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I plan on using this thing atleast 8 hrs a day.

I'm buying one of these MacBooks, but I also know what I'm probably getting into.
I had the 1st gen MBA which was hotter than my stove. Could easily burn my lap when it got hot.
Underclocking with Coolbook was the only solution (sadly doesn't work on new Apple hardware)
And now the new "Air" is fanless, I would Not play Mass Effect 3 on it. I expect a slick and light computer, but also a hot computer.
 
poobear said:
I'm buying one of these MacBooks, but I also know what I'm probably getting into.
I had the 1st gen MBA which was hotter than my stove. Could easily burn my lap when it got hot.
Underclocking with Coolbook was the only solution (sadly doesn't work on new Apple hardware)
And now the new "Air" is fanless, I would Not play Mass Effect 3 on it. I expect a slick and light computer, but also a hot computer.
Click to expand...

or...you can wait & see what the reports are. does it get really hot? how hot?

seems people have made up their minds about the new macbook's: speed, efficiency, power, keyboard, heat, shortcomings, etc...without seeing it, trying it out, or hearing what users have to say.

am waiting to get my actual hands on it...
 
gooser said:
my question is will YOU last doing that stuff 8 hours a day for 5 years?
Click to expand...

It's called reddit, netflix and I have no life along with wanting to do programming and i've been doing that for over 4 years now. I'd still be doing this if my laptop didn't die.

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wct097 said:
Sure we are.... but how many of us are on a 12" laptop for 8 hours a day? Doing programming? As a developer myself, I'm on a desktop with (3x) 23" monitors for 8 hours a day, then another 3-4 each night on a 15" MBP. Trust me when I tell you that I don't want to be doing development on a 12" laptop for 8+ hours per day.

My 15" MBP is great as a VMWare host for me to do dev work on, but it only has one screen and the text is small on it.
Click to expand...

Is 8 gb of ram enough or would you recommend me to go 16 gbs?
 
kramer733 said:
Is 8 gb of ram enough or would you recommend me to go 16 gbs?
Click to expand...

Really depends on what you're doing. Like I said before, I don't think the 12" Macbook is going to be a good platform to run virtual machines on. I think the processor is going to be more of a problem than the RAM.

I personally went with the i7 512GB/16GB 15" with discrete graphics card back in 2012. It works well for me, and I don't second guess the 16GB decision at all. That said, the VM I typically run is configured to use only 4gb of RAM. That makes me think I'd be able to live with 8GB if I had to. My "work" VM consists of Win7, VS2008, VS2010, VS2012, VS2013, SQL2008R2, SQL2012, Eclipse, all the web browsers, Photoshop, Teradata, and countless other things running on it.

If you want to run multiple VMs, in a configuration where you have a server, database, and dev machine, obviously you're going to need more RAM. I typically do all of my development on the same VM and only break it into multiple machines when I'm deploying to actual servers.
 
PDFierro said:
That's what I was wondering. Who is on their laptop 8 hours every day doing that stuff?
Click to expand...

Not doing the same stuff but on my Mac`s I can easily go past 8 hours on battery, one of the reasons I switched to the 13" Retina as my primary over the 15" Retina. Right now I am tempted to go for a second 13" MBPr given the upgraded CPU/GPU, Force Trackpad and over 10 hours on battery. The battery run time taken in isolation makes the 13" extremely compelling.

Q-6
 
Queen6 said:
Not doing the same stuff but on my Mac`s I can easily go past 8 hours on battery, one of the reasons I switched to the 13" Retina as my primary over the 15" Retina. Right now I am tempted to go for a second 13" MBPr given the upgraded CPU/GPU, Force Trackpad and over 10 hours on battery. The battery run time taken in isolation makes the 13" extremely compelling.

Q-6
Click to expand...

If runtime is primary, ever think about the 13" MBA? Or is it disqualified for other reasons (e.g., TN display)?
 
Queen6 said:
TN, it`s too much of a step back compared to IPS & Retina. Like as not I will either go for a second 13" MBPr or the new MacBook. As I am looking at a secondary/backup machine the MacBook appeals, equally it must perform reasonably.

Q-6
Click to expand...

As I thought.

I think buy, try, return if appropriate is the early adopter mantra here.
 
Maybe it's a good estimation,
My MBA runs ard 8-10 hr without intensive stuff.

But only 2-3 hour if I play game.

Probably same as the new macbook
 
Queen6 said:
Not doing the same stuff but on my Mac`s I can easily go past 8 hours on battery
Click to expand...

I think you're missing the point. People are balking at the idea of spending 8 hours a day, presumably almost every day or workday, looking at a 12" screen. I don't think anyone is doubting that this glorified netbook will operate for 8 hours continuously on battery. Most of us have managed to hit 8 hours or more on battery before, even with a 15", assuming it's just light usage.

I work behind a computer for 8-12 hours a day. I'd be miserable staring at a netbook all day long, even with a retina display.
 
wct097 said:
I think you're missing the point. People are balking at the idea of spending 8 hours a day, presumably almost every day or workday, looking at a 12" screen. I don't think anyone is doubting that this glorified netbook will operate for 8 hours continuously on battery. Most of us have managed to hit 8 hours or more on battery before, even with a 15", assuming it's just light usage.

I work behind a computer for 8-12 hours a day. I'd be miserable staring at a netbook all day long, even with a retina display.
Click to expand...

Wow. Glorified netbook, huh?
 
PDFierro said:
Wow. Glorified netbook, huh?
Click to expand...

I can't think of any definition of the term "netbook" that doesn't fit the new Macbook with the exception of "inexpensive".

Small screen: check
Light weight: check
Low power: double check
Primary use-case of accessing web-based applications: check

While I'm not interested in one myself, at that price point, I like the idea. Basically a laptop for the user that can almost get away with just owning an iPad but not quite.
 
wct097 said:
I can't think of any definition of the term "netbook" that doesn't fit the new Macbook with the exception of "inexpensive".

Small screen: check
Light weight: check
Low power: double check
Primary use-case of accessing web-based applications: check

While I'm not interested in one myself, at that price point, I like the idea. Basically a laptop for the user that can almost get away with just owning an iPad but not quite.
Click to expand...

I'll be using it to be productive with my daily work. I'll use it the same way I presently use my 13" rMBP. Doesn't sound like a netbook to me.
 
PDFierro said:
I'll be using it to be productive with my daily work. I'll use it the same way I presently use my 13" rMBP. Doesn't sound like a netbook to me.
Click to expand...

I don't think that the term "netbook" is mutually exclusive with being productive. It's simply a term that describes diminutive laptops. I don't doubt that you will use it or your 13" MBP to be productive, though I'm not aware of the type of work you do on it. I strongly suspect that these will be popular with people that can basically work on an iPad but occasionally need a real computer.

I myself use my 15" for work (software developer) and can be quite productive with it. That doesn't mean it's even remotely close to the best tool for the job or something I'd choose to use when I didn't need the portability. In my case, the best tool for the job is a desktop with three larger format monitors.

The OP mentioned that he was going to be using the machine for programming. As a developer myself, I feel that a small laptop isn't the ideal tool for that job, though YMMV.
 
Re netbook

PDFierro said:
I'll be using it to be productive with my daily work. I'll use it the same way I presently use my 13" rMBP. Doesn't sound like a netbook to me.
Click to expand...

According to wikipedia :Netbooks is a category of small, lightweight, legacy-free, and inexpensive computers that were introduced in 2007.

No mention of processor speeds or productivity capabilities.

Only bit that doesn't fit is inexpensive, but then this is apple ;-)

Personally I want one :eek:
 
Is this a serious post ? Looking ar what you want to use it for, wrong machine, maybe you did not look at specs . Gaming...... Serious?
 
I did a quick search for 2015 Netbooks and came across an article suggesting the following as the "best for 2015", which in reality were all available in 2014 and thus pre-Broadwell.

Lenovo Thinkpad X130e
Asus VivoBook S200E
Sony Vaio VPC-W121AX/T
Asus Q200

They have screen sizes of 11.6" and 10.1". Processors such as the i3-2367M, i3-3217U, and Atom N280.

When compared to the 12" screen and 5Y70 proc in the new Macbook, they're pretty close. Clearly the Macbook has the edge with "0.4" more screen, retina resolution, and a Broadwell proc, but it's not head and shoulders above these 2014 Netbooks.

If you look at the benchmarks between the 2367M and the 5Y70, there is a negligible difference: http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i3-2367M-vs-Intel-Core-M-5Y70

I don't think it's even remotely unreasonable to refer to the new Macbook as a glorified netbook.
 
wct097 said:
I did a quick search for 2015 Netbooks and came across an article suggesting the following as the "best for 2015", which in reality were all available in 2014 and thus pre-Broadwell.

Lenovo Thinkpad X130e
Asus VivoBook S200E
Sony Vaio VPC-W121AX/T
Asus Q200

They have screen sizes of 11.6" and 10.1". Processors such as the i3-2367M, i3-3217U, and Atom N280.

When compared to the 12" screen and 5Y70 proc in the new Macbook, they're pretty close. Clearly the Macbook has the edge with "0.4" more screen, retina resolution, and a Broadwell proc, but it's not head and shoulders above these 2014 Netbooks.

If you look at the benchmarks between the 2367M and the 5Y70, there is a negligible difference: http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i3-2367M-vs-Intel-Core-M-5Y70

I don't think it's even remotely unreasonable to refer to the new Macbook as a glorified netbook.
Click to expand...

in that case, a macbook pro could also be seen as a glorified netbook...

really, depending on someone's needs, the new macbook is (potentially) a full-fledged mac. would i run final cut on it? probably not. but...let's see how it benchmarks, what people report about it...
 
fisherking said:
in that case, a macbook pro could also be seen as a glorified netbook...

really, depending on someone's needs, the new macbook is (potentially) a full-fledged mac. would i run final cut on it? probably not. but...let's see how it benchmarks, what people report about it...
Click to expand...

Like I said before, I think a reasonable definition of a netbook is a diminutive laptop that has a small screen, is light weight, low power, inexpensive, and primarily will be used for accessing web-based applications. While the new Macbook fails the inexpensive test, the Macbook pro fails all of the tests other than having a small screen, and even the screen is a solid 1" or more larger than your average device that falls into the netbook category.

Again, I don't mean it as a derogatory term. It's merely a classification and nothing to get emotional about.

Some may consider a netbook to be "limited". I think that's fair to say of the Macbook as well. A fanless Core M machine is going to be limited. It doesn't matter if it has an Apple logo on it or any other manufacturer.
 
wct097 said:
I think you're missing the point. People are balking at the idea of spending 8 hours a day, presumably almost every day or workday, looking at a 12" screen. I don't think anyone is doubting that this glorified netbook will operate for 8 hours continuously on battery. Most of us have managed to hit 8 hours or more on battery before, even with a 15", assuming it's just light usage.

I work behind a computer for 8-12 hours a day. I'd be miserable staring at a netbook all day long, even with a retina display.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but the truly great thing here is that no one's forcing anyone else to spend 8 hours a day looking at a 12" screen. ;)

----------
wct097 said:
Like I said before, I think a reasonable definition of a netbook is a diminutive laptop that has a small screen, is light weight, low power, inexpensive, and primarily will be used for accessing web-based applications. While the new Macbook fails the inexpensive test, the Macbook pro fails all of the tests other than having a small screen, and even the screen is a solid 1" or more larger than your average device that falls into the netbook category.

Again, I don't mean it as a derogatory term. It's merely a classification and nothing to get emotional about.

Some may consider a netbook to be "limited". I think that's fair to say of the Macbook as well. A fanless Core M machine is going to be limited. It doesn't matter if it has an Apple logo on it or any other manufacturer.
Click to expand...

Technically, I have no problem with your definition or use of the term. What you're bumping into is the recent history of some fairly irrational troll posts that use the term "netbook" in a purely derogatory manner. People are reading "netbook" with that background in mind, rather than channeling Mr. Spock. :)
 
kramer733 said:
Will the fanless feature be a big deal? I really don't know if this is bad or not. I also plan on having this laptop for 5+ years. I'm a soon to be OS X user and don't know if this laptop is mright for me at all. I plan on using this for netflix, web browsing, playing video games like mass effect 3 and programming. I don't know if i'll use virtual machines to be honest. My MSI laptop now overheats and won't stay on for more than 20 minutes max. Will the laptop overheat given my usages and it being fanless? I know we don't have any data on this at the moment but we do have previous mac laptops that have more than 5 years of usage.
Click to expand...

For a first time Mac user, I'm hesitant to recommend this reinvention of the MacBook line. My reasoning is that the minimalism of it's form is only enhanced if you've already bought into the Apple wireless ecosystem (wireless backup, iCloud, Airdrop with other Macs).

More so, Apple has had to make sacrifices for a first version. It hasn't evolved, only just been introduced, where as the Retina MacBook Pro has kinks worked out. It's nearly flawlessly made now. So it would be a safer move to pick a 13" rMBP for a first Mac. People love that model for good reason, and would be a more certain transition into your love of the brand. Especially if you plan on keeping it for 5+ years.
 
wct097 said:
Like I said before, I think a reasonable definition of a netbook is a diminutive laptop that has a small screen, is light weight, low power, inexpensive, and primarily will be used for accessing web-based applications. While the new Macbook fails the inexpensive test, the Macbook pro fails all of the tests other than having a small screen, and even the screen is a solid 1" or more larger than your average device that falls into the netbook category.

Again, I don't mean it as a derogatory term. It's merely a classification and nothing to get emotional about.

Some may consider a netbook to be "limited". I think that's fair to say of the Macbook as well. A fanless Core M machine is going to be limited. It doesn't matter if it has an Apple logo on it or any other manufacturer.
Click to expand...

but there's your problem, this is your take on the new macbook. what i see is a probably (not having seen any benchmarks specifically for the new mb) modestly-powered mac laptop. it runs OS X...an OS that can run many non-web-based apps. so if people do their work in Word, or Photoshop, etc... and can get their work done on the new mb...then perhaps it exceeds the description of a netbook?

but you're the expert... ;)
 
newellj said:
Maybe, but the truly great thing here is that no one's forcing anyone else to spend 8 hours a day looking at a 12" screen. ;)
Click to expand...

No, but the OP is asking opinions on if the 12" machine would be a good machine to use at for 8+ hours a day. My opinion has been that it is not ideal, especially when he throws gaming and programming into his list of needs. Somehow a lot of people here seem to think that such an opinion can be "wrong".


fisherking said:
but there's your problem, this is your take on the new macbook.
Click to expand...

I don't view having an opinion based on my experience as a problem. :D

what i see is a probably (not having seen any benchmarks specifically for the new mb) modestly-powered mac laptop. it runs OS X...an OS that can run many non-web-based apps. so if people do their work in Word, or Photoshop, etc... and can get their work done on the new mb...then perhaps it exceeds the description of a netbook?

but you're the expert... ;)
Click to expand...

You don't have to be an expert to look at processor benchmarks and realize that the new Macbook using that same processor isn't going to be dramatically more powerful. That's why people start in with unicorn tears.... when people irrationally think that a benchmark for known hardware doesn't apply simply because the product in question has an Apple logo on it.

Here is the benchmark for the 1.1ghz proc: https://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+M-5Y70+@+1.10GHz&id=2382
Here is the benchmark for a low power second gen i3: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i3-2120T+@+2.60GHz
 
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