important.
2. Google is more secure than your computer.
Also, people are saying how they are worried about google employees viewing their data. Are you serious? Do you have any idea how server companies operate? They do NOT sit around reading people's email. It is heavily protected.
Actually there are nearly 30,000 apps for PalmOS from what I've read. The Pre, which runs a brand new Linux based OS called WebOS has about 30 official apps for it and about 30-40 unofficial apps. The SDK for the Pre was just officially released and the Pre App Store isn't going to be out of beta for a month or so AFAIK so the number of official apps probably won't go up until the App stores comes out of beta. There is an emulator though so that people can still run their PalmOS apps on the Pre if need be.
Changing to a brand new OS isn't easy or quick and being the long time Apple user that you are I'm sure you remember the epic thud that sounded with the initial release of OS X 10.0.
Lethal
I can see some devs doing this, but they will run into the same problem with Java applications on phones that we have today, where the 'Web Apps' will have to be tailored for every different handset due to CPU, memory, OS, screen size, interface and input differences.
It makes me so glad that Apple didn't allow java runtime apps in the first place and offered a native SDK.
One thing in favor of native apps, at least on the iPhone, is the fact that it has a good marketshare, not as good as other manufacturers. Take nokia who have a huge marketshare, their marketshare is split across multiple handsets where programming java apps, or symbian apps, have to be tailored to match each handset to reach the largest possible audience. Whereas because the iPhone and iPod touch has unity with pretty much all the things I mention above it makes the native approach more attractive to devs, and good app has a target audience in numbers of a similar level of the PS3 and 360.
The other mobile operating systems, symbian, android, windows mobile, are licensed out to various manufacturers, who make handsets of all different shapes/sizes with different components. All those differences make doing native apps a PITA, but equally it makes doing Java apps a PITA too, so it will be with web apps, unless by some stroke of luck all these phone companies agree on uniform hardware across the board, which simply won't happen.
It makes me so glad that Apple didn't allow java runtime apps in the first place and offered a native SDK.
One thing in favor of native apps, at least on the iPhone, is the fact that it has a good marketshare, not as good as other manufacturers. Take nokia who have a huge marketshare, their marketshare is split across multiple handsets where programming java apps, or symbian apps, have to be tailored to match each handset to reach the largest possible audience. Whereas because the iPhone and iPod touch has unity with pretty much all the things I mention above it makes the native approach more attractive to devs, and good app has a target audience in numbers of a similar level of the PS3 and 360.
The other mobile operating systems, symbian, android, windows mobile, are licensed out to various manufacturers, who make handsets of all different shapes/sizes with different components. All those differences make doing native apps a PITA, but equally it makes doing Java apps a PITA too, so it will be with web apps, unless by some stroke of luck all these phone companies agree on uniform hardware across the board, which simply won't happen.
Companies that artificially limit their phones to web apps are making a big mistake. Native apps do run better, so they are letting their competitors have a better product. They are consigning themselves to the cheaper, lower quality end of the market. Which is why the Pre is a contradiction: supposedly a high end product, and yet limited to these lower quality apps.
Im not into the "cloud" as my main source, and never will be.
The reason the companies are is that they now have unlimited revenue to generate as you pay monthly/yearly, etc. subscriptions.
I like to buy my apps knowing it is mine to access whenever... having it hang out on my computer as long as I want...use it once, or never, or suddenly a lot.
Again, the cloud is the way companies will milk you for money as they say it helps free up harddrive space - we have tons of harddrive space, and thats not an issue.
Not against having services that are portable, but then again I have a laptop and bought it to use and dont hop around computers as they suggest...nor would I plan on it or even trust using anothers computers... especially with the internet. [security reasons, all of a sudden they will be secure] lol
Besides that, you have your own vibe with your own computer, so this idea of going anywhere on anyones computer to work is not my idea of something that will be realistic.
Its more a lame attempt to sell the idea of perpetual payments from the world.
Sure they will do it, but I will not upgrade past that - Im sure to stay in the dino age with my last applications. [Take that google!] lol
Anyway, if companies spent as much time trying to make a better product as they did trying to milk people for money and make them virtual slaves to where their whole life they owe for something, then we would be past a level 0 civilization by now.
Peace
dAlen
The reason the companies are is that they now have unlimited revenue to generate as you pay monthly/yearly, etc. subscriptions.
I like to buy my apps knowing it is mine to access whenever... having it hang out on my computer as long as I want...use it once, or never, or suddenly a lot.
Again, the cloud is the way companies will milk you for money as they say it helps free up harddrive space - we have tons of harddrive space, and thats not an issue.
Not against having services that are portable, but then again I have a laptop and bought it to use and dont hop around computers as they suggest...nor would I plan on it or even trust using anothers computers... especially with the internet. [security reasons, all of a sudden they will be secure] lol
Besides that, you have your own vibe with your own computer, so this idea of going anywhere on anyones computer to work is not my idea of something that will be realistic.
Its more a lame attempt to sell the idea of perpetual payments from the world.
Sure they will do it, but I will not upgrade past that - Im sure to stay in the dino age with my last applications. [Take that google!] lol
Anyway, if companies spent as much time trying to make a better product as they did trying to milk people for money and make them virtual slaves to where their whole life they owe for something, then we would be past a level 0 civilization by now.
Peace
dAlen
If there are only 100 truly useful apps for a mobile device, then why not write them native for each one? Why not make the best phones we can.
The topic is the future of *mobile* development. As in mobile phones. Not sure what your laptop or computer hopping has to do w/that... I know it's a long thread but you could've at least read the OP.
Lethal
Maybe some apps scale better or are better executed web based. All i have been saying is that hardware and infrastructure are no longer the setback, its only software that is waiting to take us to the next level, however a lot easier said than done.
The fact is that you made a very good point. There are only a limited number of practical apps for any device.
For desktop computers it's document-based programs where you need a lot of editing space and a full, comfortable keyboard. For mobile phones it's things like weather information, maps, restaurant locations, up to date news. For tablets? We will find out once a company makes one physically nice enough to get mass adoption. But there will likely only be 5 or 10 things it is good for, such as reading e-books.
To make each of these devices the best they can be, we should program each natively. That is why Apple's approach of making a scalable OS, that compiles natively on each device, but at the same time gets reuse across devices through the OS libraries, is a better approach than making everything a web app.