How about a forum for Android, Pre, etc.?

[mkrishnan]

The iPhone forum used to be a place where one could come to discuss iPhone-related issues

IIRC, in those storied days, the iPhone forum was overrun with threads like, "One of the speakers on the bottom of my iPhone is broken," "I just bricked my iPhone with Pwnage Tool," and several variants of "LOL my iPhone is floating in the toilet."

To keep this in perspective, I looked at the following forums this morning:

iPhone forum: of the top 120 threads in the iPhone forum, 8 were about competitor cell phones, including all threads of the form, "I just switched to" or "I am thinking about switching to" x. That's an approximate rate of 6.7% of threads. Granted these threads are active, but they are still not very many threads in number.

Now I'm going to be lazy and only look at the first page for the rest of these, but...

iPhone Tips / ... forum -- 0 of the first 60 threads (0%) were about iPhone competitors.

iPhone Accessories -- 0 of the first 60 threads (0%) were about iPhone competitors. One thread was about an Ed Hardy product, and I view Ed Hardy to be a competitor to the success of the human race, but not to the iPhone.

iPhone Hacks -- 1 of the first 60 threads (1.7%) were about iPhone competitors.

So in perspective, I guess I am not seeing the "overrun"-ness of the iPhone forum....

 

[miles01110]

How about asking how to use competing products?

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/914886/

It's getting where you might as well change the title of the iPhone forums to Smartphone forums.

Yeah, not sure about that one. Maybe put it in the garbage can that is Apple Industry & Internet? I suppose one could make the argument that the above post could be put into the context of comparing it to the iPhone, but that person won't be me. The first response clearly derailed the thread, though.

iPhone Accessories -- 0 of the first 60 threads (0%) were about iPhone competitors. One thread was about an Ed Hardy product, and I view Ed Hardy to be a competitor to the success of the human race, but not to the iPhone.

POTD!

 

[thelatinist]

Granted these threads are active, but they are still not very many threads in number.

You cannot just dismiss the fact that they dominate the top of the forum as "granted these threads are active." Frequently five or six of these threads will be in the top 10 posts of the thread, the fact that they don't happen to be doing so at the moment notwithstanding. Even now, though, three of those threads are in the first ten posts. That's 30%. I think that is an unreasonably high percentage of Android posts at the top of an iPhone forum.

Again, I am not saying that the solution is a new sub-forum for competing products, but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

 

[miles01110]

You cannot just dismiss the fact that they dominate the top of the forum as "granted these threads are active." Frequently five or six of these threads will be in the top 10 posts of the thread, the fact that they don't happen to doing so be at the moment notwithstanding. Even now, three of those threads are in the first ten posts. That's 30%. I think that is an unreasonably high percentage of Android posts at the top of an iPhone forum.

This argument doesn't really work. What does activity really have to do with it? And why do you feel obligated to read the thread in the first place? Forgive me for always seeming contrary, but it seems like this is being blown out of proportion. If it's really a problem, make a reasoned post report on the basis of something other than "I think that this is unreasonable" because clearly other people have different opinions.

but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

Damn Google for wanting to compete, indeed.

 

[yg17]

You cannot just dismiss the fact that they dominate the top of the forum as "granted these threads are active." Frequently five or six of these threads will be in the top 10 posts of the thread, the fact that they don't happen to be doing so at the moment notwithstanding. Even now, though, three of those threads are in the first ten posts. That's 30%. I think that is an unreasonably high percentage of Android posts at the top of an iPhone forum.

Again, I am not saying that the solution is a new sub-forum for competing products, but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

Problem? What problem? It's pretty obvious from the thread title what the thread is about. If you don't want to read a thread about Android, don't open the thread. It's a pretty simple solution to a near non-existent problem.

 

[jpyc7]

. . .
Again, I am not saying that the solution is a new sub-forum for competing products, but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

I suggest that you quantify the problem if you want to get people to take your problem seriously. The moderator said he/she looked at 120 or 60 active threads in each iPhone-related forum. You say that you don't like that methodology.

So do your own analysis and explain your methodology and everyone can then respond whether they think you have a convincing argument or not.

 

[-aggie-]

I suggest that you quantify the problem if you want to get people to take your problem seriously. The moderator said he/she looked at 120 or 60 active threads in each iPhone-related forum. You say that you don't like that methodology.

So do your own analysis and explain your methodology and everyone can then respond whether they think you have a convincing argument or not.

Anyone that frequents the iPhone forums knows about these issues. I don't recall seeing you in those forums, so it might be hard for you to see the issue, if you don't read the posts daily. Just sayin'.

Looking at the "iPhone-related" forums means nothing. The ONLY place these kind of posts can go is in the iPhone forum (not troubleshooting, hacks, etc.).

You cannot just dismiss the fact that they dominate the top of the forum as "granted these threads are active." Frequently five or six of these threads will be in the top 10 posts of the thread, the fact that they don't happen to be doing so at the moment notwithstanding. Even now, though, three of those threads are in the first ten posts. That's 30%. I think that is an unreasonably high percentage of Android posts at the top of an iPhone forum.

Again, I am not saying that the solution is a new sub-forum for competing products, but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

+1, if it matters. Anyway, seems like this would help with moderating the forums, but some don't think so. I guess things will just stay as they are.

 

[mkrishnan]

Again, I am not saying that the solution is a new sub-forum for competing products, but I find your refusal even to see the problem incredibly frustrating. We are not crazy, we are not making this up, and this is not the way the thread was even a couple of months ago. It is a recent development that is only getting worse.

I'm not saying anyone is crazy... I understand you feel that there is a problem and it is getting worse, but I don't understand the evidence. Yes, if you happen to catch the forum right after someone posts an Android post, you can say that all of the top one threads in the iPhone forum is about Android. But when you look at page one of the forum, you see a lot more than one or ten threads. I'm not following how it's that hard to wade through even three out of ten threads, which again does not seem to be representative of activity in the iPhone forum anyways.

Part of the problem is that people are posting about something you don't care about... but isn't that a fact of life on a forum? If you compare the iPhone subforum to another subforum in which you personally have interest here, are there really a substantially lower percentage of threads that are of interest to you there than elsewhere? Are threads that are "important" in the iPhone forum getting ignored because of the three threads discussing Evo or HTC Sense or Droid?

Problem? What problem? It's pretty obvious from the thread title what the thread is about. If you don't want to read a thread about Android, don't open the thread. It's a pretty simple solution to a near non-existent problem.

Do people generally agree that this is correct? That is, is there an issue with people intruding on iPhone threads to bicker about or discuss non-iPhone products, or is it really limited to a thread about Android, etc? I guess, for instance, that if someone starts a thread, "The next iPhone will/should/could have OLED," discussion of the Droid or Droid Incredible is going to be fairly inevitable, just as if there's a discussion of how to implement multitasking or social networking, Pre is going to come up.... Is that a "problem," too, or is that "okay?" (That's not sarcastic -- I'm legitimately curious.)

 

[yg17]

I guess things will just stay as they are.

As they should. 6 out of 60 threads is hardly a probelm.

Besides, I think having an Android specific forum is just going to be entice the fanboys to post "OMG I went to a Verizon store and tried a Droid and it sucks!!!! The iPhone is sooooo much better!!11" and create more headaches for the mods.

Do people generally agree that this is correct? That is, is there an issue with people intruding on iPhone threads to bicker about or discuss non-iPhone products, or is it really limited to a thread about Android, etc? I guess, for instance, that if someone starts a thread, "The next iPhone will/should/could have OLED," discussion of the Droid or Droid Incredible is going to be fairly inevitable, just as if there's a discussion of how to implement multitasking or social networking, Pre is going to come up.... Is that a "problem," too, or is that "okay?" (That's not sarcastic -- I'm legitimately curious.)

I don't think it's a problem at all. Of course a thread about OLED will have posts like "I tried a friend's [non iPhone smartphone] with OLED and it's really nice, I hope the next iPhone has it".

I think people are asking for all discussion related to other phones banished from the iPhone forums, and I just don't think that's possible.

 

[-aggie-]

As they should. 6 out of 60 threads is hardly a probelm.

Besides, I think having an Android specific forum is just going to be entice the fanboys to post "OMG I went to a Verizon store and tried a Droid and it sucks!!!! The iPhone is sooooo much better!!11" and create more headaches for the mods.

However, it would keep those threads in one place, which could be ignored in Forum Spy.

 

[miles01110]

However, it would keep those threads in one place, which could be ignored in Forum Spy.

Truth. Although maybe a better alternative would be to allow selectively blocking threads in Forum Spy. THAT would be a dream come true.

Do people generally agree that this is correct? That is, is there an issue with people intruding on iPhone threads to bicker about or discuss non-iPhone products, or is it really limited to a thread about Android, etc? I guess, for instance, that if someone starts a thread, "The next iPhone will/should/could have OLED," discussion of the Droid or Droid Incredible is going to be fairly inevitable, just as if there's a discussion of how to implement multitasking or social networking, Pre is going to come up.... Is that a "problem," too, or is that "okay?" (That's not sarcastic -- I'm legitimately curious.)

Looking at some of the threads referenced I'd say it's an issue, but like most other issues "it depends" on whether or not that reaches "problem" status. There's lots of pointless bickering in every forum. I honestly don't see why the scope of this thread seems to be limited to iPhone vs. [competitor].

 

[yg17]

However, it would keep those threads in one place, which could be ignored in Forum Spy.

But I want to discuss Android and wouldn't want to ignore that forum in Forum Spy, so why should I have to wade through all of the "OMG Android blows!!!!" threads?

I think what we have now works. It doesn't provide an open invitation for the Android bashing threads, and the few threads that are about Android aren't numerous enough that you're having to sift through them.

 

[jpyc7]

Anyone that frequents the iPhone forums knows about these issues. I don't recall seeing you in those forums, so it might be hard for you to see the issue, if you don't read the posts daily. Just sayin'.

That is correct that I do not read those forums (because I am not interested) and therefore cannot see the issue. I'm just saying that your case is stronger with evidence in numbers, not in qualitative statements.

Maybe this has already been done, but a forum poll in iPhone subforum asking about this issue would be another way of converting 'qualitative' experiences into a number. I promise I won't vote in it, because I'm not reading that forum.

 

[-aggie-]

Truth. Although maybe a better alternative would be to allow selectively blocking threads in Forum Spy. THAT would be a dream come true.

Looking at some of the threads referenced I'd say it's an issue, but like most other issues "it depends" on whether or not that reaches "problem" status. There's lots of pointless bickering in every forum. I honestly don't see why the scope of this thread seems to be limited to iPhone vs. [competitor].

There's bickering maybe in other forums, but the iPhone forum gets the "Tiger Woods Fan Types of the Mac World." (Nothing against Tiger, he's my favorite golfer, but it's the best way to explain my meaning without a lot of words.) These new members aren't regular users of forums and some are young and immature. So, the iPhone forums gets more of the kind of posts that might come from that type of user.

I'd definitely like to see Selective Thread Blocking. I don't think vBulletin is set up for that though.

 

[miles01110]

These new members aren't regular users of forums and some are young and immature. So, the iPhone forums gets more of the kind of posts that might come from that type of user.

The iPad forums get their fair share of that also.

 

[mkrishnan]

However, it would keep those threads in one place, which could be ignored in Forum Spy.

We need an adaptive filtering engine for Forum Spy. I personally would like to automatically suppress any post with more than three spelling errors.

 

[GGJstudios]

I'd be happier if we could simply keep all the gaming threads in the Apple Games forum, rather than have them scattered across all the other forums. I eliminate Games from Forum Spy preferences, but still get bombarded with threads on games, steam, portal, etc.

 

[cube]

I think just one forum for whatever non-Apple gear would be enough, after all people do not buy everything from Apple.

Community discussion is just for the random stuff.

 

[-aggie-]

We need an adaptive filtering engine for Forum Spy. I personally would like to automatically suppress any post with more than three spelling errors.

Some people might pay for this feature.

@Miles: I currently have iPad forums ignored in Forum Spy. Every time I try to take them out of ignore, they fill up the screen with mostly iPad posts. Maybe a few months from now, once the G4 comes out, I can take them out of ignore.

 

[miles01110]

@Miles: I currently have iPad forums ignored in Forum Spy. Every time I try to take them out of ignore, they fill up the screen with mostly iPad posts. Maybe a few months from now, once the G4 comes out, I can take them out of ignore.

Well right now Macrumors news is dominating my Forum spy with posts of "Absolutely" and other deep thoughts.

Basically you can't win

 

[mkrishnan]

^^ To some extent, that is a problem that is just the ebb and flow of a forum. When Apple releases a game-changer product, or when someone else releases a prominent product in a space in which they play, there is going to be a ton of discussion about it. That's almost inevitable, although we try to keep things clean by merging or closing dupe threads. Similarly, people complain when Arn doesn't post rumors about new MP's or MBP's when there just aren't really any credible rumors, but you know, what do you want him to do, right?

Some people might pay for this feature.

Add this to the list of features after the forum-to-LOLCat and forum-to-Pirate translators.

 

[miles01110]

Similarly, people complain when Arn doesn't post rumors about new MP's or MBP's when there just aren't really any credible rumors, but you know, what do you want him to do, right?

We're merely asking arn and company to acquiesce to every person's individual preferences without offending anyone else. I honestly don't think that's too much to ask (PS I think this feature is included in vBulletin 4.0; you should upgrade!).

 

[thelatinist]

Perhaps a better alternative to starting a separate sub-forum would be to create a single thread within the iPhone forum for discussion of Android, like what was done for speculation threads. Just as there is no need for multiple speculation threads, there really is no need for a thread for each Android phone. Combine them all into a "Big Android/iPhone Alternative Mega-thread."

 

[mkrishnan]

Combine them all into a "Big Android/iPhone Alternative Mega-thread."

I think a single thread encompassing every iPhone competitor would be unmanageable, but a merged Android thread is not a bad idea (and perhaps a separate thread for Pre, etc). As the Android strategy continues to unfurl, there will be a lot of new models in the next 18 months, presumably more than a couple of which will get discussed here.

OTOH, the same situation happens with notebook computers, and it generally takes care of itself, since there might be 50 different Arrandale notebooks coming out, but only one or two that really capture people's interest (in the way that the Droid or Droid Incredible does, but, say, the Droid Eris does not).

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

Why not just make a subforum for each forum titled "Apple Competitors"?