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HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray Battle Over? Warner Switches to Blu-Ray

MacNut said:
A cheap duel boot player would solve that problem as well. Both formats can survive and consumers can decide for themselves.
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Duel boot players would just continue the format war (wink wink, anybody getting this?)

Anyway, LG makes RIGHT NOW a $299 combo drive. I bought it with the intention of putting it inside my Mac Pro, but sadly even with Leopard OSX doesn't support either format. So I made a Vista Home Theater PC and I can play both formats. TODAY.

MacNut said:
I want backwards compatibility, Let me play my DVD's on whatever new system comes out. Im not going to replace my whole library when there is nothing wrong with the disks now. Up-conversion is the way to go IMO.
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Jeez you are a bundle of ignorance and misinformation. All HD-DVD and Blu-Ray players play DVDs (and upscale them, BTW). I have over 300 DVDs and I'm certainly not going to replace them all. A select few favorites, yes. And I won't buy any new DVDs, all HD for me. The only snag I hit was Rob Zombie's Halloween remake wasn't on either format; aside from that I've been renting HD-DVD and Blu-Ray from Blockbuster online.

DVDs aren't all of a sudden crap -- they're still OK. But upconversion is still making up information that isn't there in the source; there's something better and that's what I want. 1080p video and lossless sound, I'm sold.

MacNut said:
Nothing is really decided until the sales numbers are in. Right now both are losing to sd-dvd.
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Yet you bought a Mac.... Strange, don't you know Windows has 94% market share?
 
janstett said:
Jeez you are a bundle of ignorance and misinformation. All HD-DVD and Blu-Ray players play DVDs (and upscale them, BTW). I have over 300 DVDs and I'm certainly not going to replace them all. A select few favorites, yes. And I won't buy any new DVDs, all HD for me. The only snag I hit was Rob Zombie's Halloween remake wasn't on either format; aside from that I've been renting HD-DVD and Blu-Ray from Blockbuster online.

DVDs aren't all of a sudden crap -- they're still OK. But upconversion is still making up information that isn't there in the source; there's something better and that's what I want. 1080p video and lossless sound, I'm sold.

Yet you bought a Mac.... Strange, don't you know Windows has 94% market share?
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Don't mind MacNut. Some people are a little slow to shed their misconceptions in the light of new information. With a few exceptions, I've only bought titles in Hi Def formats that I did not already own on DVD or if the DVD version did not hold up well upscaled on my Bravia.

I'm going to be replacing my HD DVD titles with their Blu-ray counterparts once they come out for Blu-ray assuming I actually like the movie.
 
bommai said:
DVD prices came down without another format fighting it.
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Man, is everyone here too young to remember 1997?

There was another format fighting it -- Divx (not DiVX;-)). History lesson time.

DVD launched in 1997 and only a handfull of studios supported it. In 1998 Circuit City hijacked the format by adding compression and unique keys to the DVD, and created its own players that had modem jacks to call home. These Divx discs were valid for 48 hour rental periods and each time watched would phone home and bill your account. And they would not play on standard DVD players. And they were full-frame only (no widescreen).

Divx got backing from studios that didn't yet support DVD (like Disney, Fox, and Paramount) because they liked the DRM and the fact that you had to pay to watch the same movie more than once. Back in those days, you had to have Divx-dehanced DVD player to see Disney, Fox, and Paramount movies -- although the Divx-dehanced player still played normal DVDs.

At that time, it was very similar to what we're arguing about now with studio support except nobody or very few supported both. Some supported regular DVD (Open DVD), the ones above supported the pay-per-view Divx. Divx collapsed in a ball of flames because (1) it was only sold in Circuit City, and (2) DVD fans fought pay-per-view Divx in grass root movements.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DIVX

So, there was a direct competitor to DVD -- Divx. There was also the indirect competition of Laserdisc for the home theater enthusiast, and the spectre of VHS's dominance for the mass market. DVD overcame all three and that's why it's so easy for people to forget it.

Damn, DVD was a kick-ass format and it still is, even though now IT is the old man.
 
MacNut said:
Don't have HD yet, an even when I get it I won't get a higher format dvd for a while after.
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And that's why you don't understand.

You would think you'd want to listen to people who have HDTVs, and have seen DVDs upscaled (btw good TVs have built in scalers so an upscaling player is a waste of money), and have seen HDTV broadcasts, and HD-DVD and Blu-Ray discs. They might know what they're talking about.

This is like listening to a kid on a Huffy telling you why your Mercedes sucks.
 
janstett said:
BLECH! Want me to continue?

And to say Sony is not in control of the Blu-Ray format is naive to be polite.
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That was then.. And a different set of circumstances. I'm aware of the ATRAC stuff and have a minidisc player myself (which i only used for recording things). I wanted my data off the darn thing too. How does the minidisc thing relate to this though? If I burn a BD I'm obviously going to be able to read in in BD drives.. When I record a minidisc the data gets stuck in Sony-land. BD are just normal discs with normal data on?

I didn't say Sony don't have control, i said complete control - they aren't above the law and they have a consortium of other companies who they need to keep happy. Anything that happens with BD wont just be Sony's fault or doing. People's experiences with other proprietary formats don't mean this one is bad news.
 
janstett said:
ROOT KIT! How could I forget?
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That was Sony BMG, a wholly own subsidiary of Sony which had nothing to do with the creation of Blu-ray. Panasonic creates many of the Blu-ray drive mechanisms found in blu-ray players and was an equal partner in the early stages of blu-ray development before the BDA was formed and a bunch of other companies came on board. Blu-ray is no more a "Sony" format than the CD format (co-developed with Phillips) or the DVD format which Sony was involved in.

Sony and Panasonic were founding members of the BDA.
 
CBAviator said:
So kind of a crazy question (but a good one I think)...

Say that Toshiba ends up striking some sort of deal with Blu-Ray. I know that right now the two formats are not compatible. Is this some sort of PHYSICAL incompatibility or it is some sort of firmware incompatibility? Is it possible that if a deal were struck that current HD-DVD players could eventually read Blu-Ray DVDs as well with a simple update?
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I don't think so.

Physically, the disks are different (density of the pits, depth from the surface being the main differences. You can Wiki the full specs). So a HD-DVD ROM drive won't be able to read a BD-ROM disc.

Once you get past that, it's a software difference. Blu-Ray has an extra layer of encryption and for interactive menus, one uses HDi and one uses Java. On the PC PowerDVD plays them both. Paired with a combo drive (LG sells one) it can play both formats. The actual codecs (used to encode/decode the video and audio) are the same.
 
MacNut said:
People might not want to pay 2 grand for a nice HDTV they would rather pay the 200 for the converter.

VCD was still a step up from VHS, and that was way before DVD.
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Yeah, VCD was MPEG-1 on CD-ROMs. I have Terminator 2 on VCD. Or should I say 4 VCDs. That was fun having three interruptions in the movie to change discs.

And IMO VCD was a side-step from VHS. MPEG-1 sucks pretty bad and isn't all that much better than VHS at those bitrates.
 
Extra DRM???

Yes Blu-Ray now has extra DRM called BD+. From reports, it has been broken.

Ya know... obey the LAW! If something is worth watching, then it is worth watching legally! If you don't want to buy it, rent it.

But this is where the studioes are lacking.... make their content available on a variety of services so people can legally watch it at
1) Reasonable prices
2) Under Consumer friendly terms


Also Sony is the main backer of Blu-Ray, but not the sole decision maker. BDA is.
 
valdore said:
I heard awhile back that HD was winning over BluRay because the porn industry sided with HD, similar to what happened with VHS and Beta when the porn industry went with VHS.
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Porn mattered in the early 80s with home video but not so much as most get porn online rather than physical video.
 
MacNut said:
You could argue that VCD set the stage for DVD.
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No, Laserdisc set the stage for DVD. Of course, you've never seen one so you wouldn't know.

Laserdisc hit the market in 1978; first video on an optical disc. First use of widescreen, special editions, commentaries, et al. DVD owes much of its life to Laserdisc.

VCD was almost like a prototype for DVD that was destined to die. It deserves mention, but only as a footnote.
 
DVD is still the superior format. Players are inexpensive, the media is inexpensive, and is still looks good.

That being said, only one of the four TVs in my home is HD-compatible, and that is the 19" Samsung in my bedroom, which I only play 480p content on anyway. (Wii via Component, Dreamcast via VGA)

If I could get a HD-DVD player for around $100 I would snap it up immediately, primarily for upscaling and the few HD-DVDs I'd want to purchase (Primarily Corpse Bride)

But in the end...yeah. DVDs look fine.
 
rockosmodurnlif said:
I already don't go to the theater because of the exorbitant prices for a ticket, and if they abandon DVD so they can start charging more for HD, then I'll stop buying or renting movies. I'll just wait for some cracker (not hacker, there's a difference) to break the DRM and provide the ripped movies for free in "the scene" where it will eventually trickle down to me.
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Amen, brother!

Besides, I think the quality of movie theaters is going down. It's getting all blurry, out of sync, poor sound. Also those major label, I man studio movies are pretty bad too nowadays. Check out independent films, low cost productions, asian movies. Those are great and I don't mind subtitles at all.
 
janstett said:
Nice but irrelevant. The topic was the abuse of DRM by Sony.
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It is relevant in that individual companies within the Sony conglomerate are not centrally controlled by Sony. If they were, Sony would have had a unified media strategy and they would not have sold their music on iTMS because it hurt their own online store and sales of their own music players.
 
aristotle said:
It is relevant in that individual companies within the Sony conglomerate are not centrally controlled by Sony. If they were, Sony would have had a unified media strategy and they would not have sold their music on iTMS because it hurt their own online store and sales of their own music players.
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I boycott Sony. Put rootkits on CDs. Shame on you.
 
neoelectronaut said:
DVD is still the superior format. Players are inexpensive, the media is inexpensive, and is still looks good.

That being said, only one of the four TVs in my home is HD-compatible, and that is the 19" Samsung in my bedroom, which I only play 480p content on anyway. (Wii via Component, Dreamcast via VGA)

If I could get a HD-DVD player for around $100 I would snap it up immediately, primarily for upscaling and the few HD-DVDs I'd want to purchase (Primarily Corpse Bride)

But in the end...yeah. DVDs look fine.
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So what you are telling us is that you really don't have any experience with real HD. I thought so.
 
ShnikeJSB said:
Because, unless you've been living under a rock for a few years, you'd realize Sony has had quite the history of abusing DRM... :rolleyes:
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That's like saying Apple have quite a history of slave-labour-like factory conditions.. Sony is huge.. I can't tar the whole company based on a few hiccups here and there.

I don't see why Sony are likely to be abusing DRM in this particular case. What can they abusively do with it? Stop you ripping BluRay movies? Err.. So What? Stop you watching them? Umm.. Why would they do that?

The rootkit thing seemed like a hilarious oversight.. They got into a lot of trouble. Presumably lesson learned. Only 50 discs had it installed.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_compact_discs_sold_with_XCP - And they were all rubbish anyway.
 
MrCrowbar said:
I boycott Sony. Put rootkits on CDs. Shame on you.
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But you have no problem with MSFT rootkits and HD DVD? If you don't like Sony, then buy a Pioneer, Samsung, Sharp or Panasonic blu-ray player instead of a Sony.

Do you buy DVDs from Sony pictures or Columbia Tristar? There are no rootkits on DVDs or Blu-rays from Sony studios.
 
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