iPhone 12 Pro How much of a difference do you expect to see with the Pro Max camera?

[Shreksswamp]

I actually don't understand how you think that makes sense.

You're compared a smartphone sensor to a things that aren't smartphones.

This will be a significant upgrade to smartphone photography and coupled by Apple's ever increasing image processing tech the photos will no doubt be a proper upgrade here, because that's why iPhone photos look so good now, it's not about a single component, it's about the total system.

Seriously facepalm at that chart 😅

I personally feel there has been a bit of a collective freakout among the photography community when it comes to Iphone's, rather then view phone photography in a similar vein to Polaroids they take it as an insult or direct attack against DSLR's when the tiniest inkling of suggestion that in some cases the two are comparable. Not to bash on photographers but I feel that there is certainly a threat that Iphone poses specifically when it comes to Instagram, it's far too easy to take amazing photos with the Iphone and I don't blame them for feeling like their identity is being called into question. I'm sure for years many have made themselves the photographers of their friend-group and suddenly all their friends are taking good if not better photos, it has to hurt their ego. I will not deny though that DSLR technology is superior in almost every single way but to flatout say Iphone photos are bad by comparison because you can't zoom in or the bokeh isn't perfect is silly.

 

[konicky]

I actually don't understand how you think that makes sense.

You're compared a smartphone sensor to a things that aren't smartphones.

This will be a significant upgrade to smartphone photography and coupled by Apple's ever increasing image processing tech the photos will no doubt be a proper upgrade here, because that's why iPhone photos look so good now, it's not about a single component, it's about the total system.

Seriously facepalm at that chart 😅

He compared the camera sensor in a smartphone to other camera sensors, what's wrong with that? Also addressed the issue with computational photography so not sure what your facepalm is all about!

 

[Girder_Shade]

Maybe so, but it really shouldn’t be that big of a difference between the pro and pro max. You are paying a premium for the pro, it should be premium specs.

The only thing that annoys me is that Apple saved their best camera system for the Max. I am not a fan of large phablet phones but I have no choice this time around I want flagship specs.

 

[bmac4]

The only thing that annoys me is that Apple saved their best camera system for the Max. I am not a fan of large phablet phones but I have no choice this time around I want flagship specs.

Yep that’s me too. I don’t understand why they did this.

 

[PeteBurgh]

The only thing that annoys me is that Apple saved their best camera system for the Max. I am not a fan of large phablet phones but I have no choice this time around I want flagship specs.

Yep that’s me too. I don’t understand why they did this.

I think the explanation is straightforward - there is simply more room in a large phone for ’more camera‘ (i.e. a larger sensor, a different kind of stabilisation).

If the space is there for a better camera, may as well use it. The alternative is what, unnecessarily using a compact, inferior camera just for the sake of consistency/make 12 Pro users feel better?

 

[Girder_Shade]

I think the explanation is straightforward - there is simply more room in a large phone for ’more camera‘ (i.e. a larger sensor, a different kind of stabilisation).

If the space is there for a better camera, may as well use it. The alternative is what, unnecessarily using a a compact, inferior camera just for the sake of consistency/make 12 Pro users feel better?

Or Apple could have just made the phone thicker that way we could have the better camera and bigger battery that's what most users want.

 

[bmac4]

I think the explanation is straightforward - there is simply more room in a large phone for ’more camera‘ (i.e. a larger sensor, a different kind of stabilisation).

If the space is there for a better camera, may as well use it. The alternative is what, unnecessarily using a a compact, inferior camera just for the sake of consistency/make 12 Pro users feel better?

Do you really think the camera takes up that much room? It’s not like the max is thicker. That’s just Apple excuse for putting a bigger camera in the max. If that were the case then the 11 pro max would have had a bigger sensor.

 

[akash.nu]

The only thing that annoys me is that Apple saved their best camera system for the Max. I am not a fan of large phablet phones but I have no choice this time around I want flagship specs.

Yep that’s me too. I don’t understand why they did this.

Yep count me in that group. I don’t like such huge phones. I tried with the iPhone 8 Plus and the Xs Max but could never get used to the massive size. But I’ve provisionally put an order through for the Max just for the camera.

I think the explanation is straightforward - there is simply more room in a large phone for ’more camera‘ (i.e. a larger sensor, a different kind of stabilisation).

If the space is there for a better camera, may as well use it. The alternative is what, unnecessarily using a a compact, inferior camera just for the sake of consistency/make 12 Pro users feel better?

I think it’s both a technical and business driven decision. In terms of technical choice, it’s logical to put a bigger part within a bigger body and the battery on the 12 Pro is already smaller than the 11 Pro from last year.

However, putting the best camera on the biggest most expensive device also makes business sense since iPhone photography is a thing. People like me who’d have been perfectly fine with the smaller version will now fork out an extra £100 for the bigger phone. Basically it provides another incentive for people to spend more rather than just the screen.

 

[PeteBurgh]

Do you really think the camera takes up that much room?

I do. I’m not a engineer or anything, so I can’t say definitively, but it seems logical to me. You see the teardowns of these devices, and everything is crammed in incredibly tightly. Every cubic millimetre matters, and the Max is quite a bit bigger.

That’s just Apple excuse for putting a bigger camera in the max. If that were the case then the 11 pro max would have had a bigger sensor.

I’m not sure why Apple needs an ‘excuse’. To excuse what? Selling two slightly different products with different features at different price points? As for why the previous generation didn’t have a size differentiation - I don’t know! It’s a good question, and I have no idea whether it’s a technical or marketing/business thing.

Or Apple could have just made the phone thicker that way we could have the better camera and bigger battery that's what most users want.

Well, personally, I‘d love that. As a battery case user, I’d be very excited about a proper chunky phone with an exponentially larger battery life, especially if they extra space was used to improve the camera. But geeks like me on forums like this have been calling for a phone like that for many years. The people who actually build and sell these things have clearly decided that we’re a small but vocal minority.

 

[The.Glorious.Son]

I didn’t say it wasn’t a great phone. I love my 12 and won’t upgrade to a large phone as I can’t stand them, but Apple putting better hardware on the bigger iPhone is a joke. Especially when you offer the phones at the same price as last year.

I think it’s too early to call it a joke given the reason Apple gave for the Max getting the different camera (larger size phone thus the room for this particular camera setup). Now, if come next year, the 6.1” versions magically happen to have this camera setup, then we know they were full of sh*t.

 

[Lobwedgephil]

Yep that’s me too. I don’t understand why they did this.

The Max has always been a little better in tech specs traditionally. It was the same specs for the XS and 11 Pro line, but every other year the larger iPhone has had slightly better specs in something.

 

[johnnylarue]

I expect the differences in low light and night shots to be noticeable, and as usual shots in proper light will basically be indistinguishable from the photos from any iPhone 11/11P or 12/12P. The tiny bit of extra zoom range on the Tele should give it a subtle advantage, too. People who shoot a lot of video will probably benefit the most from the better image stabilization tech.

Look, I find it pretty annoying that the more pocketable 12 Pro doesn’t have the best available camera module, sure, but at the end of the day the 12PM’s better sensor isn’t going to be the difference between a “DSLR-killer” and a “mere smartphone cam”. Neither of these phones is ready to replace a dedicated camera yet. So I’m going to keep using a dedicated camera for important stuff (i.e. professional or in my case semi-professional work) and be happy with the rather awesome results I get from my everyday-pocket-camera 12 Pro, knowing that very few of those photos will be intended for sale. The best lenses on either camera both still have that unmistakeable “iPhone” lens perspective/focal length, which is a pretty limiting factor when considering these phones for professional photography applications.

Arguably (and hypothetically speaking), ProRAW could be the feature that’s really going to drive how useable/sellable the photos from these phones will actually be, and that feature is common to both models.

Bear in mind that I’m biased, as the size of the Pro Max was a non-starter so the choice was easy for me.

 

[artfossil]

The only thing that annoys me is that Apple saved their best camera system for the Max. I am not a fan of large phablet phones but I have no choice this time around I want flagship specs.

Well, that was the same situation with the 8+ and the reason I bought that model (my current phone). I've never regretted the larger size and I'm looking forward to the 12 Pro Max.

 

[Never mind]

Let’s wait and see when SuperSaf does his comparison video.

 

[bmac4]

I do. I’m not a engineer or anything, so I can’t say definitively, but it seems logical to me. You see the teardowns of these devices, and everything is crammed in incredibly tightly. Every cubic millimetre matters, and the Max is quite a bit bigger.

I’m not sure why Apple needs an ‘excuse’. To excuse what? Selling two slightly different products with different features at different price points? As for why the previous generation didn’t have a size differentiation - I don’t know! It’s a good question, and I have no idea whether it’s a technical or marketing/business thing.

Well, personally, I‘d love that. As a battery case user, I’d be very excited about a proper chunky phone with an exponentially larger battery life, especially if they extra space was used to improve the camera. But geeks like me on forums like this have been calling for a phone like that for many years. The people who actually build and sell these things have clearly decided that we’re a small but vocal minority.

It’s 100% a marketing thing. It’s a ploy to get people to pay more for the max. There is no other reason to fraction out the pro lineup. They should be the same.

 

[bmac4]

I think it’s too early to call it a joke given the reason Apple gave for the Max getting the different camera (larger size phone thus the room for this particular camera setup). Now, if come next year, the 6.1” versions magically happen to have this camera setup, then we know they were full of sh*t.

I will agree, but I feel like it’s an almost given the 6.1 gets the new cameras next year. I don’t think the new setup takes up that much room.

 

[bmac4]

The Max has always been a little better in tech specs traditionally. It was the same specs for the XS and 11 Pro line, but every other year the larger iPhone has had slightly better specs in something.

Well kind of. The new all screen design of the X was the top of the tech lineup Apple offered. Since that new design, they made it even on the more expensive phones. I think they saw a chance to make the max a slight edge to push people to upgrade. I have a theory that most here won’t support that the max isn’t quite the seller Apple would like. They want to push people towards it because the margins are even higher on that model. If they can give people that normal won’t want a huge phone a reason to get it, that’s perfect for them.

 

[jouster]

If the camera is a huge difference between the pro and max, I think a lot of people are going to be very angry. That’s me included. The pro was priced at the exact same price as last years 11 pro and it got the exact same hardware as the pro max. Keeping those prices the same and not upgrading the pro the same as the pro max is already bad enough. If there is a big difference, that’s a big issue. I think a lot of us pro user will be very upset.

Why will you be upset? Increasing sensor size results in better performance—if it didn’t, why would Apple or anyone else ever do it? The larger sensor was announced at the event. It wasn’t a secret.

Of course there will be a significant difference in performance.

 

[Cybertox]

Im still impressed with the iPhone 4's camera. I'm in it for the screen and battery life.

The iPhone 4 was and still is a great smartphone to some extent, but let's agree that the camera is far from impressive, especially compared to what we have today...

Do you really think the camera takes up that much room? It’s not like the max is thicker. That’s just Apple excuse for putting a bigger camera in the max. If that were the case then the 11 pro max would have had a bigger sensor.

Yes it does, otherwise Apple wouldn't have gone for a better camera in the Pro Max and would have made them equal.

 

[Cybertox]

Please delete, double post by accident.

 

[bmac4]

Why will you be upset? Increasing sensor size results in better performance—if it didn’t, why would Apple or anyone else ever do it? The larger sensor was announced at the event. It wasn’t a secret.

Of course there will be a significant difference in performance.

Because I don’t like big phones, and I don’t want to miss out on the best camera because Apple doesn’t put it in the smaller one.

 

[bmac4]

The iPhone 4 was and still is a great smartphone to some extent, but let's agree that the camera is far from impressive, especially compared to what we have today...


Yes it does, otherwise Apple wouldn't have gone for a better camera in the Pro Max and would have made them equal.

That’s not true. They have made decisions before to get people to spend more money. This isn’t any different.

 

[Cybertox]

That’s not true. They have made decisions before to get people to spend more money. This isn’t any different.

I agree with you that Apple turned to some questionable methods concerning the pricing of certain products and especially accessories but in this case, I would say that the size advantage of the iPhone 12 Pro Max gave Apple the opportunity to put a better camera system in place and as we have seen, Apple did not miss out on this opportunity.

 

[the future]

Well kind of. The new all screen design of the X was the top of the tech lineup Apple offered. Since that new design, they made it even on the more expensive phones. I think they saw a chance to make the max a slight edge to push people to upgrade. I have a theory that most here won’t support that the max isn’t quite the seller Apple would like. They want to push people towards it because the margins are even higher on that model. If they can give people that normal won’t want a huge phone a reason to get it, that’s perfect for them.

Well, this may work to some extent, but they will also lose sales this way. I would have upgraded to the 12 Pro if it had the same (better) camera specs as the Max, but as it stands I‘ll keep the 11 Pro another year.

 

[bmac4]

I agree with you that Apple turned to some questionable methods concerning the pricing of certain products and especially accessories but in this case, I would say that the size advantage of the iPhone 12 Pro Max gave Apple the opportunity to put a better camera system in place and as we have seen, Apple did not miss out on this opportunity.

But do you think they didn’t have the tech last year and could have done it then? It’s not like the sensors are something new.