I’d like a larger iMac with more graphics cores they can call it an iMac semi-pro.
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Gurman: Apple Still Working on 'Pro' iMac With Larger Screen
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Oh, absolutely, I 100% agree with you. We've always bought 27" iMacs here, so I still find its absence a bit strange.
As a happy owner of 3 iMac 27 (currently, previously another retired 3), I would love to see the M2/3 version of iMac 27 or 30. Love to beautiful screen. I think Apple can leave 24 as lower end with M2, maybe M2 Pro. Then 27 or 30 model starting with M2 pro, then high end M2 Max. Don't know if M2 Ultra will fit in terms of fan requirement. Let's hope!!!
Wasn't the decoupling of the 27" iMac into the Mac Studio and the Studio display precisely to cater to the pro users who were complaining that they couldn't use their own custom displays, and that the iMac Pro being one single sealed unit meant they had to throw out a perfectly good display together with the CPU?
I see the allure of the M1 iMac as some sort of "family computer" in the living room that anyone can access, and the M1 chip likely suffices for what a typical family will do with it anyways. I don't see Apple releasing an "iMac Pro" anytime soon, for the reasons stated above. Professionals either want to be able to use their own displays, or swap out the desktop unit when it's time to upgrade.
I see the allure of the M1 iMac as some sort of "family computer" in the living room that anyone can access, and the M1 chip likely suffices for what a typical family will do with it anyways. I don't see Apple releasing an "iMac Pro" anytime soon, for the reasons stated above. Professionals either want to be able to use their own displays, or swap out the desktop unit when it's time to upgrade.
I would believe this more if Apple hadn't killed the 27" iMac. Is Apple trying to shove people into smaller, or much larger (expensive) hardware? It makes no sense to thumb their nose at people that want a larger iMac (27") and try to coerce them to buy the mythical new new iMac Pro. Apple seems to have no sense of what people want, and now keeps bait and switching them into larger more expensive systems while delivering blow after blow to their 'pro users'. Yikes...
It's also a $3600 entry cost for the Mac Studio and Studio Display and most people won't find the entry spec Mac studio sufficient, so it's even more than that. An iMac 27" 5k computer was 20% less than that and presumable would also be if they base it off the 24" iMac.
I think Apple has good enough insight into its product lineup to know what’s in demand. Some of it is strategic too. The reason why Apple is likely waiting until the M3 to update the iMac even though it’s over a year old with the M1 is just the demand is not there.
Demand for a 27 inch iMac is likely not there either. Apple wants a product that sell larger volumes ie. iPhone, iPad. Why you think they are in no rush to come with a successor to the Mac Pro? There just isn’t enough demand for such a configuration.
Apple could easily make every conceivable form factor and configuration. But the time, R&D, and volume demand is just not there to justify it.
Also, Apple realizes you can’t do everything everyone wishes on Macrumors, this is a bubble. It’s not representative of the wider market. Most users are happy with what’s available. I was at an Apple store recently and saw folks walking out with the current iMac.
I don’t think they care one bit about what’s under hood beyond it’s really pretty.
Demand for a 27 inch iMac is likely not there either. Apple wants a product that sell larger volumes ie. iPhone, iPad. Why you think they are in no rush to come with a successor to the Mac Pro? There just isn’t enough demand for such a configuration.
Apple could easily make every conceivable form factor and configuration. But the time, R&D, and volume demand is just not there to justify it.
Also, Apple realizes you can’t do everything everyone wishes on Macrumors, this is a bubble. It’s not representative of the wider market. Most users are happy with what’s available. I was at an Apple store recently and saw folks walking out with the current iMac.
I don’t think they care one bit about what’s under hood beyond it’s really pretty.
I think the Studio system makes too many compromises for the 'pro user'. It seems to me to be another 'bone' thrown out in an attempt to keep the defections to Windows and other OS's at a minimum. It's not working, I'm thinking. It seems far more a 'prosumer' toy than a 'pro user' solution, and yet it's priced at near 'pro-level'.
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Actually, there were. Right after the Mac Studio came out, there were a flurry of rumors saying no iMac Pro or big-screen iMac. The idea was you either want the M1 iMac or a M1-something Mac Studio + external display.
Demand for iMac != demand for iMac Pro. The latter is an expensive niche (that nevertheless sat in an interesting position of being an aspirational product, since many techies like Jason Snell liked to talk about how much they loved theirs). As for the iMac, there was a lot of demand for that one. Desktops don‘t sell as well as laptops any more, but there are 3 M1 iMacs in my office of 4 people, and the people who got them were ridiculously excited about getting them.
Are you gonna switch them out to 27 inch models if Apple releases such a model next year or are folks getting the job done now?
I really hope the iMac Pro rumors are true, but I don't think they are. The iMac Pro was always a stop gap between the trash can Mac Pro and the current Mac Pro. It hasn't been updated in 5 years.... I just don't think it sold well for Apple as they could have just kept selling them as they are easily as good as the M1 Macs out there now but have more screen and honestly in my opinion are better looking.
I love my iMac Pro and hope they refresh it, but I don't see it happening. Seems like there is going to be the 24" iMac, and the Mac Studio and Studio display as the 27" option.
I love my iMac Pro and hope they refresh it, but I don't see it happening. Seems like there is going to be the 24" iMac, and the Mac Studio and Studio display as the 27" option.
You don't think an iMac Pro would start with a Max chip? And remember, the iMac Pro launched at $5000 back in 2017. They would absolutely be fighting for the same market share, which I guess doesn't really matter since its all coming from the same place.
You should all never forget that the iMac was for most of the times the entry level consumer product. Hence the "i" just as with the iBooks.
G3 were pretty much useless for any "Pro" setting with that tiny CRT in a world of bigger ones turning to flatscreens.
G4 were stylish and could be placed on the reception desk but very little else (well the rare 20" might have been o.k. for a short while).
G5 and early Intel had again small screens for the time and at best half the performance of a PowerMac_G5/MacPro.
When they released the o.g. 24" with Core2Duos it became o.k. for some tasks but it wasn't until they started puttimg i5/7s into them and fumbled the 2013 MacPro that the "iMac is for Pros" idea took hold.
The 24" iMac only coming in a base M1(2/3/...) variant means it's going back to it's roots. Nothing more nothing less.
As for Apple skipping the M1+ (aka M2) *shrug* really depend on when they have A16 based, 3nm M-chips read in volume. Might be that the M2 generation ends up being short, might be that we will see an M2(xxx) variant for every product shipping as M1(xxx) today and M3 starting in late 2023.
G3 were pretty much useless for any "Pro" setting with that tiny CRT in a world of bigger ones turning to flatscreens.
G4 were stylish and could be placed on the reception desk but very little else (well the rare 20" might have been o.k. for a short while).
G5 and early Intel had again small screens for the time and at best half the performance of a PowerMac_G5/MacPro.
When they released the o.g. 24" with Core2Duos it became o.k. for some tasks but it wasn't until they started puttimg i5/7s into them and fumbled the 2013 MacPro that the "iMac is for Pros" idea took hold.
The 24" iMac only coming in a base M1(2/3/...) variant means it's going back to it's roots. Nothing more nothing less.
As for Apple skipping the M1+ (aka M2) *shrug* really depend on when they have A16 based, 3nm M-chips read in volume. Might be that the M2 generation ends up being short, might be that we will see an M2(xxx) variant for every product shipping as M1(xxx) today and M3 starting in late 2023.
In fact, the supposed "iMac Pro" is not going to be the natural replacement of the space gray iMac Pro, but the "big" version of the iMac, with the Mx Pro and Mx Max processors (I don't think that, for cooling, it will be able to mount the Ultra). A desktop version of the MacBook Pro, really.
However, if the Mac mini comes out with the M2 and M2 Pro, more or less that "semi-professional" gap in the desktop arena would be filled.
Currently in desktop there is a huge jump between the entry level with the M1 (iMac 24" and Mac mini) and the M1 Max (Mac Studio). So a "Pro" iMac with a larger screen, and with the Mx Pro and Max, would also fill that part of the gap that exists right now.
Now if you want something in between, you only have the MacBook Pro, what we want something desktop we have nothing in that gap that, at the moment, it is not known if it will be the Mac mini M2 Pro + Studio Display or there will also be an iMac 27/30" "Pro".
I feel some are missing the point that there is actually no replacement to the middle-high end iMac 27 NON "pro". The Studio being way more expensive and way too powerful in comparison. An actual all in one 27 with a M Pro could easily fill this gap. Maybe a Mini M2 Pro and a Studio Display too... Still curious about the price of such a set-up though...
I would like both a larger display option on the base multi-color iMac AND an iMac Pro variant with a focus on display quality and performance (Mini-LED ProMotion and Pro level chips). I think there is an obvious hole in the lineup for the “desktop MacBook Pro” right now and this is the machine that fills it. I think the timing makes sense so that these larger mini LED or maybe even OLED panels come down in price a bit to make such a product at a price point that sits between the Mac Studio and the forthcoming Mac Pro.
I think the colorful iMacs are wonderful machines, but I’d love for them to offer a second size of it like the iMacs of yore (minus the original, every iMac came in at least two sizes)
Also with the rumors of the “Studio Display Pro” variant, it feels like that panel might be for this iMac Pro machine.
I think the colorful iMacs are wonderful machines, but I’d love for them to offer a second size of it like the iMacs of yore (minus the original, every iMac came in at least two sizes)
Also with the rumors of the “Studio Display Pro” variant, it feels like that panel might be for this iMac Pro machine.
Probably - and having just got a Studio and two matching 4k+ 3:2 displays to replace a 5k iMac my "buyer's remorse" is backdated to the decision to buy an iMac in 2017. Individually, the new displays aren't as good as an Apple 5k, but having two of them, separate is so much more useful to me in practice.
The problem is that there is now a "gap" in the price range where the ~$1800-$2000 5k iMacs used to be.
...but the 2020 5k iMac with 10 core i9 and 57000XT GPU plus Apple's 32GB RAM upgrade was also $3600.
The Studio offers significantly better CPU performance and considerably more I/O bandwidth (4 independent TB4 sockets vs. 2 TB3 sharing a single controller).
Mac Studio + full-spec M1 Max + 1TB SSD + Studio Display = $4000 - and the result bears comparison with the entry iMac Pro at $5000. Studio Ultra + display setup @ ~$6000 c.f. the 18 core iMac Pro at $8000 (by the time you've added RAM).
GPU wise the equivalence is more debatable - I suspect that it is YMMV depending on whether your software is Metal-optimised. You could have saved a few hundred bucks on the iMac by getting 3rd party RAM (no longer an option) - and you don't get a keyboard and mouse with the Studio - but overall, the Studio + Studio display price is not out of the ball park for high-end iMac and iMac Pro configurations. However, what really counts is that - given these price comparisons - there's no reason to expect any hypothetical Apple Silicon high-end iMac, iMac/iMac Pro to be any cheaper in bangs-per-buck.
...and on top of that it's all more flexible if you want a different display configuration - I went for a pair of displays that suit my needs better than a 5k and still had £700 change c.f. a Studio Display - OTOH some people might want to pair them with a Pro XDR display.
(as for the other bits, I have enough keyboards not to need a new one, don't much like the newer Magic Keyboards anyhow, and wouldn't use a Magic Mouse if you paid me... I doubt I'm the only one in that camp).
The "loss" as I said, is the removal of the ~$2000 5k iMacs with i5 processors - but, frankly, a M1/M2 Mini + Studio Display (or, preferably, something cheaper) is a closer equivalent there. I suspect, though, that the failure of 5k or 6k to take off in the PC world means that it's just not viable to have such a display in a <$2000 iMac.
If you take price out of it, though, I'm not sure that the "Mx Pro" makes sense on the desktop where you have no heat/battery life reasons for skimping on the GPU and can have a "Mx Max" instead. I wouldn't be entirely surprised to see the "pro" kept as a laptop-only option.
I feel your missing the point that Apple has just closed a gigantic gap between the Mini and MacPro that had existed eversince G4 times....
Apple won't go back to pre Jobs times with 267 overlapping Macs. I also don't think the will go back the 4 product square that Steve advocated in late G4 times.
Or in short for every new Mac line another one will be discontinued.
HobeSoundDarryl
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Yes to both points, which now seem somewhat lost to some of the replies in this thread.
I'm a LONG-TERM iMac 27" owner and very much professional user making my living on Macs. Some iMac 27"s were my main Macs for more than 10 years. However, going into the Studio announcement, my main 27" conked. I had watched rumors of iMac 32" become iMac 30" and then "nope, same old 27" again" and I definitely wanted more screen RE. I was strongly drawn to Ultra Wide for something towards 2 screens WIDE in ONE bezel.
The iMac value proposition was historically great going in but terrible at the end... when, if any part fails or if macOS makes it obsolete, the whole thing becomes a "throw baby out with the bathwater" proposition. Since those were still Intel, the death of my best Mac was also the death of my best (bootcamp) Windows computer... AND best monitor too... like throwing THREE babies out with the bathwater.
Soured on the "all in one" concept, I decided that I would abandon iMac and go with the rumored high-spec Mac Mini MAX which- of course- did not show (again). Studio Ultra became my new main Mac paired with a 5K2K ultra-wide screen. Now I could never go back to an iMac 27" screen. That extra RE width is much more useful than I imagined.
As separates, when Studio becomes "long in tooth" and then macOS obsoleted, not all of baby must get thrown out. A comparably "slim" Windows PC covers client needs within that OS. The one monitor can accept inputs from BOTH and even split screen them to have both side by side if needed. Built-in KVM makes a single keyboard and external speakers work with both platforms too. These are nice tricks I could not get a Studio Display- if I wanted to be constrained to traditional 27"- to do without additional tech.
To this part of Gurman's quote...
...I suspect that must be pure filler speculation. Else, he is writing about those so deep in the Apple bubble... so drunk on the koolaid... that ONLY Apple offerings exist and thus there is clearly some room for a 27" revival (and IMO 30", 34", 38", UWs too, etc). He seems to be ignoring that that are HUNDREDS of monitor choices available at all sizes & shapes.
I would guess less intoxicated pros will do as I did if existing Apple screen offerings are not "cutting it" and buy themselves a Mini, Studio or Pro and pair it with 1+ screens at whatever size, resolution, etc they desire. What Studio and Mini offer right now is basically the great flexility to choose ANY size screen, ultra-wides if you want that, etc.
That comment reads like PROs can only want Apple iMacs and thus some want a bigger-screen iMac. Since there are no other ways to get a bigger-screen iMac, Apple must build one to scratch this itch. Apparently a 27" Apple monitor that is identical to the traditional iMac 27" screen doesn't cover this base either. The pros being referenced must have the Mac tech guts built INSIDE an Apple monitor.
I'm sure there are some people who can only imagine Apple product purchases and only want a Silicon replacement for 27" iMac. However, for all but those not so tightly married to "all in one" aesthetics, what they want is available TODAY with Mini or Studio paired with Studio Monitor. And anyone able to buy things outside of the bubble can have the 30", 32", ultra-wide, etc they have ever imagined TODAY.
All that offered, I agree with Gurman that an iMac "bigger" will likely be resurrected at some point. For those who can overlook the negative value proposition at the end, a bigger-screen iMac is a beautiful, useful computer. I enjoyed using them for many years. I personally could just never go back now unless Apple rolls out iMac UW with some variation of target display mode so that the monitor portion could continue to be used when they obsolete the tech guts with software.
And with that, I'll further assume iMac Pro pricing. Apple has just learned that they can strip out the whole computer and sell the monitor alone for almost as much as the prior price of iMac 27." So when they then re-insert what will probably be MBpro computing guts back into that monitor, I would expect them to add the MBpro price in too (sans duplication parts like screen & keyboard). I suspect a LOT of enthusiasm for iMac 27" is in the value proposition of great Mac with great screen starting below $2K. I'm not so sure how much of that survives if "starting at" $2999-$3999 becomes the new entry point... $4500-$6K "nicely configured."
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Is the desktop market really big enough for a Mac Mini and a Mac Studio, for an iMac and an iMac Pro and also a Mac Pro?