I saw the glossy screen today MBP

[pdxflint]

As I said before, reflections are only a problem if you focus on them... If you don't you will not even see them.

So... I'm not supposed to focus on my laptop screen?? There's an interesting perspective on the whole issue... Well, I'll give it a try, but somehow I'm thinking this ain't gonna work. . . Nope! Didn't work. I need to see what I'm doing, and focusing is required. I wish I knew how you did it, because you may be onto something...

 

[chaosbunny]

As I said before, reflections are only a problem if you focus on them... If you don't you will not even see them.

Wow thanks, I have done this wrong on my iMac the whole last year!

No the glassy is not too bad, it's ok but my eyes get tired a little bit faster when staring only at the glossy screen. I'm very glad I have my Eizo monitor next to the iMac. It's not too bad for me, but after a year with an Alu iMac I decided never to buy a glossy screen again.

It's not try it under normal lighting it's fine just don't focus on the reflections blablabla... some people simply don't like it. Some people stare at their screens for 8 hours a day. That's also why the "well the iPhones screen is glossy too" arguments are bs, you don't stare at your iPhones screen for 8 hours a day I hope.

 

[Davidkoh]

Wow thanks, I have done this wrong on my iMac the whole last year!

No the glassy is not too bad, it's ok but my eyes get tired a little bit faster when staring only at the glossy screen. I'm very glad I have my Eizo monitor next to the iMac. It's not too bad for me, but after a year with an Alu iMac I decided never to buy a glossy screen again.

It's not try it under normal lighting it's fine just don't focus on the reflections blablabla... some people simply don't like it. Some people stare at their screens for 8 hours a day. That's also why the "well the iPhones screen is glossy too" arguments are bs, you don't stare at your iPhones screen for 8 hours a day I hope.

So... I'm not supposed to focus on my laptop screen?? There's an interesting perspective on the whole issue... Well, I'll give it a try, but somehow I'm thinking this ain't gonna work. . . Nope! Didn't work. I need to see what I'm doing, and focusing is required. I wish I knew how you did it, because you may be onto something...

Okay, your eyes see everything? Correct? Your brain recieves the signals? Correct? Now you use your brain to divide the two layers (1 is the reflection, 1 is the actual image on the screen). Now you only focus on the screen one. If people want to test this, hold your finger in front of your eyes and focus on a object which is about 60-70 cm from you and behind the finger. Even with a finger you see most of the object behind, but since the finger is solid you never really "do not see it".

We do not see EVERYTHING in our vision field, we see what we focus on, the rest is just something blurry until we focus on this. And since the actual reflection is not solid you barely even notice it.

I been doing this with everything, even the old CRT screens with light from big 3 meter wide windows it works for me, only annoying part then is that you see the dust more in the light.

Just use your brain, it's the most powerfull machine in the world, so why not make use of it?

 

[eGraeme]

i must be on more rx drugs than most of you(thats a joke folks ), cause the glare never bothers me
i cant even think of noticing it after the first day, where i specifically noticed it so i could make a comment on one of these forums (last gen mbp)

and yes
it is VERY noticeable in the store
but in my daily use... what glare?!

 

[eGraeme]

Okay, your eyes see everything? Correct? Your brain recieves the signals? Correct? Now you use your brain to divide the two layers (1 is the reflection, 1 is the actual image on the screen). Now you only focus on the screen one. If people want to test this, hold your finger in front of your eyes and focus on a object which is about 60-70 cm from you and behind the finger. Even with a finger you see most of the object behind, but since the finger is solid you never really "do not see it".

We do not see EVERYTHING in our vision field, we see what we focus on, the rest is just something blurry until we focus on this. And since the actual reflection is not solid you barely even notice it.

I been doing this with everything, even the old CRT screens with light from big 3 meter wide windows it works for me, only annoying part then is that you see the dust more in the light.

Just use your brain, it's the most powerfull machine in the world, so why not make use of it?

oh scienceness facts about eyeballs reminds me of something i recently saw on discovery or some such thing
where they said you cant look at 1 spot for more than a few seconds
yer eye will mike tiny minor movements
and if it didnt, you wouldnt see what you were looking at anymore
kinda trexish, but like trex 2.1

 

[Timur]

Well, the brain is well capable of blending out the reflections and it gets alot of help from the eyes when doing so. That is simply because of the fact that reflections need to be focused behind the screen while the screen-image needs to be focused on the screen.

On the other hand this "work" can lead to both eye strain and brain strain aka getting tired sooner.

That is because:

- Everytime the reflection is moving (like someone passing by) your eyes/brain will recognize the movement, become distracted for a short time until they realize that the movement is "no danger" and then need to concentrate on the screen-image again.

- Blending distraction out is an "active process" on part of the brain. While the senses (eyes, ears, skin-nerves) easily adapt to the overal level of sensation (bright street light vs dark living room ambience, loud street noise vs quiet library) the brain still get's alot of informations that have to be filtered out. That can be quite exhausting by time.

- Many people tend to "stare down" the screen when trying hard to concentrate to onscreen informations vs reflections informations. Because of that they forget to regulary bat their eyelashes leading to dry and hurting eyes (feeling tired again).

- Most enviromental lightings are setup wrong. The ceiling lamps use to be in the center of the room while the screen is standing at a wall. There is more light coming from behind the user than coming from behind the screen. While you need to turn up the screen's brightness to compensate for reflections the contrast to the darker wall/surrounding gets bigger.

Everytime you turn your eyes from the screen to look at something in your room (like a piece of paper on your desk) your eyes have to adapt to the mostly darker lights (takes minutes). Everytime you turn your eyes back to the screen your eyes have to adapt to the brighter screen (takes seconds) while the surrounding of the screen is blended off into dark contrast again.

Weird science...

 

[Davidkoh]

Well, the brain is well capable of blending out the reflections and it gets alot of help from the eyes when doing so. That is simply because of the fact that reflections need to be focused behind the screen while the screen-image needs to be focused on the screen.

On the other hand this "work" can lead to both eye strain and brain strain aka getting tired sooner.

That is because:

- Everytime the reflection is moving (like someone passing by) your eyes/brain will recognize the movement, become distracted for a short time until they realize that the movement is "no danger" and then need to concentrate on the screen-image again.

- Blending distraction out is an "active process" on part of the brain. While the senses (eyes, ears, skin-nerves) easily adapt to the overal level of sensation (bright street light vs dark living room ambience, loud street noise vs quiet library) the brain still get's alot of informations that have to be filtered out. That can be quite exhausting by time.

- Many people tend to "stare down" the screen when trying hard to concentrate to onscreen informations vs reflections informations. Because of that they forget to regulary bat their eyelashes leading to dry and hurting eyes (feeling tired again).

- Most enviromental lightings are setup wrong. The ceiling lamps use to be in the center of the room while the screen is standing at a wall. There is more light coming from behind the user than coming from behind the screen. While you need to turn up the screen's brightness to compensate for reflections the contrast to the darker wall/surrounding gets bigger.

Everytime you turn your eyes from the screen to look at something in your room (like a piece of paper on your desk) your eyes have to adapt to the mostly darker lights (takes minutes). Everytime you turn your eyes back to the screen your eyes have to adapt to the brighter screen (takes seconds) while the surrounding of the screen is blended off into dark contrast again.

Weird science...

I never experienced any problems with any eyestrain or brainstrain Then again people are different, some people would argue it's hard to study math and such with the TV/music on, I don't find that the least bit harder. The brain is strong enough to think on 2 things at the same time. This is most likely something you can train yourself to do.

I can agree on the lighting issue, that's why I try to keep my room evenly lit with many lamps. I never sit at a computer in the dark

 

[thespyglass]

It's really really really shiny.
[...]
I would like to see what it looks like with an overlay because I need a Mac.

It is really, really, really shiny! I spent about half an hour playing on one yesterday and found it kind of ridiculous on dark backgrounds, such is the light in the Apple store. Lighter backgrounds I was okay with. It's worth noting that the store had the computers set to maximum brightness to compensate for reflections but they didn't quite manage it to my satisfaction. However, I am seeing encouraging reports from new MPB owners using the thing in more everyday lighting.

I also want to see what it looks like with an overlay. Even if I didn't mind the glossy screen I'd probably get a protective cover anyway to avoid smudges and protect the glass.

 

[jTreu]

I can see them changing to atleast offer a matte option in the future, the amount of complaints from consumers and bloggers/other professional reviewers is ridiculous.

 

[Apple Corps]

It is really, really, really shiny! I spent about half an hour playing on one yesterday and found it kind of ridiculous on dark backgrounds, such is the light in the Apple store. Lighter backgrounds I was okay with. It's worth noting that the store had the computers set to maximum brightness to compensate for reflections but they didn't quite manage it to my satisfaction. However, I am seeing encouraging reports from new MPB owners using the thing in more everyday lighting.

I also want to see what it looks like with an overlay. Even if I didn't mind the glossy screen I'd probably get a protective cover anyway to avoid smudges and protect the glass.

The real problem is that there is NO "everyday lighting". My clients view my work in a variety of offices and conference rooms - most with what we would think of as harsh lighting conditions. I went - I saw - I compared and I was disappointed by the glare from the new MacBook Mirrors. We would love to have a matte option Apple.

 

[MowingDevil]

So... I'm not supposed to focus on my laptop screen?? There's an interesting perspective on the whole issue... Well, I'll give it a try, but somehow I'm thinking this ain't gonna work. . . Nope! Didn't work. I need to see what I'm doing, and focusing is required. I wish I knew how you did it, because you may be onto something...

Flint the force you will use.

 

[mathcolo]

The real problem is that there is NO "everyday lighting". My clients view my work in a variety of offices and conference rooms - most with what we would think of as harsh lighting conditions. I went - I saw - I compared and I was disappointed by the glare from the new MacBook Mirrors. We would love to have a matte option Apple.

Harsh lighting conditions? Doubt it...

 

[MowingDevil]

I can see them changing to atleast offer a matte option in the future, the amount of complaints from consumers and bloggers/other professional reviewers is ridiculous.

I can see this too, Jobs coming out at a media event and saying "the people spoke & we listened..." or something like that. They'll be heroes to all the colour correction pros thats for sure.

 

[Apple Corps]

The conditions can be really bad - full size glass walls letting in the sun, banks of fluorescent lights - seating positions that you have minimal control over. The really rough ones are active operating rooms.

All of that said - this issue has little resolution at hand - those of us that strongly prefer matte screens are disappointed. We would simply like a choice.

 

[jdesign]

just posting my opinion so might help some people.
went to sydney apple store.. MBpro screen isn't any better from previous generation ( i mean in handling the reflection thing ) . I was expecting that it would.. but it isn't. i too work 8 hours a day looking at screens as a designer, and now i'm very very sad
I think whatever you try to tell yourself it's ok.. you'll get used to it. it is still glass type.
I guess we are forced to get used to it


but the bright side is the case design itself is fabulous, the pictures is different from real life. that you have to see to judge by yourself. the way the case is build is just great!

i'll take my chances and will buy the new mbpro. hope i wouldn't regret it later .

hope this helps someone

 

[bushbaby]

I spoke to Apple today about returning the refurb (no problem) and when he nicely said, "Is there anything else I can help you with today?'

I answered, "Yeah. Can you get us some matte screens?"

He said he's heard a LOT of that lately. He works in returns, btw.

So it's not just a handful of customers. It's just about the entire professional photography and video editing base of loyal Apple consumers. Yes we can also use additional monitors, but the beauty of the laptops is the ability to take them on the road.

And it's also affecting many business customers who use their mbps to show clients photos of products, etc. usually in offices where they cannot turn off all the lights.

I think Apple is going to have to address this soon. I still can't see how this one got past the design stage.

 

[Davidkoh]

I spoke to Apple today about returning the refurb (no problem) and when he nicely said, "Is there anything else I can help you with today?'

I answered, "Yeah. Can you get us some matte screens?"

He said he's heard a LOT of that lately. He works in returns, btw.

So it's not just a handful of customers. It's just about the entire professional photography and video editing base of loyal Apple consumers. Yes we can also use additional monitors, but the beauty of the laptops is the ability to take them on the road.

And it's also affecting many business customers who use their mbps to show clients photos of products, etc. usually in offices where they cannot turn off all the lights.

I think Apple is going to have to address this soon. I still can't see how this one got past the design stage.

I still think they wont change, if it was worth the cost to provide both they wouldn't have introduced all glossy to begin with

 

[zer0tails]

Ok! So i took a trip down to the Apple store to see for myself this new glossy macbook/macbook pro. I'm trying to decide between the new macbook and a macbook air.

They are built solid, and there is little to no flex. The new glass trackpad doesn't feel like glass, and is nothing amazing. Nice to have more space for multi-touch though.

As for the screens, they're exactly like the one on the iPhone 3G. It makes a very useful mirror, because it's bigger, and for watching out incase someone tries to sneak up behind you.

Final verdict: It's personal preference really. Most consumers will love it as it's flashier and more oooOoOooOooOoo look at me!

Final verdict: I found the macbook air's screen to be much nicer and hence will be going for it instead of the glass.

 

[MarkCombs]

Shiny, greasy, and fingerprints - yuck

lets see, I get the same CPU, benchmarks are the same, I lose a FW port, and I give up the one feature that I love - matte finish. I'm scrambling to see if I can pickup a 2.5 in the old style. Hopefully Apple comes to it's senses and realizes that it has abandoned it's pro users. This is the first misstep I've seen Apple take since the Cube. I won't buy one - I hate the reflection - unless some third comes out with a really nice and effective coating for the screen.

What a disaster!!!!!

off the beaten track - does anyone have an opinion on the old 2.4 versus the old 2.5?

m

 

[tivoboy]

Hate glossy, but this GLASS screen isn't too bad

So, I too HATE glossy and actually after LOVING my Macbook Gen1, I had to sell it since the glossy was just annoying on my eyes (I even got Bells Palsy during that time, no certainly of cause, but correlation NTL)

I really hate the fact that there isn't a CHOICE anymore, but that being said.

The GLASS is not GLOSSY. I spent about 30 minutes today in the Apple store. I know, worst place anywhere to test this out.

Compared to the Macbook Gen1 which is still being sold, the new MBP with the GLASS screen is not as bad. Granted, one CAN see ones refection of course at times, but ON AXIS, it is simply pretty bright and pretty clear, and sharp and beautiful.

OFF AXIS, then the reflections are much more noticeable. This would NOT be the type of computer to show or present to two other people, one on each side.

Compared to a Previous Gen MBP, with a GLOSSY screen, again the NEW MBP is BETTER. The previous plastic overlay was somehow MORE glossy.

It is STILL glossy, the new MBP. But, I am certain someone will come out with a nice Matte overlay.

Now, I just wonder why the new machines don't perform MEASURABLY better, faster or longer batterylife. ( I know the Battery is smaller, but why wouldn't they just be better overall?)

 

[cg165]

I spoke to Apple today about returning the refurb (no problem) and when he nicely said, "Is there anything else I can help you with today?'

I answered, "Yeah. Can you get us some matte screens?"

He said he's heard a LOT of that lately. He works in returns, btw.

So it's not just a handful of customers. It's just about the entire professional photography and video editing base of loyal Apple consumers. Yes we can also use additional monitors, but the beauty of the laptops is the ability to take them on the road.

And it's also affecting many business customers who use their mbps to show clients photos of products, etc. usually in offices where they cannot turn off all the lights.

I think Apple is going to have to address this soon. I still can't see how this one got past the design stage.

Out of curiousity, are there notebook manufacturers that are putting in matte screens in high end notebooks anymore? I ask because when I look on a few companies websites I only see glossy. Here are a few examples:

1.) Dell XPS
2.) HP Pavilion dv5t series (Brightview Widescreen is glossy I assume?)
3.) Sony NS Series (I assume XBRITE-ECO™ technology is glossy?)
4.) Gateway® M-153S
5.) Alienware m15x (this just says with Clearview technology, so I'm not sure)

As a note, I only looked up 15" models that were at least somewhat comparable to the MBP. Hopefully these were valid comparisons. I'm just curious if there are companies that actually still do make matte screens that are comparable to the MBP because it looks to me like they are generally not being produced anymore. If they aren't being produced by any company, then I don't get why people say they will buy a different notebook because of apple making theirs glossy.

P.S. I just came from the apple store and the screens/computers looked great in my opinion. Hopefully everyone here gets a chance to actually go and see them and not take reviews or opinions as fact since everyone likes different things.

 

[Balty]

Hopefully everyone here gets a chance to actually go and see them and not take reviews or opinions as fact since everyone likes different things.

When I went to the Dick Smith Powerhouse, hoping that they had the new Macbook/Macbook Pros, they did. (The sales lady didn't even know they were the new ones..... )

The store's got some pretty strong lighting, and for that the screens did pretty well. Yes, they were reflective, but not too bad (even though I had to fiddle with the screen angle......)

 

[cg165]

When I went to the Dick Smith Powerhouse, hoping that they had the new Macbook/Macbook Pros, they did. (The sales lady didn't even know they were the new ones..... )

The store's got some pretty strong lighting, and for that the screens did pretty well. Yes, they were reflective, but not too bad (even though I had to fiddle with the screen angle......)

I was actually surprised at how the screens WEREN'T as shiny as I expected. After reading a lot of bad reviews about the glass screens, I thought especially in the apple store with really bright overhead lights it would be a mirror. That just wasn't true. Sure, when there are black backgrounds it is more noticeable but in general it really isn't bad at all. I think after you use one for a week (or less) you probably will forget that it's glossy or at least it won't bother you much.

Also the trackpad button took zero getting used to. I've never owned a mac, and I was at the apple store using one and without any trouble was able to click without thinking or looking at the trackpad very easily.

 

[Balty]

I was actually surprised at how the screens WEREN'T as shiny as I expected. After reading a lot of bad reviews about the glass screens, I thought especially in the apple store with really bright overhead lights it would be a mirror. That just wasn't true. Sure, when there are black backgrounds it is more noticeable but in general it really isn't bad at all. I think after you use one for a week (or less) you probably will forget that it's glossy or at least it won't bother you much.

Also the trackpad button took zero getting used to. I've never owned a mac, and I was at the apple store using one and without any trouble was able to click without thinking or looking at the trackpad very easily.

Same here. The screen wasn't too bad....

Compared to my "current" Macbook Pro's trackpad, the new ones are great! So much more space.....

Since you don't have a Mac, around now (or when Nehalem Macs come out) is the time to buy.
Except, the prices went up...

 

[cg165]

Same here. The screen wasn't too bad....

Compared to my "current" Macbook Pro's trackpad, the new ones are great! So much more space.....

Since you don't have a Mac, around now (or when Nehalem Macs come out) is the time to buy.
Except, the prices went up...

I can't do that, I already ordered! I was waiting forever for the update, but I won't be receiving it until the 20th - 24th so I just went there to get a sleeve for it when it gets here and check them out. I really liked the trackpad and pretty much everything about it. It's exciting to learn 2 new operating systems (Leopard and Vista), and I'm sure after 2 weeks I'll have it down on the names/locations of the basic stuff.