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MP 1,1-5,1 GPU Compatibility List for cMP
- Thread starter Pentaxer
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flyproductions
macrumors 65816
The MVC-listing is for their modified cards with activated UGA-driver, which is obsolte today, as there ist the mentioned GOP-option available...for free!
Riot Nrrrd
macrumors 6502a
Thanks Alex. I’m not that familiar with Graphics Output Protocol (GOP).
I don’t have OCLP on my cMP5,1, it’s still running Mojave 10.14.6.
But maybe GOP relates to this question I have:
My cMP5,1 has an AMD RADEON HD 7950 Sapphire Mac Edition 3GB card. I have read elsewhere that if I hook up a monitor to one of its mini DisplayPort ports, the system will not boot unless the monitor is set to DP 1.1. I understand that once Mojave is running, the monitor can be switched to DP 1.2 to enable more/better resolutions; but even then, it is limited to 4K @30Hz (with the dip switch set to the “Mac” position).
I assumed this was a limitation in the Boot ROM and that every GPU card would have this issue (i.e., needing to set the monitor to DP 1.1 on boot). Is this not the case? I immediately thought, what if your system rebooted (due to a kernel panic or a power outage/recovery) while the monitor was set to DP 1.2? Then it wouldn’t boot until you were back standing in front of it to turn the monitor back to DP 1.1. 😱
If this isn’t the case with other video cards, e.g. if I could install an MVC RX580 card, leave my monitor set to DP 1.2 and the Mac would still boot (with boot screen) and run at 4K or 5K on my LG 34” Ultrawide 5K2K monitor, I would be overjoyed! Trying to limp along with my poor old cMP until Apple sorts out the M4 issues with Ultrawide monitors not providing ideal scaled resolutions.
Riot Nrrrd
macrumors 6502a
Why is the “activated UGA driver” obsolete? Especially if it works with Mojave?
Is the “aforementioned GOP option” useable if you do not use OCLP?
*Apologies, you sound German so I corrected your English a little
tsialex
Contributor
No, you just don't have pre-boot configuration support. The display will be blank and only works after the GPU drivers are loaded by macOS.
No. It will reboot and boot normally, it won't lock waiting anything.
Again, since MacPro5,1 pre-boot configuration only work with DP 1.1, if the monitor is set to DP newer than 1.1, you won't have pre-boot configuration, display will only work after the macOS loads the drivers.
tsialex
Contributor
UGA is only for MacPro3,1 and earlier. MacPro5,1 does not have UGA support.
MacPro5,1 have the Apple flavour of GOP (a very early version of what some two years later was improved and then standardized as UEFI GOP). This is the reason that make EnableGOP to work with UEFI GOP GPUs.
Riot Nrrrd
macrumors 6502a
When I boot my cMP5,1 with the Sapphire Mac edition card connected to a 30” Apple Cinema HD Display via Dual DVI, I get the boot screen at full 2560x1600 resolution. Obviously this is using DVI and not DisplayPort …
But why does pre-boot configuration support depend on which port you connect the monitor up to? Is it purely an issue with DisplayPort (and/or mini DisplayPort) and boot screens only being supported if connected to a DP 1.1 monitor, due to whatever video driver is used by the Boot ROM?
I could swear I’ve read posts on here where people have said the Mac refuses to boot if the monitor is set to DP 1.2 if it has the HD 7950 Sapphire Mac edition card. Maybe that’s the only card where it refuses to boot?
(Just because you haven’t seen this issue doesn’t mean others haven’t.)
OK, I’m assuming you are talking about “other” video cards here. (Not the HD 7950.)
I saw a post on here where someone said the MacVidCards guys flashed their boot screen-capable cards with a BIOS that was DP 1.2 aware/compliant. (Implying that maybe you didn’t have to switch monitor settings between DP 1.1 and 1.2.)
Maybe the MVC solution is obsolete and has issues with newer OSes, but I’m never going to upgrade it past Mojave as I have an Apple RAID Card (and a 4x2TB RAID 5 volume) plus an iSight FireWire camera that would break if I did.
Yes, maybe I’m overthinking this (I often do), but I guess I’m still confused how all of this works - if the Boot ROM only speaks DP 1.1, does it even matter what the BIOS on the card supports?
[Apologies if I am getting too OT for this thread.]
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tsialex
Contributor
Dual DVI, not DisplayPort 1,2 and newer.
DisplayPort 1,2 and newer only.
I had one here some years ago, and used a LG 29" 4K/DP1.2 for some time, never had this issue you read about, but maybe some displays will work differently than the combo I had.
Some people have a small display just for BootPicker, keeping the display with DisplayPort 1.2 off while booting will get you going.
I don't know if MacVidCards patched this MacPro firmware problem, AFAIK, no. Anyway, MacVidCards solution is legacy nowadays and have some issues with newer macOS releases.
This is simple and you are making it too complicated.
- The non working pre-boot configuration issue of MacPro5,1 and displays that have DP1,2 and newer DP ports happens only with GPUs with DP1.2 and newer ports when connected to displays newer than DP1.1. Does not happen with VGA/DVI/HDMI or DP1.1 displays or cards that only have DP1.1 ports.
- Changing the display to DP1.1 via the display own menu settings makes pre-boot configuration support to work again.
- Pre-boot configuration DOES NOT work if the display is newer than DP1.1.
- Display when in DisplayPort 1,2 and newer will work after around a minute when macOS loads the GPU drivers.
flyproductions
macrumors 65816
Because now Enable GOP is freely available, which can be easily injected to the Mac's or GPU's firmware and offers the exact same functionality as the MVC-modified ROMs.
Yes, it works independent of using OpenCore/OCLP.
You are perfectly rigtht. So thanks for the effort! 👍
kinless
macrumors regular
Question if anyone can answer. For context I'm currently in the process of decommissioning my 5,1 now that I've got an M4 Max. But I would like to reset it back to a machine that natively runs 10.6.8 (since UTM cannot yet successfully emulate it).
I currently use a 38" Ultrawide 3840x1600 monitor. Native resolution is achieved using either a GTX 680 or Radeon 580, but of course neither of those work with Snow Leopard.
There is an ATI 5770 laying around that I plan to put back in once the machine is reformatted, but it looks like the max resolution on that is 2560x1600. I've read reports that the 5870 can handle 4k (3840x2160) which would cover my use case, but can anyone confirm that the max resolution on the 5870 is higher than the 5770 before I drop coin on that GPU?
TL;DR is the 5870 the best card that would run 10.6.8, achieve 3840x1600 resolution AND support boot screen (for dual booting into Windows 10)?
I currently use a 38" Ultrawide 3840x1600 monitor. Native resolution is achieved using either a GTX 680 or Radeon 580, but of course neither of those work with Snow Leopard.
There is an ATI 5770 laying around that I plan to put back in once the machine is reformatted, but it looks like the max resolution on that is 2560x1600. I've read reports that the 5870 can handle 4k (3840x2160) which would cover my use case, but can anyone confirm that the max resolution on the 5870 is higher than the 5770 before I drop coin on that GPU?
TL;DR is the 5870 the best card that would run 10.6.8, achieve 3840x1600 resolution AND support boot screen (for dual booting into Windows 10)?
Are you sure? Why do I see the Apple Boot screen using an older HD5770 card in a Mac Pro 5,1 patched with the 144.0.0.0 firmware? This old card won't support Apple Metal, meaning no HW acceleration, but it still shows a boot screen, even though it does not know anything GOP. My understanding is that the firmware 144.0.0.0 patch adds GOP support.
tsialex
Contributor
The information I've posted about UGA/GOP support with the Mac Pro line is correct, see here. You can always dissassemble the Console and AppleFramebufferInfo modules to confirm it.
Without further info about the GPU, there are two possibilities, the first one is that the GPU is AppleOEM. The second one is that the GPU is a PC GPU flashed with the MacEFI from AppleOEM HD 5770.
Your understanding is incorrect, before the developement of EnableGOP by bmju, MacPro5,1 only had pre-boot configuration support with AppleOEM, MacEdition or third party flashed PC GPUs.
144.0.0.0.0 release have absolutely nothing to do with adding pre-boot configuration support with UEFI GOP GPUs, see the changelog of all the MacPro5,1 BootROM updates here:
MacPro5,1: BootROM thread | 144.0.0.0.0
For MacPro5,1 BootROM upgrades, please read the first post of the thread below to know how to do the firmware upgrade: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/mp5-1-what-you-have-to-do-to-upgrade-to-mojave-bootrom-upgrade-instructions-thread.2142418/ For MP4,1 to MP5,1 cross firmware flashing...
forums.macrumors.com
With the desktop line of Macs, Apple never provided a Mac firmware that is compatible with UEFI GOP GPUs/eGPUs for pre-boot configuration before the 2018 Mac mini. Displays connected to eGPUs that support UEFI GOP have pre-boot configuration support with the 2018 Mac mini.
2019 Mac Pro supports pre-boot configuration with UEFI GOP GPUs from the start, with internal or external UEFI GOP compatible GPUs.
Dayo
macrumors 68020
According to Vit9696 from OpenCore, there is a not well understood UGA protocol instance present on MP51:
OpenCorePkg/Library/OcConsoleLib/UgaPassThrough.c at 24246c6d0c87c02b5cedcef74b91ad4cb0032066 · acidanthera/OpenCorePkg
OpenCore bootloader. Contribute to acidanthera/OpenCorePkg development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com
tsialex
Contributor
According to Vit9696 from OpenCore, there is a not well understood UGA protocol instance present on MP51:
OpenCorePkg/Library/OcConsoleLib/UgaPassThrough.c at 24246c6d0c87c02b5cedcef74b91ad4cb0032066 · acidanthera/OpenCorePkg
OpenCore bootloader. Contribute to acidanthera/OpenCorePkg development by creating an account on GitHub.
Related to the legacy UgaDraw handles?
Anyway, for all effects of pre-boot configuration support with a MacPro4,1/5,1, Apple flavor of GOP is the protocol used.
Dayo
macrumors 68020
Every RefindPlus log from MP51 I have seen so far shows blank on UGA search of the handles.
Perhaps they found it some other way and it was not connected to any known handle.
Makes it difficult to understand how it might be working in such a case.
Could therefore somehow be a non-functional left-over item.
tsialex
Contributor
People here seems to assume that only GraphicsOutputProtocol that exists is the UEFI GOP, this is incorrect. Intel initially developed GOP with TianoCore EDK II, if I remember correctly back in 2006/2007 timeframe, then around 2008ish Apple started to improved the original Intel code and the result was implemented in the MacPro EFI of the early-2009 Mac Pro.
UEFI GOP was a much later evolution, with a lot of Microsoft contributions, that was only really standardized back in 2013 with the release of UEFI 2.3.1c.
UEFI GOP was a much later evolution, with a lot of Microsoft contributions, that was only really standardized back in 2013 with the release of UEFI 2.3.1c.
tsialex
Contributor
The card I tried is an original Apple ATI HD5770. But I also tried an ATI HD2600XT from a MacPro 3,1. No Problem with the usual grey standard Apple boot screen in my MacPro 5,1 with either card. I'm pretty sure the HD2600XT has neither VGA, nor Apple GOP support, and is UGA only.
My Mac is a MacPro 4,1 patched to 5,1 and it also has the 144.0.0.0 firmware patch. If I'm not mistaken, this firmware patch is also required for OpenCore and/or enableGOP.
This is why I questioned your statement that the MacPro 5,1 wouldn't support UGA and was Apple GOP only.
My Mac is a MacPro 4,1 patched to 5,1 and it also has the 144.0.0.0 firmware patch. If I'm not mistaken, this firmware patch is also required for OpenCore and/or enableGOP.
This is why I questioned your statement that the MacPro 5,1 wouldn't support UGA and was Apple GOP only.
Dayo
macrumors 68020
I suppose everything ordinarily visible says it is GOP only but the fly in the ointment is the mystery UGA mentioned in passing in the OpenCore comment linked earlier. Not been able to find out anything about this beyond that statement.
Knowing that the uEFI implementation on cMP is non-standard, it could be that this is on some kind of non-standard, Apple-only/specific "handle" that is not exposed by standard calls and hence, it appears that UGA is absent when checked "normally" but is actually there and used by Apple firmware as a compatibility support item when needed.
Seems to be the most plausible explanation for such GPUs showing bootscreen on MP51.
For example, a search of the uEFI System Table for CSM, needed for Legacy BIOS Boot, shows it is absent on cMP but they support Legacy BIOS Boot; which is done by other, non-standard, means.
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Dayo
macrumors 68020
Perhaps but would mean PC-only GPUs would also show bootscreens if just UGA fallback.
Mac EFI on the GPU may be supplying everything needed with such GPUs as Alex implied.
The vBIOS with such GPUs may just need to be run and it then does whatever is needed.
That is, the protocol the MP51 has, or does not have, may be irrelevant with such GPUs.
This is perhaps even more plausible and the whole thing not being really complicated.
There are no PC cards that support UGA. Perhaps you meant VGA?
One advantage I noticed with cards patched with enableGOP is that they allow you to install UEFI Windows 8/10 on a Mac Pro (installation must be done from USB). By the way, this won't work with MacVidCards. All Nvidia cards I've tested required prior patching by GOP_Updater before patching with enableGOP shows a boot screen on the Mac Pro. From what I understand, vBiosInsert, which is part of the enableGOP script, swaps the order of the original GOP and enableGOP sections (in reverse order), while retaining the original header. Once patched, such cards are no longer compatible with PC UEFI.
It appears that PC GOP and Apple GOP use the same GOP header (55 AA .. F1 0F). Depending on the original vBios, for reasons I have not yet discovered, enableGOP 1.1 causes a PC to beep five times with no picture, regardless of whether it's PC-BIOS or UEFI. For anyone looking for a permanent fix, the better option is to patch the Mac Pro firmware with enableGOP and forget about the graphics adapter. However, that's not something I want to do, as I'm trying to understand how things work and what doesn't.
From my own experience - having played around with PC cards in a MacPro for the last 15 years - I’ve encountered many misconceptions and wrong conclusions. Reliable information is sparse, and people often seem to repeat what they read elsewhere.
Dayo
macrumors 68020
I suppose I mentally classify into UEFI (GOP) and Legacy.
The point attempted to be made was that Mac FFI is likely the critical item.
Perhaps you could take the EnableGOP items to its thread.
Yes, wrong/false info is propagated to a very surprising extent over many things but I suppose the vast majority of info shared is, at the end of the day, true or when not completely so, at least harmless.
We generally have limited wherewithal to gain a full depth and scope of information and rely on those, such as yourself, that have looked into things in depth and scope, to share and expand the baseline knowledge.