Having an existential crisis

[eroslws]

Mobile phones are the drivers of technology adoption nowadays. Practically every new Android phone is using USB-C; that's half the market. If you think a shift to USB-C is going to take longer than two years, you are mistaken. At the latest, we'll see a complete shift with the next iPhone that ships with a lightning-USB-C cable. In fact, I bet the new iPads will probably come with USB-C chargers.

 

[solarguy17]

Mobile phones are the drivers of technology adoption nowadays. Practically every new Android phone is using USB-C; that's half the market. If you think a shift to USB-C is going to take longer than two years, you are mistaken. At the latest, we'll see a complete shift with the next iPhone that ships with a lightning-USB-C cable. In fact, I bet the new iPads will probably come with USB-C chargers.

the Andriod phones with USB-C ports in them are using a USB-C to USB-A cable to plug into the computer USB-A ports.

 

[aristobrat]

So what you're saying is that people shouldn't mind buying new interconnects, adaptors where needed, for absolutely no good reason. That's not a reasonable position. You might not mind, but if you ask people to just waste a bunch of cash on new interconnects and adaptors that otherwise don't make their lives better in any way, shape or form, most will probably disagree with you.

I said I don't view it as a hardship ... "severe suffering/intolerable".

Instead of plugging your USB device into your computer, you have to find the appropriate cable/dongle/adaptor/etc.

I've always had to do that. Always. Ever since my first PowerBook over a decade ago, I've always had to find the appropriate cable to plug something in. Plugging in my iPod required finding the appropriate cable/dongle/adapter/etc. Plugging in my printer required finding the appropriate cable/dongle/adapter/etc. Plugging in an external USB drive required finding the appropriate cable/dongle/adapter/etc. Every device that I use daily has required finding the appropriate cable/dongle/adapter etc. This is nothing new.

You have an additional step, on top of the cost. You probably have other computers around the house, so it's not like you get to replace the USB-A stuff cables with USB-C cables. No Sir, those new USB-C cables are in addition to the old ones.

I only have one computer, so this isn't a worry. But seriously, if I had an additional computer, is there really stress with having USB-A cables stationed near the old computer, and USB-C cables stationed near the new one?

Let's recap. It will cost people more.

Agreed.

It will take longer to plug in things.

Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my iPod.
Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my iPad.
Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my iPhone.
Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my external drives.
Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my printer.
Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my camera.

If anything, since there is no "right-side up" for USB C, it may actually take LESS time to plug them in.

For the external thumb drives that I use like once or twice a year, it'll take what ... 2-3 seconds to plug the cable into the MacBook, and then the USB drive into the cable?

You have to carry the new dongles and adaptors.

I won't be carrying any additional USB cables. I will stop carrying my old USB A cables, and I'll start carrying my new USB C cables, so that's a net of zero new cables.

I'll own a USB C to USB A cable, but I won't be carrying it around with me when I go anywhere.

 

[robotica]

USB type c port is backwards compatible so you just need to replace your cable

 

[technosinner]

First off I really like the debate here! A lot of good points both sides of the argument...

Exactly. Dongles are a consumer-created problem because people want to hang on to legacy technology. The new MacBooks have four IO ports using a modern and non-proprietary interface. This is the laptop of the future; it's not Apple's fault a vocal minority aren't ready.

Dongle may very well be a "consumer created problem", but a) we are the consumers and I am paying money to use this hardware, and b) Apple might be happy that we have to pay more to become backwards compatible, but I'm not exactly thrilled...

for gods sake just pay $19 for a little hub and move on with your life
the whine factor on these forums is astonishing

Well I wasn't really whining, I was asking a legitimate opinion. Thanks for the attitude.

The USB A complain is ridiculous. On amazon you can get like 3 usb c to usb a adapters for 10$. 3!

My big worry - and admittedly I'm speculating here - is that low-cost options will be cheap in quality and data transfer as well. Can't tell you how many cheapass USB 3 cables I have in "the box" downstairs. Having to pay more for the quality just loops the argument back...

Apple were one of the first the remove the CD drive too, right? It was only 4 years ago and, who needs one today?

I was the first one to tell people to get their act together when that happened but there were 2 main differences: disc usage was extremely low across the board, whereas USB-A is still majorly used. Also the purchase of an external DVD drive, although somewhat akin to a USB hub, is not something you need on a daily basis, where USB devices are (at least in my case).

They also pushed Thunderbolt but that didn't really catch on as expected, but with the USB-C port which also supports Thunderbolt I think the future is looking good!

Well and that's my big fear; even I agree with all of you that USB-C is probably the future, I still have a sour taste in my mouth from Thunderbolt v.1&2, and yes, even Firewire (I'm that old). We were promised the future and got another box-load of useless cables and thingamabobs... Am I shellshocked? Maybe. But I'm worried nonetheless.

The ports thing carries least weight of all the criticisms of this MacBook IMHO. A lot of new laptops have USB-c. The new HP ultra book, the chrome book pixel etc. Some may have left an oul legacy port lying around but what's the point when these new ports have the power of TB3.

That's my point in a sense. Yes to new tech, but maybe ease into it a bit? Besides TB3 is still not widespread at all, and yes USB-C is backwards compatible but I'm not a fan of adding layers to my connectivity.

Peoples complain about dongles.

I complain on a laptop. Couldn't care less on a desktop really. I see your point about carrying a bag of adapters and honestly, so do I, but I've been trying to cut back on all that to make my life simple.

How is portability impacted?

I'll need to carry one extra cable -- USB C to USB A. This will let me plug in old USB thumb drives. Frankly, they're all slower than snot, and I primarily use AirDrop, but I'll have one just in case.

One extra cable in my backpack doesn't impact the portability of this computer for me in the slightest.

Maybe this is a very specific thing, but I have a lot of USB devices that I don't necessarily want dangling (no pun intended) at the end of a cable, but rather safely tucked to the computer. But I might be super picky...

I get the move on argument, but I just find it incredibly annoying to have to have a dongle for something I could still plug into my computer a few weeks ago. Not sure if I'm making any sense here but 4 ports, one for power leaves 3. Since I don't have any USB-c devices, that means 3 cables/dongles... Just seems like a waste.

For things that already have cables, no issue. But all those keys, devices, not to mention Thunderbolt drives that will need a super expensive converter... I know I'm rambling...

-----------
I share your thoughts that USB-C is actually a great technology, but again I've seen this happen before where Apple placed their eggs in the same basket, then tossed the basket down a cliff and called it the future, hoping the eggs wouldn't break.

But crappy allegories aside, I think this might be a surmountable obstacle if tech catches up. Here in Canada I don't seem to find a lot of C devices, which wouldn't really help because I don't see the need to get rid of all my hardware if it works... I just find that wasteful.

So after reading all this I think my conundrum boils down to the following: can I trust low budget dongles and cables?

 

[duervo]

So, the new MBP... Most people here seem to be thrilled, but am I the only one who doesn't understand the point of having a laptop needing so many dongles and adapters? My mouse is not bluetooth, I don't own any USB-C cables or devices nor do I have any compatible hubs...

I mean, I get the idea and at first I wasn't against the idea, but the more I think about it the more I fail to see how this would be a good portable computer.

I've been hearing so much Apple bashing lately that I need to hear the other side of the argument.

Both sides of the argument contains a lot of Ms. Information. (She can be a total bee.) Be careful when you read, and don't be surprised if you find you have to do some of your own fact checking.

By the way, I'm really hoping you were being "poetic" using the term "existential crisis." I'd hate to think that a person has based their entire life's existence around a piece of tech.

 

[symphara]

I said I don't view it as a hardship ... "severe suffering/intolerable".

I didn't say it was intolerable. I just said that it doesn't actually make you better off. Why have it in the first place?

The new Macbooks would have been just fine with 2xTB3-USB-C and 2xUSB3.1. Best of both worlds.

Won't take one millisecond longer to plug in my iPod.
etc. etc.

Well that's your use case. It doesn't mean it's the only one. I personally plug in my G7 wireless mouse into my laptop, and I really dislike using a dongle. Yes it will be both slower, and I need to keep track of the bloody thing. The SD card reader is gone, I'd need a new dongle for that one. Then MagSafe is gone, I need a magnetic USB-C connector to replace it. My existing Mac USB-Ethernet adaptor won't work anymore, I need to buy a new one, for only CHF39.95!

In fact I have no device that plugs into USB-C, in a house full of gadgets. Ironic, since both myself and my wife have USB-C phones. I'd need to spend a ton of cash on cables and dongles. And at the end of it, I'd just have more cables and dongles, and no actual improvement to anything I've been doing until now.

 

[aristobrat]

In fact I have no device that plugs into USB-C, in a house full of gadgets. Ironic, since both myself and my wife have USB-C phones. I'd need to spend a ton of cash on cables and dongles. And at the end of it, I'd just have more cables and dongles, and no actual improvement to anything I've been doing until now.

Why don't you consider using a USB-C hub? It basically acts like a docking station. You can plug in your Ethernet (gigabit), SD/micro cards, the USB dongle required to make your wireless mouse work (), and still have extra USB 3.0 ports left over for all of your other gadgets. And the hub plugs into your Mac with just one USB-C cable. Neat and clean.

 

[dyn]

There is absolutely zero justification in removing the sd card reader port except maybe to satisfy Jony's obsession with aesthetics and minimalism.

Professional photographers in general would say that there is zero justification for having the SD card reader. Their cameras do not use SD but CF so having an SD card reader is completely pointless. Since many computers do not come with a CF card reader those people buy their own external one; the added bonus: they can use it on other machines too. Because of that, there is little point in having a CF card reader in the MBP instead.

There is absolutely zero justification for your post because your use case isn't the same as someone else's! Apple understood this rather well, that's why we only have universal ports on the machine now. The user gets to choose what they should be instead of the manufacturer incorporating ports people are not going to use ever.

I'm all for Apple anticipating the future but eventually, to reduce consumers fear, why not simply do 3x USB-C and 1x USB-A, that way everybody is happy ?

Because people already whined about only having one USB port on the MacBook so they are going to whine about the MBP having only one USB-A port. Apple just wants to push Thunderbolt 3 since it uses a universal port (USB-C) which allows users to turn it into whatever port they want. It simplifies their design, their circuitboard layout but it also means that with less components on the circuitboard the machine draws less power. Right now, Thunderbolt is a separate chip but eventually it will end up in the CPU.

Why wouldn't I want a dedicated port for Apple's own phone and tablet?

Because you don't need to. Use a Lighting-USB-C cable (there is a 1m and a 2m version available from Apple right now). No need for a USB-A port and no need for an adapter. And this will apply to many other things too. If it does USB then all you need is a different cable and those are in general cheaper than any adapter. That's no different than in the pre-USB-C era (where some manufacturers even abused the USB connector and turned it into something proprietary; HTC for example). You are seeing a problem that isn't there and unfortunately a lot of other people here do too. Since we are going to move towards USB-C you are going to end up replacing cables or even devices eventually. Cables are currently available and they are expanding. The consumer electronic shows this year have already shown a big increase in USB-C devices with many of them already on the market.

The only thing actually requiring a dongle is TB1/2 to TB3 (and vice versa). Thunderbolt is simply a more complex protocol than USB is.

Right, so why does Apple's current offerings for wired keyboards and mice all still use USB-A ports? Why does their brand new iPhone 7 sell with a USB-A to lightning cable?

Because no company is able to renew its entire inventory at the same time nor would they ever do something like that. Financially there is not a single good reason to do something like that; instead you'd want to have something called Monthly Recurring Revenue which means that you have to have something to sell/lease each month. Not to mention that renewing your entire inventory at the same time creates really big supply chain issues (if your suppliers can't meet your demands, you are screwed). Over time we will see Apple and all the others move their devices from whatever USB connector they are using now to USB-C.

The reason for the iPhone is quite simple: they sell it to customers with a Mac but also to many that don't have one (lots of companies for example and they tend to use Windows machines). It makes more sense to include the USB-A by default and offer the USB-C version on their website.

 

[technosinner]

By the way, I'm really hoping you were being "poetic" using the term "existential crisis." I'd hate to think that a person has based their entire life's existence around a piece of tech.

Hehehe yes, I was Truth be told I'm still rocking the 2012 MBP and there is little need for me to update it, which makes my analysis of this new one even more critical I guess.

In fact I have no device that plugs into USB-C, in a house full of gadgets. Ironic, since both myself and my wife have USB-C phones. I'd need to spend a ton of cash on cables and dongles. And at the end of it, I'd just have more cables and dongles, and no actual improvement to anything I've been doing until now.

Friend, I think we are in the same boat... If I had any confidence in third party adapters and cables we wouldn't be having this conversation. There is no point adding to my already ludicrous electronics collection if it's to not be able to enjoy the full potential of USB-Jesus.

...Apple understood this rather well, that's why we only have universal ports on the machine now. The user gets to choose what they should be instead of the manufacturer incorporating ports people are not going to use ever.

You make a pretty compelling argument there actually. I honestly doubt that's what Apple actually had in mind, because let's face it they don't care about anything else than our cash, but it's the end result nonetheless. Well said!

The reason for the iPhone is quite simple: they sell it to customers with a Mac but also to many that don't have one (lots of companies for example and they tend to use Windows machines). It makes more sense to include the USB-A by default and offer the USB-C version on their website.

For the sake of argument, I don't think that's accurate. I really don't think Apple cares because those who dislike them will probably never change their minds and those who love them will probably buy anything the put out. In the end, the really don't give a flying racoon what you want or need: they will tell you what you get. Case and point being the 30-pin connector.

When they switched to lightning, they did it because they decided it was better, period. There were no nails given about those who had peripherals that were specifically designed for it - and I'm not talking about cables but radios, amps, cars! If they actually thought about user cases when they made tech choices, they would have at the very least figured out a way to have an adapter which still allowed using older connectors. And let's not mention the 3.5mm thing... I personally don't see the huge deal but it seems to have rattled a few people I think it all still ships with USB-A because they simply didn't have time to update their inventory.

Another theory might be that since the iPhone is now considered a mainstream item, and it's their main bread winner, Apple might have been scared to rock the boat too hard by adding a USB-C cable (because let's face it: even if some other manufacturers did it, I doubt Apple would have included two cables). The MBP being a nice product, maybe with a higher margin (price increase? who knows) they have determined the switch of philosophy to outweigh the backlash.

My point being, Apple really doesn't give a damn about us, the users. They are concerned about what THEY believe we should use. I'm not passing judgement mind you; I will still buy their computers (can't go back to Windows... too much stuff bought on OS X) and I might even consider going back to the iPhone one day. This is a factual thing, a business decision. I believe it's actually part of the appeal of Apple, but it can sometimes backfire. Again, like a broken record, TB 1&2 and FW...

 

[duervo]

Once Apple designates the currently-supported Apple systems as "vintage" or "obsolete", I suspect that they will stop selling and supporting any Apple cables that have a USB-A end on them. Until then, the supported connectors will remain USB-A and USB-C.

So, about 5 years from now.

 

[crassapple]

I use a 7 port usb hub. All I need to buy is a usb-c to usb-b cable and I'm covered for home/office use. For field work, all I need is a usb-c to usb-a dongle. Done.

 

[Rockadile]

Ok, so you don't want a perfectly working USB-C to Lightning because it requires an adapter for your USB-A to Lightning cable or buying a new cable? Correct? And the solution is to put a lightning connector on a computer dedicated for this one device? Right?

Now here's a question – how are you going to connect two female lightning ports together? With another cable that doesn't even exist yet and will be never used for anything else?

What's your problem with Apple adding their own port onto their devices?
They didn't go USB-C with the iPhone so if they want to be proprietary than they should add Lightning to the Mac. Plenty of space along the side.

Better question is why don't they put in a USB-C to Lightning cable in with the Macs?

 

[maratus]

What's your problem with Apple adding their own port onto their devices?

Hm, I don't know... But hmmm .... it may have something to do with lightning being utterly freaking useless on a computer?

They didn't go USB-C with the iPhone so if they want to be proprietary than they should add Lightning to the Mac.

wtf is this logic? please stop trolling...

Better question is why don't they put in a USB-C to Lightning cable in with the Macs?

Seriously?

 

[Rockadile]

Hm, I don't know... But hmmm .... it may have something to do with lightning being utterly freaking useless on a computer?


wtf is this logic? please stop trolling...


Seriously?

Direct syncing, Touch ID for clamshell mode users, and charging.
That's useless? Aren't most Mac owners a iPhone owner as well?

Yeah I'm serious, so what's the answer...?

 

[maratus]

Direct syncing, Touch ID for clamshell mode users, and charging.
That's useless? Aren't most Mac owners a iPhone owner as well?

Yeah I'm serious, so what's the answer...?

This can be done the same way through USB-C

Aren't most Mac owners a iPhone owner as well?

I don't know, but I don't have an iPhone and probably won't anytime soon.

 

[myscrnnm]

So, the new MBP... Most people here seem to be thrilled, but am I the only one who doesn't understand the point of having a laptop needing so many dongles and adapters? My mouse is not bluetooth, I don't own any USB-C cables or devices nor do I have any compatible hubs...

I mean, I get the idea and at first I wasn't against the idea, but the more I think about it the more I fail to see how this would be a good portable computer.

lol, are we on the same forum? All I hear is people who are less than thrilled about the new MacBook Pros (complaints about the omission of USB-A, added expense of the Touch Bar, use of Skylake CPUs, "high" prices, et cetera).

That being said, I think you hit the nail on the head with "how this would be a good portable computer." I think that's the point. The MacBook Pro is not a desktop computer; it's not something that the user should be having plugged into a bunch of devices like external GPUs, external monitors, external hard drives, peripherals, et cetera. It's supposed to be the ultimate mobile computing machine; and I think Apple has in that sense succeeded. They've made a laptop that's noticeably slimmer than the last iteration while both increasing processing power and maintaining all-day battery life.

The new MacBook Pros certainly aren't for everyone, but it's what a laptop computer should be. But if we want to get into why those who are lauding the new MBPs are doing so, it's because USB-C really is the future. The goal of USB has always been to create a universal interface (hence its name). We've gotten to a point where USB is everywhere, but devices are getting so slim, and computerization is so increasingly prevalent, that a new form factor is necessary. Many of the thinnest laptops coming out in the next few years will be too thin to accommodate USB-A. USB-C is also bidirectional in that the plug can be rotated 180 degrees and still work. USB-A only works one way out of two, and yet it still takes three tries to plug it in correctly. The USB-C port on the MBP also supports so many existing standards, like HDMI, DisplayPort, and Thunderbolt 3.

 

[Rockadile]

This can be done the same way through USB-C


I don't know, but I don't have an iPhone and probably won't anytime soon.

...
You're just going in circles now.

You have two Macs and an iPad but no iPhone? Must be in the less than 1% group.

 

[technosinner]

Hm, I don't know... But hmmm .... it may have something to do with lightning being utterly freaking useless on a computer?

Well... at first I didn't see the point either but having a lightning connector would have been nice for those who have an iPhone to use their (crappy) earphones. For those with standard headphones, they could have used the dongle that comes with the iPhone. I realize it's redundant but there might have been something to do with it. I'm playing devil's advocate here...

...Aren't most Mac owners a iPhone owner as well?

...

You have two Macs and an iPad but no iPhone? Must be in the less than 1% group.

Actually I also have two Macs and an iPad, but and Android phone. I would go and say that many Android users have Macs and I don't think all this is mutually exclusive, even if I would concur the majority of Apple users are fully in the ecosystem. Sure makes things easy, and if I could just get a few more things on the iPhone I would go back in a jiffy; Android is a really great and mature platform now, but it lacks a certain je-ne-sais-quoi of iOS... but that's and ENTIRELY other debate

 

[EnesM]

Well and that's my big fear; even I agree with all of you that USB-C is probably the future, I still have a sour taste in my mouth from Thunderbolt v.1&2, and yes, even Firewire (I'm that old). We were promised the future and got another box-load of useless cables and thingamabobs... Am I shellshocked? Maybe. But I'm worried nonetheless.

But that is my point, thunderbolt 1 & 2 ports were niche, whereas USB-C will be supported by everyone.

Firewire? I'm from the age of RS-232

 

[jameslmoser]

Professional photographers in general would say that there is zero justification for having the SD card reader. Their cameras do not use SD but CF so having an SD card reader is completely pointless. Since many computers do not come with a CF card reader those people buy their own external one; the added bonus: they can use it on other machines too. Because of that, there is little point in having a CF card reader in the MBP instead.

There is absolutely zero justification for your post because your use case isn't the same as someone else's! Apple understood this rather well, that's why we only have universal ports on the machine now. The user gets to choose what they should be instead of the manufacturer incorporating ports people are not going to use ever.


Because people already whined about only having one USB port on the MacBook so they are going to whine about the MBP having only one USB-A port. Apple just wants to push Thunderbolt 3 since it uses a universal port (USB-C) which allows users to turn it into whatever port they want. It simplifies their design, their circuitboard layout but it also means that with less components on the circuitboard the machine draws less power. Right now, Thunderbolt is a separate chip but eventually it will end up in the CPU.


Because you don't need to. Use a Lighting-USB-C cable (there is a 1m and a 2m version available from Apple right now). No need for a USB-A port and no need for an adapter. And this will apply to many other things too. If it does USB then all you need is a different cable and those are in general cheaper than any adapter. That's no different than in the pre-USB-C era (where some manufacturers even abused the USB connector and turned it into something proprietary; HTC for example). You are seeing a problem that isn't there and unfortunately a lot of other people here do too. Since we are going to move towards USB-C you are going to end up replacing cables or even devices eventually. Cables are currently available and they are expanding. The consumer electronic shows this year have already shown a big increase in USB-C devices with many of them already on the market.

The only thing actually requiring a dongle is TB1/2 to TB3 (and vice versa). Thunderbolt is simply a more complex protocol than USB is.


Because no company is able to renew its entire inventory at the same time nor would they ever do something like that. Financially there is not a single good reason to do something like that; instead you'd want to have something called Monthly Recurring Revenue which means that you have to have something to sell/lease each month. Not to mention that renewing your entire inventory at the same time creates really big supply chain issues (if your suppliers can't meet your demands, you are screwed). Over time we will see Apple and all the others move their devices from whatever USB connector they are using now to USB-C.

The reason for the iPhone is quite simple: they sell it to customers with a Mac but also to many that don't have one (lots of companies for example and they tend to use Windows machines). It makes more sense to include the USB-A by default and offer the USB-C version on their website.

That's a whole lot of excuses for a company that "designs for the experience" to not just include a combination of ports and make everything more compatible.

 

[dyn]

You make a pretty compelling argument there actually. I honestly doubt that's what Apple actually had in mind, because let's face it they don't care about anything else than our cash, but it's the end result nonetheless. Well said!

That applies to any company. At the end of the day they, like any one of us, need to cover their costs so they have to make money. Money also allows them to have big R&D budgets.

Apple still cares an awful lot about the technical components. They still invest into the UNIX parts of macOS and they still renew things like the keyboard and trackpad. Using Thunderbolt 3 fits in right in.

For the sake of argument, I don't think that's accurate. I really don't think Apple cares because those who dislike them will probably never change their minds and those who love them will probably buy anything the put out. In the end, the really don't give a flying racoon what you want or need: they will tell you what you get. Case and point being the 30-pin connector.

Nope, it is actually very accurate. As you've said it yourself, Apple wants to make money and that means they actually have to sell stuff. The iPhone is still one of their best selling products and used by many people who aren't into the Apple eco system. Using a cable that actually matches their world makes much more sense just as much as pushing the new technology is. The only way to do both is to put 1 kind of cable in the box and the other in the store.

As for the 30-pin connector: that showed what happens when a certain type of connector is being used all over the place. You get an enormous dependancy on that connector. When you replace the connector it will have an immense disruptive effect as everything now needs to be changed.

When they switched to lightning, they did it because they decided it was better, period.

And it was because USB-C didn't exist at that time. Lighting has now settled in for a while so I can imagine Apple not wanting another 30-pin debacle.

Another theory might be that since the iPhone is now considered a mainstream item, and it's their main bread winner, Apple might have been scared to rock the boat too hard by adding a USB-C cable (because let's face it: even if some other manufacturers did it, I doubt Apple would have included two cables).

Exactly. Changing something on the iPhone is a bigger risk which is why I think they haven't done it yet. It is safer to change it once USB-C has settled in for a bit.
Another thing that also affects this is the technical side of things. The iPhone is just a smartphone and not some kind of smartphone that you can turn into a little computer (which Microsoft does with the Lumia 950). Once you incorporate USB-C it means that physically it is compatible with all the other USB-C devices out there. Anyone who has worked at a servicedesk or as a sysadmin can tell you what hell this is going to be for support. People are going to try and hook up that USB-C dock and are going to expect it to work with the iPhone. Manufacturers are going to need to figure out what they are going to do with that. Obviously the MBP doesn't have that problem as it is a common computer.

Again, like a broken record, TB 1&2 and FW...

Not very good examples since these standards are aimed at high end computing. Those kind of things you are going to find in businesses and research and the odd enthusiast. For everybody else there is USB (which Apple gambled on and which did take off very well). Luckily Thunderbolt 3 offers both Thunderbolt and USB and uses the same connector so you only need 1 port.

For field work, all I need is a usb-c to usb-a dongle.

Why a dongle and not a cable? Since USB-C and USB-A both speak the same language there is absolutely no need for a dongle. In fact, using a dongle in a situation like this is really stupid because the more connectors you have, the more signal loss you have. This may not be an issue when connecting a keyboard but it will be when you are using something that uses speeds like 5 Gbps or even 10 Gbps. If there is no cable and the dongle is the only way then I can image why you'd use a dongle as it is the only way to connect something. In this case there are quite a few USB-A to USB-C cables.

That's a whole lot of excuses for a company that "designs for the experience" to not just include a combination of ports and make everything more compatible.

That's a whole lot of excuses for a company that up until now included all those ports of which most people didn't even use all of them. Thunderbolt 1 & 2 was a separate port but most people find the TB devices to be too expensive so those ports were useless to them. Luckily they made them so you can use it for connecting displays. Which not that many do because they use a notebook as a notebook. Previously they used Firewire instead of Thunderbolt which is yet another port hardly anybody used because, again, the devices were "too expensive". Ethernet port...useless for most people since at home they have wifi (cos wires are ugly or they can't drill holes into walls/floors), the office only allows wifi access (no wired) as do Starbucks, McDonalds or whatever place they go to for remote work. Wanting to connect more than 2 Thunderbolt or mini-DisplayPort devices? Tough luck! Not possible. Wanting to connect more than 2 USB devices? Use a hub. Oh yeah, don't forget that it needs to be a powered version for it to actually function properly if you have things like a 2.5" external USB drive.

So what do we have now? Four Thunderbolt 3 ports that uses USB-C which is a universal port. Need ethernet? Hook it up. Don't need it? Use the port for something you do need. Replace "ethernet" with any of the aforementioned ports.

Why on earth would you defend a company that up until now dictated the ports users should have instead of giving the users the choice to decide what ports they want? Why do you hate freedom so much?

 

[technosinner]

Once again I'm not implying the switch is inherently wrong, but I am left to wonder if Apple means the "Pro" in MacBook Pro. Maybe this should have been a MacBook, more oriented to the enthusiast and not the professional..? Just thinking out loud here.

But in the end and after a lot of good points from you guys, I've come to terms with this whole thing; I don't need a new computer just yet, so I'll hold off until more USB-c stuff hits the market, but in the end it might not be such a bad move after all...

 

[Samuelsan2001]

What would be the advantage of a USB-C vs. USB-A external harddrive??

Nothing!! However when you need to replace it a Tb3 connected SSD will be a massive upgrade that would be useless to you if you were running on USB A ports.

 

[aleni]

just give it time, next year i bet all devices will use usb-c