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Hands-On With the New 'Portrait' Mode Beta Feature in the iPhone 7 Plus

obiwan said:
Yeah - and the question is, is this feature more useful than a headphone jack?
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I'm a huge critic of the elimination of the headphone jack, but the fact is that the headphone jack wasn't replaced by the second camera or bokeh effect. It was replaced instead by the new home button's taptic engine, a slightly increased battery size, and a gasket for waterproofing purposes, which was needed partially/mostly because of the extra grille holes added in place of the headphone jack.

I don't think any of those were worth it, though.
 
RDeckard said:
Agreed - most DSLRs have a button called "DOF (Depth of Field) preview." You just press it you'll see a preview in the viewfinder.

On mirrorless cameras, like the Sony A series, Fuji X-series (I have an X-T1), Olympus OM, etc. show the effect right in the digital viewfinder or on the screen on the back of the camera.
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Well that button actually works in the opposite way that this does. Since DSLRs always focus with the lens wide open, pressing the button stops down the lens to where you have it set allowing you to see the increased depth of field rather than decreased as this shows. I honestly have no idea why Phil decided to say it like he did.
 
jclardy said:
So..cool video, but where are the actual photo samples?
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They should change it to use force touch to bring up the camera types, and just one switch to swap from video to photo. Having to swipe through ten options to get from photo to video is terrible.

Also burying the 4k/1080 and slow motion speeds in the settings app is so dumb. I'm never going to switch them when they are in there, and not every video needs to be 4k...why can't I just tap on the "4K" icon in the camera app to change it?
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exactly, a simple switch to go from stills to video, then a drop down menu with all the other options.
for example, is there really a need for a dedicated square photo option?

maybe apple is doing this only for visibility, otherwise many people wouldn't even realise, say, that they can do slo-mo videos.
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maverick2007 said:
Even I felt the same, see the edges. I understand with software can do this but I still prefer DSLR. Good for fun pics but edges look horrible.

View attachment 657028
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honestly, a dog can photoshop better than this...
 
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friedmud said:
No. The difference is that things shouldn't be uniformly blurry. Things closer to the focal plane (i.e. where you've focused) should be less blurry... as you move further away from the focal plane things should get more blurry.

The iPhone 7+ can do this because it uses the two cameras to sense depth... so it can apply the right amount of blur to the right portions of the scene. That's really tough to do with postprocessing a regular photo.

I found this to be a good write up with several examples of the blur gradient:

https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/21/hands-on-with-the-iphone-7-plus-crazy-new-portrait-mode/
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Post processing shouldn't be hard with auto selection or magnetic or magic lasso to create an iPhone 7 like bokeh. The sample photo from the video, the edges is pretty obvious. I guess anything that take your time from doing extra work now is good enough.
 
thettareddast said:
err, yes it does. it has an aperture that changes size, and a max aperture rating based on its widest opening.

saying 'the iphone doesnt have an f-stop' is like saying a person doesnt have height.
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All iphones so far, and I'd say most of the other smartphone cameras have fixed aperture. They don't change.
 
joueboy said:
Post processing shouldn't be hard with auto selection or magnetic or magic lasso to create an iPhone 7 like bokeh. The sample photo from the video, the edges is pretty obvious. I guess anything that take your time from doing extra work now is good enough.
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Say what? This isn't so you can "take your time from doing extra work". This is for the hundreds of millions of regular people who don't use Photoshop to allow them to take better pictures with their iPhone. Professionals will continue to buy and use DSLRs and the other 99% of the users will be very happy with results their iPhone gives them.
 
Confession: Love the missing headphone jack.

Next confession....this is a stunning first implementation of this feature. Really really good. Yes...I could see in the keynote the subtle "masking" that was going on. Does it matter? Yes if you are trying to use this phone as your professional camera.

I really hope the release of this feature beats my upcoming vacation.

Physics will always be a challenge. You need space and lenses to create the best photographs, but for the average user...this will be fine.
 
kstotlani said:
Let's see if Apple continues.
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So wait... you think the next iPhone Plus won't have dual cameras? That this was just a one-time experiment?

No way. Apple tends to stick with things for the long haul.

Remember when the Motorola Atrix had a fingerprint scanner? But it was gone when the Atrix II came out?

That's not how Apple rolls. So yeah... I think Apple will continue with dual cameras.
 
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ECUTuner said:
I don't think he's claiming what you think. When I watch the entire section on the camera (and not cut out a single sentence) then to me it seems he's talking about the processing going on to generate the live view. He spent a lot of time leading up to his remark talking about the speed of the ISP in the A10, using two cameras to form a depth map and that this is done in real time.

This is like taking a single quote from Steve Jobs about having a stylus and making assumptions about what he really meant (which is that needing a stylus to operate a device is bad, not that a stylus itself is bad).
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But there is no reason to do that processing on a single lens camera... it happens "automagically" by physics!

I mean... he could have claimed that a bull's nuts don't do this processing either... but no one would give a crap.

He's trying to make it sound like the iPhone is doing something special (showing the effect of small depth of field)... when DSLRs definitely _do_ do that.

Edit: I want to be clear that I'm not at all against this capability! I think it's awesome... I just think they should have toned down the rhetoric a bit with respect to DSLR capabilities. Elsewhere during the keynote they did a great job of saying that this doesn't reduce the need for DSLRs... this was just a weird gaffe thrown in at this point in the keynote...
 
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jclardy said:
Also burying the 4k/1080 and slow motion speeds in the settings app is so dumb. I'm never going to switch them when they are in there, and not every video needs to be 4k...why can't I just tap on the "4K" icon in the camera app to change it?
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10 years later and I still find having to access apps settings in the Phone Setting area to be sooooooo incredibly counterintuitive.

rhomsy said:
Not true. You can shoot wide open in full sun using an ND filter.
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Unless you are using fast glass (f/1.8 or faster) most of the time you are ok in full sun. I would hardly call it a limitation. Anyways, most dSLRS have an expanded low ISO (50 or 100 depending on your brand) mode to help with that.
 
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Michael Scrip said:
So wait... you think the next iPhone Plus won't have dual cameras? That this was just a one-time experiment?

No way. Apple tends to stick with things for the long haul.

Remember when the Motorola Atrix had a fingerprint scanner? But it was gone when the Atrix II came out?

That's not how Apple rolls. So yeah... I think Apple will continue with dual cameras.
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I am not sure if you work for Apple that you know how Apple rolls. Apple discontinues entire product lines or doesn't update them for years (e.g. Thunderbolt Display) and all I said was let's see how this camera goes. You must know something I don't so thank you for your eye opening information.
 
Apple purchased a company called LinX Imaging in April 2015.

You can check what the LinX camera modules could do in this MacRumors article.

https://www.macrumors.com/2015/04/14/linx-camera-technology-apple/

LinX cameras have special sub pixel sensors that enable them to produce precise depth maps (much more than 9 levels).

Cs6zQbpWYAA2te5.jpg:large


Apparently the iPhone 7+ doesn't use LinX sensors hardware, which makes sense since the acquisition is probably too recent for them to have had time to include it this year.

This whole "Extra Credit project" thing Phil mentioned at the keynote sounds like someone at Apple suddenly had the idea of asking their developers/engineers to try to recreate the same functionality that LinX modules have, but in software using "normal" cameras with the help of LinX (and maybe PrimeSense) staff. But due to the lack of sub pixel hardware they could only get 9 levels of depth. That may also explain why the feature is late.

As it is, the 'Portrait' feature on the iPhone 7+ is nice , but it could be much better if/when they integrate LinX sub pixel hardware.
 
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kstotlani said:
I am not sure if you work for Apple that you know how Apple rolls. Apple discontinues entire product lines or doesn't update them for years (e.g. Thunderbolt Display) and all I said was let's see how this camera goes. You must know something I don't so thank you for your eye opening information.
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I don't work for Apple.

All I'm saying is... Apple wouldn't spend that much time on stage talking about the dual-camera system... just to cancel it next year.

You were the one who said "Let's see if Apple continues"

I think they will. :)

HTC dropped their dual-camera system after only one year... but that doesn't sound like something Apple will do. Just a gut feeling I have.
 
polterbyte said:
Matthew Panzarino's tests tell me that this is not a gimmick. Not by a long shot.

A couple of iterations in the future, and I see entrant DSLR enthusiasts changing their minds, for good.
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Can't see that happening for the foreseeable future, not for serious or professional photographers anyway, but continuously improving the smartphone cameras is great nevertheless, and the quality results they currently produce is obviously a far cry from the first smartphones incorporating digital cameras. Still, the biggest impediment to professional quality results from the latter category continues to be space constraints.

I'm very impressed however with the quality improvements in translucent-mirror (fixed-mirror) DSLRs such as Sony's a99 ll as well as mirror-less DSLRs such as Sony's a7R ll and at the lower end of the spectrum the just released Canon EOS M5. The features, quality, and useability of these cameras is improving significantly with each new iteration.
 
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kstotlani said:
That is really not true. Apple doesn't do everything better. It's their Eco system that helps them not their implementation. This argument has no base that they do it better. The fragmentation of android kills them and that is the reason I don't buy them not because they don't implement their features correctly. It's the Eco system not innovation.
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But you HAVE TO ADMIT that Apple of late with the extensive BETA programs etc has finally finally begun to limit it's past mistakes and for that I give them PROPS that they are IN FACT making an effort to improve software quality.
 
Telephoto and bokeh are the only reasons I went with a plus.

However if I didn't have kids, I wouldn't have cared as much
 
manu chao said:
Maybe that is the photographer in me speaking, but when I hear the word 'portrait' I immediately think of an image of a person (and similarly for 'landscape', I think of an actual landscape) and I only interpret it to mean the orientation of a non-square rectangle if it is used together with the word 'orientation' (or similar).

Note that the 'Portrait' mode also automatically switches you to the longer focal length thus already indicating to the user that this is for a tighter shot which is associated with people shots. And people aren't stupid, they know very well that can turn the phone to switch between portrait and landscape orientation in the default 'Photo' mode (but also in the Time-Lapse, Slo-Mo and Video mode). And once they tried the 'Portrait' mode a couple of times, they'll know that it results in a blur of the background. And in many languages, 'portrait orientation' actually is described using a word that is not a synonym for 'picture of a person', among them Spanish (formato alto vs retrato), Italian (formato verticale vs ritratto), German (Hochformat vs Porträt), Polish (format poziomy vs portret), Russian (вертика́льный форма́т vs портре́т).
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There are some limitations on the length of such a label.
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Well they called features on the watch face "complications" so why not just run with bokeh?
 
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