How To Burn Blu-Ray and Play via Apple TV 4

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by ghsNick, May 7, 2016.

  1. ghsNick, May 7, 2016
    Last edited: May 7, 2016

    ghsNick macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #1
    Hey Everyone -

    I'm going to be taking up a huge project and wanted to ask for advice. I have a Blu-Ray Collection that's about 200 Blu Rays.

    I purchased a brand new 4K iMac and I'd like to burn these Blu-Rays to my iMac.

    1) Is there a recommended Blu-Ray burner for iMac? I'd like USB 3.0.

    2) What is the best process for burning these to my iMac so they sync into my iTunes library and can play via Home Sharing through ATV4? I want it to work easily with my ATV4 and stay at the 1080p quality.

    Obviously if I can get these to 4-5GB per copy that would be great!
     
  2. mic j macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    #2
    You are embarking on a big project. There is no way to reduce BR file size to 4-5GB without quality loss. Depending on your personal "quality" sensitivity, you may or may not notice the difference between the original BR and the compressed file. But if this is really what you want to do (and I did this with my dvd/BR collection). Use MakeMKV (free) to rip the main movie file. Then use Handbrake (free), using the aTV3 preset) to compress the file and transcode it into mp4 format (which is the format the aTV requires). File sizes will vary depending on the length of the movie, how much grain it contains, and how dark/light it generally is. So expect to see anything from 2GB to 10GB. Handbrake and the aTV3 preset does an excellent job of producing the smallest file size for high quality output. If you have a lot of movies with subtitles (forced or unforced). That's a whole other can of worms. And there are lots of other threads in this MR forums for ripping, transcoding and including subtitles. I recommend searching for these topics instead of trying to re-invent the wheel. Not much has really changed since the time of the threads. Some other apps you may find useful in this process: Subler and MP4Tools (by Emmgunn).

    Now my real recommendation: By a 2TB usb HDD and use it for external storage of your BR movie files. Rip using MakeMKV and use Infuse for the aTV to play the uncompressed (original video and audio quality) file. The whole process will be much quicker, maintain original quality, eliminate the subtitles annoyance and all for $100 or less (last I looked at 2TB HDD costs a while ago). If using iTunes and file size reduction is a "must have" then you will have to go through ripping/transcoding process.

    There is also the option to rip to MKV and for most movies re-package to mp4 format using something like Subler or mp4tools (there are others as well). Most (but not all) BR movies use an mp4 video stream which the aTV and iTunes will be able to play. However, using this approach will not reduce file size and not all movies can be repackaged, but at least there will be few that have to go through the rip>transcode process.
     
  3. ghsNick, May 7, 2016
    Last edited: May 7, 2016

    ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #3
    Thanks for the advice.

    If I'm watching a movie (for example Iron Man 1) and there are some subtitles in the beginning.

    Will I have to do the process you mentioned to include those? Or will they automatically transfer over.
     
  4. mic j macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    #4
    Here is a primer on using MakeMKV (Note: haven't done this in a while so I might miss something but I will try and be accurate):
    1) set MakeMKV preference
    -Video tab: set output destination to Custom and put in the location you want the file saved to.
    -Video tab: set Minimum title length to about 300 seconds (this means anything less than 5 minutes will be ignored (thus filtering out a lot of garbage tracks)
    -save setting and close MakeMKV
    2) Put BR in BR reader. Open MakeMKV. It will find the disc. Open the disc (click the drive in the window on left side).
    3) It will scan disc and generate a list of titles. Look for the really big one (GB not MB).
    4) Click on the check box of the big file and it will expand, showing you all the available audio, video and subtitle tracks
    5) Make sure the tracks you want to write to the mkv file are checked. (I usually check the highest quality audio and subtitle tracks forced and unforced should already be checked)
    6) click on the Make mkv button on the upper right and you will be done in a few minutes.

    Handbrake:
    1) Open and select the aTV3 preset from the preset pane. Also select the Web Optimized option. No need to mess with any other settings.
    2) Click on the Source tab and select the mkv. It will scan it.
    3) Click on the Subtitles button. Select Foreign Audio Search (Bitmap) VOBSUB.
    4) Also check Forced Only and Burned In.
    5) Click on Start (top left). It will then scan mkv. It will scan for forced subs and if found it will burn them into the mp4 video file.

    That's it. I'm sure I have missed things but this is a crash course.
     
  5. ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #5
    Thanks for the feedback! I think I'm going to do it.

    Question - is there a major difference between the Blu Ray quality and Apple TV 3 at 1080p?
     
  6. archer75, May 8, 2016
    Last edited: May 8, 2016

    archer75 macrumors 65816

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    #6
    in makemkv check the box next to forced subs. In handbrake under subtitles if there's something in the box other than foreign audio then you have forced subs. Just check burn in only. If all you have is foreign audio then click the red x and get rid of it. You don't have to do anything. Makemkv grabs the forced subs if there are any so you don't need handbrake to scan for them. I found this to be the most reliable method.

    As far as playing them on your network, just use plex. It's super easy and it makes your media available anywhere. Even non macs.

    There are ways to rip without perceivable quality loss but certainly not in the 4-5gb range. Even using h.265 your files will be larger.

    And op, you don't need a bluray burner. Your ripping them to your mac, not burning them. You just need a bluray drive.
     
  7. ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #7
    Thanks! What's 1080p at h.264? Would 5-10GB be the normal?

    Also - here's the process I was going to follow.

    http://www.epinionated.net/ripping-bluray-movies-itunes-apple-tv/

    The subtitle thing is what's concerning me. Every film I have is in English but there's "forced" subtitles throughout when another language is spoken.

    The step where you're saying to select Forced in MakeMKV and the Foreign part in Handbrake are the only parts in this process I'm concerned about.
     
  8. archer75 macrumors 65816

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    Oregon
    #8
    File size can vary wildly. For h.264 I have files with the same handbrake settings come out anywhere from 5gb to 20gb+

    When you select the movie file in makemkv you can expand it and select audio tracks and subtitles. Just checked forced only next to english. If there are any forced subtitles it will grab them.
    In handbrake in the drop down you can select add new track. If there is a track to add there will be something other than foreign subtitles and then you select it. If there's nothing other than foreign subtitles it means that there are no forced subs in the MKV makemkv created.
    Don't bother checking subscene as your guide says as it's not needed. Also don't check the english boxes. Just english forced sub boxes.

    Now I only encode in H.265 to keep file sizes down. I don't like ripping for one device only as I use a variety of devices. So I do all my encodes H.265 and used the HD audio tracks. I use an Nvidia shield for my home theater and those are supported. Plex comes in because it doesn't matter what my other devices support(roku, chromecast, xbox, fire tv, etc.), if a particular device doesn't support a file plex will transcode on the fly. And plex is available on any device. Currently i'm at around 1000 movies in my collection.

    I don't use itunes so I can't help you with that part. I also don't add an audio track to handbrake. Handbrake encodes my file with the settings I have created and then after I use mkvmerge to take the HD audio from the original file and merge it with the newly encoded file.

    I don't bother with any metadata as plex does that automatically.
     
  9. ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #9
    Perfect - thanks for your advice. Last set of questions and I think I'm good to go!

    1) In HandBrake should I do H.265 or H.264? I want 1080p quality but I also want to keep my file size down (I have about 300 Blu-Rays).

    2) I will only be using this on the ATV/Home Sharing - Which audio should I select? The one that says Forced English? I though there was a choice between HD, 7.1, 5.1, etc.

    Do I still need to select an audio file in HandBrake?

    3) I plan on purchasing this External HD and Blu Ray Reader/Burner. Any feedback/recommendations?

    https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/ME3UH7T4.0/

    https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MR3UBDRW14/
     
  10. archer75, May 9, 2016
    Last edited: May 9, 2016

    archer75 macrumors 65816

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    Oregon
    #11
    The ATV doesn't support H.265 so unless if you use plex you will have to stick with H.264
    Forced english is subtitles, not audio. For audio you'll select the dolby digital sound track. Not the TrueHD or DTS-MA tracks.
    You would select an audio file in handbrake. I believe it gets converted to AAC.

    You don't have to go to a mac store to get your parts. Any hard drive or bluray drive will work. You also don't need a bluray burner. Just a reader which will keep costs down. Take a look at newegg and amazon as they will be cheaper than macsales.

    Honestly, even if you make compatible ATV rips i'd still use plex. It's just so nice.
    Whatever you do, you'll have to experiment a little to get your process down.
     
  11. mic j macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2012
    #12
    Just to avoid any confusion, please note that the link you are referring to is using a Windows version of Handbrake. Although very similar, there are a few differences between them.

    Using the Iron Man I BR you mentioned is a good BR to use to make sure whichever process for forced subs you use is working. It's the BR I cut my teeth on. Forced subs is probably the trickiest part to ripping/transcoding media. There is no standard in how forced subs are included, there can be flags that turn them on and off from unforced tracks, separate tracks (often embedded in a multitude of other subtitle tracks), using fonts that choke the system (Avatar comes to mind), and many are already burned in. It will probably take a few attempts before you really get the feel for it. Good luck.

    As for quality, I think the aTV3 preset give very good results. I used it to do all of my transcodes. I do think it is yields a hair softer look to the movie but totally acceptable if your intent is to watch a movie and not sit there and analyze the whole time. You don't get something for nothing and if you want smaller file sizes, that slightly softer look is the price. It's an individual thing, it may drive you nuts or you might not even notice it.
     
  12. golfnut1982 macrumors regular

    golfnut1982

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2014
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    #13
    Why don't you take your digital movie codes of the movies that you have/own, and put them in a digital movie locker? If you do this, you can have the title in your Apple TV. No digital storage space needed either. http://www.apple.com/itunes/digital-copy/
     
  13. DemonMF777 macrumors member

    DemonMF777

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    Location:
    S. Florida
    #14
    Only tip I'll add is to buy a full size desktop Blu-Ray drive, not one of the tiny portable/laptop style drives. This alone will save you tons of time as these drives are faster & more robust
     
  14. ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #15
    Thanks! Got this beauty...

    https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MR3UBDRW14/
     
  15. ghsNick, May 15, 2016
    Last edited: May 15, 2016

    ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #16
    Please take a look at what I have selected in MakeMKV.

    Should I have these selected? I have questions on if I need 2, 4, 6 and 7 selected? I don't think I need 2 - but I wanted to ask about 4, 6 and 7 also?

    If you can just reply and let me know if I should uncheck anything! Thanks
     

    Attached Files:

  16. archer75 macrumors 65816

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    Oregon
    #17
    Uncheck 4 and 6. You also won't need the truehd audio track as the ATV doesn't support it.
     
  17. ghsNick, May 15, 2016
    Last edited: May 15, 2016

    ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #18
    Thanks! Just did it with 1, 3, 5 and 7 (4 and 6 confused me, so I appreciate your help!)
    --- Post Merged, May 15, 2016 ---
    Last question - Can you check these three images? Do these settings look correct - let me know if you would do anything else!

    1) Wondering if I do 30 fps, 60fps or Same As Source (Variable Framerate)?
    2) How come output is 1920x800?
    3) Should I select Web Optimized?

    Screen Shot 2016-05-15 at 11.28.31 AM.png Screen Shot 2016-05-15 at 11.28.46 AM.png Screen Shot 2016-05-15 at 11.29.13 AM.png
     
  18. mic j macrumors 68030

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    Mar 15, 2012
    #19
    1) Same as source
    2) It's fine. HB trims the black bars out of the source (helps reduce file size) so it give different dimensions.
    3) I always select Web Optimized (have made it part of a custom preset based on the aTV3 preset). Probably not important for dvd but I think it helps to use if for BRs. It moves a small piece of information in the metadata from the end of the file to the front. So you don't have to wait for the whole BR to load before the data required to play is read. It adds no time to transcoding, file size, or quality so I would recommend doing it.
     
  19. ghsNick, May 15, 2016
    Last edited: May 15, 2016

    ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

    Joined:
    May 25, 2010
    #20
    Forced subs aren't appearing (when checking the file in VLC).

    I went back in MakeMKV and selected English subtitles (+ forced) and everything is appearing in subtitles (aka everything is in English subtitles).

    It seems like it's an all or nothing process. Any suggestions? Or should I continue the process in HandBrake and it will grab the Forced ones?
     
  20. archer75 macrumors 65816

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    Oregon
    #21
    You want to use forced only in makemkv and then add them in handbrake. On the subtitle page from the drop down under add new track you should see a subtitle file there(if there is one, makemkv grabs it 99% of the time). Something other than foreign audio scan. Select it and choose burn in.
    If you don't use handbrake there will still be the forced subtitle file in the MKV that makemkv created and that should display in VLC provided you have subs turned on.
    --- Post Merged, May 15, 2016 ---
    My handbrake process is a bit different as I don't encode for the apple tv or any specific device.
    1) always same as source
    2) black bars, it's normal
    3) whatever profile works for you or create your own.
    I do change the RF slider to 16 on movies I really care about. I do 18 or 20 on animation and comedies.
    I don't give handbrake an audio file as I use the HD audio track and I merge it in the MKV handbrake creates from the original using mkvtoolnix after handbrake is done.
     
  21. ghsNick, May 15, 2016
    Last edited: May 15, 2016

    ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

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    May 25, 2010
    #22
    In the MKV file (when removing 4 and 6) it doesn't grab any Forced Subs - even when selecting 5 and 7. When I select 4-7 it grabs the forced subs (but also all the other English subs).

    In Handbrake there's nothing in the Subtitle page drop down (when 4 and 6 are unselected) - only Foreign Audio.

    In Handbrake there's Subtitle options when 4-7 are selected (I'm still referring to this post).
     
  22. archer75 macrumors 65816

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    Oregon
    #23
    MakeMKV isn't detecting any forced subs then. (this is the 1% of the time). So now it's up to handbrake to detect them. You'll select the sub file in handbrake, one for each sub file(you should select all 4 in makemkv but since it's not detecting forced you'll only get two in it's mkv). Two in this case and check both forced only and burn in for each one. If handbrake detects forced subs you'll have them in the final movie.
    If that doesn't work there is another manual and much more complicated way to do it involving a program called bdsup2sub.

    When I was encoding h.264(I only do h.265 now) I was using a windows only program called ripbot instead of handbrake and it can also detect forced subs.
     
  23. ghsNick thread starter macrumors 68020

    ghsNick

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    May 25, 2010
    #24
    Thanks - also, do you change BitRate or keep it at 160?
     
  24. archer75 macrumors 65816

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    #25
    For audio? I don't do audio in handbrake so I can't help you there. I keep the lossless HD audio track.
     

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