People think if taxes are high product prices will go up since the investor will want to keep his margins. The truth is the market won't allow a price increase so all that happens is margins are lower. That means your investor has to invest more and produce more to make the money he wants. At the end of the day, it may well be the rich who are the real lazy ones and who want an easy ride.
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How Apple Minimizes its Corporate Tax Burden
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People think if taxes are high product prices will go up since the investor will want to keep his margins. The truth is the market won't allow a price increase so all that happens is margins are lower. That means your investor has to invest more and produce more to make the money he wants. At the end of the day, it may well be the rich who are the real lazy ones and who want an easy ride.
I've taken a LOT of whithering fire from detractors for saying that we need MAJOR income tax reform to get the US economy going again.
This article is actually not news to anyone who's read The FairTax Book by Neal Boortz and former Rep. John Linder (R-GA), originally published in 2005. One chapter in that book specifically talks about how businesses can "work the system" of the current complicated income tax code to legally "offshore" huge amounts of liquid assets as a means of tax avoidance. According to some economists, this practice has "offshored" possibly as high as US$15 TRILLION (!!) in such assets--enough to just about erase the current US Federal budget deficit!
And you wonder why the vast majority of Apple's liquid asset holdings are sitting in banks beyond US borders.
That's US$15 TRILLION that is sitting in foreign financial institutions, not in US financial institutions, where the money could be used as collateral for business loans and lines of credit for business operations and expansion. And this is not just a US problem either--several European countries are constantly worrying about money ostensibly owned by European residents and businesses sitting in "tax haven" countries like Carribbean island nations, beyond the reach of European national tax authorities.
In short, I believe it's high time we admit that the majority of current income tax systems around the world are becoming a huge impediment to business, and we should drastically simplify them along with a tax rate no higher than 17 to 18 percent to encourage more savings and capital investment in the local economy.
This article is actually not news to anyone who's read The FairTax Book by Neal Boortz and former Rep. John Linder (R-GA), originally published in 2005. One chapter in that book specifically talks about how businesses can "work the system" of the current complicated income tax code to legally "offshore" huge amounts of liquid assets as a means of tax avoidance. According to some economists, this practice has "offshored" possibly as high as US$15 TRILLION (!!) in such assets--enough to just about erase the current US Federal budget deficit!
And you wonder why the vast majority of Apple's liquid asset holdings are sitting in banks beyond US borders.That's US$15 TRILLION that is sitting in foreign financial institutions, not in US financial institutions, where the money could be used as collateral for business loans and lines of credit for business operations and expansion. And this is not just a US problem either--several European countries are constantly worrying about money ostensibly owned by European residents and businesses sitting in "tax haven" countries like Carribbean island nations, beyond the reach of European national tax authorities.
In short, I believe it's high time we admit that the majority of current income tax systems around the world are becoming a huge impediment to business, and we should drastically simplify them along with a tax rate no higher than 17 to 18 percent to encourage more savings and capital investment in the local economy.
Right, we all agree the meth game sucks. But since we can only hate the game, we have nothing against this player....
No, quite the contrary. When you introduce ideas of cheating the game, whether you realize or not you are agreeing we can blame players. At the end of the day it is the player who create the game. Just like with guns. Guns don't shoot people, people do.
Wow! What planet do you live on? Just look at third world countries, where none of those infrastructures (which, by the way, the rich largely pay for) exist. Who suffers most? The rich? No. Their money, work ethic and intelligence will allow them to survive. While the less talented and motivated will suffer much more.
You would do well to just shut up and read a book or two. Because your every post shines more light on your lack of understanding of reality.
Yeah, again classic arguement for why were in the situation we're in. If Apple payed what they're suppose to pay they wouldn't go out of business, they would just have a little less profit. Making 3000 times your Cost 2 Good as opposed to 30000 times does not mean its unsustainable and they have to close shop, thats what greed driven republican hard ons think but sadly you can sustain a business without have record profits doubling and trippleing every quarter. Thats called pisspoor management when you need unrealistic profits just to get by, that and CORPORATE GREED.
Not even remotely close to true. Massive overspending and lack of future planning is the #1 reason why the US government is in such bad shape. The US economy is primarily suffering because there is no confidence in the leadership of this country (and I don't just mean the President, it's both houses of Congress, all levels of state and local government, all of it's rotten to the core in both parties). Our debt and spending levels are unsustainable, no matter how much more we force corporations or individuals to pay in taxes.
Want to get this country back on track? Cut all unnecessary government spending, reduce taxes to the minimum needed to pay for those government programs, plus let's say 2% of the deficit left from the last decade, and let the economy recover by not interfering any more. Then, raise taxes just enough to pay off the debt in a reasonable time frame (and I'm talking decades here, at least, simply because it's so massive now). If we don't start paying down that debt, then China and the other countries that loan to us will eventually have to start collecting it from us in other ways. It's absolutely unsustainable.
And you know what? Apple paying more in taxes wouldn't do jack squat for the economy or for the Federal budget (which there hasn't even been one proposed, much less passed, in 3 years, which says a lot about the audacity of the current Congress and President).
jW
If Apple pays full tax, but Google and Microsoft don't, who do you think is going to have lower prices? And which products are people going to buy, the cheap ones or the expensive ones?
If one company (in this case Apple) pays full taxes when the rest don't, they will go out of business. I'd like every company to pay the same taxes (and for their taxes to be less to make up for it), but they don't.
If the rich were paying for these services, why are they crumbling and falling apart? Oh! The poor aren't paying their share? Let's tax them more? Truth is there is anything left for them to pay. So either the rich ponny up or the infrastrucure will decay further.
If the rich really did pay for these things, the proof would be in the eating of the pudding. We could look and see what the quality of service was like.
You have a habit of using divisive labels in this discussion. Please stop doing that, lilo. Thanks!
I have looked at your conjectures closely. Each point is deconstructed below. What you don't realize is that everybody needs each and every thing you have listed below. If "rich people" are hurt by the lack of these things, then non-rich people are invariably hurt worse.
Someone traveling 20 miles to/from work can use a bike? A mom taking her family can use a bike? Really?
What about houses and buildings that use oil for heating?
What about all of the other products completely unrelated to energy or travel that use petrochemicals? Are you ready to do without all of those -- or pay a huge premium for them? Do you feel qualified in claiming that nobody else will care if the price of these goods skyrockets?
Actually, if Apple's product couldn't be delivered to customers, then none of the 304,000 employees would have a job. And none of the 210,000 independent developers who receive income from iOS applications wouldn't have any iOS users to sell their applications to.
I have no idea what this means. Do you think Apple is "exploiting" its employees? Can you explain how?
But you fail to realize: Apple's 304,000 employees have indeed benefitted from their education.
Even if you personally do not, the vast majority of Americans do indeed depend on the roads.
Again, you fail to realize: without a reliable way to deliver product, then those 304,000 employees would not have a job.
Companies that use heavy trucks do indeed pay the lion's share for maintenance of the roads.
Odds are low that you have a wife. Odds are essentially zero that you have small children.
Yet the well-being of the vast majority of Americans does indeed depend on an orderly society. Most would be revolted if we start having broken bones and molotov cocktails in the streets of America.
Most would be disgusted with those activities. But you don't care? Really?
Once again, you fail to realize: if nobody goes to stores, then the stores go out of business. Any sort of activity which hurts "rich people" will invariably hurt vast swaths of non-rich people, too.
Indeed. We have looked at your arguments, and absolutely none of them make any sense. Zero for five.
Maybe the arguments have nothing to do with political party -- maybe they have to do with common sense.Correct. The rich do pay far more than the poor.
Do you realize that 47% of Americans pay no income tax at all? That's zero -- as a percentage and as a dollar amount.
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Ffs do the math. If Apple paid up rather than turn out 30 billion in profits they would get like 20 billion in profits, god forbid.
Absolute rubbish. Sounds like you think investors just have money to invest wherever and whenever they want and that they should just pass along those gains to the worthless rubbish who don't want to work, but only want their handout. There are of course worthless people with a variety of income levels, but the ones that are producing and actually helping the economy are the ones who aren't just willing to throw away money because it somehow helps other people, especially not at the point of a gun. The "rich" aren't lazy for finding ways to pay less in taxes. They're protecting their investments, so that they can invest in other things that will benefit them and those who they purchase from and sell to.
jW
Again classic republican talking point, Do you work for Paul Ryan's Path to Poverty group? No Apple doesnt pickup goigle or msofts taxes, the government just has less money. Apple then doesnt pay there 30% plus the difference of msoft and googles percent of the 30% that they evaded from paying, nice talking points though, sounds like you need to look into being a republican budget strategist, you have a natural talent for it.
So who here paid more income tax than they had to?
It's fine that people are taking note that corporations get unjustified freebies, but Apple is hardly an exception. Fix the system so that it is fair to everybody. Of course, Apple is a convenient target here, being the behemoth it is now. If this brings about changes for everybody, then I'm all for it.
It's fine that people are taking note that corporations get unjustified freebies, but Apple is hardly an exception. Fix the system so that it is fair to everybody. Of course, Apple is a convenient target here, being the behemoth it is now. If this brings about changes for everybody, then I'm all for it.
Right cause owning 14 houses, a helicopter and a yacht is really helping the economy better than having that money taxed and invested in healthcare, roads, and education. Yes we need people to build houses, etc., but no one needs that kind of excess and that isn't my idea of re-investment.
I don't blame Apple any more than any other company, but still want to see this changed across the board. If it takes Apple's visibility to call attention to corporations getting a free ride in the resources that allow them to make their money, then so be it.
You can't solve this with a little arithmetic. Apple would not even make the $33.75G if they had higher prices to start with.
It's easy. Apple employees are in USA. Apple's well being depends on USA infrastructure (health and education system), army etc. and not on Ireland's one. That's what makes it immoral for them to pay taxes to Ireland while designing their products in USA.
Care to tell me who you're talking about and why you deserve the money they earned, instead of them having the right to keep it, since, you know, they earned it?
jW
Even building 14 houses, a helicopter, and a yacht provides a lot of jobs. Boosting healthcare only keeps the lazy alive (although a bit of public healthcare is necessary for those who experience very unexpected problems).
Who said anything about a price increase? That your non-sequiter. I said paying taxes will lower profit margins, not prices or units sold.
Exactly. No company should pay taxes in the country that they are not selling the products in. However, I blame the entire system of bad regulations and the result of every company using tax loopholes, not any individual company.
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Tax increase => price increase. They have no choice but to push it onto the consumers.
Also, "that your non-sequiter" is a fragment.
I never said I should get the money. Nice try though. As for them earning the money, exploiting tax loopholes suggests they didn't earn it. They would have earned it if they paid their fair share. Now we need to get government to step in and regulate taxes even more strictly than before. We need to have our officials waste their time with this nonsense rather than investing their time elsewhere. In other words, a bunch of us needs to clean up the mess these people created. Ya ya, they were just doing what everyone does. That doesn't mean I don't get to criticize them and scold their behavior.
Well, they should have the right to keep it, but they should still be taxed. Public services are an investment that eventually helps the businesses a lot more. Every student of public education is an investment because they can become skilled workers for a corporation or owners/founders of a corporation.
However, there is a point at which having too many public services is too wasteful, and they make people lazy; I think the US is past this point a bit. The unemployment benefits are out of control.