High Sierra and games

[Janichsan]

So, well, what are your experiences with High Sierra and games?

I can summarise mine with one four-letter-word, that I cannot write here without drawing the ire of the moderators.

Pretty much every game I tried runs like crap: Hitman, Grid 2, Borderlands 2, Kerbal Space Program, Euro Truck Simulator 2, War Thunder (in OpenGL mode), Elder Scrolls Online, Total War: Shogun 2 – none achieves more than something around 15 to 20 fps. That's when they are not freezing or crashing (like War Thunder in Metal mode, Unreal Tournament, Rome: Total War). The few exceptions that seem to run fine are Empire at War, XCOM, International Snooker 2012 and Minecraft.

I tested this on a 2016 15" rMBP with a AMD Radeon Pro 460 (4 GB).

So much for the promised driver optimisations…

 

[jeanlain]

No issue here.
iMac radeon 580.

 

[gkarris]

Pretty much every game I tried runs like crap: Hitman, Grid 2, Borderlands 2, Kerbal Space Program, Euro Truck Simulator 2, War Thunder (in OpenGL mode), Elder Scrolls Online – none achieves more than something around 15 to 20 fps. That's when they are not freezing or crashing (like War Thunder in Metal mode). The few exceptions that seem to run fine are Empire at War, XCOM, International Snooker 2012 and Minecraft.

I tested this on a 2016 15" rMBP with a AMD Radeon Pro 460 (4 GB).

So much for the promised driver optimisations…

Whenever I look for Metal 2 online, I also get "VR Capable GPU" in the same article. This translates to an AMD RX 480 (8GB). Sorry, yours falls short...

No issue here.
iMac radeon 580.

AMD RX 580, I would imagine, would work fine...

 

[jeanlain]

Radeon Pro 580. But if there's a bug somewhere, any card can have performance issues.
Mine does appear to run fine. I tested most of my Steam library and haven't noticed any difference compared to Sierra.
Hitman runs just a well and War Thunder (benchmark) doesn't crash. There's however an issue with red reflections on plane surfaces viewed at steep angles.

 

[Janichsan]

Whenever I look for Metal 2 online, I also get "VR Capable GPU" in the same article. This translates to an AMD RX 480 (8GB). Sorry, yours falls short...

I'm not talking about VR or anything. I'm talking about games that ran with 60 or more frames per second under Sierra on that same hardware and now are running like crap or not at all.

 

[jeanlain]

FWIW, War Thunder (benchmark) runs fine on my MacBook Air, Intel HD 6000. Reflections on metal surfaces are normal (they are reddish on my iMac).

 

[HawtTuna]

All of the games that I have played before (Rocket League and Pillars of Eternity) have had a 50% decrease in FPS since High Sierra on my MacBook Pro 2017 15 inch with Radeon Pro 555. I used to get a pretty consistent 50-60 fps in Rocket League now I get about 20-30 fps just in the training mode.

 

[jeanlain]

Could be an issue with power management on the Radeon Polaris laptops. The cards may be set to low power for some reason.
I suppose you checked the games weren't using the Intel GPU?

 

[Janichsan]

Could be an issue with power management on the Radeon Polaris laptops. The cards may be set to low power for some reason.
I suppose you checked the games weren't using the Intel GPU?

I already had that idea and made sure with gfxCardStatus that only the dedicated GPU is used and also disabled automatic GPU switching in the Energy settings. It makes no difference. A couple of the affected games (e.g. Total War: Shogun 2) also show which GPU they are using: it's always the dedicated AMD GPU.

 

[jeanlain]

I was thinking about the drivers reducing GPU power for some reason. Some at netkas forum (I think, but I cannot find the original post) have reported that High Sierra reintroduced an issue with GPU power management, forcing low-power state. I know this issue affects hacks, but it may also affect some Macs. I think the latest iStat menu can monitor GPU frequency.

 

[Irishman]

So, well, what are your experiences with High Sierra and games?

I can summarise mine with one four-letter-word, that I cannot write here without drawing the ire of the moderators.

Pretty much every game I tried runs like crap: Hitman, Grid 2, Borderlands 2, Kerbal Space Program, Euro Truck Simulator 2, War Thunder (in OpenGL mode), Elder Scrolls Online, Total War: Shogun 2 – none achieves more than something around 15 to 20 fps. That's when they are not freezing or crashing (like War Thunder in Metal mode, Unreal Tournament, Rome: Total War). The few exceptions that seem to run fine are Empire at War, XCOM, International Snooker 2012 and Minecraft.

I tested this on a 2016 15" rMBP with a AMD Radeon Pro 460 (4 GB).

So much for the promised driver optimisations…

Hang on, so, what frame rates were you getting on those games pre-High Sierra? I play Borderlands 2 on mid-level settings at 1080p on my late 2012 21.5" iMac, and get about 35-55 fps both before and after High Sierra.

I'm really surprised to hear that upgrading to High Sierra makes that much of a negative difference. I mean, BL2 isn't even a Metal game.

 

[960design]

So, well, what are your experiences with High Sierra and games?

I can summarise mine with one four-letter-word, that I cannot write here without drawing the ire of the moderators.

Pretty much every game I tried runs like crap: Hitman, Grid 2, Borderlands 2, Kerbal Space Program, Euro Truck Simulator 2, War Thunder (in OpenGL mode), Elder Scrolls Online, Total War: Shogun 2 – none achieves more than something around 15 to 20 fps. That's when they are not freezing or crashing (like War Thunder in Metal mode, Unreal Tournament, Rome: Total War). The few exceptions that seem to run fine are Empire at War, XCOM, International Snooker 2012 and Minecraft.

I tested this on a 2016 15" rMBP with a AMD Radeon Pro 460 (4 GB).

So much for the promised driver optimisations…

Star Control 2 is running great.
So is Minecraft.
Haven't tried Borderlands 2, yet.

 

[HawtTuna]

I just tried Civilization 6, before I was getting around 40-45 frames on the default settings. Now I get 8-10 fps, a huge decrease.

 

[jeanlain]

Please post your configuration, especially if you're having issues.

(I tested Borderlands 2. I don't have an fps counter but it seems to run just a well a before).

 

[Janichsan]

Hang on, so, what frame rates were you getting on those games pre-High Sierra? I play Borderlands 2 on mid-level settings at 1080p on my late 2012 21.5" iMac, and get about 35-55 fps both before and after High Sierra.

I'm really surprised to hear that upgrading to High Sierra makes that much of a negative difference. I mean, BL2 isn't even a Metal game.

I normally run all games at 1440x900 (as that is the only sensible evenly scaled resolution on 15" rMBPs, and sometimes even the highest offered resolution in games, due to the way macOS handles Retina resolutions). Before High Sierra, the games I mentioned ran at:

• Borderlands 2: 50-60 fps, high settings, without ambient occlusion
• Hitman: ca. 40 fps average according to benchmark (ranging from 30 to 80 fps), mid to high settings
• ETS 2: 40-50 fps, high settings
• War Thunder: 67 fps average with OpenGL
• ESO: ca. 40-50 fps, high settings
• Kerbal Space Program: around 60 fps, high settings
• Total War: Shogun 2: ca. 50-60 fps, mid to high settings

(I tested Borderlands 2. I don't have an fps counter but it seems to run just a well a before).

If you are using Steam, you can activate a framerate counter on the "In-Game" page of Steam's preferences.

 

[bericthered]

I can attest to the same thing. -> 15" Macbook pro 2012 (non-retina) geforce 650M 512mb.
-Slime Rancher -> 5-15 fps (was running at 30+ fps on Sierra)
-Layers of Fear: Masterpiece edition -> 5-10 fps - does not save (known issue on high sierra)
-Superhot -> 15- 20 fps (was running at 35-50 fps on Sierra)
-Torchlight II -> 30-40 fps (was running at 35-50 on Sierra)

Running these games on bootcamp (Windows 10) still gives the best performance. My framerates hover 5-10 fps higher than Sierra numbers.

I've also tested a couple none 3d games (Salt and Sanctuary, Owlboy) in High Sierra and performance seems to be the same as on Sierra.

 

[chrono1081]

I'm not running games, but actually something much more intensive (Mari) and have no issues here and I'm painting with a large amount of udims.

 

[Euroamerican]

This thread just gave me pause as to whether or not I want to upgrade one of my Macs to Sierra/HighSierra. What about those few games I have? I know there are discussions about which versions of the Mac OS work with certain games out on the one website I get games from, GOG.

Then again, some of the oldies-but-goodies that I get from GOG actually only run on Windows. So what do I do? I actually run one of them in a VMWare Fusion VM.

So here is my thought: What about running your games in a Mac OS (older version of 10.X) VM within the host High Sierra's vm utility?

 

[imaginex20]

2017 15” MBP, I used to get over 100 FPS on Sierra for CS:GO, now I get 35 FPS. What the hell is wrong with this OS?

 

[antonis]

Not game related but I find some specific animations to be highly lagged in High Sierra compared to the previous version, like the lock screen cube rotating animation. IIRC apple has said that in High Sierra all the UI has been reworked with Metal ?

 

[Irishman]

2017 15” MBP, I used to get over 100 FPS on Sierra for CS:GO, now I get 35 FPS. What the hell is wrong with this OS?

late 2012 21.5" iMac and my CSGO framerate is unchanged after HS. (All settings maxed and 1080p, 60 fps or better).

 

[Janichsan]

From the replies, I'm getting the drift that this problem seems to be limited to MacBooks Pros.

 

[jeanlain]

Which is why I suspect a bug in power management. It could also be a bug in the new Metal-based Window server, but I'm not sure why it would not affect my radeon pro 580 if it affects other Polaris GPUs.
Has no one checked GPU frequency? The new iStat menu can report it.
EDIT: well it reports 0 MHz, so I suppose there are issues to fix.

 

[imaginex20]

Here is what I noticed: if I restart my computer and play the game, the FPS is fine. When I put my computer to sleep and wake it up and play game, the FPS is horrible.

 

[Janichsan]

Which is why I suspect a bug in power management. It could also be a bug in the new Metal-based Window server, but I'm not sure why it would not affect my radeon pro 580 if it affects other Polaris GPUs.

I won't rule out the power management as the cause of the problem, but shouldn't then all games be affected? As I mentioned, there are a couple that do not have these issues for me.

Has no one checked GPU frequency? The new iStat menu can report it.
EDIT: well it reports 0 MHz, so I suppose there are issues to fix.

I think you need a special kext for iStat to show CPU and GPU frequencies.